If we lose to Leiscter, it's all over.
2nd string against Chelsea? Or do we risk more tiredness
- Thread starter Adam-Utd
- Start date
For me Id rather win the FA cup than finish 4th and by a big distance. The money isnt as important as it was 10 years ago with the much higher domestic tv cash.
Biggest downside is the lure for the top players but there wont be much transfer activity anywhere this summer and maybe next summer too due to covid - hence Pogba now happy to stay - which is v good for us.
Also winning a trophy can be infectious and lead to more. Finishing 4th would be nice but doesnt mean anything in itself unless we then kick on (look at Arsenal and Spurs in recent years)
Maybe its because Im 42 but winning the FA cup does mean a lot to me even if not the same as when I was a kid
Biggest downside is the lure for the top players but there wont be much transfer activity anywhere this summer and maybe next summer too due to covid - hence Pogba now happy to stay - which is v good for us.
Also winning a trophy can be infectious and lead to more. Finishing 4th would be nice but doesnt mean anything in itself unless we then kick on (look at Arsenal and Spurs in recent years)
Maybe its because Im 42 but winning the FA cup does mean a lot to me even if not the same as when I was a kid
I wouldn't start one of Bruno-Pogba, Lindelöf-Maguire and Rashford-Martial. If possible also one of Shaw-AWB should sit and James should start instead of Greenwood.
Champions league or Europa league? I don’t think it’s much of a discussion. Sack the FA cup right off. I’m sure the impact of Sancho is way more important than the FA Cup.
To me its more winning a trophy or not winning a trophy. Hopefully we can win the FA cup and finish 4th anyway but sacking off the FA cup? For a shot at 4th place? Nah. Used to laugh at Arsenal fir the 4th place trophy.
Winning the FA cup is better to me than getting to say the round of 16 in the champions league then getting knocked out.
And Sancho wanted to come last summer without champions league
Would love to see a complete second 11 but I dont think that will be the case. Rashford will always play, same with Maguire.
I think Pogba, Rashford, Maguire will play from first team.
I think Pogba, Rashford, Maguire will play from first team.
If we stuff West Ham 5-0 and Leicester lose to Spurs, we can afford to lose by one goal
I would have no problem with only Maguire and Lindelof from yesterday in the starting XI for sunday but that won't happen.
He is out injured
Or if Leicester drop points at Spurs. Imagine not beating West Ham after Spurs get a point. I'd probably get an aneurysm.
Has to be rotation of course there does. We have 48 hours to recover then another game Wed night. Fully expect Romero to play as he did in the last round versus Norwich
Romero
Dalot Bailly Maguire Williams
McTom
Fred Pogba
James Ighalo Rashford
Romero
Dalot Bailly Maguire Williams
McTom
Fred Pogba
James Ighalo Rashford
Yeah, we really don't have a choice. Those saying 'it's an FA semi final of course you don't rotate' aren't living in the real world. We have to win every remaining PL game. Making/missing out on the CL this season could affect our future for a decade. The team are starting to creak, with a number of key players - notably Matic, Bruno and AWB - looking really tired.
Play a significantly changed side. If Chelsea go full strength, we'll lose. But we'll be laughing when they have to play Liverpool three days later, and if our refreshed side beat West Ham we'll have the last laugh too.
Play a significantly changed side. If Chelsea go full strength, we'll lose. But we'll be laughing when they have to play Liverpool three days later, and if our refreshed side beat West Ham we'll have the last laugh too.
Not if they lose to Spurs and we beat West Ham well enough. Chelsea have to play Liverpool and Wolves as well so there are lots of permutations.
Its a little circumstantial mate. Because, its dependant on various scenarios and predicting the results of 2 games. Here are a few scenarios:Why is no body reading my comment above where I explained playing our best 11 against Chelsea and risk not winning against West Ham is a good idea?
| United beat West Ham | United Draw with West Ham | United Lose to West Ham | |
| Leicester Beats Spurs | Must win for both teams on final day. BUT position dependant on Chelsea's results as well. | Must win for us against Leicester. Leicester only needs a draw. | Must WIN and by a big margin. We have to beat them by 4-0 just to cover the GD. Impossible task to pummel them at Home. |
| Leicester Draws with Spurs | MORE LIKELY: A draw against Leicester would be enough to get us through. But we will probably win. | LESS LIKELY: Must win for both teams on final day. Dependant on Chelsea's results. | Must win for United on final day |
| Leicester Loses against Spurs | MORE LIKELY: A draw against Leicester would be enough to get us through. | LESS LIKELY: Need a draw against Leicester. | Must WIN and by a couple of goals. Dependant on how many goals each team loses by. Also dependant on Wolves and Chelsea result. |
As you can see, to make lives easier for us on final day - A win against West Ham is a must. In case we falter against them, we will still get another bite at the cherry against Leicester. Also its about momentum and carrying it through to the final game.
The ideal situation is not to have a MUST win game as our last game. We will know whether or not it is a must win game for us by what Leicester does on Sunday. Mind you they will play on the same day as us - so the team we select for Chelsea will already be fixed by that as well.
Players are knackered as well. I don't think our Best XI can play both games, so we have to pick and choose. I pick the West Ham game for playing the best XI. We cannot afford to drop points against them - because then it becomes a must win against them with all the added pressure.
If final day becomes a winner takes all match (us or them situation), anything can happen! Nerves, pressure, bad day... you never know.
My final verdict: Don't take a risk. Rest key players for Chelsea. Come out recharged against West Ham.
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It's bizarre that I'll be a bit angry if we don't rest most our players for a FA Cup semi final but sadly thats where we are right now. It would be down right idiotic to go full strength.
You`re talking as if its guaranteed Leicester get a result vs Jose who`s home record with Spurs is as solid as it gets and is gunning for a EL spot. Unlike Sheffield Spurs will definitely give them a hard time and its confirmed Maddison/Chilwell are out for the season on top of missing Soyuncu and any dropped points at this stage of the season is detrimental as I don`t trust this team`s bottle to live up to the hype when they are under pressure if we dropped points to West Ham the Leicester game becomes a MUST win do you trust us that much under such circumstances to get the job done??I can offer a different view on this. Since we have 62 points, just like Leicester city, and we have -3 goal difference compared to Leiscter, we have to beat Liescter to reach UCL. Our result against West Ham is more or less meaningless. Allow me to explain.
As far as our next game goes, we just have to make sure we don't lose to West Ham. The reason is even if we draw against West Ham and Liescter wins their game against Spurs, Liescter will be two points ahead of us. We have to beat Leiscter to reach UCL. If we win against West Ham and Liescter wins, we still to need beat Leiscter to go up due to goal difference. So we can play a very strong team against Chelsea and just try not to lose against West Ham.
Play our best 11 for the Chelsea game. It is very unlikely we will lose the West Ham. We have to beat Liescter regardless of our next result against West Ham.
Below is a short summary:
Play the best 11 against Chelsea
Chelsea will most deffinetly not play their best 11 because of Liverpool game. The reason is if United and Liescter win their games and Chelsea loses to Liverpool, Chelsea must win against Wolves to not miss out on UCL.By playing our best 11, we will more than 50% likely go to Final.Just don't lose to West hamGet that 4 days rest and smash LiescterLet me know what you guys think
If we beat West Ham on the other hand at least one of Leicester/Chelsea drop points there is a very good chance we go into the Leicester game needing just a point that will be much easier to deal with than a must win game. "Dont lose to West Ham" is such a defiast mentality at this late stage of the season.
Maybe Lingard and Forsu were given minutes last night to get them ready for Sunday. No one knows the line up for Sunday. Expecting at least 6 changes. Bailly, Williams, Dalot, Romero, Fred, Ighalo are certain to start
At least please rest Bruno. We can play counter attacking with Fred-McT. We did win against them without Bruno anyway. Guy has been playing and running too much for a human body to handle lately.
I feel we can afford to rest a player from the defence, midfield and attack.
I would bring in Bailly, Fred and Ighalo
I would bring in Bailly, Fred and Ighalo
Chelsea are playing liverpool and Wolves. Do Frank risk it?
This question goes two ways
This question goes two ways
Spelling Leicester incorrectly TEN times in one post is all time legendary fare fellaI can offer a different view on this. Since we have 62 points, just like Leicester city, and we have -3 goal difference compared to Leiscter, we have to beat Liescter to reach UCL. Our result against West Ham is more or less meaningless. Allow me to explain.
As far as our next game goes, we just have to make sure we don't lose to West Ham. The reason is even if we draw against West Ham and Liescter wins their game against Spurs, Liescter will be two points ahead of us. We have to beat Leiscter to reach UCL. If we win against West Ham and Liescter wins, we still to need beat Leiscter to go up due to goal difference. So we can play a very strong team against Chelsea and just try not to lose against West Ham.
Play our best 11 for the Chelsea game. It is very unlikely we will lose the West Ham. We have to beat Liescter regardless of our next result against West Ham.
Below is a short summary:
Play the best 11 against Chelsea
Chelsea will most deffinetly not play their best 11 because of Liverpool game. The reason is if United and Liescter win their games and Chelsea loses to Liverpool, Chelsea must win against Wolves to not miss out on UCL.By playing our best 11, we will more than 50% likely go to Final.Just don't lose to West hamGet that 4 days rest and smash LiescterLet me know what you guys think
Normally I'd say win the FA Cup but with how the games are all so close together with no time for rest or recovery, as well as Leicester will have pretty much the week off before they face us.. I have to say rest the first 11 completely.
Romero
Fosu-Mensah
Bailly
Lindelof
Dalot
Fred
Mctominay
Mata
Lingard
James
Ighalo
I'd like that. Firstly the FA Cup doesnt matter right now and secondly, I think that team could get a result.
Fosu-Mensah
Bailly
Lindelof
Dalot
Fred
Mctominay
Mata
Lingard
James
Ighalo
I'd like that. Firstly the FA Cup doesnt matter right now and secondly, I think that team could get a result.
Rest ‘The Five’ (coining it). Their passes showed how tired they were. We need them fresh for an assault on West Ham. Leicester could lose to Mourinho. Chelsea could fall to Liverpool.
We must pounce against West Ham. Fully charged.
We must pounce against West Ham. Fully charged.
The question is will chelsea risk it?
We are basically in the same situation
We are basically in the same situation
A few changes for me. If Ole goes for wholesale changes then he will be pillared for not taking the cup seriously if we lose. A genius if we do go with wholesale changes and an idiot if he doesn't make changes and we end up with a few injuries.
Put FA Cup to one side. No guarantee Liverpool won't turn them over midweek, so are Chelsea going to put a full team out?
Wouldn't be surprised in the slightest to see us play a wider formation to stop Azpilcueta(sp?) and Reece James putting the ball in the box for Giroud. So maybe a start for Dan James. Any changes in Midfield I would put Fred in before McTominay. He looked way off the pace.
Put FA Cup to one side. No guarantee Liverpool won't turn them over midweek, so are Chelsea going to put a full team out?
Wouldn't be surprised in the slightest to see us play a wider formation to stop Azpilcueta(sp?) and Reece James putting the ball in the box for Giroud. So maybe a start for Dan James. Any changes in Midfield I would put Fred in before McTominay. He looked way off the pace.
Rest. Top 4 has to be the priority.
It's a terrible idea. Why leave ourselves in the position of having to beat Leicester at the King Power, unnecessarily.Why is no body reading my comment above where I explained playing our best 11 against Chelsea and risk not winning against West Ham is a good idea?
If Leicester draw to Spurs, which is not outside the realms of possibility, then a win for us against West Ham leaves us needing only a draw at the King Power. That is a far better position to be in.
If you offered me victory vs Chelsea (at the expense of points vs West Ham) or victory vs West Ham (at the expense of getting KO'd from the FA Cup), I know which one I'd pick.
Even putting the maths to one side, our first XI look exhausted and probably aren't capable of beating Chelsea in two day's time. We need to rest players, lots of players.
Nah, I think we can manage. We've only played football for a month after three months of rest, and with five subs per game and drinking breaks, I think the first eleven should be able to carry it through. Rest a couple who really needs it, Bruno looks like he could use a rest, maybe Greenwood too. Otherwise I'd say go for it. There's a good chance we only need a draw vs West Ham anyway.
There is no circumstance in which a draw against West Ham is a good result. It's not out of the realms of possibility that we can qualify for the CL even if we don't beat West Ham but it makes our job that much harder.
Shocking as ever.Rest.
What even is the point of a trip to Wembley without fans.
What even is the point of a trip to Wembley without fans.
Does everyone realise that Chelsea are in exactly the same situation as us??
Yeah they had two extra days to prepare but they also have had the same amount of rest days overall.
Ridiculous to say we should play the second string, we should be wanting a trophy AND top four.
And there's no reason why we can't do that.
Yeah they had two extra days to prepare but they also have had the same amount of rest days overall.
Ridiculous to say we should play the second string, we should be wanting a trophy AND top four.
And there's no reason why we can't do that.
If Leicester beat Spurs, a draw against West Ham is as good as a win. We'll need to beat Leicester either way. If Leicester lose at Spurs, a draw vs West Ham will be as good as a win (barring unlikely goal difference scenarios). Either way, a draw at Leicester will be enough.
Only if Spurs and Leicester draw will a win vs West Ham leave us with a better chance than a draw.
They are; Leicester, however, aren't. They'll have a full week's rest ahead of the final game and if they beat us in that, we're probably out. It's bad enough that we need to get a result there, even without being knackered.
The only player I would put in the starting 11 for the rest of the season is Bruno. Everybody else can be rotated.
Well, no, not quite. If Chelsea lose at Liverpool, a draw at Leicester is great even if they beat Spurs - but only if we beat West Ham.
Can't believe I have to argue that a home draw against bloody West Ham managed by David fecking Moyes is NOT a good result, by the way. It's a terrible result on its own, regardless of anything else.
I'm not arguing it's a good result, I'm talking about it being a useful result in the sense that it leaves us with as good a chance to get the Champions League spot. But you're right, there's a scenario where we can overtake Chelsea too and of course the best and easiest thing would be to win the last two. All I'm saying is there's a pretty decent chance that a draw will be just as useful.
Some players will still play. Shaw if fit, Maguire, AWB, Matic, one of Rashford/Martial and one of Bruno/Pogba will definitely play. Reckon Ole goes with a back 3
GK- Romero
LCB- Shaw
CB- Maguire
RCB- Bailly
LWB- Williams
CM- Fred
DM- Matic
RWB- AWB
No10- Bruno/Pogba
ST- Ighalo
ST- Rashford/Martial
GK- Romero
LCB- Shaw
CB- Maguire
RCB- Bailly
LWB- Williams
CM- Fred
DM- Matic
RWB- AWB
No10- Bruno/Pogba
ST- Ighalo
ST- Rashford/Martial
I say let's not make our task any harder than it already is. West Ham at home is an immeasurably kinder fixture than Liverpool away or Tottenham away so we really really really should win. I don't want to rue dropping points against fecking West Ham at the end.