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2021-22 Performances


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AjaxCunian

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His best time here was far better than anything Dalot has produced.
 

VP89

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AWB is terrible this season. It annoys me posters had once pointed to his shit play to vindicate Dalot as they were both in similar brackets of terrible.
 

AltiUn

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4 clean sheets in 26 games says a lot.
 

Sparky Rhiwabon

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we probably didnt even scout 4 RBs.
I’m convinced we used to use Match of the Day to scout players and select transfers. Back then both AWB and Maguire used to get talked up on there every week, then we signed them. I doubt our research went much further than that.
 

Isotope

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I think none of AWB or Dallot is Ten Hag's ideal RB. AWB will generate more money (and lessening wage burden) when he's sold to fund a new RB.

So AWB is gone, then.
 

JB7

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Posted back in Jan but still relevant. It's plain to see that while Dalot is a limited footballer and not good enough to be our starting RB either, he's still a much more progressive passer and a better footballer than AWB. I'd rather keep him as backup and cash in on AWB, and I'm glad Ten Hag agrees.
Except it's not that relevant because those statistics aren't true of now.

Touches in attacking third per 90: AWB 18.5, Dalot 16.9
Carries into penalty box per 90: AWB 0.2, Dalot 0.45 (interestingly carries into top 3rd of the pitch is AWB 1.66, Dalot 1.2)
Progressive passes per 90: AWB 2.66, Dalot 4.95 (this is somewhat skewed by Dalot attempting nearly 3 times as many long balls per 90 as AWB, while AWBs short passing is considerably more accurate than Dalot's)
Tackles + interceptions per 90: AWB 4.87, Dalot 5.10

In terms of other defensive stats you look to shots or passes blocked, where AWB averages nearly 1 more than Dalot per 90 for each, number of times dribbled past per 90; AWB 0.55 & Dalot 0.85 etc.

I'm not arguing for or against either player as I don't think either are good enough, but of the two I'd prefer AWB in the team. In reality we badly need a new right back.
 

Fortitude

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If ETH is the coach we think he is, AWB has every chance of not only staking his claim as the first choice RB but also becoming a very functional cog. As is 90% of the squad tbh.

If he can become the best version of himself (with ETH's coaching and tactical setup), he has lots of quality which can be very useful for us.

Is his base skillset ideal for what we imagine we would need? No but we're not in an ideal position to upgrade every area of the pitch.
He's missed 3 years of fundamental development, on top of that, has been given next to no tactical training. By now, it might be too much to fix unless he has a high level of intelligence and receptive interpretation. Whether it's even worth the time and effort to correct years of neglect is questionable.

I'd rather him as the backup until he can be sold, though, as he's miles above Dalot, who isn't a PL footballer, let alone a United one.
 

criticalanalysis

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He's missed 3 years of fundamental development, on top of that, has been given next to no tactical training. By now, it might be too much to fix unless he has a high level of intelligence and receptive interpretation. Whether it's even worth the time and effort to correct years of neglect is questionable.

I'd rather him as the backup until he can be sold, though, as he's miles above Dalot, who isn't a PL footballer, let alone a United one.
I don't disagree but you should read my subsequent posts in this thread. The problem with what you've said is that it applies to the majority of the squad.

So the reality is that ETH will have to coach AWB and many others to raise their bottom level. Unless we're going by media reports etc (none of which I believe or put much weight to), in my eyes he's as 'receptive' with his flaws and positives as much as anyone else.

For my own mental health and expectations, that's where I'm at because I don't see a first choice RB coming in. If it does, then great, happy to write AWB off.
 

Fortitude

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I don't disagree but you should read my subsequent posts in this thread. The problem with what you've said is that it applies to the majority of the squad.

So the reality is that ETH will have to coach AWB and many others to raise their bottom level. Unless we're going by media reports etc (none of which I believe or put much weight to), in my eyes he's as 'receptive' with his flaws and positives as much as anyone else.

For my own mental health and expectations, that's where I'm at because I don't see a first choice RB coming in. If it does, then great, happy to write AWB off.
Sure, it can be said with regards to the whole squad, but few are as fundamentally deficiencient as AWB, and that's not meant as an insult, rather, he was one of the players that really needed the coaching to take the leap from what he is to what he should/could've been and that chunk is lost now in the abyss; what is usually worked on beyond a certain age is tactical and formation understanding as it is assumed the player already has the fundamentals down (and do at clubs that coach properly); it's a bigger ask for him to bring his deficencies up to even a baseline and then now take them up to top club class. It isn't impossible, but that's reserved for players with higher than normal levels of aptitude and intelligence, which we've seen nothing to suggest AWB has.

It's like cramming for university's worth of education to take a test that should be only revision away from you being able to ace; it's a massive ask and I wouldn't think any worse of a player for failing because the few that have that capacity are miles away from the norm.

I don't know about writing him off, I just think the conditions for success are so slim it might be a logical choice to simply cut losses and not even bother with the rigmarole of all that coaching application, effort and education.

I'm saying this with Dalot being the primary I'd want out the door, too.
 

criticalanalysis

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Sure, it can be said with regards to the whole squad, but few are as fundamentally deficiencient as AWB, and that's not meant as an insult, rather, he was one of the players that really needed the coaching to take the leap from what he is to what he should/could've been and that chunk is lost now in the abyss; what is usually worked on beyond a certain age is tactical and formation understanding as it is assumed the player already has the fundamentals down (and do at clubs that coach properly); it's a bigger ask for him to bring his deficencies up to even a baseline and then now take them up to top club class. It isn't impossible, but that's reserved for players with higher than normal levels of aptitude and intelligence, which we've seen nothing to suggest AWB has.

It's like cramming for university's worth of education to take a test that should be only revision away from you being able to ace; it's a massive ask and I wouldn't think any worse of a player for failing because the few that have that capacity are miles away from the norm.

I don't know about writing him off, I just think the conditions for success are so slim it might be a logical choice to simply cut losses and not even bother with the rigmarole of all that coaching application, effort and education.

I'm saying this with Dalot being the primary I'd want out the door, too.
I get and agree to an extent but my point is not that 'AWB is good enough to spend time coaching on', it's 'AWB will likely be one of our main RB options (unless we get someone new in), therefore ETH will have to make him a better player if he wants the team to improve'.

As for his deficiencies, to play devil's advocate, I'd argue that he has qualities, which if used right and in certain situations/tactics, can be of an asset (as a stop gap solution/functional cog); I've mentioned some scenarios in previous posts. I would love to be proven wrong but ETH is not going to be able to play high quality, tactical, interchangeable football in his first season; he will need to play practically and for that he will need players who have tangible practical qualities. Going by his own comments in the presser, he will have to make use of the squad and find tactics to match the players. Between Dalot and AWB, the latter is a safer bet, as he is faster, stronger, a defensive-first player and has more playing experience.

I don't really care if we keep AWB and neither do I rate him but imo he has some objectively good attributes, which can be moulded into something, even if that something is not the standard we'd ideally want; it is however, a reality that we may find ourselves in next year.
 
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Fosu-Mens

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Except it's not that relevant because those statistics aren't true of now.

Touches in attacking third per 90: AWB 18.5, Dalot 16.9
Carries into penalty box per 90: AWB 0.2, Dalot 0.45 (interestingly carries into top 3rd of the pitch is AWB 1.66, Dalot 1.2)
Progressive passes per 90: AWB 2.66, Dalot 4.95 (this is somewhat skewed by Dalot attempting nearly 3 times as many long balls per 90 as AWB, while AWBs short passing is considerably more accurate than Dalot's)
Tackles + interceptions per 90: AWB 4.87, Dalot 5.10

In terms of other defensive stats you look to shots or passes blocked, where AWB averages nearly 1 more than Dalot per 90 for each, number of times dribbled past per 90; AWB 0.55 & Dalot 0.85 etc.

I'm not arguing for or against either player as I don't think either are good enough, but of the two I'd prefer AWB in the team. In reality we badly need a new right back.
Regarding "carries into top 3rd": Teams actively tries to get AWB on the ball and letting him bring the ball forward because they assume that he will not attempt a dangerous pass or be able to do something worthwhile with the ball.
 

Olecurls99

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He's missed 3 years of fundamental development, on top of that, has been given next to no tactical training. By now, it might be too much to fix unless he has a high level of intelligence and receptive interpretation. Whether it's even worth the time and effort to correct years of neglect is questionable.

I'd rather him as the backup until he can be sold, though, as he's miles above Dalot, who isn't a PL footballer, let alone a United one.
Easier to teach a player to defend than teach a defender to play.

Dalot has the standard Portuguese technical ability at least. Bissaka has very limited technical skill. You don't coach technique at 25. That should have been developed a long long time ago.
 

Long Time Red

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Crazy comparison to me.

Wan Bisaka is very very bad on the ball. Walker isnt in the team just for his recovery speed, he can also be relied on to keep the ball. Something City do for most of their games. You cannot rely on Wan Bisaka to build up and keep the ball.

AWB would work well in a low level team that doesn't expect to be on the ball much.
Kyle Walker has had years and years of proper coaching from Pochettino and Guardiola. He was a bit of a liability before Pochettino. often giving the ball away and making poor mistakes.

Wan-Bissaka's coaches to date:

Hodgson
Solskjaer
Rangnick
 

Fortitude

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I get and agree to an extent but my point is not that 'AWB is good enough to spend time coaching on', it's 'AWB will likely be one of our main RB options (unless we get someone new in), therefore ETH will have to make him a better player if he wants the team to improve'.

As for his deficiencies, to play devil's advocate, I'd argue that he has qualities, which if used right and in certain situations/tactics, can be of an asset (as a stop gap solution/functional cog); I've mentioned some scenarios in previous posts. I would love to be proven wrong but ETH is not going to be able to play high quality, tactical, interchangeable football in his first season; he will need to play practically and for that he will need players who have tangible practical qualities. Going by his own comments in the presser, he will have to make use of the squad and find tactics to match the players. Between Dalot and AWB, the latter is a safer bet, as he is faster, stronger, a defensive-first player and has more playing experience.

I don't really care if we keep AWB and neither do I rate him but imo he has some objectively good attributes, which can be moulded into something, even if that something is not the standard we'd ideally want; it is however, a reality that we may find ourselves in next year.
I'm not at all convinced either AWB or Dalot are prerequisites for ten Hag and I wouldn't bet on him being reliant on either to get his vision going. Promoting someone; bringing someone back into the fold or converting a player from another position into a pseudo right-back for the time being might easily be seen as the better and more logical investments of both time, and effort.

AWB, even as he is right now, could be a force in a counter-attacking team who need a specialist to do a job. Lest we forget, AWB got slaughtered when we switched from reactive to proactive and his remit did a 180. There's not even a question he has some useful attributes, but how useful are they if mired in a bog when it comes to what is needed to be an attacking - and vital - cog in a overtly aggressive side? That's the question I would ask.

What I'm saying here is, even if he wasn't deficiant, turning a player who excels in a wholly different system and way of playing, into a rounded and relied upon component in an oppressive side would be task enough; the drilling and re-conditioning alone would take up a summer, imo. But it isn't just that we're dealing with here, it's a player who doesn't really understand what he is supposed to be doing, when he's supposed to be doing it and what tools to execute it with. These things need to be intrinsic and seamless, that is not easy to apply when you're essentially eradicting the vast majority of what made AWB a player with any kind of reckoning about him.

I'd argue his path would be one of the most difficult at the club if in this hypothetical, so many players are given a chance to prove themselves.
 

Fortitude

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Easier to teach a player to defend than teach a defender to play.

Dalot has the standard Portuguese technical ability at least. Bissaka has very limited technical skill. You don't coach technique at 25. That should have been developed a long long time ago.
Dalot doesn't have the prerequisite anything to be here, imo. So he's moot, for me. Even at his very best, he's way below the bar.
 

Olecurls99

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Thank you. It’s an argument I’ve had on here numerous times till I got bored. Fans say “he can’t control a ball”. I’ve always argued that he can. The ball playing stuff is a myth.what his problems are:
  • Positioning
  • Jogging back
  • Heading
  • Decision making
  • confidence destroyed

positioning could absolutely be corrected with good coaches. As could jogging back.
Heading could surely be improved a little through coaching.

decision making is a harder one. This would not only need coaching off pitch but a leader on the pitch too giving instant feedback and advice.

confidence Is the biggest issue for me. It’s been utterly eroded and i doubt at this point our fanbase will help him get it back. In fact the opposite

best thing for him would be to leave and find a less toxic environment, rebuild his confidence and work on those other weaknesses
At this level his control of the ball should be instinctive so he can focus on the next pass. He is concentrating so much on controlling the ball that by the time he gets his head up it's too late and he's either closed down or has to go backwards. So many out-balls are to full backs and they can really contribute to attacks these days. His basic technique isn't good enough to help our attacks
 

golden_blunder

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At this level his control of the ball should be instinctive so he can focus on the next pass. He is concentrating so much on controlling the ball that by the time he gets his head up it's too late and he's either closed down or has to go backwards. So many out-balls are to full backs and they can really contribute to attacks these days. His basic technique isn't good enough to help our attacks
You may or may not be right. I don’t think he’s had good coaching or support since he’s been here. Time will quickly tell under ETH
 

criticalanalysis

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I'm not at all convinced either AWB or Dalot are prerequisites for ten Hag and I wouldn't bet on him being reliant on either to get his vision going. Promoting someone; bringing someone back into the fold or converting a player from another position into a pseudo right-back for the time being might easily be seen as the better and more logical investments of both time, and effort.

AWB, even as he is right now, could be a force in a counter-attacking team who need a specialist to do a job. Lest we forget, AWB got slaughtered when we switched from reactive to proactive and his remit did a 180. There's not even a question he has some useful attributes, but how useful are they if mired in a bog when it comes to what is needed to be an attacking - and vital - cog in a overtly aggressive side? That's the question I would ask.

What I'm saying here is, even if he wasn't deficiant, turning a player who excels in a wholly different system and way of playing, into a rounded and relied upon component in an oppressive side would be task enough; the drilling and re-conditioning alone would take up a summer, imo. But it isn't just that we're dealing with here, it's a player who doesn't really understand what he is supposed to be doing, when he's supposed to be doing it and what tools to execute it with. These things need to be intrinsic and seamless, that is not easy to apply when you're essentially eradicting the vast majority of what made AWB a player with any kind of reckoning about him.

I'd argue his path would be one of the most difficult at the club if in this hypothetical, so many players are given a chance to prove themselves.
If we can sell and bring in someone in, again I'm all for it but your suggestions is just as 'risky' as my idea that he can do a serviceable job.

We both and ETH won't know how his coaching/tactics will work and how players will react or develop. In that sense for me most of the players have a blank canvas (very very broadly). If one wants to look at pressing/counter pressing football then I would look to players who are physically up to the task. AWB would fit that criteria, especially if we're going to have Sancho on the right as he would require someone, who can overlap (to give that space) and be defensively solid. If we narrow a RB, who is good in 1 vs 1, has physical attributes, can hold his own in possession (again very loosely applying here to AWB i.e as long as he becomes a cog and we don't expect him to play make/be our source of play progression) then AWB has potential to be that in the meantime. Of course ETH will want possession football and game intelligence, which are AWB's weakest points but those in-game decisions can be minimised depending on the team selection/the way the game is managed.

Anyways, we'll be going around in circles with this. Let's see how this pans out in pre-season! I'm excited to see what ETH can do.
 

RedStarUnited

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I still dont understand why some of you think technique is a coachable thing. If technical ability doesnt exit in a player then it just doesnt exist.

If you look at signings by Pep for example the number one thing he always looks for is technical ability. He can take a John Stones and teach him defensive actions that improve him as a player. You would never see Pep take a player like Smalling and try improve his on ball abilities - its a waste of time.

AWB is technically poor. We need to have as few technically bad players in the team as possible if we want to start chasing the likes of City and Liverpool.
 

Xaviboy

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Him and Dalot are not good enough. Never seen a player overhit a cross so much then Dalot. AWB doesn't even get in to a postion to put a cross in. Both not good enough.
 

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I still dont understand why some of you think technique is a coachable thing. If technical ability doesnt exit in a player then it just doesnt exist.

If you look at signings by Pep for example the number one thing he always looks for is technical ability. He can take a John Stones and teach him defensive actions that improve him as a player. You would never see Pep take a player like Smalling and try improve his on ball abilities - its a waste of time.

AWB is technically poor. We need to have as few technically bad players in the team as possible if we want to start chasing the likes of City and Liverpool.
The pro awb argument is he doesn't need to improve technique. Just enough patterns of play so he can attack a little by better decisions and so on.

I obviously disagree I just think he's poor all over. Tackling won't cut it.
 

Telsim

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The perfect reminder highlights are useless when trying to form an opinion about a player.

I was hoping the bump was that he was getting sold. :(
 

Tavern in the town

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I really want to know what happened to this AWB


Nothing happened to him. He’s a full back who played almost every minute for a team that probably averaged about 53% possession (I’m guessing) per game, obviously he’ll put in a few good crosses at some point. That’s 3 minutes worth of clips from thousands of minutes of football. Imagine how long Trent or Reece James’s would be.
 

golden_blunder

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Nothing happened to him. He’s a full back who played almost every minute for a team that probably averaged about 53% possession (I’m guessing) per game, obviously he’ll put in a few good crosses at some point. That’s 3 minutes worth of clips from thousands of minutes of football. Imagine how long Trent or Reece James’s would be.
His second season he made progress on the offensive side and had 5 or 6 assists which put him if I remember about 4th for assists from fullbacks that season.
all the clips certainly put paid to the opinion that he can’t control a ball.
last season broke him. I don’t know what was going on with the coaching but he regressed. It didn’t help that fans got on his back at every juncture. He’s just broken now. Lost all confidence. Unless ETH can work miracles then the lad needs to move for his own sake.
I could see him ending up at spurs under Conte
 

RonaldoVII

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His second season he made progress on the offensive side and had 5 or 6 assists which put him if I remember about 4th for assists from fullbacks that season.
all the clips certainly put paid to the opinion that he can’t control a ball.
last season broke him. I don’t know what was going on with the coaching but he regressed. It didn’t help that fans got on his back at every juncture. He’s just broken now. Lost all confidence. Unless ETH can work miracles then the lad needs to move for his own sake.
I could see him ending up at spurs under Conte
Conte plays wing backs? Or do you mean as the right CB?

I think he'll end up back at Palace on loan unfortunately.
 

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50 mil. Spiderman, what a buy, if only Marvel was a football club.
 

Poborsky's hair

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Nothing happened to him. He’s a full back who played almost every minute for a team that probably averaged about 53% possession (I’m guessing) per game, obviously he’ll put in a few good crosses at some point. That’s 3 minutes worth of clips from thousands of minutes of football. Imagine how long Trent or Reece James’s would be.
AWB is not a crosser, as Evra wasn't. His dribblign skills are a good asset going forward. He topped the ranks the season we bought him from defenders, and given more confidence and playing more aggressively on opposition half we will see new AWB. At least I give him the edge over Dalot who is just hopeless, only "looks" more composed but his crossing is closer to Bebe..
 

TOKUGAWA-X

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I havent given up on Aaron, i still believe ETH can work with his unique ability as he is still young and can learn other basics.
 

SAF is the GOAT

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I have a video of him working and training on passing, controlling the ball, dribble forward and crossing.

Unfortunately, the only option in here is to bring a link.

If you want to see it(or better-bring the video here) its in "players_plus" on IG(I don't have an IG)
 

OpenIntrovert

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I still dont understand why some of you think technique is a coachable thing. If technical ability doesnt exit in a player then it just doesnt exist.

If you look at signings by Pep for example the number one thing he always looks for is technical ability. He can take a John Stones and teach him defensive actions that improve him as a player. You would never see Pep take a player like Smalling and try improve his on ball abilities - its a waste of time.

AWB is technically poor. We need to have as few technically bad players in the team as possible if we want to start chasing the likes of City and Liverpool.
AWB's problem is not technique, neither is it dribbling. The problem is his off the ball movement and his decision making. In order to attack he needs to know which areas to get into after passing the ball as well as when to make passes. This is tough to train as all players have natural instincts when making their decisions, so it remains to be seen how he can improve on this aspect.

AWB can also be trained to be a defensive wing back or even a defensive forward like how Valverde was used against Liverpool. His stamina and tight man marking skills are quite good, so he is not someone ETH would throw out of the locker just yet.
 
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