Antonio Conte Sack Watch (Napoli)

romufc

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And if you believed that for a second it's your fault
Oh no, I didnt rate Conte, I thought that style of management doesn't work anymore, I saw first hand with Jose.

However; when you hire a manager like Conte who has won what he has, you expect a trophy at least.
 

Galactic

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Definitely should stay. So that they’ll miss on top 4 and keep showing us what a joke of a club they are.

Why would any non-Spurs fans want him sacked?
 

SAFMUTD

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Thats the thing right, no fan likes someone disrespecting them, Conte has had a dig at the fans at times too for not being patient.

He can go on about all this history of the Spurs and what not but the history hasn't changed? He knew what Spurs are before signing for them.

The reason Conte and Jose take on the Spurs job is because they are not at the elite level and see Spurs as an opportunity to get back there and failed.

This is as much of a L to Conte as it is to Spurs.

Conte has been backed by the board, more than any Spurs manager and he has failed to deliver.
Exactly this. Conte didnt include himself in that critic he make it sound as if it's all Spurs fault. But he was backed almost 200M between the two windows with most of the players being an absolute fiasco.

58M for Richarlison, 30M for Bissouma, 15M for Spence. None of those are starters all chosen by Conte. So he has his part on the failure as well. As you say he's not an elite manager anymore he won't find a top club giving him the chance outside Italy.

Also with how he went out of Chelsea and now this circus with Spurs I suspect many teams will think twice before hiring him.
 

romufc

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Exactly this. Conte didnt include himself in that critic he make it sound as if it's all Spurs fault. But he was backed almost 200M between the two windows with most of the players being an absolute fiasco.

58M for Richarlison, 30M for Bissouma, 15M for Spence. None of those are starters all chosen by Conte. So he has his part on the failure as well. As you say he's not an elite manager anymore he won't find a top club giving him the chance outside Italy.

Also with how he went out of Chelsea and now this circus with Spurs I suspect many teams will think twice before hiring him.
Its not just Chelsea though, I remember at Inter at a press conference he said he wont know if he can continue, almost kind of blackmailing the board saying give me x amount or I walk.. Inter then went out and bought loads of players.

They won the league so he can point to that however; his CL knock out record is rubbish as well.

I know for a fact, I would never ever want a manager like Conte for United.
 

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A trophy.

There were alot of Spurs fans with optimism, including United fans that Conte will deliver a trophy.

I mean I also saw some talk about pushing for a title race.
Well that's pie in the sky stuff - top 4 was the aim and they are on course for that. They are competing against better squads for trophies, trophies a lot of teams are desperate to win (ourselves included after our drought.) so that was never their priority over CL qualification.
 

SAFMUTD

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There are Spurs fans agreeing with him and sick and tired of the acceptance of mediocrity. Levy has that club in a headlock and has gotten away with it for far too long.

Calling out what's wrong with a club instead of pretending everything is A-OK is fine for me; hushed tones do nothing to fix a problem that's seeped into the foundations of a club - by then the rot is set and it needs rooting out. Managers rarely have the stones to do it because it's their job on the line, or it's seen as deflection from them doing a bad job. Conte isn't doing a bad job, though, and he's an exacting man who'd rather be out if those around him don't aspire to what he does.

He called out everything that Spurs are infamous for; he's put the ball in their court to change, or... stay the same and be seen as the same laughing stock as they are meme'd for being.
It depends on where you set the bar for Spurs, do you really see them as a big club? I consider them as a "biggish" club, they're not a team designed to win but to compete. They manage to get european football more often than not with a smaller budget than the others in the top 6.

Judge them for not winning anything would be like Judging Leicester for it. The fact that some people think they should be winning talks about the good job Levy has done there. Convincing these people that they should be judged as a big club.

Maybe Conte isn't doing an awful job results wise, they're still within top 4 reach but the football they play is god damn awful, the players he bought have been mostly failures his in game managment has been questionable to say the least. Including the defensive changes in UCL when needing to score. So he's not without fault here making it sound like everything has to change so Spurs can succeed maybe he's right but that everything starts with him. They need a way better manager he's just toxic and past it.
 

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Exactly this. Conte didnt include himself in that critic he make it sound as if it's all Spurs fault. But he was backed almost 200M between the two windows with most of the players being an absolute fiasco.

58M for Richarlison, 30M for Bissouma, 15M for Spence. None of those are starters all chosen by Conte. So he has his part on the failure as well. As you say he's not an elite manager anymore he won't find a top club giving him the chance outside Italy.

Also with how he went out of Chelsea and now this circus with Spurs I suspect many teams will think twice before hiring him.
He did include himself. He said whether it is him or any other manager, the fundamental issues remain. And it is so spot on that it should send shockwaves through that club and their support as well as their players. Exactly as he intended it to do.

He wants out, but he's making sure he exposes the club for what it is whilst doing so and it's up to them to pick up the baton and address the issues.
 

SAFMUTD

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Its not just Chelsea though, I remember at Inter at a press conference he said he wont know if he can continue, almost kind of blackmailing the board saying give me x amount or I walk.. Inter then went out and bought loads of players.

They won the league so he can point to that however; his CL knock out record is rubbish as well.

I know for a fact, I would never ever want a manager like Conte for United.
We had our share with Mourinho. I hate those past it managers that have absolutely no autocritic and defend themselves with look how much I used to win the problem is not me its you. Phrases they repeat themselves and the press such as "its a miracle I managed this team to top 4" are absolutely narcisistic.
 

romufc

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Well that's pie in the sky stuff - top 4 was the aim and they are on course for that. They are competing against better squads for trophies, trophies a lot of teams are desperate to win (ourselves included after our drought.) so that was never their priority over CL qualification.
They got CL qualification last season, so the natural plan is to go forward, which is a trophy. I mean I wouldn't speak for Spurs fans but I have seen alot in the last year or saw say they would take a trophy over top 4 because they dont compete in the CL anyway.

I mean at the start of the season, when you looked at the squads, I dont think anyone would have said our squad is that much better than Spurs squad.

You dont hire Conte for CL qualification...

I mean they they went out to Sheffiled United and Forrest in the cups not City or Liverpool.
 

SAFMUTD

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He did include himself. He said whether it is him or any other manager, the fundamental issues remain. And it is so spot on that it should send shockwaves through that club and their support as well as their players. Exactly as he intended it to do.

He wants out, but he's making sure he exposes the club for what it is whilst doing so and it's up to them to pick up the baton and address the issues.
So he's basically saying its not his fault right? if its him or any other manager with the same results all he's saying is that there's not a thing he could do to change the outcome so by definition not his fault.

Also I don't think he's doing it to help Spurs change or whatever he's doing it to save face. Just like when he got out of Inter when they sold Lukaku. He's not a "hands to work" manager, he's a spoiled brat.
 

romufc

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He did include himself. He said whether it is him or any other manager, the fundamental issues remain. And it is so spot on that it should send shockwaves through that club and their support as well as their players. Exactly as he intended it to do.

He wants out, but he's making sure he exposes the club for what it is whilst doing so and it's up to them to pick up the baton and address the issues.
No, he did not say he could have done better with the squad, he took the job on knowing the history and the owners, nothing has changed.

Exposing the club, he had a go at the fans as well, saying they need to be patient...

I know people talk about issues remain but look at our owners and look what Ten Hag has done to show you a example of a manager who can work under difficult owners.

We had our share with Mourinho. I hate those past it managers that have absolutely no autocritic and defend themselves with look how much I used to win the problem is not me its you. Phrases they repeat themselves and the press such as "its a miracle I managed this team to top 4" are absolutely narcisistic.

Yep, we need to move on and we should have hired an elite coach after Jose. yep, they are all about themselves. They forget the reason they are hired for the job, to change what happened.

Ten Hag did not come in and cry about the culture, he made changes and said to be successful, you need to do X, Y, Z.
 

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It depends on where you set the bar for Spurs, do you really see them as a big club? I consider them as a "biggish" club, they're not a team design to win but to compete. They manage to get european football more often than not with a smaller budget than the others in the top 6.

Judge them for not winning anything would be like Judging Leicester for it. The fact that some people think they should be winning talks about the good job Levy has done there. Convincing these people that they should be judged as a big club.

Maybe Conte isn't doing an awful job results wise, they're still within top 4 reach but the football they play is god damn awful, the players he bought have been mostly failures his in game managment has been questionable to say the least. Including the defensive changes in UCL when needing to score. So he's not without fault here making it sound like everything has to change so Spurs can succeed maybe he's right but that everything starts with him. They need a way better manager he's just toxic and past it.
You need to go back and watch that hatchet job he's done again and take note of what he's saying. That Spurs have no aspirations, no culpability, no fight or fire to become anything other than what they are. They are essentially inert, and have accepted that as a club, which is unacceptable. The rot comes from Levy and has permeated every other element of the club. The fight the fans should have in them has eroded and turned into a perpetuity of acceptance, an acceptance that contradicts the standing they believe they should have. There's a cognitive dissonance that has loomed over them like a fog - the players have no heart, no fire and no belief they can be anything more; the higher ups have made it so and a single manager cannot come in and change what is bedrock, or he certainly can't do it without a chairman as equally hungry and hellbent on change as he is.

Spurs are seen as the biggest laughing stock in the PL with Chiellini's comment basically become legion across the continent, and generally accepted as what Spurs are. They've done nothing to dispel the notion and everyone expects what we see from them. They've coasted for years - for every season other clubs have that is below par, they are slaughtered for it, internally and externally. Not so at Spurs.

Like I said before, his reasons for saying what he said were not altruistic, but they were absolutely bang on the money to the point it compounds the humiliation if Spurs don't look to do anything to fix it, with or without him there.
 

Fortitude

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They got CL qualification last season, so the natural plan is to go forward, which is a trophy. I mean I wouldn't speak for Spurs fans but I have seen alot in the last year or saw say they would take a trophy over top 4 because they dont compete in the CL anyway.

I mean at the start of the season, when you looked at the squads, I dont think anyone would have said our squad is that much better than Spurs squad.

You dont hire Conte for CL qualification...

I mean they they went out to Sheffiled United and Forrest in the cups not City or Liverpool.
That's what he thought, too.
 

romufc

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You need to go back and watch that hatchet job he's done again and take note of what he's saying. That Spurs have no aspirations, no culpability, no fight or fire to become anything other than what they are. They are essentially inert, and have accepted that as a club, which is unacceptable. The rot comes from Levy and has permeated every other element of the club. The fight the fans should have in them has eroded and turned into a perpetuity of acceptance, an acceptance that contradicts the standing they believe they should have. There's a cognitive dissonance that has loomed over them like a fog - the players have no heart, no fire and no belief they can be anything more; the higher ups have made it so and a single manager cannot come in and change what is bedrock, or he certainly can't do it without a chairman as equally hungry and hellbent on change as he is.
I get this, I would have been on saying the same things you are saying about 8 months ago too. Until I saw what a true elite coach / manager does.

Would you agree United for the last 6/7 years were the same?

No aspiration, no culpability, no fight, nothing and Ten Hag ((manager) came in and changed that, gave players a go at the start they failed and said, right now we do it my way.

He changed the culture, where players are responsible for their performances. To say ambition is lacking when they have spend alot of money is not true though is it? They have backed him and it was his decision to play B team in the cups to get knocked out.
 

Fortitude

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So he's basically saying its not his fault right? if its him or any other manager with the same results all he's saying is that there's not a thing he could do to change the outcome so by definition not his fault.

Also I don't think he's doing it to help Spurs change or whatever he's doing it to save face. Just like when he got out of Inter when they sold Lukaku. He's not a "hands to work" manager, he's a spoiled brat.
You miss the point that CL qualification is still in their hands and that they currently sit in 4th place in the table? He's not saying these words from a particular point of weakness despite the poor result on the weekend; he's saying what we all see, that the players don't have that dog in them and are used to nothing coming of it, which isn't allowed at other clubs of their supposed standing and aspirations.

He is a spoilt brat, and he does absolve himself wherever he can, but he also called it on the money and is making the point that the problem is intrinsic and goes deeper than the level he himself works from. It's not a false statement; 'It is the history of the Spurs.'
 

Fortitude

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I get this, I would have been on saying the same things you are saying about 8 months ago too. Until I saw what a true elite coach / manager does.

Would you agree United for the last 6/7 years were the same?

No aspiration, no culpability, no fight, nothing and Ten Hag ((manager) came in and changed that, gave players a go at the start they failed and said, right now we do it my way.

He changed the culture, where players are responsible for their performances. To say ambition is lacking when they have spend alot of money is not true though is it? They have backed him and it was his decision to play B team in the cups to get knocked out.
We're desperate to change and have shuffled a lot of people around behind the scenes, not just the manager, and even the owners bent to public pressure and released 'funds' because of the backlash. We are not like Spurs, even when we were atrocious these past years, our aspirations and desire to fix the problem (no matter how poorly we managed to be at doing so) is not at all like Spurs.

There's no match for Spurs in the PL, and certainly not for that timespan he refers to.
 

Maluco

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No matter what anyone thinks about what he said, or how Spurs are run, this was as predictable an outcome as they come. The thread is full of people predicting what would happen.

A constant complainer of a manager who never has enough resources or players, and a gun shy board who will always go for the cheaper option.

The question that needs to be asked by Spurs fans is not “why has Conte failed”, it’s “why was he hired in the first place”

Its utter incompetence to have an outcome as predictable as this one and be starstruck by the big name and go for it anyway.

Levy is not fit to run the football side of the project at Spurs and fans should be demanding a change. This is an embarrassing episode and shouldn’t have been allowed to happen.
 

rimaldo

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I’m starting to think you have a thing for ex Chelsea managers.
with how many managers the chelsea machine has munched through, it’s next to impossible to not appoint an ex-chelsea boss. i think it’s just about only my nan left, and she made it to the final interview stage when avram grant got the job. he only beat her as he looked marginally less like uncle fester than her.
 

Brwned

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There are Spurs fans agreeing with him and sick and tired of the acceptance of mediocrity. Levy has that club in a headlock and has gotten away with it for far too long.

Calling out what's wrong with a club instead of pretending everything is A-OK is fine for me; hushed tones do nothing to fix a problem that's seeped into the foundations of a club - by then the rot is set and it needs rooting out. Managers rarely have the stones to do it because it's their job on the line, or it's seen as deflection from them doing a bad job. Conte isn't doing a bad job, though, and he's an exacting man who'd rather be out if those around him don't aspire to what he does.

He called out everything that Spurs are infamous for; he's put the ball in their court to change, or... stay the same and be seen as the same laughing stock as they are meme'd for being.
Do you think it would be better to risk the club’s future in the search for glory, rather than maintaining the club’s health and competing at the level you’d expect them to be at with the resources available to them?

At the end of the day, for them to outcompete the 4 clubs ahead of them they’d need to aim for something exceptional to do anything other than just being in the CL mix. And unless you’re hoping for something magical, you need to spend well beyond your means to compete against clubs with literally twice the resources you do. It’s not uncommon for that to lead to long-term suffering.
 

WeePat

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with how many managers the chelsea machine has munched through, it’s next to impossible to not appoint an ex-chelsea boss. i think it’s just about only my nan left, and she made it to the final interview stage when avram grant got the job. he only beat her as he looked marginally less like uncle fester than her.
Touche :lol:
 

Fortitude

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Do you think it would be better to risk the club’s future in the search for glory, rather than maintaining the club’s health and competing at the level you’d expect them to be at with the resources available to them?

At the end of the day, for them to outcompete the 4 clubs ahead of them they’d need to aim for something exceptional to do anything other than just being in the CL mix. And unless you’re hoping for something magical, you need to spend well beyond your means to compete against clubs with literally twice the resources you do. It’s not uncommon for that to lead to long-term suffering.
They don't need to outspend those around them to compete, but they would need to work a niche in what they do and put the appropriate resources into it.

They've got innovative clubs chasing them up the rear developing really impressive teams on a fraction of their budget, so it's not just about what is ahead of them but what is happening just below - there's activity swirling around them whilst they basically decay, as usual.

They're essentially a rudderless club - if/when Kane goes, there's a serious void to fill, which we know Levy will make a hash of, per the script we're accustomed to by now.
 

KikiDaKats

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No, he did not say he could have done better with the squad, he took the job on knowing the history and the owners, nothing has changed.

Exposing the club, he had a go at the fans as well, saying they need to be patient...

I know people talk about issues remain but look at our owners and look what Ten Hag has done to show you a example of a manager who can work under difficult owners.




Yep, we need to move on and we should have hired an elite coach after Jose. yep, they are all about themselves. They forget the reason they are hired for the job, to change what happened.

Ten Hag did not come in and cry about the culture, he made changes and said to be successful, you need to do X, Y, Z.
The difference is Ten Hag came in at a time every one at United had accepted our players are over indulged and we need a coach that will have authority over them.
Conte might have gone over the top but certain players are being over indulged by the club. Pointing at Son and Kane here. They have pressured every manager to cater for Kane and his goal but everyone ignores how it affects the whole shape of the team. People forget Pochettino worked well because it was a hungry and mobile young Kane in the squad but we have a static one that gets carried a whole game so he can stick the ball in the net. If they are to continue in this direction Son has to be replaced with a lesser upcoming player. The other option Skip Kane has to leave and a new rebuild, starting with playing style.
Conte might be wrong or a bad manager but it’s the same players we keep saying they have xyz ability that have been underperforming for years and even got Pochettino fired, when they became household names.
 

RVN1991

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It's astonoshing how awful their recruitment has been since they made the CL final. They've spent money, just on the wrong players, even a guy like Romero who can be a good defender is a total liability, I've said it before, I think Conte did as good a job as anyone could have considering how mediocre that squad is.
 

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You need to go back and watch that hatchet job he's done again and take note of what he's saying. That Spurs have no aspirations, no culpability, no fight or fire to become anything other than what they are. They are essentially inert, and have accepted that as a club, which is unacceptable. The rot comes from Levy and has permeated every other element of the club. The fight the fans should have in them has eroded and turned into a perpetuity of acceptance, an acceptance that contradicts the standing they believe they should have. There's a cognitive dissonance that has loomed over them like a fog - the players have no heart, no fire and no belief they can be anything more; the higher ups have made it so and a single manager cannot come in and change what is bedrock, or he certainly can't do it without a chairman as equally hungry and hellbent on change as he is.

Spurs are seen as the biggest laughing stock in the PL with Chiellini's comment basically become legion across the continent, and generally accepted as what Spurs are. They've done nothing to dispel the notion and everyone expects what we see from them. They've coasted for years - for every season other clubs have that is below par, they are slaughtered for it, internally and externally. Not so at Spurs.

Like I said before, his reasons for saying what he said were not altruistic, but they were absolutely bang on the money to the point it compounds the humiliation if Spurs don't look to do anything to fix it, with or without him there.
[/QUOTE
How well did they do before Levy? Maybe it's not his fault.
 

cesc's_mullet

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Exactly this. Conte didnt include himself in that critic he make it sound as if it's all Spurs fault. But he was backed almost 200M between the two windows with most of the players being an absolute fiasco.

58M for Richarlison, 30M for Bissouma, 15M for Spence. None of those are starters all chosen by Conte. So he has his part on the failure as well. As you say he's not an elite manager anymore he won't find a top club giving him the chance outside Italy.

Also with how he went out of Chelsea and now this circus with Spurs I suspect many teams will think twice before hiring him.
Minor point, but I'm sure Conte did not want Spence, which has been the issue.
 

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I think the players probably share the same sentiments as Conte. You can't be carried by one player who you know wants to move on to better things and still be aspirational.