Are we in the Dalglish stage?

Solius

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I know a lot is being said right now about what's going on with the club and I can't help but see similarities with us and Liverpool when they brought back Kenny Dalglish to manage them in 2011.

I can remember us laughing at them almost every week when they were struggling to pick up points and the man had them playing dull and stiff football. He took over temporarily at first but there were then calls to make him permanent manager, which they did. It wasn't great, and a lot of Liverpool supporters refused to turn on him though due to his status at the club and he stayed in the job for a year before eventually being sacked.

The next thing they did? They brought in a young manager who had a defined style of play. Swansea at the time were playing good football and despite what you may think of Rogers he did pretty well at Liverpool and was a slip (lol) away from a title. Klopp then had that base to build on when he eventually came in.

Moyes was a footballing dinosaur, we all know that. LVG was pretty similar in that vein too. Mourinho is a bit more modern but still had that stubbornness and refusal to accept players sometimes need an arm round the shoulder. Ole, despite being one of the younger generation of managers these days seems to also be stuck in the 90's with his thinking. It's pretty obvious that even just copying what Fergie did doesn't work anymore. If SAF was still manager he'd have completely changed his style by now because he was excellent at moving with the times.

The four managers we've had though, can anyone tell me the difference between their styles? Because all I've seen for the past 6 years is us passing it across the face of the opposition box and hoping an individual does something brilliant.

I do think it's a matter of time until Ole goes and I wish him the best. I really hope we hire a young exciting manager because what else have we got to lose?
 

12OunceEpilogue

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It's a fair analysis, though it makes Jose our Roy Hodgson, to which I'm sure he'd say 'not special'.
 

Needham

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You're also optimistically aggregating Liverpool's 20 plus years of crap and rage into just 6. Utd could be also rans for years to come yet.
 

balaks

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You're also optimistically aggregating Liverpool's 20 plus years of crap and rage into just 6. Utd could be also rans for years to come yet.
I think there is a very strong chance of that happening.
 

Big Ben Foster

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Main difference is Liverpool were sold in 2011 to new owners who actually cared about the product on the pitch.
 

OnlyTwoDaSilvas

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Seems more like the Souness/Evans/Houllier stage.

Resting on laurels of 20+ years of dominance, stubborn to the fact that the club has been left behind in many areas, clubs we deemed smaller than us are either creeping up behind or are already speeding past us.

Our next manager might be our Rafa Benitez, who might propel us forward a bit and win a few cups, but ultimately fall short of expectations. Hopefully we wont follow that timeline precisely and end up with a Roy Hodgson.
 

Reynoldo

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You're also optimistically aggregating Liverpool's 20 plus years of crap and rage into just 6. Utd could be also rans for years to come yet.
Yeah but everything moves faster these days and nobody has any patience so hence the expedited timelines ;)
 

Sterling Archer

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Not a bad comparison. Highlights the important fact: our success depends on Woodward's next decisions. Much the same way the last several seasons results have. We need to focus attention higher than the manager with the long term in mind
 

Sandikan

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At least when they brought their hero ex player back, he had won stuff and proven he could be a manager!

Ours was based on little beyond playing rep.
 

R'hllor

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Not really, we are in our own version of shit.
 

CassiusClaymore

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I like the idea we're going through an accelerated Liverpool style cycle. Gives me a sense of optimism that isn't there when I wake up in the morning.

Our next manager might be our Rafa Benitez, who might propel us forward a bit and win a few cups, but ultimately fall short of expectations. Hopefully we wont follow that timeline precisely and end up with a Roy Hodgson.
I'd have Mourinho down as our Rafa in that case.
 

OnlyTwoDaSilvas

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I like the idea we're going through an accelerated Liverpool style cycle. Gives me a sense of optimism that isn't there when I wake up in the morning.



I'd have Mourinho down as our Rafa in that case.
That's a good point. Looks like we're going in reverse. Moyes was Hodgson, Mourinho was Rafa, I guess that makes Ole the equivalent to Souness, club legend but not really good enough. Then it's back to 20 years of domination. Sounds good.
 

Lynty

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We do need a young manager with a clear style.

Unfortunately, we haven't had the base for them to work with until now. That's why I like Ole. He wants to play modern progressive football. Unfortunately he isn't good enough to coach it. But he's building the squad for it and that will pay off for the next manager.

Ten Hag was my oringal choice. But I don't watch enough football from the continent to have another opinion
 

GoldanoGraham

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Good post - it also similar to the Sourness era - he came in, purchased lots of very average players (like he did at Rangers but that league was so poor he got away with it), the original winning team/players faded into the past and they were then on a cycle of mediocracy with shite players over and over......

it’s ironic that he sits there on sky sports lording it up like the font of eternal footballing knowledge - having ripped the sole out of that team and replaced them with dross - then as now - whoever comes in after has a massive rebuilding job to do - that’s where we are now - we’ve loads of players to replace with upgrades - the question is can Ole do it? Will he retain the support and the players to see us through to the next transfer window?

The only difference now in our cycle v Liverpool’s was that the managers churn much quicker now....
 

Gazza

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We are in the Dalglish at Newcastle phase, with 40 year olds John Barnes and Stuart Pearce.
 

AshRK

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What calibre of players did they have back then? Gerrard etc, compared to this lot
If I remember correctly they did have Torres for half a season and then bought Suarez and Carrol in January. They had Kuyt who scored a hattrick against us. Mostly they had dross.
 

SteveJ

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Are we in the Dalglish stage?
Well we are acting like we're permanently pissed...
 

GDaly95

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Well, we are and we aren't.

We're in it in the sense that we have a legend in charge and we're rapidly declining.

Liverpool were saved by a takeover ultimately. The 'stages' they were in has no bearing on what 'stage' we're in.

Liverpool were declining, then they were taken over and they worked their way into a transition period.

We're just declining.
 

Inigo Montoya

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If I remember correctly they did have Torres for half a season and then bought Suarez and Carrol in January. They had Kuyt who scored a hattrick against us. Mostly they had dross.
And finished 2nd with Gerrard,Alonso and Torres. I'd be happier with those 3 in the squad

We forget that teams were getting closer year by year.
 

red thru&thru

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I know a lot is being said right now about what's going on with the club and I can't help but see similarities with us and Liverpool when they brought back Kenny Dalglish to manage them in 2011.

I can remember us laughing at them almost every week when they were struggling to pick up points and the man had them playing dull and stiff football. He took over temporarily at first but there were then calls to make him permanent manager, which they did. It wasn't great, and a lot of Liverpool supporters refused to turn on him though due to his status at the club and he stayed in the job for a year before eventually being sacked.

The next thing they did? They brought in a young manager who had a defined style of play. Swansea at the time were playing good football and despite what you may think of Rogers he did pretty well at Liverpool and was a slip (lol) away from a title. Klopp then had that base to build on when he eventually came in.

Moyes was a footballing dinosaur, we all know that. LVG was pretty similar in that vein too. Mourinho is a bit more modern but still had that stubbornness and refusal to accept players sometimes need an arm round the shoulder. Ole, despite being one of the younger generation of managers these days seems to also be stuck in the 90's with his thinking. It's pretty obvious that even just copying what Fergie did doesn't work anymore. If SAF was still manager he'd have completely changed his style by now because he was excellent at moving with the times.

The four managers we've had though, can anyone tell me the difference between their styles? Because all I've seen for the past 6 years is us passing it across the face of the opposition box and hoping an individual does something brilliant.

I do think it's a matter of time until Ole goes and I wish him the best. I really hope we hire a young exciting manager because what else have we got to lose?
Give FSG some credit, they put a plan and structure in place.
 

AshRK

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And finished 2nd with Gerrard,Alonso and Torres. I'd be happier with those 3 in the squad

We forget that teams were getting closer year by year.
That happened in 08-09 season. I was referring to the Daglish time, They were pretty dire since then for almost 3-4 seasons
 

SteveW

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Every day another moaning thread with a fresh new angle.

The Caf really does come alive when we lose a few games.
 

El Zoido

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Jamie Redknapp said quite clearly that they were. And he played for them at the time!
They never looked like serious relegation candidates for one! He’s just being colourful. Liverpool have not finished lower than 8th in 65 years. We will almost certainly finish lower than 8th this season and I’m fact very much look like we will be bottom half. Even when Liverpool have been inconsistent they’ve had good players and had the odd game where they put opponents to the sword. I’m sorry but it’s clear to me that we’re worse right now than Liverpool ever were.
 

INeedAbsynthe

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I feel you are considerably worse off.

Kenny although some serious time had passed is a league winning manager, some of his methods may have been outdated but he was far more qualified for the job then Ole is. Even Hodgson who was still horribly out of his depth and seemingly believed his relegation fighting methods would perfectly transition at least has a track record of being a solid premier league manager.

Ole was utterly abysmal at Cardiff and probably would eventually been relegated again to league 1. The very act of landing that interim job along with the purple patch has created this illusion that he is far more qualified then he is. I see people and pundits demanding that he is given time and if he actually had a proven track record I’d agree but giving him time for the sake of giving him time is absurd.

Yes there is a far bigger problem higher up but that doesn’t change the fact he still isn’t good enough.
 
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INeedAbsynthe

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Their Hodgson side was the level we're at now.

Martin Kelly, Jay Spearing, Cristian Poulson, Paul Konchesky, David N'Gog. Charlie Adam, Jose Enrique... the list goes on. They were woeful.
Woah now.
Enrique and Kelly were decent back then.

Poulson and Koncheskey though....I can’t find the words. As for Ngog I don’t think think the bloke even plays at a professional level anymore which says something .
 

charlenefan

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I wish we were in the Dalglish stage, that would suggest light is at the end of the tunnel

I'd say we're more in the Souness stage which is a really depressed fecking thought
 

Speedicut75

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Bill Shankly .............. SAF.
Boot room ............... Class of 92.
Graham Souness ............. Ole Solskjaer.

I am being flippant, before the derision begins, but I think there are similarities between the two clubs, particularly where the mawkishness in some elements of our respective fan bases are concerned; but UTD's fate, for now, is still divergent in most critical aspects, because of our enormous commercial prowess, but without that cushion, which accommodates so many mistakes, we'd soon also be facing 30yrs in the wilderness.
 

SilentWitness

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What you're saying is you're going to hire Eddie Howe who gets you back into the top 4 and then is sacked to be replaced by that Leipzig bloke and in 2025 you will be a CL winner and then by 2026 PL title winners again.

I see it.
 

BlueHaze

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The four managers we've had though, can anyone tell me the difference between their styles? Because all I've seen for the past 6 years is us passing it across the face of the opposition box and hoping an individual does something brilliant.
LVG was the only one where I could see an actual style albeit dull as feck but it was all about passing it like a merry go round untill there was an opening and then transition to attack. The others I can literally make no difference of. It could be tedious with Jose going up though and then closing shop for the rest of the game clinging on for your life. Moyes and Ole play almost identical to me.