Is it really that mental? Do you really think Tierney is that bad of a player? Or maybe you think Shaw is just that good? I feel the conversation around these two in this thread has swung completely the other way now
Arsenal 22/23 - go to new thread
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I would have binned him off last season with the bloody rest of them to be perfectly honest. Will he turn it on next season post-contract? I suppose that's the question asked of any player to be fair.
It's all based on current form too. I mean, that lad who turned down Arsenal for Chelsea, what's the Chelsea thinking on him now?Is it really that mental? Do you really think Tierney is that bad of a player? Or maybe you think Shaw is just that good? I feel the conversation around these two in this thread has swung completely the other way now
You mean Mudryk? The thinking hasn’t changed one bit. The excitement around him is exactly the same as it was the day we signed him.
I've not seen much of him (or Chelsea). Is he playing well?
Not really. Looked great at Anfield in his little debut cameo but has looked very rusty in his appearances since. Hadn’t played a game since November when he signed though, so to be expected. It doesn’t help his case that Arsenal’s plan B Trossard has basically hit the ground running.
Comparisons are bound to be made, I guess.
I don't know if the bolded is aimed at me, but I didn't say that. Or even think that. Shaw is more talented than Tierney. I just think that Tierney is consistently pretty good while when Shaw is bad - he can be very bad.
Take a look at the Luke Shaw thread. Or multiple match threads. Or even your former Manager's own words. Tierney has never been publicly called out in a press conference. Or been outside of his target weight. Shaw is a supremely gifted footballer who is having a great season. Plus, he's performed well in a CB pairing, which is a credit to both him and ETH. But I don't think his performances haven't consistently matched his ability at United. And that opinion is all over this very site.
Yeah i suppose, i thought it just felt a needless one, as i knew the next 30 replies were going to be how Arsenal fans always overrate their players.
As @Powderfinger pointed out, if reports are to be believed the signing of Rice, or someone of that ilk, will be the priority signing of the summer. I think they would see someone like Rice as being able to cover both Xhaka's position in the left 8, or Partey's position in the number 6, with the view to probably becoming the number 6 long term.
I think the other positions we'll target are right back and another forward. Can see us going in for someone like Fresneda or Livramento at right back, with White and Tomiyasu able to play at centre back. Forward i'm not so sure about. I think it all depends on how he sees Nketiah & Balogun going forward? Does he target a more physical central forward to give us something different ie someone like Tammy Abraham? Or is he happy with Jesus, Nketiah & Balogun as the options there and target a wide right forward, someone like a Moussa Diaby, as he can cover both wings as well?
The cafe has always had a weird thing about Shaw. There's a sense that his best form is only a fleeting thing and he's in complete control of that - as though every other players form doesn't also fluctuate. He is held to a different standard, and Jose and his appalling treatment of Shaw are probably a big part of the reason for that. I wouldn't swap him with any LB in the world
You've used the word cover a few times here, and that's kind of my point. It's a delicate balance for you. You will need players that are CL level but also willing to come into a very settled side. That's a challenge.
United have suffered similar many times in the past. Currently we have the 'benefit' of having 2 or 3 positions that are clearly upgradable
He didn't turn down Arsenal, his previous club did.
Fair enough. I think he's been the best conventional LB in the league this season (Zinchenko is so inverted he's even popped up on the right at times). I think he probably is held to a different standard because £30m for a teenage FB was unheard of at the time. It still is, even with transfer inflation. And the talent is so obviously there, that I can imagine the frustration when he's not on it.
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This is a good point. I think it will be the hardest transfer window in many ways, as finding players that you can afford, are available, improve the squad and are comfortable with rotation is pretty tough. We were quoted £80+ for the likes of Mudryk and Caicedo - but neither would start over Martinelli and Partey. If those are the prices for players that don't even get into our first 11, we're gonna have a seriously difficult time.
I think we're gonna lean on our Academy much more.
He was forced to join Chelsea?
Is the English media largely made up of Arsenal fans? I do not live in England but consume a fair bit of English podcasts and media and the love in I see for Arsenal is disgustingly over the top, I cant count how many times I've heard someone from out there claim that the title is "practically won" when they're only 8 points ahead of City who have a game in hand and who will probably blow Arsenal's back out when they meet again like they do every single time they meet. It makes sense considering they're in London.
I think he was given the choice between chelsea and staying in Ukraine, so it was a tough decision for him. Its sad that hes not even getting a game these days, not even coming off the bench, I still think hes an excellent player, just cant be spending these very important years in his career on the bench when he should be developing.
I think they’ll win it. It’s not just because of the lead but because they’re playing better football in the league this year.
At gunpoint, yes.
Nah, I think it's clear he would have preferred to join Arsenal, but that happens all the time. Odegaard originally preferred to fight for his place at Madrid following his loan to us - he's now our Captain and fully committed.
Luke Shaw is a very good player, and hes been impressive at center back too, id take him ahead of Tierney. Not ahead of Zinchenko though, he gives me Paul Scholes vibes from left back.
More than likely when things settle at Chelsea he might establish himself in the side.
He is an excellent player but he is in a difficult situation now as Potter seems to experiment with 343 formation using wing back for width.
That's not true. He turned down Arsenal for more money. If he wanted to sign for Arsenal, he could have just rejected the terms presented from Chelsea. But the money was too good for him (Most people in his situation would take it first - who cares about a more settled team etc, take what you can get in the short earning potential period you have).
Arsenal was still busy negotiating the final structure, Mudrykcould haved waited a little more but chose not to.
TLDR - Mudryk turned Arsenal down.
Maybe they will, my point is you'd think they have a twenty point lead with 5 games left, they still have some tricky fixtures and have to face a team they never beat and is breathing down their necks.
It's the internet, you're always going to see extremes of both side.
Right here on the Caf, most of the Arsenal fans acknowledge that nothing is final yet, and that the possibility of winning the league is still very close.
but if you believe the countless times you've seen arsenal fans proclaim the title is won is representative of majority of arsenal fans, that's your opinion too.
While most of the people here can apply nuance, there's still a significant number that can't and tend to lump fan bases as being all the same just because of a few examples.
Nope, it's overrun with Liverpool fans. Pundits tend to be 40-60, so Liverpool were the dominant side when they were growing up. After that United. Then Tottenham, for some reason.
We were initially pretty much written off by everyone. It's only recently that the love-in has begun and I think it's because it makes for the better story. If the media big us up and we win that's more compelling than another City title. And if we come second you get endless content around us "bottling" it. Win-win.
It's suitably mental, yea. I don't think he's a bad player, but he struggles to get any game time for club or country (he's not even the best Scottish LB).Is it really that mental? Do you really think Tierney is that bad of a player? Or maybe you think Shaw is just that good? I feel the conversation around these two in this thread has swung completely the other way now
Luke Shaw, for all of his inconsistencies, can lay claim to being the best LB in Europe/the World when he's 'on'.
Have you ever watched Paul Scholes?
If you watch Zinchenko closely youll see it too, when he walks into midfield and runs the game.
Most news stories or YouTube clips I spot don’t say that it’s a done thing but advantage Arsenal which it is as since the City game the gap hasn’t gone down but in fact increased. City are the ones who need a decent swing their way now.
Alright but still, Paul Scholes
Is it the colour of his hair?You’re comparing Zinchenko in midfield to Paul Scholes?
One of the best midfielders of his generation and a player Henry said was the best player in PL history?
I'm sorry but you post some unadulterated shite.
I get Arsenal fans are giddy but this constant crowbarring of Man Utd players as a benchmark is so weird. If Zinchenko gives you Paul Scholes 'vibes' as you put it, I'd encourage you to either a) actually watch Paul Scholes or b) get your eyes checked.
The instant touch, turn, and pinged pass, or the first touch short pass to get away from players , or the quick feet if under pressure to work the space, the only thing he hasnt got is the goals. Its amazing , watch him next game, its like Scholes reincarnated as our left back.Alright but still, Paul Scholes
I mean why have you chose to compare him to Scholes and not a former Arsenal player like Fabregas?
Very difficult not to see you as a WUM when your post baiting stuff like this tbh. The kind you know will get a reaction.
Well when I say cover, I also mean compete, like Trossard has. Especially with Champions League next season, you need a good as squad as possible. The reason City do so well in all the tournaments isn't because they have the biggest squad, it's because they have the best squad in terms of quality of replacements. When you look at attacking midfield, De Bruyne, Gundogan, Silva, Foden, Mahrez, Grealish. You can almost drop in any of those names and offer a similar output.
Also, when I talk about cover, it's handy having players that can play multiple positions to a good level as well. It helps keep squad size down, and helps spread out minutes. Again, Trossard has benefited from being able to play wide and central. Someone like Rice can play defensive midfield or further forward. Someone like Diaby isn't just restricted to the right, he can play left as well.
Edit: I'm just using those 2 players as examples, not saying we are defo signing those.
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Even as an Arsenal fan I can't get onboard with this absurd comparison
Fabregas was very good, but Scholes was on another level altogether.
@Buxton doesn't Nketiah remind you of Rooney as well? The way he runs, and then scores goals, and stuff.