Arsene Wenger would rather come top 4 than win the Europa League (Which is more important?)

[CamsUnited]

Winning a trophy is always more important to fans ( or it should be ) than league position unless it's first of course.

I'd imagine it's different for the clubs money men. I always remember Rio and Mcmanaman talking on BT last season and both agreed, as players they didn't care about league positions, all about trophies. They want to look back on a career full of medals rather than 3/4th places.

 

[macheda14]

I think he probably means that at there is more room for error in qualifying via top 4. Pinning all your hopes on the Europa League at this point in the season would be madness. We only started doing that towards the tail end of last season.

 

[Samid]

Jose's response at the presser tomorrow will be good.

 

[adexkola]

Europa League = Automatic Qualification and a Major Trophy

4th = Qualifiers and square root of feck all.


It's a very transparent dig at Mourinho and nothing more. Too bad he's too pig headed to realise it's just another embarrassment to the Arsenal fans who don't see Top 4 as anything to be proud of.

Arsenal fans have 3 FA cup trophies they turn their noses up at. I'm not sure they're universally enamoured by the prospect of a trophy considered tinpot by the majority of PL fans (I'm not in that category mind, but still...)

 

[Kylar Stern]

I don't think it matters in any case; I can't see them finishing top 4 or winning the EL at this stage.

 

[JSArsenal]

He doesn't say what's in the thread title. He doesn't even say he prefers the top 4 to winning the Europa league.

'We don't calculate that this is a way to qualify for the Champions League,' Wenger said at a Wednesday press conference ahead of Cologne.

'It is not the best chance but one of the opportunities. I came out many times saying the best way to do it is the top four of the Premier League.'

What he is trying to say, is that its better to rely on getting back in the top 4 to qualify for the Champions League instead of relying on a knock out competition. Which is true, we could make it all the way to the semis only to be knocked out because an opposition player dived for a penalty. Whereas in the league one game isn't going to make or break us, but our consistency over the entire season.

Why should Wenger in September, come out and say we're putting all our focus in the Europa League and not trying our best in the league?

He doesn't see the Europa League as our only way of getting back in the top four, but instead as a European trophy. Its not I will play all of my best players in the league and only send out a reserve side in the Europa. Its basically him saying we want to do well in the league first and foremost and do our best in the Europa League, preferably winning both or coming in the top 4 and winning the Europa League. I guarantee no one at Arsenal is turning up their noses at a European trophy.

 

[Morpheus 7]

They are both considered trophies to him.

 

[Ish]

He's against anything that requires winning stuff.

Seems that way

 

[Mciahel Goodman]

A trophy is a trophy and Arsenal would benefit from winning one (especially at European level, even if the second tier).

 

[Kapardin]

It seems as though Wenger is really proud of his top 4 finishes, to the extent that he regards it as something that can be proudly stated as an achievement. In his mind, its' like a trophy. That's why he is more obsessed about getting back that record than going through the Europa League route. I am not even sure why he feels this way considering that no-one else is obviously going to complement him on it.

Its' obviously not fair on the fans, as winning the EL brings them an actual trophy.

 

[stevoc]

This is the manager of a club that for its rich history, has no European trophy
There's also talk that a host of first team players will be rested for their EL game.

Is this the right mentality?
At the start of last season, I was desperate for us to take the tournament seriously and I'm thoroughly glad we did.

Same here was very disappointed with the indifference the players showed to the competition in 2012 when we were probably the best side in the competition. Glad Jose took it seriously last year.

 

[Safa Boy]

Says everything about Wenger really.

 

[AR87]

Same here was very disappointed with the indifference the players showed to the competition in 2012 when we were probably the best side in the competition. Glad Jose took it seriously last year.

After winning the league, winning Europa was what I thought was the best trophy for United. I also think that despite the lower quality of competition, the experience of going through a long European campaign while still playing meaningful games in the league for the majority of the season and going far in both domestic cups was a really good experience for the squad as it was an experience for them together.

The whole thing in many ways binded the team together IMO and was a valuable learning tool for them to learn about each other in high stakes, European knockout situations.

 

[Damien]

He's just considering that getting top 4 is a more reliable way to get into the CL not that it's better than winning the EL. And that's an obvious truth.

Yeah Tournament football is tricky, especially in the knockout rounds where a single bad game could see you knocked out. In the league there's more chance of salvaging something.

Yeah. We were almost knocked out against Celta.

 

[Safa Boy]

Same here was very disappointed with the indifference the players showed to the competition in 2012 when we were probably the best side in the competition. Glad Jose took it seriously last year.

I love that about Jose. You get the feeling he truly wants to win every competition he's involved in. It's not just lip service with him.

 

[Moonred]

He is right. Bad choice of words from Arsene probably. You are more likely to aim for top 4 as a route to the CL than winning Europa. The second strategy is risky and becomes viable at a later stage of the season.

 

[Mciahel Goodman]

I think Arsenal can finish above Spurs and Liverpool, so top four is doable for them this season.

 

[Adisa]

He doesn't say what's in the thread title. He doesn't even say he prefers the top 4 to winning the Europa league.



What he is trying to say, is that its better to rely on getting back in the top 4 to qualify for the Champions League instead of relying on a knock out competition. Which is true, we could make it all the way to the semis only to be knocked out because an opposition player dived for a penalty. Whereas in the league one game isn't going to make or break us, but our consistency over the entire season.

Why should Wenger in September, come out and say we're putting all our focus in the Europa League and not trying our best in the league?

He doesn't see the Europa League as our only way of getting back in the top four, but instead as a European trophy. Its not I will play all of my best players in the league and only send out a reserve side in the Europa. Its basically him saying we want to do well in the league first and foremost and do our best in the Europa League, preferably winning both or coming in the top 4 and winning the Europa League. I guarantee no one at Arsenal is turning up their noses at a European trophy.

Wenger, a few weeks ago said EL winners shouldn't get an automatic CL place. That's a bit of context.

 

[Adisa]

I think Arsenal can finish above Spurs and Liverpool, so top four is doable for them this season.

This Spurs side is still very good.

 

[Mciahel Goodman]

This Spurs side is still very good.

They are but the smaller English teams fecking love the prospect of playing at Wembley. It's like a cup final. And their squad is thin. If they were at WHL, I'd say top four without hesitation. But the Wembley factor and the small squad could see them in trouble come Christmas.

I think they'll do well in their CL campaign though. Early days, but I can see them getting a point against Madrid (losing the away fixture), not losing to Dortmund away, and beating Apoel home and away, which puts them through.

QFs is doable for them. In a cup competition, who knows.

 

[Ikon]

It shouldn't even be a debate, winning a European trophy for me. All day long.

^^Absolutely Agreed^^
Personally, I believe that EVERY competition is worth winning, and I'll not turn my nose up at any silverware that United can claim.
I was chomping at the bit to finally win the UEFA Cup, and I am absolutely chuffed to bit that we did win it.

If I were an Arsenal supporter I would be furious to hear Wenger's comments.
They haven't won the league since 2004, Wenger looks down his nose at the League Cup, and if it wasn't for a phenomenal haul of 3 FA Cup wins in the past 4 years, their supporters would be totally starved of anything to celebrate.


In their entire European history, one solitary success, a Cup Winners Cup back in 1994.
For a club of Arsenal's stature that's just pathetic, and I don't mean that as an insult to any Arsenal supporters, I mean that in sympathy.

The Europa League offers Arsenal a great chance of winning a major European trophy as well as automatic entry into the Champions League, and once again Wenger turns his nose up at it.
The man's logic just absolutely baffles me..!!

 

[ottosec]

Wenger knows like everybody else that winning EL is much better than coming 4th. Not only you get a European trophy, but you also get straight in the CL groups, and not in the qualifiers.

That being said, you can't plan your season around winning a knock out competition, where a bad day could feck up all your work, you must be an idiot to do that, so it's obvious that their main concern is to get into top 4. Of course, if they get far in Europe their focus will probably shift to the EL.

It's a normal approach from Wenger, I don't see whats the issue here.

 

[noodlehair]

Why is it for some reason treated as if it's impossible to win the Europa League AND finish 4th?

Teams routinely try to win the Champions League whilst also qualifying for it via the league...the only real difference is the Europa League has less good teams in it.

Pissed me off last year when Jose decided it was one or the other when top four was still well within reach. Now Wenger is playing the same card in September.

 

[Samid]

Wenger knows like everybody else that winning EL is much better than coming 4th. Not only you get a European trophy, but you also get straight in the CL groups, and not in the qualifiers.

That being said, you can't plan your season around winning a knock out competition, where a bad day could feck up all your work, you must be an idiot to do that, so it's obvious that their main concern is to get into top 4. Of course, if they get far in Europe their focus will probably shift to the EL.

It's a normal approach from Wenger, I don't see whats the issue here.

At this stage I don't think we can trust his judgement. I mean this is the same guy who plays a RB at LWB, full backs at CB, rests his best GK in the CL and spends a fortune on a striker only to bench him against his rivals.

 

[Mogget]

I am not talking in terms of reliability of getting CL football.
This is a man who said EL winners should not get a CL spot.
I think he feels coming top four is a more deserving accolade than winning the EL.
That's what I have an issue with.

So you made a thread based on what you think Wenger "feels"? Nowhere does he say that finishing in the top 4 is better than winning the EL or that he'd rather finish in the top 4.

 

[LoneStar]

There is little to no chance that they'll make top 4 this season. Their only hope of CL next season is winning the Europa, which in itself is very difficult. I think Wenger will be sacked by the end of this season.

 

[Kapardin]

There is little to no chance that they'll make top 4 this season. Their only hope of CL next season is winning the Europa, which in itself is very difficult. I think Wenger will be sacked by the end of this season.

How can you say that? Sure, its' Wenger, but they seem to be picking up the pieces after the Liverpool debacle. If they throw away the EL, they certainly are going to challenge for top 4.

The Chelsea game is a big test though. If they implode there, then it may be difficult for them to recover from that. But until then, I would treat them as definite top 4 contenders.

 

[AXVnee7]

If it were an absolute decision between the two results - top 4 only, or the Europa League then you'd be a fool to pick the former. Trouble is in reality there's so much uncertainty going into a season it's difficult to know which competition to favour. That's why I'm glad Jose went for both last season and only shifted all the eggs into the Europa basket when forced to. Otherwise he'd have fought to finish both 4 and win the Europa League.

I'm surprised Wenger feels this way, if he's being sincere. He's never won a trophy in Europe, and this could be his best chance yet to get one in the bag.

 

[thegregster]

With the resources Arsenal have they should be well able to get out of a Europa League group and still be able to perform in the PL. I think our poor performances in the first half of last season weren't just down to being in the Europa league.

I think once your in the latter stages it becomes very difficult.

By the time the second round starts they will have played around 24 PL games and will know what to prioritise.

 

[The Outsider]

This might just be mind games for the match at Stamford Bridge, telling his players not to over exert themselves.

 

[ChaddyP]

This might just be mind games for the match at Stamford Bridge, telling his players not to over exert themselves.

they dont have to over exert they are all being rested anyway

 

[Santi_Mesut_Alexis_87]

This is the manager of a club that for its rich history, has no European trophy
There's also talk that a host of first team players will be rested for their EL game.

Is this the right mentality?
At the start of last season, I was desperate for us to take the tournament seriously and I'm thoroughly glad we did.

He finally has the chance to win an european trophy and doesn't want to take it? Losing mentality.

 

[LoneStar]

How can you say that? Sure, its' Wenger, but they seem to be picking up the pieces after the Liverpool debacle. If they throw away the EL, they certainly are going to challenge for top 4.

The Chelsea game is a big test though. If they implode there, then it may be difficult for them to recover from that. But until then, I would treat them as definite top 4 contenders.

Unless Pool implode I just can't see then getting into the top 4. City, United, Chelsea, Spurs and Pool are all better than them. And I can see their second half of the season ruined because of the contract situation with their major players.

 

[dichinero]

Yeah but we came away with a major european trophy and qualification to the champions league. Still, Koln are 6/1 tonight so if Arse won't be taking it seriously there is a good chance they will get beat.

They are not us so ambitions might be slightly different.

 

[JSArsenal]

Wenger, a few weeks ago said EL winners shouldn't get an automatic CL place. That's a bit of context.

I think you're also taking that statement out of context.

In that same interview he also said that he will always play a team that can win the next game, statement that applies to both the League and Europa.

What he was protesting against, is that teams will deliberately play much weaker teams in the league and "let some games go" so to speak in order to focus on the Europa League as a route to get into the Champions League. Whereas he thinks a team should always try to win every single game in the league and should select their best team in order to do so. Would Wenger practice what he preaches if we had a CL semi-final against Real Madrid preceded by a home game against Bournemouth? Who knows, but that is what he was trying to say.

He also made the point that making it a route into the Champions League is pointless as the teams who have won it recently automatically qualified for the Champions League anyway (except Man Utd). I would have to verify if that assertion is true but its the point he was trying to make.

I understand his rationale there as well and there was nothing outlandish about those comments, even though I disagree with them.

The end point is, he's stating that Europa League winners shouldn't qualify for CL for other reasons and not because he thinks the Europa League is unworthy or a lesser competition.

 

[oneniltothearsenal]

This is the manager of a club that for its rich history, has no European trophy
There's also talk that a host of first team players will be rested for their EL game.

Is this the right mentality?
At the start of last season, I was desperate for us to take the tournament seriously and I'm thoroughly glad we did.

Not to me. In fact I think it sums up everything that I feel is wrong with the current Wenger mentality.
Preferring to qualify for the league via Top 4 instead of winning his first European trophy and qualifying through getting a trophy for Arsenal's barren European cabinet sounds utterly bonkers to me. To me it shows a mentality of not trying to be the best at something but rather just trying to be good enough. It is aiming for the trees instead of aiming for the stars.

Wenger's comments have a negative effect on both the players and fans. A manager, imo, should never disregard trying to win a competition that offers a trophy as it de-motivates our players. It also reinforces an odd subtle mindset - the mix of hubris and being too good for a competition combined with a lackadaisical attitude towards actually winning. It is not good for reinforcing a winning mentality throughout the squad. It does reinforce a pick up your pay checks and have a laugh after a loss mindset.

Then it is just disrespectful to us long time fans. Sorry Mr. Wenger but some of us actually cared about winning against Galatasaray! Some of us actually wanted to win this trophy! Some of us crave European trophies much more than yet another FA Cup! And to say you would rather get Top 4 and win nothing than win a European trophy? It's bonkers I say. Truly and utterly bonkers. If any gooner disagrees with me I will happily debate this point.

 

[Santi_Mesut_Alexis_87]

At this stage I don't think we can trust his judgement. I mean this is the same guy who plays a RB at LWB, full backs at CB, rests his best GK in the CL and spends a fortune on a striker only to bench him against his rivals.

Exactly. He doesn't play mind games. He does really think what he says.

 

[Rolandofgilead]

They are not us so ambitions might be slightly different.

They have no ambition at all it would seem.

 

[ShakeUnBake]

So the man that makes the top four every year but never wins a trophy has declared he prefers making top four over winning trophies?

Say it isn't so.

 

[arthurka]

Of course you would Arsene...