Asian teams in Qatar

[huyn]

Since Africa and South America have their own thread, I figured I'd start one for Asia.

As it stands, Asia is the second region with 3 qualified teams in the last 16 behind Europe's 7 and in front of South America's 2, Africa's 2 and Concacaf's 1. Africa can tie at second if Cameroon goes through tonight (they need to do what South Korea did this afternoon and have the same luck as well). We can also add Saudi Arabia's honorable performance with that giant upset over Argentina and two close losses. It shows the progress from the region as a whole, especially since those teams (except for Japan) mostly rely on players who play in their domestic leagues.

This thread will probably be short-lived as it'll die down after the round of 16 since only Japan has a slight chance of making it to the quarters in my opinion and Croatia will still be favored. Despite being korean I think Australia has a better chance of going through, we've been the less convincing team among the 3 and we're facing the favorites of the tournament.

 

[DevilRed]

Both been brilliant this tournament.

Always positive and looking to attack.

Never giving up.

 

[Rood]

Is the World Cup being held in Asia (for only the 2nd time and 20yrs since the first one) a major factor in the performance of Asian teams?

There was some plonker in another thread suggesting that Asia should only get the World Cup every 50years because their players are too shit

 

[RedTiger]

It's nice you've put Australia in with AFC. You're a step ahead of most footie commentators who keep saying only 2 teams have qualified for the next round.

 

[Giggsyking]

3 teams, asia deserves more spots next worldcup.

 

[huyn]

It's nice you've put Australia in with AFC. You're a step ahead of most footie commentators who keep saying only 2 teams have qualified for the next round.

Of course. While I would never teach my daughter that Australia is in Asia when it comes to geography, for football they are part of the Asian region and that's where they should be. The old system was not fair for them, having to stomp their way through meaningless qualifiers just to play deciding matches against teams from superior regions, they rarely qualified and were never going to improve that way. You could also argue, and I'm not going to because I'm not an expert on Asian football, but it's entirely possible that their inclusion in AFC has contributed to the improvement of the region. It's good for the continent to have a third team able to challenge SK and Japan as they've always had an easy shared domination over the region.

 

[Scandi Red]

3 teams, asia deserves more spots next worldcup.

Starting from the next world cup there will be 48 teams. It would be weird if the AFC didn't get more spots. They only have 4 guaranteed spots now, I think?

 

[nickp91]

South Korea and Japan in the Round of 16 Feels like 2002 all over again

 

[RedTiger]

Of course. While I would never teach my daughter that Australia is in Asia when it comes to geography, for football they are part of the Asian region and that's where they should be. The old system was not fair for them, having to stomp their way through meaningless qualifiers just to play deciding matches against teams from superior regions, they rarely qualified and were never going to improve that way. You could also argue, and I'm not going to because I'm not an expert on Asian football, but it's entirely possible that their inclusion in AFC has contributed to the improvement of the region. It's good for the continent to have a third team able to challenge SK and Japan as they've always had an easy shared domination over the region.

The question is whether Australia decide to go back to Oceania due to their permanent WC spot in 4 years time.

 

[huyn]

Starting from the next world cup there will be 48 teams. It would be weird if the AFC didn't get more spots. They only have 4 guaranteed spots now, I think?

Yes 4 guaranteed spots, 5 if you include Qatar as the host, Australia beat Peru in qualifiers to make it to Qatar.

 

[huyn]

The question is whether Australia decide to go back to Oceania due to their permanent WC spot in 4 years time.

Obviously they're free to do as they see fit, but even though they struggled in the qualifiers for this WC, they had a tough group, and their showing in Qatar should make them confident about their worth. Also there'll be more spots for every continent next WC so they should be a lock in if they stay in Asia as there's a huge gap between the top 6 and the rest.

 

[Lay]

3 teams, asia deserves more spots next worldcup.

They have 8 spots for the next World Cup.

Anyway, they've done remarkably well. Qatar and Iran starting so poorly made it seem it will be a disaster showing as Japan, South Korea and Australia were in difficult groups. Great for them all. Hope Japan can make the quarters.

 

[Scandi Red]

They have 8 spots for the next World Cup.

It's definitely not unfair, but Japan, South Korea, Australia and Iran will sleep-walk through the qualifiers from now on. Now there's at least a small threat of failing.

I hope there will be some sort of reward for finishing 1st(and 2nd if the groups are big). Perhaps the winner should be given a top seed spot for the WC? That would certainly make things more interesting.

 

[Kopral Jono]

Without veering into stereotyping -- all AFC representatives at this World Cup play with different styles -- the common thread between them is unmatched resilience. What they lack in quality they more than make up for in effort and togetherness.

The rest of the world should take note.

 

[Cal?]

South Korea and Japan in the Round of 16 Feels like 2002 all over again

Japan v Korea in the QF to guarantee an AFC team in the SF?

 

[World Game]

The question is whether Australia decide to go back to Oceania due to their permanent WC spot in 4 years time.

Doubt it, being in AFC lets us host/participate in Asian Cup and our clubs participate in the Asian Champions League. We will stomp other Oceanian teams but are around the same level as the top Asian teams. So more competitiveness and money all round.

Being in AFC benefits everyone. Being part of Oceania benefits no one. WC qualification will be easy either way.

 

[Kopral Jono]

Qatar aside, Asian teams this World Cup showed everyone they weren't just there to make up the numbers. Saudi Arabia were unlucky not to get anything in the Poland game. Iran, despite everything, were one result away from going through. Australia had a solid game plan and even managed to give Argentina a late scare on Saturday. South Korea were involved in the best game of this tournament so far and made Suarez cry. Japan, along with the small matter of beating Germany and Spain in the process, on another day could have beaten Croatia if it wasn't for managerial cowardice after taking the lead.

Eight spots for the next expanded World Cup sounds just about right.

 

[Scandi Red]

Eight spots for the next expanded World Cup sounds just about right.

There is a pretty big gap down to the other teams, no? The 7th and 8th ranked teams are gonna have a brutal time in the world cup based on the current level. I still agree with 8 spots, though. With as many as 48 teams competing it's only right. Anything less than 6 would have been an insult.

What I want to see more than anything is some form of reward for the highest ranking team from Asia(and Africa for that matter). It's crazy that the best team in Asia practically never will get into Pot 1 or 2, even when they deserve it. The FIFA ranking system is a complete mess and I have no idea how we can fix it, but I think a start would be to reserve 3 spots in the Pot 1/2 for the best Asian, African and CONCACAF nation. That would give a massive competitive boost to these confederations.

 

[Charrockero]

Except Qatar, all Asian teams showed lots of quality.

Unfortunately, Football is a sport where generally the same teams always win... Europeans + Brazil & Argentina.

After this WC, I expect myself to watch even less football.

 

[Cantonagotmehere]

Both been brilliant this tournament.

Always positive and looking to attack.

Never giving up.

Love watching the play, totally agree.

 

[Kopral Jono]

There is a pretty big gap down to the other teams, no? The 7th and 8th ranked teams are gonna have a brutal time in the world cup based on the current level. I still agree with 8 spots, though. With as many as 48 teams competing it's only right. Anything less than 6 would have been an insult.

What I want to see more than anything is some form of reward for the highest ranking team from Asia(and Africa for that matter). It's crazy that the best team in Asia practically never will get into Pot 1 or 2, even when they deserve it. The FIFA ranking system is a complete mess and I have no idea how we can fix it, but I think a start would be to reserve 3 spots in the Pot 1/2 for the best Asian, African and CONCACAF nation. That would give a massive competitive boost to these confederations.

The gap in Asia between the top dogs and bottom-feeders is indeed a big one. I would say the sixth, seventh and eighth best teams are Qatar, the Emirates and Oman respectively and judging from the only team among those three competing in this tournament it does look quite bleak, but four years is decent amount of time for everyone to get their acts together (Iraq and Syria are other teams to look out for). I find it kinda funny, though, how the final decision to expand the World Cup was partly fuelled by Fifa's eagerness to include China -- the largest untapped market in world football by a comfortable margin -- more often and yet their national team are nowhere near the level required, or at least not in the near future.

Your proposition is a solid one and would make for a very interesting group stage. This would also be on merit rather than favours -- I personally regard the likes of Senegal and Japan to be somewhere around the level of Uruguay and Mexico but just below second-tier European teams. Another welcome change to the current system would be for the winners of Oceania qualifying to go straight into the final round of AFC qualifying instead of direct World Cup qualification. That footballing desert is in desperate need for competition for their own sake and I see no other way than what I just proposed.

 

[Scandi Red]

Your proposition is a solid one and would make for a very interesting group stage. This would also be on merit rather than favours -- I personally regard the likes of Senegal and Japan to be somewhere around the level of Uruguay and Mexico but just below second-tier European teams. Another welcome change to the current system would be for the winners of Oceania qualifying to go straight into the final round of AFC qualifying instead of direct World Cup qualification. That footballing desert is in desperate need for competition for their own sake and I see no other way than what I just proposed.

Yeah, I think that generally speaking the best Asian, African and CONCACAF nations should be ranked somewhere between 12 and 20(regardless of that the FIFA ranking says).

Pot 1 and 2 contain the top 15 + the host today, so we wouldn't really be making dramatic any changes with my suggestion. But speaking as a European, I know that there will be a lot of whining here the moment a traditional powerhouse inevitably gets placed in Pot 3.

 

[Rood]

Yeah, I think that generally speaking the best Asian, African and CONCACAF nations should be ranked somewhere between 12 and 20(regardless of that the FIFA ranking says).

Pot 1 and 2 contain the top 15 + the host today, so we wouldn't really be making dramatic any changes with my suggestion. But speaking as a European, I know that there will be a lot of whining here the moment a traditional powerhouse inevitably gets placed in Pot 3.

They already are - USA, Mexico, Senegal and Iran are all in the Top 20

Asia have outperformed in this tournament with 3 teams in the knockouts and even the other 2 winning group matches so have a decent argument for more spots

Based on this World Cup the Americas have too many spots with only 1 CONCACAF team and 2 CONMEBOL making it through the group stage

I guess the fight for WC places is not a big deal anymore though anyway due to the expansion to 48

 

[tenpoless]

Well it was fun. Wanted Japan to go through though.

 

[Andre Kagawa]

Well it was fun. Wanted Japan to go through though.

Same I hate penalties.

 

[Scandi Red]

They already are - USA, Mexico, Senegal and Iran are all in the Top 20

True, but this is not always the case. And the cut-off for Pot 2 is around rank 15, depending on the host nation(s). So Senegal and Iran both ended up in Pot 3 despite being the best in their massive confederations.

In my system Senegal and Iran would have made it into Pot 2.

 

[FrankFoot]

They already are - USA, Mexico, Senegal and Iran are all in the Top 20

Asia have outperformed in this tournament with 3 teams in the knockouts and even the other 2 winning group matches so have a decent argument for more spots

Based on this World Cup the Americas have too many spots with only 1 CONCACAF team and 2 CONMEBOL making it through the group stage

I guess the fight for WC places is not a big deal anymore though anyway due to the expansion to 48

Yeah, in Conmebol we can't complain really...next WC we have 6.5 spots for 10 teams, that's basically most of south american teams going to the next WC, you have to be extremely bad to miss the next qualification.

I'm glad cause that means Chile is mostly going, but then again the overall quality of the WC is gonna be underwhelming with so many teams.

 

[huyn]

I'm pretty happy overall with the performances of Asian teams at this WC. Qatar was the most disappointing by far, they should have been one of the best asian teams, they were playing at home and coming as Asian Champions. I was shocked by how bad they were. Iran and Saudi Arabia both managed to win a game and showed that they belong.
Australia, Japan and South Korea keep improving, I think the future is bright. Unlike most small football countries, they are rich countries with infrastructures and means to keep improving. Getting to KO stage for Aus and SK is good, Japan can be disappointed since they could have gone further if they had trained penalties at least once.

 

[Rood]

I'm pretty happy overall with the performances of Asian teams at this WC. Qatar was the most disappointing by far, they should have been one of the best asian teams, they were playing at home and coming as Asian Champions. I was shocked by how bad they were. Iran and Saudi Arabia both managed to win a game and showed that they belong.
Australia, Japan and South Korea keep improving, I think the future is bright. Unlike most small football countries, they are rich countries with infrastructures and means to keep improving. Getting to KO stage for Aus and SK is good, Japan can be disappointed since they could have gone further if they had trained penalties at least once.

Cannot understand how this crap Qatar team won the Asia Cup beating Saudi, South Korea and Japan on the way

I suppose it was 3 years ago already so lots can change and Italy won the Euro Cup then didn't even qualify

 

[Foxbatt]

Cannot understand how this crap Qatar team won the Asia Cup beating Saudi, South Korea and Japan on the way

I suppose it was 3 years ago already so lots can change and Italy won the Euro Cup then didn't even qualify

In 2015 it took them a bent referee who played more than 9 mins of extra time for them to beat Maldives 0-1. I really also don't understand how they beat the Saudis, Koreans and the Japanese.

 

[Winrar]

Qatar being as crap as they were was really disappointing. They are Asian champions after all, and beat comparatively good teams to win it.
Saudi Arabia with an all-time shocker against Argentina early in the tournament was fantastic to see. They used the offside trap really well to sink Argentina attacks. They didn't even play that badly in the games they lost, too.
Iran could've shown better better than they were, but they still have 1 win from Wales.
Aside from their first game against France, the socceroos have impressed as well with 2 wins afterwards and putting up a good performance against Argentina.
Japan impressed by more than holding their own against some of Europe's best teams. Shame they flubbed the penalties against Croatia.
Last but not least, my motherland Korea looked threatening in attack and put up a serious fight overall, but our overall lack of discipline was eventually gonna cost us badly and it did so against a world class Brazil side.

I've been hoping to break our AFC asian cup jinx (haven't won it ourselves since 1960), but it's gonna be incredibly tough. Asian teams overall look better than I've seen in many years.

 

[huyn]

Cannot understand how this crap Qatar team won the Asia Cup beating Saudi, South Korea and Japan on the way

I suppose it was 3 years ago already so lots can change and Italy won the Euro Cup then didn't even qualify

I remember that quarter against us, it was a boring game, their keeper was unbeatable, we dominated and got more chances but they scored a long range screamer late in the game. Ali, their striker, was on fire whole tournament, he scored a bicycle kick early in the final against Japan then the same guy who scored that screamer against us scored another one afterwards and the match was over. They had luck on their side but cant say they didnt deserve to win.

 

[dasty]

Cannot understand how this crap Qatar team won the Asia Cup beating Saudi, South Korea and Japan on the way

I suppose it was 3 years ago already so lots can change and Italy won the Euro Cup then didn't even qualify

Qatar basically killed their own chances by pausing their domestic league 2 months earlier than other leagues so that their players can all train together longer for the World Cup. Players need competitive games to stay match fit yet they spent the 2 months basically just training and playing friendlies. It's a disastrous decision and it showed in their performances.

 

[Kopral Jono]

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I said in another thread that Japan's saved penalties, while none were convincingly struck, bar their first were better than all of Spain's and that on a different day Livakovic could have gone the other way on each one. This seems to have confirmed my suspicions that it was indeed the case.

 

[FootballHQ]

There is a pretty big gap down to the other teams, no? The 7th and 8th ranked teams are gonna have a brutal time in the world cup based on the current level. I still agree with 8 spots, though. With as many as 48 teams competing it's only right. Anything less than 6 would have been an insult.

What I want to see more than anything is some form of reward for the highest ranking team from Asia(and Africa for that matter). It's crazy that the best team in Asia practically never will get into Pot 1 or 2, even when they deserve it. The FIFA ranking system is a complete mess and I have no idea how we can fix it, but I think a start would be to reserve 3 spots in the Pot 1/2 for the best Asian, African and CONCACAF nation. That would give a massive competitive boost to these confederations.

It was five already with Australia making it through the play offs so wouldn't say three extra teams is a huge leap compared to what other confederations are getting.

Fifa are desperate to see China make World cups regularly so this is one way of giving them a better chance, Qatar will be in the mix regularly after getting a taste and hopefully UAE will wake up a bit as they have potential to be regular World cup participants. Uzbekistan are also a nearly team since they moved from europe so increased chances. Also offers chance of a real feelgood qualification like Syria who narrowly lost out to Australia in 2018 play off.

 

[Zetrio2002]

The qualifying route for Australia is ridiculously long. It's amazing they even made it. Probably the players got better because they played so many games.

Luckily it was single game playoffs for Australia this time round.