SER19
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In any case he's not a worthy winner imoIt's really more about the 2020-2021 season than the 2021-2022 season otherwise they wouldn't close voting in october and have the award in November.
In any case he's not a worthy winner imoIt's really more about the 2020-2021 season than the 2021-2022 season otherwise they wouldn't close voting in october and have the award in November.
It's between him and Lewandowski. Either imo is fair. Lewa should at least have a 2020 Ballon D'or in retrospect whether or not he wins this one. Messi had a great individual season for Barca and had a great copa.In any case he's not a worthy winner imo
It’s Danny Wellwide.Danny Welbeck deserves a look in
3rd in domestic league and battered out of Europe. Obviously this is an individual award and he had an individually excellent season but can't help but feel he's riding a wave of reputation here. All in all i don't think i care really, individual awards are often nonsenseIt's between him and Lewandowski. Either imo is fair. Lewa should at least have a 2020 Ballon D'or in retrospect whether or not he wins this one. Messi had a great individual season for Barca and had a great copa.
So an individual award awarded to a player for having a great individual period is that player riding a wave of reputation. You can argue about other players being more deserving, but to discard Messi because of his team's failure, especially when we can now see how bad they are without him, and it was basically him dragging them to whatever position they were at last season. Context is important.3rd in domestic league and battered out of Europe. Obviously this is an individual award and he had an individually excellent season but can't help but feel he's riding a wave of reputation here. All in all i don't think i care really, individual awards are often nonsense
Having an execellent indivdual season is kind of the point of the award. If it's supposed to be fair.3rd in domestic league and battered out of Europe. Obviously this is an individual award and he had an individually excellent season but can't help but feel he's riding a wave of reputation here. All in all i don't think i care really, individual awards are often nonsense
The COPA title obviously plays a big role, he ended up best player of the tournament despite his bad final. Lewa didn't have a single win with Poland during the euro and ended up last of the group, he was injured for the most important CL when Bayern lost to PSG, that's the tie breaker imo (even if he's not responsable for those bad performances). If it wasn't for the COPA, Lewa would have easily won.3rd in domestic league and battered out of Europe. Obviously this is an individual award and he had an individually excellent season but can't help but feel he's riding a wave of reputation here. All in all i don't think i care really, individual awards are often nonsense
I will not say Messi just had few good games at Copa.Feel for Lewandowski. He has been by far the best player in the world the last two years and did not get this award as the first Pole ever because they cancelled it and Messi basically had a few good games at Copa America, even though Lewa himself was great at Euro in an awful team.
The way I see it Lewandowski had a much higher number of goals (41 v 30) while providing a similar number of assists (7 v 9) in the league in fewer games (29 v 36). They had the exact same number of CL goals while Lewa’s team went further in competition and would have very likely made it even further had he been healthy for QFs against Paris.I will not say Messi just had few good games at Copa.
Messi had an excellent 2020/21, especially this year onwards till Copa, when he had the most number of goals and assists.
Argentina and Barcelona were basically give the ball to Messi and pray, at least Argentina played a solid anti-football filled with play acting and fouling at every instance, and a phenomenal Emi Martinez in the goal, which helped them not crumble under pressure like Barcelona.
We tend to overlook how Messi and Cristiano were basically saving the ass of Juve/Portugal and Barcelona/Argentina in Euros and Copa, and club season. Especially at club, given both sides had incompetent coaches.
Lewandowski had similar thing with Poland, not saying he had easy, and I am not one of those who say Bundesliga is easy hence Lewa scores so much, when he is basically scoring at same rate in UCL and Euros.
Modric got a Ballon Dor without a WC medal. Made the final though. Personally I agree that Lewandowski deserved it, but I don't think most goals scored should be the only metric. I think though with Lewandowski breaking Mullers bundesliga record he deserves it.The way I see it Lewandowski had a much higher number of goals (41 v 30) while providing a similar number of assists (7 v 9) in the league in fewer games (29 v 36). They had the exact same number of CL goals while Lewa’s team went further in competition and would have very likely made it even further had he been healthy for QFs against Paris.
The other difference between them was that Messi played for one of the two strongest teams in South America and hence was able to be successful at Copa America while Lewandowski played for one of the weakest teams at Euro and despite his heroic efforts (he scored 3 out of 4 goals that we scored) he was not able to get them anywhere due to their inept midfield and defense.
Messi had a good year, Lewandowski had a historic year beating a 40-year old record that many thought couldn’t be broken - and he did that while being injured for 5 games.
It’s quite obvious these days that you can’t win this without getting a WC/Euro medal if you aren’t Ronaldo or Messi, which is a bit tedious to be honest. A player like Lewandowski has zero chance because he will never be successful with his national team and what he does for Bayern can at most give him second best after Messi/Ronaldo in any given year. A lot is said about him being robbed in 2020 but I’m almost sure it would have gone to Messi anyway.
Which was the other one?Undeserved for sure. 2nd undeserved one for him overall.
Most of the people think 2010 was undeserved because they think Sneijder deserved it.Which was the other one?
He didn't have a great individual season.Having an execellent indivdual season is kind of the point of the award. If it's supposed to be fair.
Messi was much better player than Sneijder that season though. Sneijder was great at inter and won the trebl, but that Inter side was a collective not the Sneijder show. If Robben had converted that chance he would've won it probably.Most of the people think 2010 was undeserved because they think Sneijder deserved it.
Some people 2019 was deserves by Van Dijk.
I disagree on both accounts tbh. Especially so on Van Dijk.Most of the people think 2010 was undeserved because they think Sneijder deserved it.
Some people 2019 was deserves by Van Dijk.
He did. It was only because of him that Barcelona got near a title challenge and he was la liga topscorer as usual and and then he was copa player of the tournament.He didn't have a great individual season.
Let it go. He doesn't play for you anymore.Messi scored in 15/21 league games for a decent at best Barca side in 2021. Assisted in 3 of those 6. He practically had 3 games with no productivity. 23 goals and 8 assists.
Won Copa America and Copa Del Rey(scored 2 in the final). Was the best player at Copa and had 9 goals/assists in 7 games.
Started poorly at PSG but also had injury problems since the Copa. 3 goals in 3 CL games is very good.
Lewandowski won a league title. His club just got pumped 5-0 out of the German cup early on with him playing.
Lewandowski has scored in 24/27 league games in 2021. Scoring 36 and 7 assists.
Both have been excellent in 2021, people also are overplaying Messi's Ligue 1 form. Hes started 4 games and was subbed off injured in one of them.
Both are deserving off the award taking everything into consideration, the way people act like Lewandowski clearly deserves it over Messi like in 2020 is absurd.
Great reply, such an asset to the forum.Let it go. He doesn't play for you anymore.
Slight difference is that Lewandowski is a striker leading the line in an extremely well drilled team. Messi is a playmaker in a dysfunctional team still maintaining a comparable goal record to the most prolific scorers in the world. It's old but there still is nothing comparable to that.The way I see it Lewandowski had a much higher number of goals (41 v 30) while providing a similar number of assists (7 v 9) in the league in fewer games (29 v 36). They had the exact same number of CL goals while Lewa’s team went further in competition and would have very likely made it even further had he been healthy for QFs against Paris.
The other difference between them was that Messi played for one of the two strongest teams in South America and hence was able to be successful at Copa America while Lewandowski played for one of the weakest teams at Euro and despite his heroic efforts (he scored 3 out of 4 goals that we scored) he was not able to get them anywhere due to their inept midfield and defense.
Messi had a good year, Lewandowski had a historic year beating a 40-year old record that many thought couldn’t be broken - and he did that while being injured for 5 games.
It’s quite obvious these days that you can’t win this without getting a WC/Euro medal if you aren’t Ronaldo or Messi, which is a bit tedious to be honest. A player like Lewandowski has zero chance because he will never be successful with his national team and what he does for Bayern can at most give him second best after Messi/Ronaldo in any given year. A lot is said about him being robbed in 2020 but I’m almost sure it would have gone to Messi anyway.
Nah. It shows in statistics and heat maps as well. He's in a cluster of his own.This argument is literally just mysticism.
I agree. But I was talking about the ones which is generally debated by people.Messi was much better player than Sneijder that season though. Sneijder was great at inter and won the trebl, but that Inter side was a collective not the Sneijder show. If Robben had converted that chance he would've won it probably.
Yup, Van Dijk actually failed when facing Messi, conceding three goals, until he got his ass bailed by his teammates.I disagree on both accounts tbh. Especially so on Van Dijk.
Barcelona lost to better teams. I agree botching his penalty against PSG was one of his cock ups. Difference between Messi and Lewandowski is that Messi has a burden of having to do much more, he's not a pure striker. And that Barcelona side was bang average.Messi was mediocre against Real Madrid this year, his team lost. He was decent against PSG, his team lost 1-4. In the second game he was playing well, then missed a penalty that would have put Barcelona up 1-2, which killed any comeback momentum. He was good against Atletico, but did not score or assist. The game ended 0-0.
When Lukaku does shit like this people correctly identify it as what it is.
Heat maps against Getafe.Nah. It shows in statistics and heat maps as well. He's in a cluster of his own.
It kind of depends, should the Ballon D'or go to the best player to the one who one the most with his team or should go to player who had the best individual season? For me since it's an individual award it should to to the player who was best individually.I agree. But I was talking about the ones which is generally debated by people.
Yup, Van Dijk actually failed when facing Messi, conceding three goals, until he got his ass bailed by his teammates.
I'm pretty confident he could reproduce that against the likes of Stuttgart and Hertha BSC as well.Heat maps against Getafe.
Great reply, such an asset to the forum.
Yeah, Liverpool won the CL and Van Dijk was key to their defense but Messi(who apparently can't do it without Xavi and Iniesta) scored 51 goals and got 22 assists in 50 games in a Barcelona side that was average for it standards. And then of course there is stuff like dribbles, chances created, passes completed etc. Even Van Dijk agreed that Messi deserved to win it.Yup, Van Dijk actually failed when facing Messi, conceding three goals, until he got his ass bailed by his teammates.