Benjamin Mendy charged with eight counts of rape against five women | Released on Bail

[UncleBob]

Not to defend dickheads who think because they have money and status every girl wants to sleep with them, but I'm sure there's a fair share of women looking for some quick "shut up and go away" cash also, so maybe it's fairly common? Not many footballers get done for this in the end which probably says a lot about the justice system and it's view on rape/sexual assault more than anything...

how so?

 

[villain]

In th UK, "bail" is a set of conditions (eg don't leave your town) rather than a monetary payment.

I'm pretty sure bail bonds (like you get in the USA) aren't a thing in the UK.

Happy to be corrected on this of course.

You are correct. Bail bonds are just the icing on a corrupt justice system cake in America.

 

[TheReligion]

Definition of a corrupt judiciary system

he won't get bail

He hasn't got bail. That's the point. It was turned down and he's been remanded in custody until next month.

In th UK, "bail" is a set of conditions (eg don't leave your town) rather than a monetary payment.

I'm pretty sure bail bonds (like you get in the USA) aren't a thing in the UK.

Happy to be corrected on this of course.

Yeah we still do use that. You can pay a security or surety can be put down on your behalf by someone suitable.

It doesn't happen very often but it still is in UK law to be considered by the courts as a means of mitigating the risk of the defendant absconding.

 

[crossy1686]

how so?

It's hard to prove you were sexually assaulted when prosecution suggest you were up for being molested because you got in a taxi with the accused and went back to their hotel. This has only just started to change in recent years but you still see cases getting thrown out because someone under the influence went back to someone's home.

 

[duffer]

Yeah we still do use that. You can pay a security or surety can be put down on your behalf by someone suitable.

It doesn't happen very often but it still is in UK law to be considered by the courts as a means of mitigating the risk of the defendant absconding.

Interesting, thanks.

I think we can all agree that the risk of losing £50k for Mendy would zero deterrent of him fecking off out the country.

 

[Tarrou]

He hasn't got bail. That's the point. It was turned down and he's been remanded in custody until next month.

Yeah I know. Was responding to a hypothetical where a bail fee was set.

 

[Classical Mechanic]

He gets another bail hearing with a more senior judge next month doesn't he? I can imagine some uproar from women's groups if he gets bail given the circumstances of the charges against him.

 

[TheReligion]

Interesting, thanks.

I think we can all agree that the risk of losing £50k for Mendy would zero deterrent of him fecking off out the country.

Oh agreed and that's why it's been turned down and he's sat in prison.

When you haven't been charged the presumption is to give bail where you can. When you have been charged this changes though and the presumption is to not grant bail. That's the go to. The mindset changes.

From that starting point you then look at the grounds to oppose bail based on the character of the defendant. So things like does he offend on bail, is he a risk to the public, does he break conditions. These must be objective as opposed to being subjective. You then look at the strength of evidence too.

It appears Mendy has breached bail previously and committed an offence on bail. Given the nature of the offences you could also argue he's a risk to the public.

Then you look at what can be done to mitigate these risks and post charge change the presumption. This is difficult to do especially when you consider what he's done whilst given bail previously.

 

[cyberman]

So was he under investigation for the previous rapes while playing for City?

 

[TheReligion]

So was he under investigation for the previous rapes while playing for City?

Yeah it looks as though he's been on bail for quite some time. Which is normal as with sexual offences there's often forensic evidence to examine.

 

[Cloud7]

Man, I can truly never understand things like this. IF these allegations turn out to be true, it's just....why? Like I really can't wrap my mind around it, short of said person just being broken in the head.

You have everything, literally everything, that a man could want. You have more money than you could spend in your lifetime. Fame. You're a fit, world famous athlete who can get almost anyone he goes after. The entire world is at your feet for the rest of your life, because you're good at playing football, something that people do for fun, you can live in the lap of luxury for the rest of your life because of it.

And you go and throw it all away like this.

 

[UncleBob]

It's hard to prove you were sexually assaulted when prosecution suggest you were up for being molested because you got in a taxi with the accused and went back to their hotel. This has only just started to change in recent years but you still see cases getting thrown out because someone under the influence went back to someone's home.

Weird take. The problem, in cases without technical evidence, is that it's always going to come down to word against word. If multiple people tell a very similar story then it's easier, but single cases where you can't actually prove anything then what are you supposed to do?

 

[Oldyella]

He was arrested last year for an allegation and was on bail for those offences.

He was then arrested this week (Thursday, I believe) for a further allegation that led to him being charged and remanded.

I remember the initial rumours about it all because people were saying it was Greenwood who had been arrested.

One of his bail conditions was to hold no house parties. He did over Christmas. Sure it was mentioned at the time, although it said City were investigating for reasons of breaking lockdown. Obviously more was going on that the public weren't aware of. Were the club, even then?

 

[cyberman]

Yeah it looks as though he's been on bail for quite some time. Which is normal as with sexual offences there's often forensic evidence to examine.

That’s not a good look for City. City should have taken action long before this

 

[Withnail]

In th UK, "bail" is a set of conditions (eg don't leave your town) rather than a monetary payment.

I'm pretty sure bail bonds (like you get in the USA) aren't a thing in the UK.

Happy to be corrected on this of course.

I thought that you may have to pay a sum that you get back if you comply with all of the conditions and if you couldn't pay the deposit then you're remanded in custody.

 

[duffer]

I thought that you had to pay a sum that you get back if you comply with all of the conditions and if you couldn't pay the deposit then you're remanded in custody.

That would be ridiculously biased against poor people.

 

[Sandikan]

Why do these threads get locked btw?

Because they can cause problems for website owners with the law.
Both in allowing falsehoods, and also the risk of taking away the right to a fair trial if anyone involved in the case such as the jury comes in with pre existing biases.

 

[Withnail]

That would be ridiculously biased against poor people.

Sorry I edited to "may have to". Obviously that would be dependent on the severity of the case, likelihood to abscond etc.

Irish law is very similar to UK and in high profile cases I've seen instances where bail has been set at 50k/100k etc.

 

[WeePat]

Man, I can truly never understand things like this. IF these allegations turn out to be true, it's just....why? Like I really can't wrap my mind around it, short of said person just being broken in the head.

You have everything, literally everything, that a man could want. You have more money than you could spend in your lifetime. Fame. You're a fit, world famous athlete who can get almost anyone he goes after. The entire world is at your feet for the rest of your life, because you're good at playing football, something that people do for fun, you can live in the lap of luxury for the rest of your life because of it.

And you go and throw it all away like this.

Most people have something going for them. Most people stand to lose something huge if they get caught up in something as serious as this. A footballer like Mendy doesn't stand to lose more than you and I relatively speaking, yet women suffer these attacks daily. So clearly losing everything or a lot of what you have isn't and has never been a deterrent when it comes to certain types of people.

 

[Bebestation]

@crossy1686

I agree. It obviously needs evidence - just because the women has highlighted that they were raped doesn't exactly make it true.

This happens alot either way, just as much as women may get raped, there are women who have sex with rich men to trick them for compensation money through law.

See it in sports, music and plenty other entertainment basis.

 

[Tom Cato]

He needs to be on suicidewatch. I cant even fathom the enormity of having your whole existence disappear before your eyes and your life effectively ruined.

Even if aquitted no team will hire him again, professional life is over for Benjamin Mendy

 

[Tom Cato]

Why do these threads get locked btw?

He's not been sentenced, only charged. I assume its to not foster a space where people can make unfounded speculation, contribute to harassment, and the ever looming population that just cant help be racist.

 

[RUCK4444]

@crossy1686

I agree. It obviously needs evidence - just because the women has highlighted that they were raped doesn't exactly make it true.

This happens alot either way, just as much as women may get raped, there are women who have sex with rich men to trick them for compensation money through law.

See it in sports, music and plenty other entertainment basis.

I agree. Although the fact he's been remanded with no bail is a bit telling isn't it?

You would think they have a bit more evidence to remand him, perhaps it's just the fact there are multiple accounts from different women.

We shouldn't speculate though.

 

[Cloud7]

Most people have something going for them. Most people stand to lose something huge if they get caught up in something as serious as this. A footballer like Mendy doesn't stand to lose more than you and I relatively speaking, yet women suffer these attacks daily. So clearly losing everything or a lot of what you have isn't and has never been a deterrent when it comes to certain types of people.

You are right about that I guess. Which goes back to what I said, you really just have to be broken in the head to do something like this.

 

[DomesticTadpole]

By the way do only poor men rape. Just because someone has money does not mean they cannot be a rapist. Rapists have a mindset, it has nothing to do with money or lack of. It is their view of women.

 

[K Stand Knut]

One of his bail conditions was to hold no house parties. He did over Christmas. Sure it was mentioned at the time, although it said City were investigating for reasons of breaking lockdown. Obviously more was going on that the public weren't aware of. Were the club, even then?

Quite possibly.

Not holding house parties would be a very strange bail condition to impose though, IMO

 

[duffer]

Even if aquitted no team will hire him again, professional life is over for Benjamin Mendy

Nonsense. If he'd acquitted he'll get plenty of offers. Even a shit player like Ched Evans is playing pro football and he actually went to prison for rape.

 

[UnitedFire]

Guy on bail for rape can’t resist going out and doing it again. I wonder how many more will come out. Innocent until proven guilty of course but on the evidence so far it looks pretty grim

Can't resist or knows he is going down so doesn't care.....! Sounds like he should never have been on bail.

 

[UnitedFire]

Nonsense. If he'd acquitted he'll get plenty of offers. Even a shit player like Ched Evans is playing pro football and he actually went to prison for rape.

Evans was later acquitted.

 

[Classical Mechanic]

Quite possibly.

Not holding house parties would be a very strange bail condition to impose though, IMO

If he's alleged to have raped someone at a house party at his house then it seems pretty logical restriction to impose on him.

 

[Tom Cato]

Nonsense. If he'd acquitted he'll get plenty of offers. Even a shit player like Ched Evans is playing pro football and he actually went to prison for rape.

I immediately regretted the wording of my post.

I should have written "No team in the professional top fligths in Europe". He'll have plenty of offers from lower division teams in Europe or outside the continent.

 

[duffer]

Evans was later acquitted.

Yep, and went on to play professional football. That was my point.

 

[Cloud7]

By the way do only poor men rape. Just because someone has money does not mean they cannot be a rapist. Rapists have a mindset, it has nothing to do with money or lack of. It is their view of women.

No I fully get that. I guess I look at this from the POV of someone who doesn't have that mindset, and I just can't wrap my mind around someone who would risk a life people only dream of, to assault a woman. But, I guess it's not something that can be looked at from any sort of rational lens. How their minds work is just....unfathomable.

 

[crossy1686]

Weird take. The problem, in cases without technical evidence, is that it's always going to come down to word against word. If multiple people tell a very similar story then it's easier, but single cases where you can't actually prove anything then what are you supposed to do

Well I don’t think people cry rape for a laugh so going through the process of making that claim and everything that comes with it surely should hold more weight than Mendy’s mate saying “yeah she was all over him in the club”. Don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying he did it or he didn’t do it, and I’m speaking generally, but these cases rarely take into account the human factor.

 

[K Stand Knut]

If he's alleged to have raped someone at a house party at his house then it seems pretty logical restriction to impose on him.

I know but logic and Police don’t tend to mix very well.

There is also other ways that I think the bail conditions would be worded.
I meant specifically using the words ‘not to have house parties’ seemed odd.

It would be similar to banning shoplifters from any shops

 

[UncleBob]

Well I don’t think people cry rape for a laugh so going through the process of making that claim and everything that comes with it surely should hold more weight than Mendy’s mate saying “yeah she was all over him in the club”. Don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying he did it or he didn’t do it, and I’m speaking generally, but these cases rarely take into account the human factor.

So you reckon all rape accusations are true because there's no way anyone would claim it unless it's true?

 

[crossy1686]

@crossy1686

I agree. It obviously needs evidence - just because the women has highlighted that they were raped doesn't exactly make it true.

This happens alot either way, just as much as women may get raped, there are women who have sex with rich men to trick them for compensation money through law.

See it in sports, music and plenty other entertainment basis.

Completely agree. The key to all this is simply consent and that applies to the build up, before and during the act. People are free to change their mind at any point and it still be assault but ultimately this has everything to do with rapists and not the victim.

So you reckon all rape accusations are true because there's no way anyone would claim it unless it's true?

Nope, not at all. I’m simply saying that the amount of rape cases compared to the amount of people who actually do time for rape is massively out of whack. Which means there’s either a magnitude of fake rape claims or the system doesn’t take into account that consent is fluid. It can be given and taken at any point.

If anyone needs a reminder on how consent works, here’s a nice little video:

 

[UncleBob]

Completely agree. The key to all this is simply consent and that applies to the build up, before and during the act. People are free to change their mind at any point and it still be assault but ultimately this has everything to do with rapists and not the victim.

Nope, not at all. I’m simply saying that the amount of rape cases compared to the amount of people who actually do time for rape is massively out of whack. Which means there’s either a magnitude of fake rape claims or the system doesn’t take into account that consent is fluid. It can be given and taken at any point.

If anyone needs a reminder on how consent works, here’s a nice little video:

It has feck all to do with consent being fluid and everything to do with what you can prove. If two people claim two opposite things, she says she told him to stop and he claims she never did anything like that and that she gave consent, and there's no evidence apart from their versions of the night, then there's no fecking way anyone should be convicted.

 

[crossy1686]

It has feck all to do with consent being fluid and everything to do with what you can prove. If two people claim two opposite things, she says she told him to stop and he claims she never did anything like that and that she gave consent, and there's no evidence apart from their versions of the night, then there's no fecking way anyone should be convicted.

So you’re saying that despite the victim and the rapist both knowing the victim was indeed raped the rapist shouldn’t be convicted because he said he didn’t do it?

This is exactly why no one gets convicted of rape and it’s pretty fecked up.

It of course depends hugely on the events that unfolded and I do agree that people can’t just be convicted on someone’s word alone. It’s a tough one but maybe footballers/celebrities should be more careful about banging random girls from nightclubs. Best thing to do is score a threesome and take a witness home. Pro tip.

 

[Relevated]

Why would City not play him when all it was initially was an accusation? I understand rape is a huge issue, but some of you need to think with your brain instead of your emotion and sudden bursts of desire.

They might come out bad, but they didn't do anything wrong. If the law allowed him to do anything he pleases, then there was no harm in playing him.