Chelsea appoint Thomas Tuchel

[DoneDaDa]

It's actually quite disgusting how the media are targeting him. As much as i think the stance of some of my fellow fans has been wildly OTT they've all realized that it's not Tuchel's fault and he's simply accepted a job offer and have directed no anger towards him. Some fans outraged by Frank's sacking are despite their emotions very excited by Tuchel.

Harry Redknapp's comments especially were utterly mindblowing, for a (ex) manager to so openly disrespect a colleague like that is just unbelievable and beyond the pale.

It seems like everytime I go on reddit there is a new qoute from one of Lampards buddies in the media slating Tuchel. Its funny because Tuchel himself said Lampard texted him wishing him luck he doesn't seem to have any hard feeling (not like he has any reason too), but everyone else is butthurt, probably Neville statement was the best.

If Roy Keane said that, Micah would be in hysterics

This would've been hilarious.

 

[WeePat]

It's actually quite disgusting how the media are targeting him. As much as i think the stance of some of my fellow fans has been wildly OTT they've all realized that it's not Tuchel's fault and he's simply accepted a job offer and have directed no anger towards him. Some fans outraged by Frank's sacking are despite their emotions very excited by Tuchel.

Harry Redknapp's comments especially were utterly mindblowing, for a (ex) manager to so openly disrespect a colleague like that is just unbelievable and beyond the pale.

I was in the camp that wanted to give Lampard until the end of the season at the very least, but there is no doubting that we now have a superior manager and our prospects for this season and beyond look much brighter.

These pundits are just defending their mate. The only legitimate defense of Lampard, aside from the fact that he's a club legend which in the grand scheme of things is neither here nor there, is that he's a rookie manager and therefore when you appoint a manager like that you're doing so with the idea that you're going to have to afford him the room to make his rookie mistakes.

 

[Chairman Steve]

I’ve always assumed media hacks suck up to English managers because of the trust and perks they potentially get off them like exclusives and whatnot. I imagine foreign managers don’t give two shits about the English press and probably view them with contempt by default.

 

[Dancfc]

I was in the camp that wanted to give Lampard until the end of the season at the very least, but there is no doubting that we now have a far superior manager and our prospects for this season and beyond look much brighter.

These pundits are just defending their mate. The only legitimate defense of Lampard, aside from the fact that he's a club legend which in the grand scheme of things is neither here not there, is that he's a rookie manager and therefore when you appoint a manager like that you're doing so with the idea that you're going to have to afford him the room to make his rookie mistakes.

Defending their mate is fine i'd likely do the same truth be told (especially if my mate managed a club i had no emotional connection with as is the case with Micah, Redknapp etc with us) but the way they're going after and taking their anger out on Tuchel is not kool, like atall. I dread to think the crap that will come out of their mouths if we fail to win Sunday.

 

[WeePat]

Defending their mate is fine i'd likely do the same truth be told (especially if my mate managed a club i had no emotional connection with as is the case with Micah, Redknapp etc with us) but the way they're going after and taking their anger out on Tuchel is not kool, like atall. I dread to think the crap that will come out of their mouths if we fail to win Sunday.

Yeah I saw a clip of Robbie Savage bitching and whining about Tuchel not starting Mount and Tuchel not being 'that special'. Really bizarre reaction.

 

[Topgun1]

By that logic Zola is crap because he never won against Arsenal in the league.

Player X is garbage therefore we beat them =/= We beat them therefore player X is garbage

 

[duffer]

Harry Redknapp's comments especially were utterly mindblowing, for a (ex) manager to so openly disrespect a colleague like that is just unbelievable and beyond the pale.

You thinking Redknapp's reaction was "mind-blowing" is mind-blowing.

He was actually a lot more restrained than I expected. I was waiting for a torrent of C-bombs.

 

[C'mon FC]

We used to have drills like that when I was a kid. My coach was a big fan of Brazilian football - he claimed that Pelé and Garrincha improved their technique by playing with oranges (or grapefruits - or whatever it was).

Anyway - the theory was that if you can control a smaller ball effectively, you can control a bigger one all the more effectively.

No idea whether it has merit as a coaching method on the highest level - but the idea itself doesn't seem crazy as such.

The smaller a thing is the more precise you need to be.

Does anyone know if Tuchel did the same training in Paris?

 

[TheMagicFoolBus]

No idea if any other clubs do this...

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Good thread on the benefits here:

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It's telling that despite being extremely exacting from a tactical perspective, Tuchel has never fallen out with his players the way coaches like Sarri have or even Pep has (albeit on an individual level). All reports suggest Tuchel is extremely creative in terms of his training - going out of his way to ensure it both pushes his players to their limits but also is varied & challenging in unconventional ways.

 

[TheMagicFoolBus]

The smaller a thing is the more precise you need to be.

Does anyone know if Tuchel did the same training in Paris?

Probably? There's a famous story during his time in Germany - he felt his players were playing long balls down the touchline too frequently and that these types of passes were inherently ineffective given the typical gamestate and their approach / personnel. So in order to train his team to play diagonally more often, he had them train on a diamond shaped pitch, with the corners removed entirely. In addition to the tactical benefits, he felt like there were psychological benefits - instead of the coach blowing his whistle and saying that such and such pass is bad, players felt more encouraged to try to solve problems creatively and also were better trained to look for aggressive diagonals in matches when passes down the line were available.

 

[C'mon FC]

Probably? There's a famous story during his time in Germany - he felt his players were playing long balls down the touchline too frequently and that these types of passes were inherently ineffective given the typical gamestate and their approach / personnel. So in order to train his team to play diagonally more often, he had them train on a diamond shaped pitch, with the corners removed entirely. In addition to the tactical benefits, he felt like there were psychological benefits - instead of the coach blowing his whistle and saying that such and such pass is bad, players felt more encouraged to try to solve problems creatively and also were better trained to look for aggressive diagonals in matches when passes down the line were available.

Heard about that. Shows his out of the box thinking quite well.

I actually believe that he will do incredibly well with Chelsea. As mentioned above, he didn't get enough Credit in Paris.

 

[do.ob]

Good thread on the benefits here:

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It's telling that despite being extremely exacting from a tactical perspective, Tuchel has never fallen out with his players the way coaches like Sarri have or even Pep has (albeit on an individual level). All reports suggest Tuchel is extremely creative in terms of his training - going out of his way to ensure it both pushes his players to their limits but also is varied & challenging in unconventional ways.

I can't speak much about his time in France and the media didn't really care what happened at Mainz, but at Dortmund it was suggested that he had a falling out with Hummels, that prompted the latter's desire to leave and after his last match, the domestic cup final, the veterans of the squad openly spoke out against his treatment of one of their team mates.

 

[TheMagicFoolBus]

I can't speak much about his time in France and the media didn't really care what happened at Mainz, but at Dortmund it was suggested that he had a falling out with Hummels, that prompted the latter's desire to leave and after his last match, the domestic cup final, the veterans of the squad openly spoke out against his treatment of one of their team mates.

Really? I thought that the heart of what went wrong in Dortmund at least initially was the board's willingness to sell Mkhitaryan and Gundogan whilst letting Hummels leave on a free, despite assuring Tuchel otherwise. Didn't the Dortmund board play hardball with Hummels over a contract renewal? Perhaps I'm misremembering and you'd probably know better but that's my recollection at least. I also thought the issues in the second season were down to a combination of the fallout from selling his key players, Tuchel feeling like the scouting department were getting involved in his training, and the Dortmund board responding completely inappropriately towards the bomb attack on their bus in the CL.

I suppose my statement was probably too definitive, but I do think it's fair to say that Tuchel hasn't had a public falling out with a player to the extent that Pep has had with Yaya Toure or Zlatan, for instance. Perhaps I have (very) blue-tinted specs on, but for me Tuchel has been more or less 100% correct in every dispute he's had with a board in his career. As I said though, you probably know better than I do so if I'm totally mistaken I'd love to hear your perspective!

 

[do.ob]

Really? I thought that the heart of what went wrong in Dortmund at least initially was the board's willingness to sell Mkhitaryan and Gundogan whilst letting Hummels leave on a free, despite assuring Tuchel otherwise. Didn't the Dortmund board play hardball with Hummels over a contract renewal? Perhaps I'm misremembering and you'd probably know better but that's my recollection at least. I also thought the issues in the second season were down to a combination of the fallout from selling his key players, Tuchel feeling like the scouting department were getting involved in his training, and the Dortmund board responding completely inappropriately towards the bomb attack on their bus in the CL.

I suppose my statement was probably too definitive, but I do think it's fair to say that Tuchel hasn't had a public falling out with a player to the extent that Pep has had with Yaya Toure or Zlatan, for instance. Perhaps I have (very) blue-tinted specs on, but for me Tuchel has been more or less 100% correct in every dispute he's had with a board in his career. As I said though, you probably know better than I do so if I'm totally mistaken I'd love to hear your perspective!

I don't even think his agent would tell it like that. First of all Hummels didn't leave on a free and the conflict between him and Tuchel became most obvious when the latter made some snappy comments about Hummels having to be subbed off injured during the cup final. It was again brought up when Bayern hesitated to sign him after they sacked Ancelotti and as far as I remember Hummels himself actually confirmed meeting up with Tuchel to talk things out after that.

There were also reports that he wrote a scathing SMS about his DoF, Zorc, intended for his agent, but accidentally sent it to the man himself.

In his second season he complained to the public that the club bought too many young players (such as Dembele and Guerreiro) and not enough experienced players (such as Toprak, Bellarabi or Schürrle).

This is basically the club's version of Tuchel's handling of the bus attack: https://onefootball.com/en/news/tho...is-dortmund-players-after-bus-attack-24434868

Schmelzer's (Tuchel's captain) post match comment after actually winning the domestic cup with Tuchel that season:
"I was very shocked by it. I just don't understand it. If a player like Julian Weigl is absent[injured], then the only one who can do it at least on that level, is Nuri Sahin. We all know what kind of qualities he has. The explanation why he didn't play has to be given by the coach. We stand fully behind Nuri.[...]"


Think for yourself how likely it is that someone leaves on bad terms at three out of three jobs, but it's not because of him, it's actually the fault of his three separate sets of bosses. I think he's a terrific tactician and probably a great hire for Chelsea in their current situation, but on a human level he seems to come with an expiration date.

 

[Dancfc]

I don't even think his agent would tell it like that. First of all Hummels didn't leave on a free and the conflict between him and Tuchel became most obvious when the latter made some snappy comments about Hummels having to be subbed off injured during the cup final. It was again brought up when Bayern hesitated to sign him after they sacked Ancelotti and as far as I remember Hummels himself actually confirmed meeting up with Tuchel to talk things out after that.

There were also reports that he wrote a scathing SMS about his DoF, Zorc, intended for his agent, but accidentally sent it to the man himself.

In his second season he complained to the public that the club bought too many young players (such as Dembele and Guerreiro) and not enough experienced players (such as Toprak, Bellarabi or Schürrle).

This is basically the club's version of Tuchel's handling of the bus attack: https://onefootball.com/en/news/tho...is-dortmund-players-after-bus-attack-24434868

Schmelzer's (Tuchel's captain) post match comment after actually winning the domestic cup with Tuchel that season:
"I was very shocked by it. I just don't understand it. If a player like Julian Weigl is absent[injured], then the only one who can do it at least on that level, is Nuri Sahin. We all know what kind of qualities he has. The explanation why he didn't play has to be given by the coach. We stand fully behind Nuri.[...]"


Think for yourself how likely it is that someone leaves on bad terms at three out of three jobs, but it's not because of him, it's actually the fault of his three separate sets of bosses. I think he's a terrific tactician and probably a great hire for Chelsea in their current situation, but on a human level he seems to come with an expiration date.

Yeah i'm very much keeping one eye open on that aspect of him, i don't want to sound like some of the Spurs fans who are going/went to big reaches to try and convince themselves Mourinho had changed.

A couple of things that give me some small hope is that he seems self aware of his history of boardroom fallout's (which in itself is an improvement on Jose and Conte who could shoot Bambi and conquer up ridiculous mental gymnastics to absolve themselves of any blame) and from what i'm reading his issues have got progressively lesser at every club which hopefully points to him growing up a bit.

But as you pointed out he's a fantastic tactican so if he can give us a peak similar to those two (hopefully without awful results and tumescent footy once it gets to the end part) it will be worth it even if the worst case projections of him/Marina become reality.

 

[L1nk]

He’s going to do well at Chelsea, isn’t he

 

[FrankDrebin]

He’s going to do well at Chelsea, isn’t he

He has to or he'll get sacked.

 

[duffer]

He has to or he'll get sacked.

Same as any manager at almost any club then.

 

[hellhunter]

Same as any manager at almost any club then.

Michael Owen level of revelations here

 

[amolbhatia50k]

18 shots to 1 is impressive. Although it is Burnley at home

 

[amolbhatia50k]

He has to or he'll get sacked.

As it should be tbf

 

[The Firestarter]

Michael Owen level of revelations here

If they don't score before the game ends, they will lose.

 

[always_hoping]

Good win for Tuchel. A type of match Chelsea would have dropped points in if Lampard was still manager.

 

[WeePat]

18 shots to 1 is impressive. Although it is Burnley at home

Keep in mind that in Burnley's last two games they beat Villa (H) and Liverpool (A). It was a nice home game though. The real test will be on Thursday.

 

[Mb194dc]

Control of the game was impressive. Our finishing not so much...

Tactically very impressive. I don't feel our midfield has really worked pretty much since Conte was manager. Sarri played Kante high up the pitch and Lampard didn't know what to do with Mount, Havertz, Jorginho, Kante to get balance.

Only Burnley at home but encouraging signs.

 

[RooneyLegend]

Off to a strong start here. Two back to back games where you could argue they were nothing short of perfect defensively.

 

[JPRouve]

If they don't score before the game ends, they will lose.

At the very least they will be goalless.

 

[JPRouve]

Tuchel is a very good coach but sometimes he tries to be too cute, he has an organization that works and tries to drastically change it.

 

[RashyForPM]

It’s rare these days that Chelsea - or any team - limit their opposition to absolutely no chances across an entire game. So even though it was Burnley, props to him for that. I mean, under Lampard this season, it felt like even in games they won comfortably like West Ham they could and probably should have lost.

 

[The Firestarter]

At the very least they will be goalless.

Surely Michael knows that.

 

[Nani Nana]

Off to a strong start here. Two back to back games where you could argue they were nothing short of perfect defensively.

Great coach, he will definitely improve them.

 

[simplyared]

Must say I like the guy. Comes over well in his interviews so far. Liked the way he praised his team after the first game saying he liked the intensity etc and that he was positively surprised with the level of the squad etc. A win today as well.
Great addition to the PL!

 

[Hansinity]

Just 2 games, but already seeing a really good basis of defence. I really liked how he balanced PSG as well, they had a great balance between pressing and defence last season.

 

[WeePat]

Off to a strong start here. Two back to back games where you could argue they were nothing short of perfect defensively.

Wolves and Burnley aren't exactly among the more adventurous teams in the league but I'm still really impressed with the organisation and willingness to recover the ball as soon as it’s lost. We'll face tougher challenges in the weeks ahead no doubt, but it's great to see the foundation of what we can expect from Tuchel's version of Chelsea.

He mentioned post game that we were missing precision up front but he was otherwise very happy with everything else. You'd imagine that precision will come with more games and more training sessions.

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[WeePat]

He's a very engaging character. I could listen to him all day in all honesty. I dont want to fall head over heels for a new manager so soon but this guys is making it hard

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[Cheech Wizard]

He's a very engaging character. I could listen to him all day in all honesty. I dont want to fall head over heels for a new manager so soon but this guys is making it hard

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I bet you Chelsea sack him before your fans can finally see him in the flesh. Whenever that is.

 

[mav_9me]

His time at PSG to me does not count in evaluating him at all. I doubt he was true to himself there. At Dortmund he appeared to fall out with players/club.

I have a feeling he will do well at Chelsea.

 

[WeePat]

I bet you Chelsea sack him before your fans can finally see him in the flesh. Whenever that is.

Sad state of affairs, but I will do my best to enjoy the ride from my sofa as much as I can. The feel around the club reminds me of the start of Conte's tenure and we all know how negatively that ended but the highs before the fall were incredible.

 

[horsechoker]

He's a very engaging character. I could listen to him all day in all honesty. I dont want to fall head over heels for a new manager so soon but this guys is making it hard

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Might be happy he's dealing with fewer drama queens.

 

[TheMagicFoolBus]

I don't even think his agent would tell it like that. First of all Hummels didn't leave on a free and the conflict between him and Tuchel became most obvious when the latter made some snappy comments about Hummels having to be subbed off injured during the cup final. It was again brought up when Bayern hesitated to sign him after they sacked Ancelotti and as far as I remember Hummels himself actually confirmed meeting up with Tuchel to talk things out after that.

There were also reports that he wrote a scathing SMS about his DoF, Zorc, intended for his agent, but accidentally sent it to the man himself.

In his second season he complained to the public that the club bought too many young players (such as Dembele and Guerreiro) and not enough experienced players (such as Toprak, Bellarabi or Schürrle).

This is basically the club's version of Tuchel's handling of the bus attack: https://onefootball.com/en/news/tho...is-dortmund-players-after-bus-attack-24434868

Schmelzer's (Tuchel's captain) post match comment after actually winning the domestic cup with Tuchel that season:
"I was very shocked by it. I just don't understand it. If a player like Julian Weigl is absent[injured], then the only one who can do it at least on that level, is Nuri Sahin. We all know what kind of qualities he has. The explanation why he didn't play has to be given by the coach. We stand fully behind Nuri.[...]"


Think for yourself how likely it is that someone leaves on bad terms at three out of three jobs, but it's not because of him, it's actually the fault of his three separate sets of bosses. I think he's a terrific tactician and probably a great hire for Chelsea in their current situation, but on a human level he seems to come with an expiration date.

Fair enough re: Hummels! Don't know why I thought that was a free .

I've seen the reports on the SMS he sent; that seems a colossal brainfart. To be fair, reports also suggested Zorc was trying to interfere with his team selection and that was the substance of the SMS, so on that basis he was right to complain.

His second season got derailed because instead of building on what he'd done in pushing Bayern to the brink, the club sold his key players despite assuring him that wouldn't happen and then giving him youth. I'd argue it's to his credit that he turned Dembele into a massive profit for Dortmund and Guerreiro into a top top player. If the club breaks promises to you is that not a basis to feel aggrieved?

I'm sorry, but the link you've posted there is comically bad. Tuchel said publicly that it was a disgrace the team had to play when they did and the Dortmund hierarchy agreed to it - I'd far more trust statements in the public domain than unnamed sources from a journalist who's clearly trying to push an agenda.

I definitely agree that Tuchel can be a challenge to work with. I just don't think he's on par with someone like, say, Antonio Conte.