City and Financial Doping | Charged by PL with numerous FFP breaches

[Alex99]

I think it's a given they'll get expelled by the Premier League. I imagine if they attach a fixed term to that, so expulsion and no return within 5 years, the Football League will be compelled to only offer them a return to a division which is that the same amount of promotions away as the time bar from the Premier League. That's inevitable as otherwise you could have City win the Championship for 5 years in a row but unable to be promoted which will cause carnage. So with that logic applied:

Expulsion = Championship
+2 Year Ban from PL = League One
+3 Year Ban from PL = League Two
+4 Year Ban from PL = Vanarama National League
+5 Year Ban from PL = Vanarama National League North

That's assuming the FL / VNL accept them. FL may want to take a stand with FFP also involved in them. I imagine VNL will welcome them with open arms.

I don't see their titles getting stripped as that will cause carnage as you then infer the team 2nd should have won the league, 5th should have qualified for Champions League. It will open City up to a long line of legal claims for damages and vicariously the PL also for not having adequate control measures for FFP.

Unfortunately, I don't think it's a given that they get expelled at all.

Also, there's precedent in other countries for simply not having a champion in certain seasons after titles were stripped.

It's obviously shit for teams that could have finished a place higher, but there's little you can do about that outside of some sort of compensation.

 

[RedRocket9908]

I think it's a given they'll get expelled by the Premier League. I imagine if they attach a fixed term to that, so expulsion and no return within 5 years, the Football League will be compelled to only offer them a return to a division which is that the same amount of promotions away as the time bar from the Premier League. That's inevitable as otherwise you could have City win the Championship for 5 years in a row but unable to be promoted which will cause carnage. So with that logic applied:

Expulsion = Championship
+2 Year Ban from PL = League One
+3 Year Ban from PL = League Two
+4 Year Ban from PL = Vanarama National League
+5 Year Ban from PL = Vanarama National League North

That's assuming the FL / VNL accept them. FL may want to take a stand with FFP also involved in them. I imagine VNL will welcome them with open arms.

I don't see their titles getting stripped as that will cause carnage as you then infer the team 2nd should have won the league, 5th should have qualified for Champions League. It will open City up to a long line of legal claims for damages and vicariously the PL also for not having adequate control measures for FFP.

Expulsion from the EPL is different to relegation from the Premier League, if City were expelled from the Premier League they wouldnt just drop down a tier they would have apply to join the EFL and if accepted (although thats unlikely) EFL rules state that they would need to start in League 2.

 

[Pughnichi]

PL will just wait and wait till statutory time limits passes and oops cant do anything now. Maybe give a 1M fine and forget

I don’t think there is a time limit on epl. Which is why it’s taking such a long time.

The fifa/cas one did have a time limit.

explains in here somewhere how the epl don’t have such problems with time

but could also be wrong? Who knows anymore!!

 

[Garnacho's Shoelaces]

Expulsion from the EPL is different to relegation from the Premier League, if City were expelled from the Premier League they wouldnt just drop down a tier they would have apply to join the EFL and if accepted (although thats unlikely) EFL rules state that they would need to start in League 2.

Yeah you're right but equally EFL could chuck them in the Championship too which would make it effectively a relegation. I guess one team in Championship/League 1 would be disadvantaged but equally a team in League 2/VNL would be disadvantaged by City jumping in there.

I guess Championship could promote four teams?

 

[Garnacho's Shoelaces]

Unfortunately, I don't think it's a given that they get expelled at all.

Also, there's precedent in other countries for simply not having a champion in certain seasons after titles were stripped.

It's obviously shit for teams that could have finished a place higher, but there's little you can do about that outside of some sort of compensation.

I don't see any other punishment which would reflect the gravity of the corruption by City. This is immeasurably a bigger cheating scandal than the likes of Lance Armstrong.

 

[RedRocket9908]

Yeah you're right but equally EFL could chuck them in the Championship too which would make it effectively a relegation. I guess one team in Championship/League 1 would be disadvantaged but equally a team in League 2/VNL would be disadvantaged by City jumping in there.

I guess Championship could promote four teams?

I think the decision as whether they would be accepted in to the EFL would be decided via a EFL member vote rather that the EFL themselves, would the EFL members be willing to allow them in and effect their own chances of success.

 

[Garnacho's Shoelaces]

I think the decision as whether they would be accepted in to the EFL would be decided via a EFL member vote rather that the EFL themselves, would the EFL members be willing to allow them in and effect their own chances of success.

True, I don't know enough about EFL constitution.

 

[Alex99]

I don't see any other punishment which would reflect the gravity of the corruption by City. This is immeasurably a bigger cheating scandal than the likes of Lance Armstrong.

I don't disagree that they're clearly corrupt as feck, but I have little faith in anything serious being done about it.

 

[Lightbringer]

The 3 worst things in sports at the moment:

1.Manchester City
2. Chelsea
3. Alexander "Putinist" Ovechkin captaining the Washington Capitals.

Just nuke the first 2 parts from the earth or have them start over at the lowest division and have them work they way up again from scratch. In 10 years they would be allowed to join the premier league again. And of course strip of all domestic titles, erase them from the history books, delete all highlights from their titles from websites etc, when its done it should be like they did not exist on english football during the time period.

This would be great for Chelsea and City supporters as well as in 10 years they would be enabled to feel really proud if their team won again, instead of just racking up meaningless titles from cheating year after year!

 

[Ayoba]

As much as I would love it to happen, I don't think they will be expelled. That only happens during extreme cases, such as match fixing.

City will be fined, heavily, and a strong points deduction, like 30 points. They'd still probably win the league

 

[MarylandMUFan]

The 3 worst things in sports at the moment:

1.Manchester City
2. Chelsea
3. Alexander "Putinist" Ovechkin captaining the Washington Capitals.

As a former Caps season ticket holder, #3 is just ridiculous (considering you left of LIV golf and all the other Saudi sportswashing events).
Do I wish Ovi was more aware of Putin and his atrocities when he was younger? Yes. But he hasn't done anything lately that leads me to believe he still supports what Putin is doing.

 

[Lightbringer]

As a former Caps season ticket holder, #3 is just ridiculous (considering you left of LIV golf and all the other Saudi sportswashing events).
Do I wish Ovi was more aware of Putin and his atrocities when he was younger? Yes. But he hasn't done anything lately that leads me to believe he still supports what Putin is doing.

Do you mean like the #SaveChildrenFromFascism campaign to justify the illegal invasion of chrimea? Ovechkin was like 30 years old by then with a grey beard already.

I think he was old enough to not do that if he did not support Putin. The war started in 2014, not recently. And he also created "Team Putin" like 5 years later.

And the reason I put Ovechkin on the list is because he is enabled by the NHL and Washington. The LIV tour is handling their own business. People have been suspended for liking a tweet, and yet Ovechkin is allowed to captain a team while having
a a crazy dictator as his instagram profile pic, there no excuse for that.

Chelsea, City and Ovechkin are being protected by by the premier league and the NHL.

In scandinavia Ovechkin is cancelled, his legacy is dead. He would not even be allowed to play hockey here, much less being the face of a franchise. '

The only reason he is tolerated in the USA is that business and money goes before morals!

 

[amolbhatia50k]

A lot of arses twitching in Stockport today.

Nah. Everton are an easy target. City have unlimited number of brown envelopes to hand over.

 

[gorky_utd]

No body is going to touch citeh. They have unlimited fund of oil money. Any investigation team will probably be paid in millions.

 

[Sandikan]

I can't see the PL allowing the owners to continue after trying so hard to cover up their cheating.

They'll end up selling to some mysterious business man who pops up put of nowhere who just happens to have the same resources, outlook and perspectives as the current lot.

 

[LARulz]

My understanding of why nothing will happen to City (from someone who works at the PL) is that City will keep this locked in litigation due to their team of lawyers and hope for a submission victory

 

[Sandikan]

Amongst all the "fa will do nothing" posts, there's one question.

Why on earth did the FA bother bringing these highly public charges if they had no intention of following them through?

People can't seem to understand that if 1 charge for Everton has taken well over a year to sort out (there have been rumblings of this for ages) why on earth would 115 charges get wrapped up quickly?

 

[Sandikan]

My understanding of why nothing will happen to City (from someone who works at the PL) is that City will keep this locked in litigation due to their team of lawyers and hope for a submission victory

Works at the PL? If it's the teaboy I'd not be worried. If it's the guy who is behind the charges, more so.

 

[MarylandMUFan]

Do you mean like the #SaveChildrenFromFascism campaign to justify the illegal invasion of chrimea? Ovechkin was like 30 years old by then with a grey beard already.

I think he was old enough to not do that if he did not support Putin. The war started in 2014, not recently. And he also created "Team Putin" like 5 years later.

And the reason I put Ovechkin on the list is because he is enabled by the NHL and Washington. The LIV tour is handling their own business. People have been suspended for liking a tweet, and yet Ovechkin is allowed to captain a team while having
a a crazy dictator as his instagram profile pic, there no excuse for that.

Chelsea, City and Ovechkin are being protected by by the premier league and the NHL.

In scandinavia Ovechkin is cancelled, his legacy is dead. He would not even be allowed to play hockey here, much less being the face of a franchise. '

The only reason he is tolerated in the USA is that business and money goes before morals!

That article makes Ovi look like more of an unwitting puppet than anything else. He clearly states that he wants peace and wants Ukrainian people to have a good life. I just don't think he is smart enough to understand how he is being used.

 

[AlexiV]

Good example of capital justice. There is to much money involved for City and Chelsea to get the sentencing they deserve. Pretty sure all the City and Chelsea deniers would condemn the lack of sentencing of the Sackler-family for their role in the Oxycontin-crisis turning a blind eye at the corruption from their respective clubs. But it's just football eh.

 

[Taribo's Gap]

Amongst all the "fa will do nothing" posts, there's one question.

Why on earth did the FA bother bringing these highly public charges if they had no intention of following them through?

People can't seem to understand that if 1 charge for Everton has taken well over a year to sort out (there have been rumblings of this for ages) why on earth would 115 charges get wrapped up quickly?

One theory is to ward off the threat of an independent football regulator. The PL being seen as "doing something" would obviate the need for an independent football regulatory body.

 

[duffer]

You know things are bad when Barcelona fans are dishing out moralistic comments.

 

[Taribo's Gap]

You know things are bad when Barcelona fans are dishing out moralistic comments.

Isn't that just normal course?

 

[Castia]

My City fan mate reckons City will just get hit with a huge fine. Thinking about it the PL would love that.

 

[JagUTD]

My City fan mate reckons City will just get hit with a huge fine. Thinking about it the PL would love that.

If it's in the region of £20trillion, it might be acceptable.

 

[Garnacho's Shoelaces]

I don't disagree that they're clearly corrupt as feck, but I have little faith in anything serious being done about it.

I did before the PL have assessed a realistic prospect of proving the allegations, 115 of them.

Doing nothing was the easiest thing and least reputational damage as there was no media pressure to investigate them. The PL are now both legs in. The highest reputational damage would be making these allegations against one of their own members and being incapable of proving it. The best outcome for the PL now is proving the charges and severe punishment.

I don't see them having gone this nuclear without the absolute confidence of proving it to the required standard.

 

[Donut]

I’m already licking my fingers thinking who we’ll take from City and Chelsea. I’m thinking: Pep, Ederson, Diaz, Colwell, Enzo, Haaland, KDB, Foden,… Mudryk just for laughs. Oh yeah, Jim coming in, them two going down, it’s all coming together, back to the top where we belong.

 

[RedRocket9908]

I’m already licking my fingers thinking who we’ll take from City and Chelsea. I’m thinking: Pep, Ederson, Diaz, Colwell, Enzo, Haaland, KDB, Foden,… Mudryk just for laughs. Oh yeah, Jim coming in, them two going down, it’s all coming together, back to the top where we belong.

I honestly wouldnt want Pep anywhere near our club no matter how good he is.

 

[JagUTD]

I'm confident that if the League fails to apply a fair and consistent punishment now they've set a precedent, the 19 other member clubs will simply boycott or vote City out.

We already know at least 9 clubs have voted against City in the past. While below the 14 required, it did include the biggest clubs in the League and if they were to start a boycott, the league ceases to exist.

Evertons statement about monitoring other ongoing cases suggests they would look to garner support in the event City get away with it.

It won't come to this though because the league knows the above.

 

[RedPed]

I don't get why penalties have been swiftly handed out to the likes of Juventus, Barcelona, Wigan, Sheff Wed, Reading etc. and now Everton but nothing doing for Man City, probably the biggest piss-takers of the lot.

 

[sullydnl]

I don't get why penalties have been swiftly handed out to the likes of Juventus, Barcelona, Wigan, Sheff Wed, Reading etc. and now Everton but nothing doing for Man City, probably the biggest piss-takers of the lot.

That's partly your answer. More charges, more complexity, more resources being directed to stymie progress.

 

[Hughie77]

where not crooks. cas said are accounts wear the most beautiful thered ever seen.

Go and stick your head in the sand like the rest who believe there not bent..and who's where?? Ffs

 

[duffer]

I don't get why penalties have been swiftly handed out to the likes of Juventus, Barcelona, Wigan, Sheff Wed, Reading etc. and now Everton but nothing doing for Man City, probably the biggest piss-takers of the lot.

And Chelsea & Man United, we both got our FFP fines pretty quickly.

 

[Rooney in Paris]

Go and stick your head in the sand like the rest who believe there not bent..and who's where?? Ffs

another one bites the dust

 

[Gandalf Greyhame]

Along with the expansive legal obstruction City's lawyers are no doubt putting up to their charges, I feel there will be even graver issues at hand that prevent City from being penalized.

One would be the extent of corruption. It is not unreasonable to imagine that regulatory bodies and hundreds or even thousands of important personnel all the way up to the top are complicit in either committing or covering up financial crimes indirectly or directly. It's a sport washing exercise by an entire oil state - discovering the magnitude of involvement will be anything but simple.

The second would be holding such a massive scale of operation accountable. How do you unravel each and every charge and and mete out proportional punishments to all entities involved? How many relevant regulatory bodies can you reasonably involve? How much resistance can a limited team overcome on their own when multiple branches of complicit government and private agencies find it in their self interest to oppose you? What scale of manpower is needed to tackle a nation's attempt at strong arming a sport and another's complicitity in letting it happen? It may take decades to get through just five or six charges, how long will 115 take?

I don't think City are ever going to face any punishment for their charges, not conventionally.

 

[caid]

I honestly wouldnt want Pep anywhere near our club no matter how good he is.

Same. Way too much dirt associated with him.

 

[OleGunnar20]

There's no truly fair way to undo cheating on City's scale really. Relegate them as far down the pyramid as you like, they'll be back.

Having said that, stripping titles and relegation out of the PL would be a start. Hopefully the FL refuse to take them at championship level and they have to start from the bottom.

A guy can dream ey.

 

[Redstain]

So Everton get 10 point deduction for 1 breach and City have over 113 ? I think the league have purposefully been strict with this, once they finalise the investigations City are going to get the hammer swung towards them. They probably did it on purpose to forewarn City and potentially Chelsea.

The only thing that will get City some leeway is if there's a drawn out judicial process.

 

[caid]

There's no truly fair way to undo cheating on City's scale really. Relegate them as far down the pyramid as you like, they'll be back.

Having said that, stripping titles and relegation out of the PL would be a start. Hopefully the FL refuse to take them at championship level and they have to start from the bottom.

A guy can dream ey.

Lifetime ban from the sport for owner and executives. Thats the real punishment.
A team with an 80k seater stadium who gets tens of thousands of supporters in lower leagues kind of belongs in the premier league. And i'm totally fine with them being back under different ownership.

 

[Salford_Red83]

Go and stick your head in the sand like the rest who believe there not bent..and who's where?? Ffs

Ha! he got you good!