Climate Change | UN Report: Code Red for humanity

[Fingeredmouse]

This thread is actually fecking depressing.
People posting idiot fringe loonies denying climate change.
Jaded cynics criticising people trying to make a change based on pedantic cynicism.
Sneering cliched put downs because people of whatever perceived demographic can't have an opinion.
Genuine incomprehension of why democratic process requires direct action.
Points being made that responsibility for climate change is personal and that Governments are off the hook.
If they succeed in raising the profile of this matter to such a level that something actually happens in a co-operative fashion globally between Governments, and they likely won't mainly because most people don't give a feck as is evidenced by this thread, then almost every living thing on this planet will benefit. But I'm sure the fact they exist in society and have travelled will ensure that you still think they're artisan bread knitting fannies.

 

[Buster15]

I fear we've already gone over the edge and there's very little we can do to stop it
When the most influential country in the world is in complete denial about the problems we face and developing countries are just going to add more and more to co2 levels across the globe, we haven't a chance.
People acoss the world weren't willing to forego their luxeries and not enough was done in finding non fossil/renewable energies to aid 3rd world countries in their development as well as sustaining their own energy needs when the issue 1st raised itself. Even now, governments across the world are only making token efforts instead of really addressing the problem.
We are fecked.

That is my concern as well. Hopefully like minded people in the USA will follow suit and pressurise their government.
Only hopeful. Certainly not optimistic.

 

[Buster15]

How old are you?

More importantly what is your mental age.

 

[Brwned]

Was anyone here actually at the protests? I was at most of it this week and to me it's been a major disappointment. It might have some kind of impact through sheer longevity, but there's little sign that it has anywhere near enough strength to be anything significant.

XR deserve credit for mobilising enough folks to create a level of disruption that raises awareness, but that's as far as it went unfortunately. Most of the folks who came just embraced it as a harmless street party. The messaging of XR didn't translate to the crowds at all, there was no semblance of a movement or a shared purpose, if anything it was just confirmation of how little the public care. The only thing that united crowds was a cheer when people were arrested. Going from people dancing on Waterloo Bridge to people going on with their busy lives blissfully unaware in Covent Garden was a bizarre experience on both levels. It's shocking how few people from London were actually part of the protest.

It's sad that people find it intolerable to have their daily lives inconvenienced by political action about one of the most important issues of our time, but that's the world we live in. The reality is we need to have some more substance behind the movement if you want it to gain public support. And if you don't want it to gain public support then you need a particularly creative strategy, or a lot of fortune, for it to have any kind of positive impact. We're long past the stage of just needing to raise awareness about the issue, so the bar is much higher than just making a bit of noise about it.

 

[Dante]

The world is a lot more cynical than it used to be. That applies to advertising, politics and also protests.

Organising something like the Million Man March took huge grass-roots effort and that's why it's still talked about today. But currently, the internet can most of the work for you. The upshot is that mass protests won't work like they used to. If you want to change the public's mind, you have make them want to do it, rather than tell them to.

An Inconvenient Truth and Blue Planet have done more for pro-environment than anything else I can remember in the last 20 years. That's how you inject your ideas into the public consciousness. Present them something they want to engage with, then piggy-back your message onto it.

 

[NinjaFletch]

Was anyone here actually at the protests? I was at most of it this week and to me it's been a major disappointment. It might have some kind of impact through sheer longevity, but there's little sign that it has anywhere near enough strength to be anything significant.

XR deserve credit for mobilising enough folks to create a level of disruption that raises awareness, but that's as far as it went unfortunately. Most of the folks who came just embraced it as a harmless street party. The messaging of XR didn't translate to the crowds at all, there was no semblance of a movement or a shared purpose, if anything it was just confirmation of how little the public care. The only thing that united crowds was a cheer when people were arrested. Going from people dancing on Waterloo Bridge to people going on with their busy lives blissfully unaware in Covent Garden was a bizarre experience on both levels. It's shocking how few people from London were actually part of the protest.

It's sad that people find it intolerable to have their daily lives inconvenienced by political action about one of the most important issues of our time, but that's the world we live in. The reality is we need to have some more substance behind the movement if you want it to gain public support. And if you don't want it to gain public support then you need a particularly creative strategy, or a lot of fortune, for it to have any kind of positive impact. We're long past the stage of just needing to raise awareness about the issue, so the bar is much higher than just making a bit of noise about it.

If I'm honest, this reads more like you don't understand their aims than anything else.

 

[Brwned]

If I'm honest, this reads more like you don't understand their aims than anything else.

I'm part of XR

 

[Classical Mechanic]

Personally I think it’s great they had a peaceful protest and relations with the police were so good. Climate change is such an epochal issue but so many of us are ambivalent towards it.

 

[redshaw]

Brexiteers have used and continue to use extreme actions and it's worked a fecking lot better than the milquetoast platitudes from remainers. Half a million people marching through London and between them they managed to capture the public imagination less than a permadrunk arsehole with a stupid flatcap.

Can't recall much of what the brexiteers/leavers have done. I remember they blocked some trucks possibly, wasn't a big story and would have to look it up. My impression is the remainers are doing way better.

 

[NoLogo]

Anyone watching The Facts about climate change with Attenborough on 1? Jeez for an intelligent species we are sure are stupid. It’s the biggest single thing facing us and our planet.

It's all due to religion. Not a theist religion but the religion of money also known as capitalism. Trump is the most prominent example of that believe. He would rather poison the whole planet for all humans than slow down economic growth for his country. I mean he even said it openly that this was the reason why he got out of the paris climate agreement. Of course he isn't the only one who thinks like that. The leaders of my country (Germany) let our car industry get away with bribery, cartel arrangements and customer fraud by not keep promised emission limits in their cars. Yet our government acts like nothing really bad happened and if forced on the issue you can pretty much read between the lines that so much money is in this industry that punishing them to hard would be dangerous to our economy. Greed has made us blind to any sense or reason and as long as we allow capitalism to reign as unchecked as it does these days it won't change.

 

[Smores]

Worst thing is I'm pretty confident if we had a referendum on dealing with climate change this country would vote against any efforts

 

[Jippy]

I wandered by the Marble Arch camp today. They've cleared Oxford Circus now, but Oxford Street was closed down around MA. I've only ever seen Oxford Street that busy on Boxing Day sales (did that once, never again).

The camp looms like a festival- there are stalls, stages etc...The crowd was predominantly young, but not exclusively so. It was also ethnically diverse. No idea where this is going, if anywhere, but there was defo an energy about the whole thing.

 

[maniak]

Would be interested to know what exactly the protesters do personally to combat climate change. I'm assuming none of them eat meat, use plastic, use gas, electricity, don't drive. Otherwise it just seems like an excuse to protest, as it were.

I don't get this. So unless you are 100% pure in a certain topic you can protest against those who abuse something to the extreme?

 

[Jippy]

I don't get this. So unless you are 100% pure in a certain topic you can protest against those who abuse something to the extreme?

Yep turn it back on the protesters. Forget our inefficient 1960s coal-fired power station, you bought a bottle of water in the park last week. Max deflection, zero equivalence.

 

[Buster15]

Personally I think it’s great they had a peaceful protest and relations with the police were so good. Climate change is such an epochal issue but so many of us are ambivalent towards it.

Epochal is a good word to choose.
It is something that is likely to affect everybody in the years to come.
And because it is a global problem it deserves to have global governance.
But as we have recently seen, individual governments are making the right noises but will do what they always do. Nothing.

As a result it is now down to ordinary people to assume responsibility and take the lead.
I expect the political parties to try to align with climate change and in a sense that may not be a bad thing because at least voters will be able to vote them out if they fail to deliver.

 

[Eboue]

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

very cool

 

[dumbo]

You've had your little protest now back to business and your voluntary servitude. Personally I've always wanted to be alive just long enough to see Gaia incinerate your children, it seems I might just get the chance now.

 

[Fingeredmouse]

Sadiq, you demonstrably do not share the passion of the demonstrators.

 

[maniak]

So condescending. Which is the general attitude rulers seem to have in most countries regarding climate change demonstrations. Our species will be the laughing stock of the galaxy when we destroy ourselves.

 

[Classical Mechanic]

So condescending. Which is the general attitude rulers seem to have in most countries regarding climate change demonstrations. Our species will be the laughing stock of the galaxy when we destroy ourselves.

It will be like intergalactic Brexit.

 

[Vidyoyo]

Maybe we do need AVALANCHE after all.

 

[Don't Kill Bill]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AL5Hjg30b_M

Co2 since 1960.

I don't know why but I find these types of graphs mesmerising.

 

[Buster15]

So condescending. Which is the general attitude rulers seem to have in most countries regarding climate change demonstrations. Our species will be the laughing stock of the galaxy when we destroy ourselves.

Luckily it is ordinary people who can see the dangers while our so called leaders are perfectly happy to pretend that it will all go away and they can get on with what they choose to believe.

It is possible that there is other intelligent life out there in our galaxy and it is also possible that we are a one off.
Either way, planet earth is our only home and if we truly are as intelligent as we like to think then we better start to look after the place and learn to live in a sustainable manner.
If not, we will have shot ourselves in both feet.

 

[KirkDuyt]

Humanity is far too fecking stupid to really do anything about climate change. The only chance we have, is someone really smart inventing something to negate the damage we do, because while commendable, these protests really aren't going to convince the board of directors of companies like Shell or Exxon Mobil to change anything.

 

[Stookie]

It's all due to religion. Not a theist religion but the religion of money also known as capitalism. Trump is the most prominent example of that believe. He would rather poison the whole planet for all humans than slow down economic growth for his country. I mean he even said it openly that this was the reason why he got out of the paris climate agreement. Of course he isn't the only one who thinks like that. The leaders of my country (Germany) let our car industry get away with bribery, cartel arrangements and customer fraud by not keep promised emission limits in their cars. Yet our government acts like nothing really bad happened and if forced on the issue you can pretty much read between the lines that so much money is in this industry that punishing them to hard would be dangerous to our economy. Greed has made us blind to any sense or reason and as long as we allow capitalism to reign as unchecked as it does these days it won't change.

I agree with all of that. This obsession with growth is a big part of the problem as well. Every country needs growth of manufacturing, growth of capitalism etc etc. But when is enough growth enough? Do we just keep growing until there’s no possible room for anything else? To grow we need to expand, to expand we need to build, build and build until we can’t build anymore. We need to get to a point where someone says ‘we don’t need any growth this year, let’s just stay as we are’ but it will never happen. It’s a depressing future we are leaving for our kids and grandkids. In years to come they’ll look back at our generation and say ‘bloody hell, that lot just went for it didn’t they, they knew all the risks and still went for it’. I read an interesting theory that humans are actually a virus, and that the earth is heating up to get rid of the virus as most living things do. Then when we’re gone it can start again.

 

[Maagge]

I agree with all of that. This obsession with growth is a big part of the problem as well. Every country needs growth of manufacturing, growth of capitalism etc etc. But when is enough growth enough? Do we just keep growing until there’s no possible room for anything else? To grow we need to expand, to expand we need to build, build and build until we can’t build anymore. We need to get to a point where someone says ‘we don’t need any growth this year, let’s just stay as we are’ but it will never happen. It’s a depressing future we are leaving for our kids and grandkids. In years to come they’ll look back at our generation and say ‘bloody hell, that lot just went for it didn’t they, they knew all the risks and still went for it’. I read an interesting theory that humans are actually a virus, and that the earth is heating up to get rid of the virus as most living things do. Then when we’re gone it can start again.

It's kinda interesting. Most politicians will run with a plan to have say a GDP growth of 1-2% yet the OECD in general seems to have about 0.5%. So why do they keep thinking they can budget with more than that?

 

[NoLogo]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AL5Hjg30b_M

Co2 since 1960.

I don't know why but I find these types of graphs mesmerising.

Yeah data presentation done right can be really amazing. If you like that sort of stuff I can recommend r/dataisbeautiful on reddit and https://pudding.cool/.

That being said, the explosion in co2 emissions from China in the early 2000s is really scary. If India goes a similar way in the next 10 to 15 years we are well and truly fecked or well at least our kids are.

 

[Buster15]

Humanity is far too fecking stupid to really do anything about climate change. The only chance we have, is someone really smart inventing something to negate the damage we do, because while commendable, these protests really aren't going to convince the board of directors of companies like Shell or Exxon Mobil to change anything.

I share exactly the same views.
The average person will nod and make all the right noises but as soon as it comes to them actually doing something or making a change to their lifestyle, like walking instead of driving then everything becomes far too difficult and everyone else should do something but not them.

The same for industry. They will tell you how wonderful they are to the environment but as soon as it impacts the bottom line or makes them less competitive, just like America then they will gradually pull back.

To my mind it is going to take something or some event to bring it home to the masses.

 

[Tarrou]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AL5Hjg30b_M

Co2 since 1960.

I don't know why but I find these types of graphs mesmerising.

UK is interesting. I guess we've remained relatively stable due to the transition from Coal to Nuclear?

 

[horsechoker]

Where does everyone stand on the Greta Thunberg?

It's excellent that she has brought the discussion back into the mainstream but it all feels like a good media exercise so people can pat themselves on the back for looking like they're doing something good.

I feel bad for her in a way because I think her intentions are true and noble but she is being exploited and it probably won't make a difference in the end. Once the media is bored with her we'll barely hear from her again.

Maybe I'm just overly cynical

 

[DJ Jeff]

Where does everyone stand on the Greta Thunberg?

It's excellent that she has brought the discussion back into the mainstream but it all feels like a good media exercise so people can pat themselves on the back for looking like they're doing something good.

I feel bad for her in a way because I think her intentions are true and noble but she is being exploited and it probably won't make a difference in the end. Once the media is bored with her we'll barely hear from her again.

Maybe I'm just overly cynical

Don't think a child with Aspergers should be in the limelight to such a degree that she is harassed by random old cnuts online about the way she talks.. of course she's put herself there so maybe she's able for it.

 

[Massive Spanner]

https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-48041487

Antarctica: Thousands of emperor penguin chicks wiped out

 

[lynchie]

UK is interesting. I guess we've remained relatively stable due to the transition from Coal to Nuclear?

Coal to Gas mainly. Also the transition from manufacturing and heavy industry to a largely service economy, so most of our real emissions are exported to other countries.

 

[nickm]

Where does everyone stand on the Greta Thunberg?

It's excellent that she has brought the discussion back into the mainstream but it all feels like a good media exercise so people can pat themselves on the back for looking like they're doing something good.

I feel bad for her in a way because I think her intentions are true and noble but she is being exploited and it probably won't make a difference in the end. Once the media is bored with her we'll barely hear from her again.

Maybe I'm just overly cynical

The young can take a moral stance on this that the olders cannot. They need to be front and centre in this. My 11 year old son asks me hard to answer questions about climate change all the time especially the life he is going to lead. We need these kids to hold our feet to the fire on this because us lot are are fecking it up and need to be told.

 

[Buster15]

Where does everyone stand on the Greta Thunberg?

It's excellent that she has brought the discussion back into the mainstream but it all feels like a good media exercise so people can pat themselves on the back for looking like they're doing something good.

I feel bad for her in a way because I think her intentions are true and noble but she is being exploited and it probably won't make a difference in the end. Once the media is bored with her we'll barely hear from her again.

Maybe I'm just overly cynical

It doesn't matter whether we hear about her because this isn't about her. It is about potentially the biggest threat that mankind has to face up to.
Whether we are going to be able to live on this tiny planet in a way that doesn't result in catastrophic living conditions.

Greta Thunberg is simply someone who has been able to bring this issue into the public domain and the fact that she is a young lady has resulted in a bigger impact.

Eventually, her and XR will no longer have the same media impact and then it is up to us all to hold our government to account in order to get the necessary changes.
This is a global problem and it demands a global solution.
But we should not forget her and I am sure that she will continue to remind us of how important climate change is to us all.

 

[Eboue]

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

 

[RedTiger]

We are so fecked. It's making me more and more depressed everyday and I feel useless. I try and ignore it, try and push it to the back of my mind because what can I do? I don't control the levers of power or the levers of capitalism. I think about this shit every night.

 

[Buster15]

We are so fecked. It's making me more and more depressed everyday and I feel useless. I try and ignore it, try and push it to the back of my mind because what can I do? I don't control the levers of power or the levers of capitalism. I think about this shit every night.

Trying to ignore it is absolutely the wrong thing to do if you don't mind me saying.
All of the current information relating to the devastating damage we/all of us are doing to our planet is smacking us in the face.

We were first told 30 years ago about the very high risk of climate change.
In that 30 years the damage has increased and now we are being informed about the significant loss of biodiversity as a direct result of human intervention on our planet.

The most intelligent life form on this small planet is choosing to ignore all the scientific evidence and continue as normal.
It is a very Inconvenient Truth.
And it is only getting worse.
And the reason why. Total lack of leadership.
I have a huge respect for XR because when our children and our grandchildren ask us why we ignored the facts, our only answer will be:
WE COULDN'T BE BOTHERED.

 

[RedTiger]

Trying to ignore it is absolutely the wrong thing to do if you don't mind me saying.
All of the current information relating to the devastating damage we/all of us are doing to our planet is smacking us in the face.

We were first told 30 years ago about the very high risk of climate change.
In that 30 years the damage has increased and now we are being informed about the significant loss of biodiversity as a direct result of human intervention on our planet.

The most intelligent life form on this small planet is choosing to ignore all the scientific evidence and continue as normal.
It is a very Inconvenient Truth.
And it is only getting worse.
And the reason why. Total lack of leadership.
I have a huge respect for XR because when our children and our grandchildren ask us why we ignored the facts, our only answer will be:
WE COULDN'T BE BOTHERED.

The truth is that as humans we don't make collective decisions, we're either leaders or followers (with followers vastly outnumbering). We won't get anywhere by trying to coddle the masses into making their own lifes less convenient, we will need to have it forced on us for there to be any significant change in our collective behaviour. The problem arises when you realise that the people who hold the power to force this from above don't have it in their interests to do that.

 

[Buster15]

The truth is that as humans we don't make collective decisions, we're either leaders or followers (with followers vastly outnumbering). We won't get anywhere by trying to coddle the masses into making their own lifes less convenient, we will need to have it forced on us for there to be any significant change in our collective behaviour. The problem arises when you realise that the people who hold the power to force this from above don't have it in their interests to do that.

Undoubtedly you are quite right.
I am not overly confident that we will be able to make those necessary changes in the timeframe.