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Yeah yeahThat's why I mentioned its not just saying one spinner is better than the other, but also having an extra spinner as compared to the opposition.
No worries.A deadline is a deadline. Poll was open since yesterday morning.
If you ask me I would say no overseas pitches as similar to one in Asia, but going into all-time draft with over hundred years of players and matches played over various decades it makes it difficult to judge some the past spinners and its difficult to guess on what kind of pitches they would have played.We only got stats to judge these players but expecting at some point mangers would come up with details of pitches, spinners of past and how the batsmen cope with those.But how many places do we know of outside of Asia, that produce pitches that behave like that though?
Ah, thought it was tomorrow, will send in a couple of hours. Sorry.@The Man Himself @Edgar Allan Pillow send writeup you lazy cnuts
This is what happens when one leaves @Edgar Allan Pillow in-charge of anything. He was supposed to send it.@The Man Himself @Edgar Allan Pillow send writeup you lazy cnuts
One captain turns up for the toss, the other's still in the hutch. I should get a vote or two thereThis is what happens when one leaves @Edgar Allan Pillow in-charge of anything. He was supposed to send it.
League rules here are that you have to have 8 players at the venue for the toss to happen. You get one over deducted for every four minutes the toss is delayed and walkover is given if you still don't have 8 players by the 31st minute.One captain turns up for the toss, the other's still in the hutch. I should get a vote or two there
There's a hairy-ass streaker on the pitch. Refs had to delay the toss to give you a chance to get over your PTSDSomeone put a chair against their dressing room door
1) Your opening pace duo is awesome, but if it's pace you want Garner, Boult, Vaas ain't bad eitherWhy we'll win:
1) Pace friendly green top pitch + best pace duo of the draft.
2) 12Oz openers will be hard pressed with relentless pace attack exposing middle order to our bowlers relatively early. And that'll be a game changer.
3) We have better top order and better bowling. Too big a challenge for Kallis to bridge.
I prefer what I have to McMillan, Dev, Wasim but it's a fair point, I'm asking you to come with me on Beefy having something to say with the bat over two innings that belies his relatively modest average. At his best he could take games away from teams single-handed in a tough batting era but if you're not a fan I can't blame you. Dhoni's also a fine test batsman, with a proven record of providing versatility in his approach depending on the state of play. Vaas batted more like a genuine all-rounder in the latter half of his career, and although you could argue he milked Bangladesh in 2007 and Zimbabwe earlier than that, he showed genuine skill and I like him just fine at eight.Well matched, edging towards @Edgar Allan Pillow because of his bowling attack and I don't really like Botham, Dhoni and Vaas at 6,7 and 8. Early wickets which can happen and I'd want a bit more lower order strength.
@12OunceEpilogue
Botham is such a difficult one because he basically should've been dropped much earlier than he was. Its almost two different players. From wikipedia:I prefer what I have to McMillan, Dev, Wasim but it's a fair point, I'm asking you to come with me on Beefy having something to say with the bat over two innings that belies his relatively modest average. At his best he could take games away from teams single-handed in a tough batting era but if you're not a fan I can't blame you. Dhoni's also a fine test batsman, with a proven record of providing versatility in his approach depending on the state of play. Vaas batted more like a genuine all-rounder in the latter half of his career, and although you could argue he milked Bangladesh in 2007 and Zimbabwe earlier than that, he showed genuine skill and I like him just fine at eight.
Yep, got famous, got fat and relied on his status and skill rather than doing the work towards the end. I know it's too much to ask for everybody to assume '81/82 Botham is turning up for this while all the opposition players are going off their career averages only but I firmly believe Botham is having a say with the bat in that second innings.Botham is such a difficult one because he basically should've been dropped much earlier than he was. Its almost two different players. From wikipedia:
Botham's batting – although never the equal of his bowling abilities – declined as well, with a batting average of 38.80 for his first 51 Tests substantially higher than the 28.87 he managed in his last 51 Tests, again a number that would be considered unsatisfactory for a specialist batsman in most Test sides. In the first 5 years of Botham's Test career, when not playing as captain, he scored 2,557 runs at an average of 49.17 including 11 centuries and a highest score of 208, took 196 wickets at an average of 21.28 including nineteen 5 wicket hauls and held 50 catches. Such figures denote a player who would easily maintain a place in any Test side as a specialist batsman or bowler alone. During this period his reputation as one of the leading Test all-rounders was firmly established.
Nice of you to not assume Ijazz's gender.@Samid ? They missed by a minute.
Agree with this. 12Oz has good batting but no real bowling attack to speak of. This is somewhat matched by the other team having poor batting but is surviving due to Marshall + Akram.I don't like either of these teams and wish had drawn them instead of harshad.
For EAP, Brian McMillan useless in the team, having him as 6th bowler is crazy and you are better off with a specialist batsman in there. I mean even Gibbs or Morkel would be a fifth bowler in this side, bowling overkill for sure.
Oz on the other hand has average bowling unit for QF IMO. I think Marshall + Akram duo supported by Kapil is hard to overlook here despite Oz's batting being stronger
I don't like either of these teams and wish had drawn them instead of harshad.
For EAP, Brian McMillan useless in the team, having him as 6th bowler is crazy and you are better off with a specialist batsman in there. I mean even Gibbs or Morkel would be a fifth bowler in this side, bowling overkill for sure.
Oz on the other hand has average bowling unit for QF IMO. I think Marshall + Akram duo supported by Kapil is hard to overlook here despite Oz's batting being stronger
I don't know how many current quicks you can name before you mention Boult in terms of greatness, but it isn't very many. He's done it at every level including with the red ball and as a left armer with plenty of swing in his locker he's a great opening partner for Joel Garner, a West Indian legend. I also seem to remember Vaas getting no love in an ODI draft, no idea why as he was a top quick bowler in his day and had to almost single-handedly carry his nation's fast Test bowling for over a decade, while other top bowlers could share the load with players nearer their calibre. Botham is a marmite player as I conceded earlier but I just don't see where he qualifies as a nothing bowler, Lyon has a great record particularly away from typical turners and Kallis is as good a sixth bowler as you could hope to find.Agree with this. 12Oz has good batting but no real bowling attack to speak of. This is somewhat matched by the other team having poor batting but is surviving due to Marshall + Akram.
I would have voted for you on a flat wicket and perhaps even on a turner. I agree modern day bowlers like boult get underrated but his front line pacers are better than any of your pacers.I don't know how many current quicks you can name before you mention Boult in terms of greatness, but it isn't very many. He's done it at every level including with the red ball and as a left armer with plenty of swing in his locker he's a great opening partner for Joel Garner, a West Indian legend. I also seem to remember Vaas getting no love in an ODI draft, no idea why as he was a top quick bowler in his day and had to almost single-handedly carry his nation's fast Test bowling for over a decade, while other top bowlers could share the load with players nearer their calibre. Botham is a marmite player as I conceded earlier but I just don't see where he qualifies as a nothing bowler, Lyon has a great record particularly away from typical turners and Kallis is as good a sixth bowler as you could hope to find.
If you're tempted by the logic that on a fantastic bowling surface it is EAP/TMH's top top quality opening pair that tips the balance fair enough, but I'm not having for a second that I've no bowling attack to speak of.
Problem is that you don't need another allrounder you need a proper specialist batsman. On a green pitch if you require your 6th bowler to chip in then Akram and Marshall have already failed which is not a good sign ...EAP will be doing most of the argument/posting as typing anything more than 3-4 lines bores me nowadays
I just want to put a word for Big Mac. His numbers prima facie are average and doesn't seem a player who should be in 2nd round of all time drafts but as most of us have seen him, you should recall that he was one of the better going allrounders of 90s. Of course not as good as the ones in previous decade, but his batting average of ~40 increases to ~47 if Asia performances are excluded. He was 29 when South Africa were readmitted so we couldn't see a prolonged career for him but he was very important to that South Africa team when they were admitted back. So he is no Kallis from our opposite team, but we expect to do him a decent job at no. 6 in this match up. Though a decent bowler in helpful conditions, we may not need him on a green pitch when there is Akram+Marshall+Kapil and Morne to support.