And then Spinoza will get a bargain......
https://www.redcafe.net/f8/i-made-offer-house-today-201176/#post4588799
You're one sweet guy.
Daily Mail
- Thread starter p_ps_sock
- Start date
https://www.redcafe.net/f8/i-made-offer-house-today-201176/#post4588799
You're one sweet guy.
Nothing to do with feck everyone else, I have no sympathy for idiots getting themselves in trouble through having no foresight, and you can't blame the government for that.
I remember the early 90's, I have parents who told be what the early 80's were like, and I studied politics so know what the 70's were like, just because someone is old doesn't mean they're knowledgable, and just because someone's young(ish) doesn't mean they have no knowledge
no, it's any opportunity to have a dig and get it into the social conscience
Tis true.
Although, Labour don't need any help to feck themselves over anymore than they already have.
as long as people like you take that stand point nothing will change.
I wasn't in love with the idea of new labour, I still think John Smith's death was one of the worst things to happen to this country in the last 20 years, but they've done a pretty good job despite some of the poor choices made over the 11 years.
If people like you who are fed up with the status quo won't vote for a 'minor' party then you'll never get the changes you want and democracy fails.
New Labour deserves you. Go and put your GCSE on UK Political Theory (1970-2000) to good use.
you keep saying that without actually making any points.
What have they fecked up, which decisions/policies do you disagree with?
wtf is that supposed to mean?
just because I wasn't an adult in the early 80's I'm not qualified to make decision based what I KNOW went on then.
No I don't, dismount from your high horse.
Besides, do you not think Labour have fecked themselves over?
Personally, I think the Police, the NHS and schooling has got worse, plus they grossly misread the situation on Immigration too.
They've handled the economy well, the latest problems aren't completely outside their control, but they certainly are trying to right it.
Studying the 1960s/70s/80s in however much detail is not the same as living through those decades. I wouldn't try to tell someone who lived through the Second World War and rationing how bad things musth've been because I read it in a book.
I can tell you about the Best-Law-Charlton era because I saw it - but I've no idea how good the Busby Babes were because I didn't, no matter how much I read Tom Clare's articles.
What are you talking about? I said I vote on issues and manifestos, either national or local, and that means I have no particular allegiance to any party. I have always voted in General Elections, Local Elections and National Referendums - and on some occasions the party I voted for got in.
PS I rather liked John Smith and also Neil Kinnock, who would have at least showed more honesty than Blair.
John Terry, of course, subscribes to the Daily Mail.
FFS
you remember the 90's and your parents remember the 80's and read of the 70's and now you're the expert - Jesus wept as for your knowledge read remembered or imagined
look up the Wilson/Callaghan years PS Must read about the Holacaust so next time I meet survivors from Dachau/Auswitchz I can tell them they had it easy
steady on - he's read books ffs
John Terry, of course, is the editor of the Daily Mail.
Selling himself to thousands of low-lifes every day?
Sounds about right.
Sounds about right.
Why do people love to go on about why they hate the Daily Mail and the people who read the Daily Mail? I read the Daily Mail amongst every other major publication in this country- the Mirror still believes Labour is building a socialist nirvana whilst the Independent seem to have the recurring front page headline that we are all doomed with regard to global warming.
You may not like the stance the Mail takes on the news but they do print the news and what is relevant, which is more than can be said for the likes of the People and the Star- why not have a go at them.
Oh I forgot, it is the Mail that stands most opposed to Liberal idealism.
You may not like the stance the Mail takes on the news but they do print the news and what is relevant, which is more than can be said for the likes of the People and the Star- why not have a go at them.
Oh I forgot, it is the Mail that stands most opposed to Liberal idealism.
Don't know why I got so embroiled in this - I prefer the Telegraph. It's just I find New Labour abhorrent.
cos it washes even whiter than white
So do I, it is my paper of preference though I still read every other one going and I feel no hatred to any other paper or the people who read them.
Same here - including the obvious Beano and Dandy subscribers.
What? No, it's a vile rag, only just a bit better than the Daily Express by the odd decent commentator or campaign.
Melanie Phillips and Richard Littlejohn tell you all you need to know. Nasty, prejudiced, regressive rag which sadly speaks for more people than liberal-lefties like myself like to believe.
Just because one lived through something doesn't always make the immediately right, though it gives the an advantage.
Take the closing down of the nationalised industries in the early in 1980s. Speak to a miner or family of an ex-miner who lost their job and they'll be so fraught with anger and emotion that trying to convince them it was the best thing in the long run would be pointless, even though arguably a lot of the prosperity enjoyed in cities like Leeds, where I live and study now, owes much to those changes and the shifts in the economy/investment that followed.
They won't want to hear it, because all they will remember is their personal pain, quite rightly, they'll just remember their inability to feed their own family, find a job etc.
Just because they have that emotional capital doesn't necessarily make them right in the grand scheme of things. Sometimes not living personally through something can make you a dispassionate judge of it long term, even if it puts you in risk of sweeping generalisation or over-simplification etc.
It is no better than the tabloid rubbish they pretend to be above. They just use longer paragraphs to be as small minded.
I think I dislike the paper most because it represents that small minded bigotted little white middle class England that annoys me so much.
As a character in Fry and Laurie once said "I don't read The Mail. I prefer a newspaper".
I see where you're coming from, but what p_ps was trying to argue was that because he had studied that era he understood that pain. Imagine him going up to an ex-miner and telling him "I know what it must have been like".
I used to live in Northwich, which in the 19th century had a big salt mining industry. That came to a close because it became uneconomic to do so, but obviously much longer ago than the coal mines. That type of industry base is no longer viable as it has all moved overseas. My family background is the Lancashire cotton spinning industry, which has similarly disappeared along with much of the Yorkshire wool industry. The coalminers strikes of the 80s came about because you had two hardline politicians, Margaret Thatcher and Arthur Scargill (who are now thought of as dinosaurs of the right and left, respectively), who were both convinced they were right and neither would budge.
Ironically, the coal is still there and at some future time, when petroleum and natural gas run out or are about to run out, it will have to be used as a natural, albeit expensive carbon source for energy and chemical intermediate production.
I know its stretching the imagination but if you class The Sun as a newspaper, surely The Sun wins this award hands down!
I rate this post.
I don't recall saying I was an expert.FFS
as for your knowledge read remembered or imagined
PS Must read about the Holacaust so next time I meet survivors from Dachau/Auswitchz I can tell them they had it easy
I said not living through it doesn't mean I'm not qualified to comment on it or make voting decisions based on what happened.
The last comment is just a joke.
no I haven't claimed I understand the pain of the 70's, my comments have been on the 80's and 90's, times when I was alive and although young through most of it have heard first hand for most of life what the early 80's were like in thatchers failed experiment. That is an emotive issue for me. I'm not claiming to be an expert but I've known only one tory and one labour government and thats what has shaped my views.
I know (some) of the facts of the 70's but haven't made one comment about them apart from saying I know the facts, it isn't an emotive issue for me as neither I nor my immediate family were effected by them. Maybe that clouds my judgement, I don't know.
I do know that Thatcher was a figure of hate in our household due to what her policies put my family through.
Anyway, this thread was supposed to be about the mail being a rag.
Opinions are like arseholes, everyone's got one but they probably shouldn't be inspected too closely.
I have absolutely no problem with people choosing to vote however their conscience tells them, whether that be Tory, Labour, Lib Dem, Green or Whatever. I don't understand people who vote Tory on conscience but thats democracy, my problem is rags like this turning it into a popularity and mud slinging contest rather than a vote on issues.
We could argue issues and reasons till the day we die and not agree but I did not intent to offend and if I have I appologise.
Opinions are like arseholes, everyone's got one but they probably shouldn't be inspected too closely.
I have absolutely no problem with people choosing to vote however their conscience tells them, whether that be Tory, Labour, Lib Dem, Green or Whatever. I don't understand people who vote Tory on conscience but thats democracy, my problem is rags like this turning it into a popularity and mud slinging contest rather than a vote on issues.
We could argue issues and reasons till the day we die and not agree but I did not intent to offend and if I have I appologise.
Thatcher's failed experiment. What's that? Is this one of your exam questions - "The Thatcher years - were they a terrible success or a glorious failure? Please discuss".
Just as Tony Blair is a figure of hate in many households today. As were Callaghan and Wilson.
If your family suffered as a direct result of Thatcher policies, then I can at least understand your reaction. But please bear in mind that this has already happened, or is likely to happen in the next few months and years to come, to many other families as a result of New Labour's failures on many fronts.
the policy of keeping inflation under control through having a large pool of unemployed
Tony Blair a hate figure? Why?
Apart from party affiliations and disliking him personally he did nothing I can think of that rivals thatchers negative influence on people's day to day lives.
wasn't having a go at you, just wanted to know why you think that.
did sound confrontational - apologies
that just it, I just don't see where this is coming from, unemployment isn't bad, inflation is low(ish) there aren't millions queing to sign on.
If that was the case I could understand the vile being spewed but just don't see it.
There maybe a house price slump on its way but there are alot of factors involved, mainly the banks lack of confidence in each other rather than policy errors.
I don't but true.I know its stretching the imagination but if you class The Sun as a newspaper, surely The Sun wins this award hands down!
The Sun doesn't annoy me as much because anyone stupid enough to think that it reports real news will never master the complexities involved in voting.
Mine did. That's why I can't bring myself to vote for the Tories, and doubt I ever will.
if you want an answer to that you really do need to revise your recent history
as for Thatcher for every negative influence on day to day lives of people there were probably as many beneficial.
For me - as a working class child brought up in a mining community with a coalminer father her reducing the power of unions was one of her greatest achievements. Something previous labour governments were incable or unwilling to do and made the jobs of subsequent Labour administrations easier than they would have been