Daniel Taylor on Martial

Bebestation

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If he doesn't score he assists.
 

Withnail

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Weird thread.
Quite.

Also cobbling together a bunch of old stories along with the fact that he isn't getting picked for France and using them as a stick to beat him with I find a bit odd.

Especially the France stuff. If he isn't a regular at United he isn't getting near their squad. It's not like they're stuck for forwards.
 

OL29

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It's this weird obsession this forum has had over the last few years of wilderness -- to attack the best players, but end up defending the talentless lionhearts.
Yeah, it started with Nani, our fans tend to appreciate passion over ability.
 

KennyBurner

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Yeah, it started with Nani, our fans tend to appreciate passion over ability.
English football has always admired passion more than ability. Things started changing when wenger arrived.
 

momo83

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He's 24 in a few weeks, I'm not saying he's an OAP before people jump on me, but he's not 20 anymore. There's only so long we can point to the moments of brilliance. He's barely progressed since he got here. I desperately want him to fulfil his clear potential, but I'd be lying if I said I believe he will, at least at Utd.

People who talk like we shouldn't bring in another striker because we have him are quite frankly mad.

Many on here in love with the idea of what Martial could be, and not what he currently is. He's got all the materials to be very good, but is unbelievably frustrating.

I hope it can click for him, maybe with more quality around him, some better coaching, we'll see more from him.
Tbf he’s shown what he can do... he’s career and progression has been hindered by first LVG being in awe of Rooney and secondly Mourinho favouring Zlatan and Lukaku.. will he ever be as great as he could have been? Don’t think so because he’s been mismanaged at key developmental stages of his career, but he can still be very very good
 

Jeppers7

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In patches though. As he's always done. He is equally as good as he is bad. He will rip a team apart one week and then go annonymous when we depend on him the next week.

That's not good enough. It's the fact he downs tools that bothers me the most. When things don't go his way, he stops making runs, stops showing for the ball, he strolls around the pitch looking uninterested. So frustrating for us as we know he does have the ability to rip teams apart.
He’s not where I’d start...he’s been excellent this season. Along with james perhaps our best player, McT has been overrated. Had many poor games.

I’d start with midfield. Then I’d get cover in forward areas. Then perhaps if the issues still lie in a season, look then.

People are so consumed with dislike for individual players, usually our most talented, they can’t see past it
 

Classical Mechanic

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He’s not where I’d start...he’s been excellent this season. Along with james perhaps our best player, McT has been overrated. Had many poor games.

I’d start with midfield. Then I’d get cover in forward areas. Then perhaps if the issues still lie in a season, look then.

People are so consumed with dislike for individual players, usually our most talented, they can’t see past it
Rashford has clearly been our best player in my opinion: 10 goals and 4 assists in 16 starts. Produced the magic to get us past Chelsea in the League Cup and always puts a shift in.

Martial has done well but he just hasn't played enough for him to be considered our best player. James has done well too but he's less influential than Rashford overall.
 

roonster09

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Rashford has clearly been our best player in my opinion: 10 goals and 4 assists in 16 starts. Produced the magic to get us past Chelsea in the League Cup and always puts a shift in.

Martial has done well but he just hasn't played enough for him to be considered our best player. James has done well too but he's less influential than Rashford overall.
Yeah, Rashford is our best player this season, followed by James. Like you said Martial missed many games.

When he was available, he was good. Started 9 games and contributed goal or assist in 7 games, that's a good record. I think for now attack is set, we need to concentrate on midfield.
 

JPRouve

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Rashford has clearly been our best player in my opinion: 10 goals and 4 assists in 16 starts. Produced the magic to get us past Chelsea in the League Cup and always puts a shift in.

Martial has done well but he just hasn't played enough for him to be considered our best player. James has done well too but he's less influential than Rashford overall.
I wouldn't separate them. Rashford's good form coincede with Martial presence and I don't think that Martial's game would be as valuable without Rashford.
 
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DoomSlayer

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Rashford has clearly been our best player in my opinion: 10 goals and 4 assists in 16 starts. Produced the magic to get us past Chelsea in the League Cup and always puts a shift in.

Martial has done well but he just hasn't played enough for him to be considered our best player. James has done well too but he's less influential than Rashford overall.
It should actually be 10 goals and 5 assists, so Rashford should easily reach 30+ goal contributions for the season. Not bad for man like "trashford" as I've seen him being called on the Caf.
 

VJ1762

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I wouldn't separate them. Rashford's good form coincede with Martial presense and I don't think that Martial's game would be as valuable without Rashford.
Better love story than twilight.
 

Jeppers7

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Rashford has clearly been our best player in my opinion: 10 goals and 4 assists in 16 starts. Produced the magic to get us past Chelsea in the League Cup and always puts a shift in.

Martial has done well but he just hasn't played enough for him to be considered our best player. James has done well too but he's less influential than Rashford overall.
I like both, Rashford had a terrible start to the season though. But on form I think he's class and as a front three it excites me.
 

Blueman

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I'v watched Martial a lot in the last few months. I was expecting him to shine under a new manager who believes in him. But I dont like what I see tbh.

He loses the ball and nothing..... He doesnt chase back and win it or even try, he doesnt even look concerned. He gets exasperated when teammates make a poor pass to him, I watch him when United score and nothing - no excitment, no cheering or relief, totally devoid of passion and emotion when it comes to football. He doesnt half remind me of a very poor Nicolas Anelka
 

EireRed_GS

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Martial's first half performance yesterday vs villa drove me absolutely mental..

He just wasnt bothered. At one point when we had the ball on the attack he stood at the D at edge of box, our MF was looking for runners, people moving, something to give them an option, & Martial was just stood there. took a step to his right , one to his left. Barely moved. All during this time, Juan Mata (Whos legs are gone) made about 4 zig zag runs from one side of the D to the other right past Tony. All during this time Martial didnt move a muscle and the ball eventually was played through to no one. I was behind the goal screaming at him. When he cant be bothered like that we might aswell have 10 men on.

He sorted himself out in the 2nd half and started moving a bit then. Shocking attitude overall.

And did he walk straight down the tunnel after beign subbed too??
 
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Sky1981

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If Martial were to leave today, it wouldn’t be about how he was , it would be about what could have been.
Having said that, I’m a huge Martial fan. His presence in our team currently makes us significantly better and unlike many others who’ve posted here, I believe that he has the potential to score 25+ in a season. Even last year there was a good period under Mourinho where he scored in 6-7 games consecutively.

However, that does not mean that we shouldn’t go for another striker such as Haaland. One thing that Martial himself is wouldn’t be able to disagree with would be that his availability / form on the pitch remains patchy and as a squad we need another quality forward option. If we want Martial to become what we hope he could be, he will have to do it the cost of proving himself against internal competition as well.
Off course. Even if the rumors and hearsays are true having martial certainly helps a midtable teams.

I doubt martial would start on other top 4 teams with this sort of attitude. His only contribution to the team is when he has his moments of brilliance, any other time he's a handicap.

I can see why old school coaches like deschamps and jose dont like to rely on someone whose forms is too erratic to depend on.

He'll be good for underdogs that needs that moment of brilliance to score, not in a well oiled teams that scores consistently
 

Andersonson

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Off course. Even if the rumors and hearsays are true having martial certainly helps a midtable teams.

I doubt martial would start on other top 4 teams with this sort of attitude. His only contribution to the team is when he has his moments of brilliance, any other time he's a handicap.

I can see why old school coaches like deschamps and jose dont like to rely on someone whose forms is too erratic to depend on.

He'll be good for underdogs that needs that moment of brilliance to score, not in a well oiled teams that scores consistently

Of course he wouldnt be a starter for a top team. He isnt good enough for that.

What bothers me the most is his personality. He cant speak english, half the games he jogs around and he's one of the best paid players without ever being close to having a very good season bar his debut.

Pisses me off the wages our players are on just because its man united. Some of the players earning top money and being Everton quality.

Martial looked a top talent, but the mentality isnt there. We should get rid of him and the scouting department
 

0le

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We're 11th in the league. Hard to find positives there to be fair to them.
Yes, I agree, but even when there is a lull around the club, the same thing happens to generate clicks.
 

MaxiPaxi

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He'll never reach the potential that he has. He's extremely talented but way too laissez faire in his attitude and approach to just about anything regarding football. He doesn't particularly look interested in anything really.
 

freeurmind

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We've got problems in our squad but Martial isnt one of them. Yes sometimes his application is lacking but hes got quality. I think him and Greenwood are good enough to lead the line.
 

AneRu

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He'll never reach the potential that he has. He's extremely talented but way too laissez faire in his attitude and approach to just about anything regarding football. He doesn't particularly look interested in anything really.
True he lacks grit, if he had McTominay's attitude he would be some player. I think attitude is the only difference between him and someone like Mane. When things don't go his way initially he doesn't have that fight in him to continue knocking the door.
 

Tony247

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Martial is only a decorated Baloteli. He is lazy and careless. Talent means nothing when you don't supplement it with hard work. You know a hard worker and a team player when you see one. He is neither. Better sell him when we can get some money back.
 

Judas

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Swap him with a clinical goalscorer who can link up play, and I'd never think about him again. For all Rashford's faults, he's always giving his all, even if nothings coming off for him. It's a shame, but he's not the first nor the last footballer who looks to have it all, but doesn't know how or really seem to want to be the very best he can be.

I do think there would be harsher opinions on him if he played for another club, but we all want him to be a success so bad, watched him so closely, of course we thinker highly of him.
 

flappyjay

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Swap him with a clinical goalscorer who can link up play, and I'd never think about him again. For all Rashford's faults, he's always giving his all, even if nothings coming off for him. It's a shame, but he's not the first nor the last footballer who looks to have it all, but doesn't know how or really seem to want to be the very best he can be.

I do think there would be harsher opinions on him if he played for another club, but we all want him to be a success so bad, watched him so closely, of course we thinker highly of him.
When Rashford was playing as a striker before Martials return there were games where he actually had less touches that De Gea and was also getting stick for his movement, there is also a video ridiculing is movement. There are only 4-5 strikers who can make up for our shite midfielders now Martial like Rashford before him is getting the blame for how poor the team is
 

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Rashford isn't a CF though, it's not where he plays best. Martial believes CF is where he should be, its where he wants to play, and yet his performances aren't great, they're really no different to when he's out wide. So it's a bit different for me, not sure the comparison is needed.
 

12OunceEpilogue

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When Rashford was playing as a striker before Martials return there were games where he actually had less touches that De Gea and was also getting stick for his movement, there is also a video ridiculing is movement. There are only 4-5 strikers who can make up for our shite midfielders now Martial like Rashford before him is getting the blame for how poor the team is
Yeah I think Martial as it stands is our best centre forward, better than Rashford in that position for sure, but that doesn't allay the nagging feeling that Martial lacks the mental bona fides to make the step up from the good, streaky, sometimes wonderful player he is to the consistently great, maybe world class forward we all hope he can be. I think that's also Taylor's point in his writing.
 

theklr

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Yeah I think Martial as it stands is our best centre forward, better than Rashford in that position for sure, but that doesn't allay the nagging feeling that Martial lacks the mental bona fides to make the step up from the good, streaky, sometimes wonderful player he is to the consistently great, maybe world class forward we all hope he can be. I think that's also Taylor's point in his writing.
Agree somewhat, his bad spells are usually longer than other top-class CF's.

But all strikers/players have some off games, with him is just more apparant since we dont have any backup or alternative style of play on his off days.
 
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12OunceEpilogue

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Agree somewhat, his bad spells are usually longer than other top-class CF's.

But all strikers/players have some off games, with him is just more apparant since we dont have any backup or alternative style of play on his off days.
Definitely United is a bad place to be at the moment when you dip in form, as there's no-one to take your place to ease the heat on you. I'd say Rashford bore the brunt of that issue most this season when he was worked like a pit pony and ended up injured running blind alleys against Newcastle, but yes the fact we have no viable alternative to Martial in that central forward role isn't helping him.
 

flappyjay

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Rashford isn't a CF though, it's not where he plays best. Martial believes CF is where he should be, its where he wants to play, and yet his performances aren't great, they're really no different to when he's out wide. So it's a bit different for me, not sure the comparison is needed.
He isn't but he also isn't someone you can ever accuse of being static yet he also couldn't seem to ever get any balls passed to him no matter how many runs he made
 

Bebestation

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A pure false 9.

His intention is to first bring players in to play before he makes the run in to the box.

If we use this as a tactic - his runs will become much more consistent because its what he does literally all thrle frigging time.
 

Sayros

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The boy might get people off his back for a week or so now!
Until the team, not even just him, but the team has a poor game...then he'll be back to being a fraud, lazy bum, nothing player, etc by some of the "supporters" around here.
 

Sayros

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Meanwhile, 6 goals and 4 assists in his last 13 PL starts.
 
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