Aside from the rumoured leaks last season, I'm also reminded of the season before that when he was dropped to the bench against Fulham and then that very day reports emerged linking him with a move away from the club. With subsequent reports suggesting "senior figures" at the club were not impressed by such stories mysteriously appearing in the press.
Dean Henderson | Nottingham Forest loan watch
- Thread starter roonster09
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Always came across as a bit of a twat. That being said I do understand where he's coming from. With the World Cup coming up he has a chance to win a spot in Southgate's XI and it wouldn't be worth gambling on a starting spot. In reality he should have just gone on loan and kept his mouth shut. You've got the move you wanted, what exactly are you hoping to achieve by ranting in public?
What makes it obvious?
The most notable thing I would be looking for to see if a player is leaking information to the media is for that media to then be really promoting that player (or alternatively criticising his competitors). Sure there was plenty of social media promoting Henderson and criticising De Gea, but I don't remember any of the actual media doing so. If anything the media tends to absolutely love De Gea and constantly go on about his saves while largely ignoring his weaknesses.
Don't blame him at all. He hasn't said anything wrong except for calling out Ole and Ed.
Ole wasn't around long enough last season to take responsibility for the likes of Lingard and Henderson's lack of minutes. That's on RR more than anyone and even then I find it hard to believe that had either been lighting it up in training an interim with nothing to lose wouldn't not of picked them
Nothing that wasn’t already obvious. He’s joined the long list of average English goalkeepers who think they’re great. Fits in well with Pickford and Ramsdale.
Eh?
Criticising the regime is what the leaks were doing and commenting on morale at the club. Disgruntled players is what you are looking for…
Pretty much every player was disgruntled last season...
I don’t think anything he said is particularly bad? ETH almost certainly would have wanted him to stay as he’s obviously within the top 2 keepers at the club. He just wasted a season on the bench with us and obviously wants to be playing. I’m not in the blame Ole for everything camp but I do think in this particular case it’s pretty much all down to Ole convincing him to stay and then almost immediately making DDG the starter.
Agreed.
Solskjaer as much as I like him, managed things very badly and created a bad atmosphere by trying to appease too many players and we ended with a unbalanced and bloated squad.
I don't care if he's a twat. We need to replace DDG soon and I don't want club to spend 80m on some rando when we have a replacement right here.
He has reason to be passive aggressive in that interview. Ole and Ed were pussie for let status quo tcontrol the club for so long.
He has reason to be passive aggressive in that interview. Ole and Ed were pussie for let status quo tcontrol the club for so long.
it was Ole's fault he got covid and missed the start of the season?
Yeah but it's the squad management aspect. The squad building. We as fans all knew that if de Gea is fit and in form, he'd start. Henderson only stayed on the basis of being the #1 goalie. Not #1 unless de Gea recovers form. Ole told him he was #1. He wasn't.
Lingard had the loan, had offers to leave, but was told he'd be used. He of course, was not. Of course the players should take some blame for lacking common sense and being unable to see what is clear for everyone else (van de Beek right now is suffering the same issue). But as a manager, you have to be clear and honest with your players and what their roles are, otherwise they'll get pissed and become disgruntled and cause dressing room issues. Motivation drops, training performances drop, and that attitude just exploded everywhere else once it slips in if not handled appropriately.
That's all on Ole. How he accumulated the squad, the promises he made, and then refused to actually use them as he said (whether he was right to leave them out or not doesn't matter, he shouldnt have promised them these roles). That's the problem with overly big squads and it happens always if a manager collects too fat of a squad. That's why Pep loves working with a tiny squad. That's why he let Jesus and Zinchenko leave. Its better to let them leave if they want regular football, than to force them to stay "just in case" there's an injury crisis. That to me has always been the starting main reason for last season's disaster, and why I'll always point at Ole for that. That, and the amateurish coaching level. By the time Ralf came, the damage was done. He of course didn't help by bringing in MLS level coaches, but by then, half the squad was pissed and knew they were off anyway. So it was an impossible situation for him.
Agreed. We have to eventually move on from the subbutteo keeper like Spain have.
Maybe he is trying to show off he is really good and confident, but comes across as a dickhead. And rumours of being leaky
Henderson was basically number 1 come the end of Ole's 2nd season, DDG had become the Europa league keeper
Lingard was getting minutes under Ole early on in the 3rd season after the loan, he wasn't starting games granted but he was coming on getting goals and important ones as well. Lingard was getting way more game time under Ole than he did under RR
Yep. Didn't know what he wanted to do with goalkeepers, told them both they were #1, of course 1 will get pissed when he isn't. There is no such thing as healthy competition in a position that never gets rotated or subbed. It's nonsense. You have a starter and a backup.
And you can't be a useful squad player if there are 2/3 players ahead of you just in terms of a backup role alone. It was horrible squad management and why it's vital that guys like Bailly, Jones, Williams, Tuanzebe, Telles all leave. Or even Van de Beek, Garner... If we sign a midfielder, those 2 will have severely limited minutes, and they should be aware and ready for this. Otherwise they'll kick up a fuss.
Yeah but you can see why he's angry. I don't particularly care for Lingard, but the club obviously dithered/lied to him too
You have to be fair to the player. They have careers to think about. It's one thing saying to a player 'fight for your place' but they have to have the opportunity at least to do that.
Solskjaer just kicked the can down the line on any tough decisions and the result is a bloated squad with some pi**ed-off players
You have to be fair to the player. They have careers to think about. It's one thing saying to a player 'fight for your place' but they have to have the opportunity at least to do that.
Solskjaer just kicked the can down the line on any tough decisions and the result is a bloated squad with some pi**ed-off players
Alway thought he was an arrogant jerk. Hope we get a fee for him next year.
Lingard played a combined 64 minutes in the opening 12 league games last season. That doesn't count as getting minutes. 19 combined minutes in the first 3 games of the CL. 72 minutes in the EFL Cup game we lost.
As for Henderson, that's debatable. He came in when De Gea got injured. Top 4 was comfortable, Europa League became priority. It became very easy to play Henderson in the league where the games became irrelevant, and de Gea in the Europa League when he recovered which was all we had to play for in the last 3rd of the season.
Yes, Ralf didn't help, but Ole was the #1 reason for accumulating a stupidly bloated squad, and he would have promised these players bigger roles than what they actually had before he got sacked (very evident by everything they all said since last summer). Also - when the team is losing regularly, you can't even point to "don't want to change a winning team" as the reason they aren't getting minutes. So it makes things worse.
Not talking to ETH could prove a huge mistake. I get he was frustrated but it’s nobody’s fault that he caught Covid and took an age to get fit again.
This lad's funny and he doesn't even mean to be!
There was rumor that Rashford was leaker too but everyone still want to kiss his ass
complete speculation unless you were in the room as well
ah yes the 3rd most abused PL footballer in the PL always getting his ass kissed is he
Sell
Don’t want him
Don’t want him
I totally understand what he's saying, but there's something about that third tweet that rubs me up the wrong way. Maybe even elements of that fourth one.
From what he's saying, the club seem to be giving mixed messages. But, the reality is, you've got two players fighting for one spot. It's also the type of position where a manager is more likely to play it safe and stick with what they know, since you can't be changing your goalkeeper every single week. A loan may be a good idea for him, but he 100% should be talking to ETH, at least before pissing off on loan. For that reason alone, I wouldn't mind one bit if ETH decided to move him on.
Rashford leaking, Deano leaking and Lingard. It's just leaking.
Evidence please.
Sounds like he's just done with the club
Evidence of what? That a fan base thought Henderson and Lingard were mostly behind it? You can find that yourself, starting in here.
Booed by his own fans at home too along with constant abuse and scorn after the Euros but yea his ass gets kissedah yes the 3rd most abused PL footballer in the PL always getting his ass kissed is he
I’m torn on this as if he’s been lied to I get the anger. I also feel we let him down when DDG had poor seasons and he never really got a chance (even if it was just to drop DDG for a game to show a bit of meritocracy) then he did well in his run before getting covid and basically hasn’t been seen since. He’s 25, he should be starting somewhere by now for the good of his long term career.
Get the impression he’s not very popular though, seems like no one is that bothered about him internally and he seems done with us.
There were interviews with so many players last summer saying how they've spoken to the manager, they will have game time and are happy with the roles given, etc etc etc. Dean Henderson now. No player is going to be happy with being told they're 3rd/4th choice and barely making the squad, and then go out and complain about it later. They're told 1 thing and another thing happens. Our squad last season this was always going to happen given how bloated it was. Many of us brought it up last summer as an issue, and it turned into being a huge problem clearly.
Ronaldo, Cavani, martial, Sancho, Rashford, Greenwood, Bruno, mata, Lingard, Donny, Elanga were essentially our "front 4 options" last season. Arguably Pogba too. That's 11/12 players for 4 positions. Ok Elanga as a youngster didn't care and Mata probably knew he wasn't playing much, and let's say Pogba is the deeper midfield (even though he played in the front 4 often). Still 9 players. You think Lingard and Donny were told "hey, you're options 8 and 9 for the front 4, that means if there is a full rotation, you might make it, but other than that, you'll be lucky to make the bench" and that they were just ok with that? Like feck they were! It was obvious they were lied to about their roles and it backfired.
Why didn't Ralf help? Oh right, he was under pressure to deliver results, and played those he trusted. This isn't FM... if the fringe players get disgruntled why did the first teamers also turn to shit?
The dressing room atmosphere plays a big impact on performances, that has always been a known thing. Ralf didn't help because he brought in MLS level coaches and the whole Lingard thing on deadline day and then never using him. Generally though I think he had an impossible task anyway, but he didn't help.
Fringe players being disgruntled means your training sessions each and every day are impacted. Players who are friends with others get impacted by it and start taking sides. You get constant distractions. You aren't training or working with a United group, but it's a group where half the people are putting in half the effort as they don't want to be there, and then it drags the quality of everything down. The morale was absolutely shattered last season, and that stemmed from a mixture of garbage coaching and garbage squad/man management. That's it. Henderson and Lingard are 2 of the biggest examples of garbage management. Both should have been sold ages ago if they wanted regular football, yet they were kept around to be "squad players", and then never used
It's fine for him to be angry and feel the way he does but he doesn't need to go public about it. It's completely unnecessary and just creates problems. He should be professional
If he was promised the starting keeper spot last season he has every right to be angry and mistrust the club. Of 49 first team matches the club played last season he played in 3 for a total of about 250 minutes.
Henderson went on loan for 3 full seasons working his way up the leagues, did a full season in the prem with Sheffield and played in 26 first team matches for united before that. He is clearly good enough to start in the premier league, likely with clubs lining up to loan/buy him so he can start for them. it sounds like he'd have been fine with another loan to a premier league club, so lying to him about being the starting keeper then letting him rot on the bench with 3rd keeper minutes is awful.
Henderson went on loan for 3 full seasons working his way up the leagues, did a full season in the prem with Sheffield and played in 26 first team matches for united before that. He is clearly good enough to start in the premier league, likely with clubs lining up to loan/buy him so he can start for them. it sounds like he'd have been fine with another loan to a premier league club, so lying to him about being the starting keeper then letting him rot on the bench with 3rd keeper minutes is awful.
That’s straight out the Fergie textbook. If you think you may need them, exaggerate what their role will be to get them to stay. If you don’t need them and they get pissed off about it, who’s arsed at that point? Just them. A few players complained that Fergie did this.