Autocorrect strikes again?
Did Wayne Rooney fulfil his potential?
- Thread starter sullydnl
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I remember when Rooney was our biggest talent and not Ronaldo. And after that wink in 06 world cup, a lot were calling for Ronaldo to be gone(Which is stupid, and I should add that I was not a fan of Ronaldo either.). And no, Rooney hasn't fulfilled his potential. He didn't take care of his body properly which could've helped him along in the later years in his career(which is now, considering he started playing regular professional games at 16) and he has been absolutely abysmal for the most part of last two years, where he should be regularly scoring goals.
Yes.
Rooney has achieved incredible things. Being the top scorer for a club like United is no joke but has he fulfilled his potential? I am gonna have to say no.
Look, the answer of this question is very relative and no one is 100% right. But, I remember the very first years of Rooney and he could and should have been a Ballon d'or contender for at least a couple of times. He had lightning pace, incredible strength, good enough finishing and a very very good vision. On top of that, I used to feel he was a lot more competitive on the pitch. Apart from 2009-2010 season, I don't think we saw a consistent development in any of these strengths. I always felt his development slowed down after 2006-2007. SAF changed his position from main striker to a different version of number 10, maybe that played a role but I just don't think he never managed to establish a sustainable level like Messi or Ronaldo did. Yes, those two are on a different level above anyone else but Rooney was a better prospect than Ronaldo in their first two years.
SAF wrote in his book that, compared to a standard player, Rooney needed more time to recover. I am sure that played a role. If the lifestyle rumours about him is true, then maybe that is the reason why, but I am not a doctor. We always read about Ronaldo's unbelievable work ethic. We see the results on the pitch. We have Zlatan right in front of our eyes. Wayne never took of or never played on a sustainable level as those two.
I think, with his potential, he should have been a lot better but as I said, the answer of this question is very relative. At the end of the day, I am always grateful to his contributions. He is a legend for sure.
Look, the answer of this question is very relative and no one is 100% right. But, I remember the very first years of Rooney and he could and should have been a Ballon d'or contender for at least a couple of times. He had lightning pace, incredible strength, good enough finishing and a very very good vision. On top of that, I used to feel he was a lot more competitive on the pitch. Apart from 2009-2010 season, I don't think we saw a consistent development in any of these strengths. I always felt his development slowed down after 2006-2007. SAF changed his position from main striker to a different version of number 10, maybe that played a role but I just don't think he never managed to establish a sustainable level like Messi or Ronaldo did. Yes, those two are on a different level above anyone else but Rooney was a better prospect than Ronaldo in their first two years.
SAF wrote in his book that, compared to a standard player, Rooney needed more time to recover. I am sure that played a role. If the lifestyle rumours about him is true, then maybe that is the reason why, but I am not a doctor. We always read about Ronaldo's unbelievable work ethic. We see the results on the pitch. We have Zlatan right in front of our eyes. Wayne never took of or never played on a sustainable level as those two.
I think, with his potential, he should have been a lot better but as I said, the answer of this question is very relative. At the end of the day, I am always grateful to his contributions. He is a legend for sure.
No; who knows what he would have become if he had the application of others who sit in that kind of pantheon.
Rooney relied too much on his natural ability and fitness and paid no heed to the finer aspects of his game on or off the pitch. He started so many seasons in reverse trying to recover from his pre-season escapades that it took its toll in the end and compromised whole chunks of his seasons.
It's pointless to compare a player like Rooney with the mere mortal footballers who dot the football landscape as he was always destined for greatness and the question was always about where he would end up in relation to the past greats, so trophy haul isn't the be all of his legacy at all.
As it is, he's going to claim the records as top scorer for club and country but be in nobody's all-time team for either side, which says a lot.
It could take generations for another English talent with his potential to come along, which is testament to what Rooney was.
Rooney's ended up a crown prince; he should have been a king.
Rooney relied too much on his natural ability and fitness and paid no heed to the finer aspects of his game on or off the pitch. He started so many seasons in reverse trying to recover from his pre-season escapades that it took its toll in the end and compromised whole chunks of his seasons.
It's pointless to compare a player like Rooney with the mere mortal footballers who dot the football landscape as he was always destined for greatness and the question was always about where he would end up in relation to the past greats, so trophy haul isn't the be all of his legacy at all.
As it is, he's going to claim the records as top scorer for club and country but be in nobody's all-time team for either side, which says a lot.
It could take generations for another English talent with his potential to come along, which is testament to what Rooney was.
Rooney's ended up a crown prince; he should have been a king.
Aye, even if we accept that he could never have reached the level of Messi or Ronaldo he still failed to match the level of the next best coterie of players from his generation. You've already mentioned Ibra/Suarez and the likes of Xavi and Iniesta were far, far, far superior players too. Probably a few more too?
If we go by the Ballon D'Or (which I don't like but whatever), then even in a Messi-less and Ronaldo-less world Rooney would still only have been recognised as the third best player in the world at his peak, something someone like Griezmann has already achieved. In other years quite a large number of players would have outperformed him. That certainly wasn't what I expected when he burst onto the scene.
For me it just comes down to the eye-test though. The player I watched for years simply wasn't the player I think he could have been.
This for me is the most obvious part when it comes to whether I feel rooney has fulfilled his potential. How can you achieve soo much but still not be in that discussion. For me he truly wouldn't get in any all time great team.
If you were to give him a graph with the Y axis (verticle) of total ability and x axis (horizontal) of age, the ages of 16-25 would almost be a verticle line, then from 25-28 he went diaganol a bit and 28+ he went horizontal and then back down on himself.
Like someeone else said, if we say Rashford will accomplish what Rooney has (stats wise) then id take it all day long but looking at Rooney ages 16-24 and for me sky was the limit so its easy to be a little dissapointed but due to his body shape and the way he played (like a wrecking ball) it has taken its toll.
Its like getting a super car and thrashing it everytime you get in it, even to go the shops when the engine is cold. Eventually it will wa(y)ne.
Like someeone else said, if we say Rashford will accomplish what Rooney has (stats wise) then id take it all day long but looking at Rooney ages 16-24 and for me sky was the limit so its easy to be a little dissapointed but due to his body shape and the way he played (like a wrecking ball) it has taken its toll.
Its like getting a super car and thrashing it everytime you get in it, even to go the shops when the engine is cold. Eventually it will wa(y)ne.
This. The revisionist history that goes on regarding Rooney on here is quite something. It was only the first half of last season where he was consistently poor over a long duration of time. Even last season towards the end he was quite important in our victories in the fa cup semi final and final. And as stated Rooney was by far our best attacking player during Moyes' and LVG's first season. Even this season after he was dropped he's been quite good from November onwards whenever he's played.
His best years were definitely from 2006-2012 but that doesn't mean he's been shit after that.
Onto the topic of this thread, well seeing how he played in the first few years of his professional career yes it has to be said we all expected him to become a Balloon D'or level player which he didn't. But his numbers and accomplishments speak for themselves. And he's done all this playing for th biggest club in the country and being a vital player in one of our most successful periods.
Also looking at the number of goals he's got for club and country over his career, I struggle to think of any Englishman other than Alan Shearer who can come close to his numbers over the last 30 years or so. That is a testament to his sheer quality and longevity. And all this while not always playing as the main striker.
2004 ish I thought he'd go on to be better than he was. Great player for sure - but no didn't fulfill his potential for me.
I honestly think if he had the same dedication as Ronaldo towards fitness/lifestyle he would have been better (Ballon d'Or contender), but that said it is difficult to have any complaints when the man is going to be the all time United top scorer.
Quite ashamed of some the posts in this thread.
Fulfilled his potential? He's Manchester United's and England top scorer. What else could he do?
He's scored also the best goal I've ever seen at old Trafford, against city too.
He's dedicated his full footballing careeer to us, despite the fact he's an Everton fan too.
I think he's fulfilled his footballing potential. He's a United legend, and a footballing legend.
Any footballer EVER will be extremely lucky to have a career like Wayne's.
He's done all this whilst also not being renowned for his goal scoring ability. He's such a selfless team player and under appreciated by people on this forum.
Well done Wayne, I'd like you to break the record at home and get a good reception. Sir Bobby is a legend which might never be replicated. But anyone who scores 200+ goals for this club deserves the record. Well done and let's hope one day in 30/40+ years someone else can break the record which you rightfully own.
Fulfilled his potential? He's Manchester United's and England top scorer. What else could he do?
He's scored also the best goal I've ever seen at old Trafford, against city too.
He's dedicated his full footballing careeer to us, despite the fact he's an Everton fan too.
I think he's fulfilled his footballing potential. He's a United legend, and a footballing legend.
Any footballer EVER will be extremely lucky to have a career like Wayne's.
He's done all this whilst also not being renowned for his goal scoring ability. He's such a selfless team player and under appreciated by people on this forum.
Well done Wayne, I'd like you to break the record at home and get a good reception. Sir Bobby is a legend which might never be replicated. But anyone who scores 200+ goals for this club deserves the record. Well done and let's hope one day in 30/40+ years someone else can break the record which you rightfully own.
Yea I think so. Sure at 18 he was destined to be the next pele or whatever but how many players have we seen come with the 'next maradona' 'next Pele' 'next zidane' tags? And how many have even reached a reasonable level?
Compare that to a player who was expected to be the best player in the world going by his performances at 18 and won the premier league 5 times, CL once, played in the CL final another couple more times, league cup, FA Cup, club World Cup, is the highest scorer for his national team, is the highest scorer for his club. All by 32. That's success and fulfilling potential in my books.
Compare that to a player who was expected to be the best player in the world going by his performances at 18 and won the premier league 5 times, CL once, played in the CL final another couple more times, league cup, FA Cup, club World Cup, is the highest scorer for his national team, is the highest scorer for his club. All by 32. That's success and fulfilling potential in my books.
Speak for yourself. I am hoping it happens within the next 15 years, considering that we have 2 very special young players in our ranks. It will be very difficult, but both Martial and Rashford have the talent to break that record. Or so I hope.
I'll say no because he could and probably should be playing at a higher level now and for the past few seasons, he has declined faster than he should have had he looked after himself better. He was also left in the dust behind Ronaldo when for a time they were on a similar level. After his debut match I think people had expectations he would have a career like Messi but it didn't pan out that way for one reason or another but that being said he has had a better career than all but a small number of professional footballers and will go down as a legend for club and country. Not hitting his full potential doesn't mean he hasn't done incredibly well.
I agree. I completely understand why many people feel Rooney could have accomplished even more, but that shouldn't result in understating his actual accomplishments. Most professional footballers could only dream of having a career like Rooney has had.
So do I. But that goal scoring record is no joke, and something only a true elite player could ever even think of achieving.
It says a lot about Wayne Rooney's career that I think that Martial could potentially be a future BPITW, yet I don't think he would come near to breaking our record even if he stayed with us his whole career.
Martial is a special player by the way and so exciting to watch. He's top drawer.
Thank you for all your great moments.
I wish you were the egoistic little bastard till the end of your career. You mellowed down, the anger was gone and you learned how to talk to the media like a proper pen pusher. No?
Whatever. You scored goals, you lifted the trophies up in the air, you gave us that fabulous air-strike against Manchester City, a debut teens around the world are dreaming of...
You are a legend.
Goals like this, will always make me wonder why did you have to mellow, get fat and unselfish.
I wish you were the egoistic little bastard till the end of your career. You mellowed down, the anger was gone and you learned how to talk to the media like a proper pen pusher. No?
Whatever. You scored goals, you lifted the trophies up in the air, you gave us that fabulous air-strike against Manchester City, a debut teens around the world are dreaming of...
You are a legend.
Goals like this, will always make me wonder why did you have to mellow, get fat and unselfish.
Why? He would need to score just 23 goals per season (in average) for the next 10 years. The players who belong in BPITW category do it quite easily.
The problems about Martial are can he really become a future BPITW and will he stay here for the entire career.
Not in my opinion, he could've beat the record 3 years ago if he really played to his potential. Some key decisions in his career have ultimately limited this as well as certain lifestyle choices. I may get slated for this, but he has more natural ability than someone like Zlatan but due to the differences in mentality Zlatan will always be remembered as the better player.
I have no idea what your post is about.
What more do you want from him? To stay 20 years old forever? That's not possible. Every footballer changes throughout their career even the very bests to have played the game.
Rooney has been a better player, performance and influential wise for the last 25 years than any other player to play for our club. I would argue he was more influential than Cantana, Keane et al. I honestly would. If not as influential, just as influential whether fans like it or not.
Cantona led a team to trophys, Rooney was part of a team that was led to trophys.
This is your opinion. Don't present it as fact.
Rooney was a fantastic player at his best but probably didn't stay at his top level for as long a period as many would have liked/expected.
Definitely. Record goalscorer for club and country, won everything there is to win. People forget how good he was until a couple of years ago.
Do you understand just how hard that will be? To score 23 goals a season for 10 straight seasons?
As if that's a normal thing to do? Even for the best players ever that's unheard of. Maybe for Messi and Ronaldo that's about doable.
I'd love for Martial to do that. I hope he does. If he does then that's a monumental achievements and he deserves all the praise he gets.
But why are he taking about Martials future achievements that he might break our record one day, when Rooney just has today?
Wayne Rooney you are a Legend and I'm lucky to have seen you play every week.
No.
Sir Alex lead us to trophies not Cantona.
I would say yes and i'm sure he would say the same. He has won everything in the English game and has been one of the main contributors to that. Because he is very good in any position on the field, he hasn't played every game as an out and out striker through no fault of his own. If by not winning the Ballon d'or you think his potential was never fulfilled then I think that view would be naive. Unfortunately for him Ronaldo and Messi have dominated that bracket for the last 8+ years.
No.
Wayne Rooney is a con artist who only managed to score 249 goals because of the longevity of his time here at Manchester United. Ronaldo would have broken the record in 4 or 5 years.
Wayne Rooney is a con artist who only managed to score 249 goals because of the longevity of his time here at Manchester United. Ronaldo would have broken the record in 4 or 5 years.
I love the guy. I 'm a little bit of a perfectionist, so things that don't go perfect from start to end, tend to get my attention. Rooney is not perfect.
Rooney was literally used by SAF. Every fecking position that needed someone special, whether it was only for one game or for the whole season, was covered by Wayne Rooney. Left winger, number ten, right winger and even number 9. When he was played as a lone striker, he had a great season (in terms of goal scoring) but he gained more fat and muscles - and this is what I think destroyed him. Changing roles is not bad. Changing roles in such a hurry is dangerous. His body couldn't handle the change of kgs (lbs).
I'm sorry for him. He could have been even greater. When both of them, Ronaldo and Rooney, were young, Rooney was definitely the better player. Imagine if he had the big ego Ronaldo has got.
I don't mean to present it as a fact, being influential in football and the dressing room is not an exact science, and certainly something me and you can tangiably measure.
What I'd argue is that Rooney has been a hugely positive factor in our history. And also someone who I couldnt expect more from career wise. He's given his all, and also achieved all there is to achieve - what else does anyone want from him?
I don't know why people feel the need to equate saying he did not completely fulfill his potential with, understating his achievements.
The problem for Rooney is, Messi and Ronaldo. At one point Rooney was held above both. He gets a similar wage and is recognisable as both, but the fact is they are light years away from him now. Either would have got the record in half the time
Depends on how good you think he could have been. I guess you could maybe say that yes he could have been even better but I don't think he ever really had the talent of a Ronaldo or Messi. He's been playing top level football since 17 and his decline was pretty expected I think. Maybe he could have been even better but I have no disappointments over his career at United. He's done everything you could have ever hoped for and he's an all time great.
He's just this day became our highest goal scorer. And threads like this are created to debate how good he has been for our club.
Attitude towards him are baffling. It honestly stifles me.
They'd get goals faster than any footballer ever really so it's not a slight on Rooney.
Nobody is debating that. That's not what this thread is about. It's a simple question and a matter of opinion. "Do you think Rooney has fulfilled his potential?" Your answer depends on how highly you regarded him as a talent when he was young.
Personally, I thought he was nailed on to be one of the greatest players of his generation, a player that would regularly compete for the title of BITW. He has quite clearly fallen short of that. That is why my answer to the OP is NO.
It doesn't mean, I don't hold his achievements in high regard.
If my viewpoint has a problem, you can argue that, my expectations were to great. And even that, I can't agree. Apart from Messi, I cannot remember seeing a mare accomplished teenage footballer than Wayne Rooney.
Good article with a lot of statistics.
http://www.bbc.com/sport/football/38097719
http://www.bbc.com/sport/football/38097719
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Yes, but playing at the same time as them when at one time he was regarded as and tipped to have a better career will be held as a slight against him