Do we extend Ole's contract?

[Amir]

We would still be winning the league every year if we hadn't dropped off massively.

Forest would still be winning trophies in Europe if they hadn't dropped off massively.

Sheffield United would still be a Prem team if they hadn't dropped off massively.

Where does it stop!

And using your own words....

My point is that we surely aspire to improve to the level of the title-winning sides we've seen in previous seasons. Some would say that going to 3rd to 2nd is an indication that we're on that way. My claim is that we are not in terms of our football and that the reason we've risen to 2nd is simply that the standard for 2nd place was lower last season compared with previous seasons. We're still nowhere near the standard that has been required in recent seasons to win the league.

Now, of course we can win the league even if we don't improve to that level, if Liverpool get stuck behind and City have a bad season, but we should be basing our title hopes on us becoming brilliant rather than the brilliant becoming worse.

 

[Widow]

the reason we've risen to 2nd is simply that the standard for 2nd place was lower last season compared with previous seasons.

This still is applicable to every situation, ever!

If Liverpool wins the league next year is it just because City would have 'dropped off massiverly'? Or maybe, Liverpool improved or how about a bit of both!

I fully understand your point but I think it's very simplistic and honestly, very narrow-minded to suggested the only reason we finished second was due to other teams not performing to type and that is has nothing to do with us improving at all.

 

[AjaxCunian]

This still is applicable to every situation, ever!

If Liverpool wins the league next year is it just because City would have 'dropped off massiverly'? Or maybe, Liverpool improved or how about a bit of both!

I fully understand your point but I think it's very simplistic and honestly, very narrow-minded to suggested the only reason we finished second was due to other teams not performing to type and that is has nothing to do with us improving at all.

Did we improve actually over the period since Bruno's arrival in 19/20? So Feb 2020 - end 19/20 vs 20/21. I wonder.

 

[He'sRaldo]

This shouldn't be a question after that EL final showing, at most other clubs our size he would be gone immediately after that.

In fact him getting one more year should already be viewed as an extension of his stay here, and based on how he performs we can make a further decision. Of course it helps that he's not super in demand so there's no need to make an immediate decision. The two most recent contracts we've given to managers could both be seen as premature moves that backfired, so it would make the most sense to learn from our mistakes and not rush the decision.

I do think that Ole would thrive under such conditions though, the team seems to perform for him when under pressure so it could be an extra motivating factor.

 

[Widow]

Did we improve actually over the period since Bruno's arrival in 19/20? So Feb 2020 - end 19/20 vs 20/21. I wonder.

I would hope so or what's the point in signing new/better players?

 

[Amir]

This still is applicable to every situation, ever!

If Liverpool wins the league next year is it just because City would have 'dropped off massiverly'? Or maybe, Liverpool improved or how about a bit of both!

I fully understand your point but I think it's very simplistic and honestly, very narrow-minded to suggested the only reason we finished second was due to other teams not performing to type and that is has nothing to do with us improving at all.

I think we were clearly better overall in 2020/21 than we were in 2019/20. I also think that we weren't better in 2020/21 than we were in the second half of 2019/20. So basically, our improvement is still about the Bruno effect - only this time we had him for a full season rather than part of it.

If Liverpool win the league next season it could be because they improved a lot or because City dropped off massively... We'll have to wait and see. Particularly in 2020/21, I don't see how anyone can argue that it happened to Liverpool. Just like in 2019/20 City's form dropped which helped Liverpool, even though they would have probably won the league anyone just because they were so good and consistent.

 

[Jibbs]

Ask England fans who do not support United, would they take Ole over Southgate as England manager?
The supporters of Ole probably have just accepted mediocrity.

 

[Jibbs]

I personally think Ole has made immense progress along with this United squad judging by what had happened before his arrival. Ole hasn't had a smooth ride since winning on the trot when he initially got here. I agree, the football hasn't been great all the time but I think it will improve as he gets the right play in the right positions. I think the previous managers all had to make do with out squad because none of our players are actually played in their strong positions on the pitch. Let's take the current squad into consideration, Rashford- I know he's been great since his introduction as a striker but he was supposed to be played as a number 10 but he's turned into an inside-left forward now. Still not a proper winger in my opinion. Greenwood is not a right sided play but he has to be played there because we have no specialist on the right. Mata is a number 10 too but was played on the right. Martial is a striker but was often played on the left and now he's just lost his trait. He's not a striker in my opinion and that's evident. Much like Jesus for City. Fred and Mctominay as not defensive midfielder but have played there more often than not. Our midfield has been the weakest area since SAF left because every time we counter, the ball moves quickly to the forwards and they find a way to manipulate defenses but when the game is slowed down and we need to find a way to go forward, the vulnerability in our midfield kicks in.

Ole has finally identified that we need a CDM but I still don't think he understands the importance of one. Bringing in players like Sancho, Kane or Haaland is definitely not the solution to our problems. We need a defensive midfielder like Rice, Camavinga or such to really tighten up the defense and connect the defense with the forwards. We need a player through whom every attack of ours should build and he must become the pivotal point for the change in direction. I hope we at least find a way to sign a player like Neves, who will still help in transition. If Ole or the board fail to sign a CDM and instead buy players like Sancho, Varane, Trippier and think this is a successful window, that would be a mistake and they will learn that very soon when the new season commences. I'd wait until the window shuts to make this decision but I think Ole will do well considering what he has had in the past in terms of quality of the squad.

Ole has done zero progress. Mourinho took us to 2nd and won us the Europa Cup and might have actually won us the league if he was properly backed. None of the players he was unhappy with or wanted to sell, has proven him wrong.

Rashford is not a striker, he does not have the balance to be a striker and has one dimensional play. Martial is not a striker. One of them needs to be sold, probably Martial, that's what Mourinho wanted at that time.
Ole if sacked next year would leave us in equal mess as Mourinho, who was actually not backed. He wanted Maguire and Perisic, Woodward refused to get him both.
Now even if Ole gets Sancho, a defender and a DM this year and he gets sacked during the season, we would still need a striker and a replacement for Pogba and probably a new Goalkeeper. This is 200 million expense right there.

 

[McTerminator]

Yeah, but that's not the argument... The claim is that part of the reason for the gap between us and City at the end of the season is the six points we dropped in the first three games. But if the summer had been normal - for everyone - that gap would have probably increased rather than decreased.

I don't remember how City faired in those early games, but as a result of the late start, didn't United's fixture list (and City's) become more congested than any other team?

If so squad depth would have played a major part for the entirety of the season due to the scuffed start.

 

[McTerminator]

Considering the season ahead is easily the most important one so far of his tenure , it will be his 3rd full season, he's had time to implement his ideas and will hopefully get the players he needs this summer, at least Sancho and a new CB ,

If we renew his contract now and we do not win any trophies this season and finish outside top 4 would there be a valid reason to keep him on ? Let him have 1 more season here to see what he does, if he wins a trophy and takes us on a good run in cup competitions then great he will be rewarded with a new contract in the end ,just like Tuchel, if not, we need a new manager.

There is no more room for complacency, if Ole flops this season and cannot win a trophy he needs the boot asap.

I support Ole, but I agree with this post.

It is crunch time.

Of course the discussion that will need to be had, if Ole fails this season and gets the boot, is "can any manager truly succeed here under the Glazers". Excluding SAF, they have now had four full time managers, two of which were very high profile and high quality. They all failed, ultimately.

 

[Mainoldo]

I feel they would announce it already if they did give him a contact. Rightfully so they will give it until mid season to decide. Ole’s not going to pull a Jose and say he’s Son loves watching PSG.

 

[Amir]

I don't remember how City faired in those early games, but as a result of the late start, didn't United's fixture list (and City's) become more congested than any other team?

If so squad depth would have played a major part for the entirety of the season due to the scuffed start.

City dropped 12 points in their first 8 game, and only won 5 of the first 13.

As for the fixtures congestion, both us and City started the season a week late so we both had one game to complete at a later date. It wasn't that bad compared with the others.

 

[Amir]

I feel they would announce it already if they did give him a contact. Rightfully so they will give it until mid season to decide. Ole’s not going to pull a Jose and say he’s Son loves watching PSG.

If he says he's Harry Winks he just might pull it off, but I think Son's a little too much.

 

[Tom Cato]

Ask England fans who do not support United, would they take Ole over Southgate as England manager?
The supporters of Ole probably have just accepted mediocrity.

Only snobby Manchester United fans will shit upwind while the trajectory is still pointing upwards.

 

[FreakyJim]

I support Ole, but I agree with this post.

It is crunch time.

Of course the discussion that will need to be had, if Ole fails this season and gets the boot, is "can any manager truly succeed here under the Glazers". Excluding SAF, they have now had four full time managers, two of which were very high profile and high quality. They all failed, ultimately.

high reputation but on a massive decline

LVG was a dinosaur, so was/is Mourinho.Less said about Moyes the better. These were wrong appointments by people that don't have any idea what they want this football club to look like in terms of actual football on the pitch.

 

[OleTheGreat]

Ole has done zero progress. Mourinho took us to 2nd and won us the Europa Cup and might have actually won us the league if he was properly backed. None of the players he was unhappy with or wanted to sell, has proven him wrong.

Rashford is not a striker, he does not have the balance to be a striker and has one dimensional play. Martial is not a striker. One of them needs to be sold, probably Martial, that's what Mourinho wanted at that time.
Ole if sacked next year would leave us in equal mess as Mourinho, who was actually not backed. He wanted Maguire and Perisic, Woodward refused to get him both.
Now even if Ole gets Sancho, a defender and a DM this year and he gets sacked during the season, we would still need a striker and a replacement for Pogba and probably a new Goalkeeper. This is 200 million expense right there.

I have to agree with you on those points. Jose knows what he wants but his style of play is the lamest in the world. He can win you loads and loads of trophies but his tactics will always be dirty. His relationship with the camp always breaks down after a couple of years because he hardly smiles. That is one thing I like about Ole, he smiles a lot and presents himself really well in the interviews. Secondly, coming back to the football side of things; you are right again. Of course Sancho isn't enough and I think I made that pretty evident in my post. A lot has to still change in the way we play and express ourselves out there. I still think this team is very very rigid in the way they play. It's so hard to watch because I watch so many teams below us go out on the field and play such great attacking football, even those with bad defensive records. I think if we manage to get Varane or Torres, a decent CDM. Ole will give Pogba the freedom to move further up and express himself which will ultimately connect Bruno, Sancho, Rashford and Cavani/Greenwood and I think we are in for a world of fun.

 

[McTerminator]

high reputation but on a massive decline

LVG was a dinosaur, so was/is Mourinho.Less said about Moyes the better. These were wrong appointments by people that don't have any idea what they want this football club to look like in terms of actual football on the pitch.

Surely that’s exactly my point though.

even if, by some miracle, the leaches made the correct appointment at the right time theyprobably wouldn’t back him. The problem still always rests primarily with the Glazers.

 

[Eyepopper]

You extend his contract right now to show the club is behind him, there has been progress, but you extend it by 1-2 years.

At the very least you don't want to spend £80m on a 21 year old player when there's any questions over whether the manager has the support of the club.

 

[hobbers]

I feel they would announce it already if they did give him a contact. Rightfully so they will give it until mid season to decide. Ole’s not going to pull a Jose and say he’s Son loves watching PSG.

I think they're probably just waiting to drop it in either with some exciting transfer news, or at the start of next season if there's a couple of good results.

They know it isn't something any fan is particularly clamouring for which says enough in itself.

 

[devilish]

I'd say that a 1 + 1 would do.

 

[Mainoldo]

I think they're probably just waiting to drop it in either with some exciting transfer news, or at the start of next season if there's a couple of good results.

They know it isn't something any fan is particularly clamouring for which says enough in itself.

Yeah but I just don’t get it. It’s similar to the Jesse Lingard contract extension a few years back which was done But he wasn’t playing well at the time so they delayed the announcement to drop in with some good news’s like a new signing.

If we don’t want the news then clearly it’s just a bad idea all together. So all this it’s signed stuff I’m never too sure about with this club. If it’s signed they would just announce it. I mean Lingard still hasn’t signed his already privately known contract extension.

 

[golden_blunder]

Ole has done zero progress. Mourinho took us to 2nd and won us the Europa Cup and might have actually won us the league if he was properly backed. None of the players he was unhappy with or wanted to sell, has proven him wrong.

Rashford is not a striker, he does not have the balance to be a striker and has one dimensional play. Martial is not a striker. One of them needs to be sold, probably Martial, that's what Mourinho wanted at that time.
Ole if sacked next year would leave us in equal mess as Mourinho, who was actually not backed. He wanted Maguire and Perisic, Woodward refused to get him both.
Now even if Ole gets Sancho, a defender and a DM this year and he gets sacked during the season, we would still need a striker and a replacement for Pogba and probably a new Goalkeeper. This is 200 million expense right there.

Do you not think the squad is better now that what it was 3-4 years ago?

 

[AshRK]

I would wait rather than doing anything stupid right now. Let us see where we are come December- January and then we can make a decision.

 

[Eriku]

Do you not think the squad is better now that what it was 3-4 years ago?

Not just that, Jose’s EL trophy came with the decision to completely abandon any real attempt at getting into top four. Ole at least tries to win what he can. Maybe a bit much at times, but Fergie was the same.

Not to mention Jose had De Gea in absolute God mode.

 

[Jibbs]

Do you not think the squad is better now that what it was 3-4 years ago?

Squad was good under mourinho too.... it just needed couple of signings at the start of 2018 to compete for the title. Had Ed bought him Maguire and Perisic we might actually had won the title.
We would need a striker and a midfielder at the end of Ole's contract too.

 

[Stacks]

You extend his contract right now to show the club is behind him, there has been progress, but you extend it by 1-2 years.

At the very least you don't want to spend £80m on a 21 year old player when there's any questions over whether the manager has the support of the club.

every top club sign players and they are aware the manager may not be there if he doesn't perform. All top clubs change manager frequently. Lamaprd was sacked and the new signings didn't kick up a fuss. They can wait and see if he delivers silverware as he has failed good opportunities so far so there is no rush

 

[MadMike]

every top club sign players and they are aware the manager may not be there if he doesn't perform. All top clubs change manager frequently. Lamaprd was sacked and the new signings didn't kick up a fuss. They can wait and see if he delivers silverware as he has failed good opportunities so far so there is no rush

Real, Barca, Chelsea, PSG, Juve, Bayern... they hire and fire managers all the time. Seemingly no problem for the clubs, their players and their new signings.

But United have to extend the manager's contract (a manager that most of these clubs would have sacked for underperformance by now) or the players won't like it.

Caf logic

 

[Jibbs]

Real, Barca, Chelsea, PSG, Juve, Bayern... they hire and fire managers all the time. Seemingly no problem for the clubs, their players and their new signings.

But United have to extend the manager's contract (a manager that most of these clubs would have sacked for underperformance by now) or the players won't like it.

Caf logic

CAF has accepted the mediocrity. 90% here wouldn't mind a top 4 finish with no trophy next year . When the club should be challenging for the title.

 

[Sandikan]

Ole has done zero progress. Mourinho took us to 2nd and won us the Europa Cup and might have actually won us the league if he was properly backed. None of the players he was unhappy with or wanted to sell, has proven him wrong.

Rashford is not a striker, he does not have the balance to be a striker and has one dimensional play. Martial is not a striker. One of them needs to be sold, probably Martial, that's what Mourinho wanted at that time.
Ole if sacked next year would leave us in equal mess as Mourinho, who was actually not backed. He wanted Maguire and Perisic, Woodward refused to get him both.
Now even if Ole gets Sancho, a defender and a DM this year and he gets sacked during the season, we would still need a striker and a replacement for Pogba and probably a new Goalkeeper. This is 200 million expense right there.

Ole didn't pick up from Mourinho coming 2nd though.
Liverpool hadn't emerged as this massive force when Mourinho came 2nd.
Chelsea hadn't booted 200m the season before Mourinho came 2nd.

When he picked up from Mourinho, he found us well off the pace, with crippled morale, due to the classic Jose 3rd season meltdown nonsense.

He picked up a squad with a winger as right back, no right winger, and Bailly/Jones and Lindelof as centre backs.

Against that backdrop, Ole has done a very steady improvement job.

Obviously the big difficulty is maintaining that now there's less scope above to improve.
In fact, seeing off Liverpool and Chelsea might be the major victory this season.

 

[Sandikan]

Real, Barca, Chelsea, PSG, Juve, Bayern... they hire and fire managers all the time. Seemingly no problem for the clubs, their players and their new signings.

But United have to extend the manager's contract (a manager that most of these clubs would have sacked for underperformance by now) or the players won't like it.

Caf logic

We've just had a little run of sh!ts and giggles changing managers to absolutely wildly different approaches, and we've seen it's caused massive problems with ending up with loads of player turnover.

Ole just got us to 2nd, he as a minimum deserves to be backed to see if he can bridge the gap.
Sancho is a big signing if it happens, but there needs to be another smart transfer or 2 on top.

 

[Skills]

We've just had a little run of sh!ts and giggles changing managers to absolutely wildly different approaches, and we've seen it's caused massive problems with ending up with loads of player turnover.

Ole just got us to 2nd, he as a minimum deserves to be backed to see if he can bridge the gap.
Sancho is a big signing if it happens, but there needs to be another smart transfer or 2 on top.

No we haven't. Every single manager we've had has overstayed their welcome by 6 months to a year, and that's what has cost us each time.

 

[MadMike]

Ole didn't pick up from Mourinho coming 2nd though.
Liverpool hadn't emerged as this massive force when Mourinho came 2nd.
Chelsea hadn't booted 200m the season before Mourinho came 2nd.

When he picked up from Mourinho, he found us well off the pace, with crippled morale, due to the classic Jose 3rd season meltdown nonsense.

He picked up a squad with a winger as right back, no right winger, and Bailly/Jones and Lindelof as centre backs.

Against that backdrop, Ole has done a very steady improvement job.

Obviously the big difficulty is maintaining that now there's less scope above to improve.
In fact, seeing off Liverpool and Chelsea might be the major victory this season.

Largely agreed, but as you point out in the bolded the meltdown was due to Jose's toxicity finally taking its toll on the players. Not because the team was rubbish. He still essentially had a team capable of ~80 points with the right management.

Ole has improved the squad and I love the recruitment strategy during his tenure (mostly going for young talent). He also seems to have united the dressing room. I will gladly give him all the credit for that.

But the team still has no defined style of play, no plan for the low block, no plan B, we've massively regressed in our ability to attack/defend set pieces, we make less use of squad depth or the bench (a big advantage of being a rich club) and we seem mentally weak in the cup ties when it matters.

It's difficult to say if Ole has reached his ceiling; maybe he has, maybe not. But we shouldn't be offering a contract extension while we still have to find that out.

 

[MadMike]

No we haven't. Every single manager we've had has overstayed their welcome by 6 months to a year, and that's what has cost us each time.

Precisely. We even extended Mourinho after 2 years (when it was obvious his managerial style was starting to cause serious problems) to then not back him in the transfer market and basically waste the 2018/19 season on top of having to pay him off. Just madness...

 

[28gunsalute]

Let OGS see out hi contract with a proviso that if he wins the title he will be rewarded with a new deal and money to spend.
Pay for results not promises.
If he can't win us a trophy next season then he has to go.

 

[Flytan]

I just don't think he's good. He's perfectly.mediocre and the only reason he's not worse is because he knows the club. If he hadn't played here, he would never have lasted this long. I mean just look at how everyone talks about him and how he's "done just enough". That's not how a manager should be. He should be able to get more than the sum of our parts and with how poorly Bruno has played recently after carrying our asses for most of the season, if we start slow he will be fired mid-season, months after we could have replaced him with someone better.

 

[FootyGirl88]

Squad was good under mourinho too.... it just needed couple of signings at the start of 2018 to compete for the title. Had Ed bought him Maguire and Perisic we might actually had won the title.
We would need a striker and a midfielder at the end of Ole's contract too.

It’s very strange because we have a better squad now, but we’re not winning trophies and we’re not challenging for titles something isn’t adding up..

 

[kouroux]

The Mourinho praise makes me question if some of our members don't suffer from amnesia and I say this as someone who's never rated Ole that highly and who doesn't wanna see him extend his contract

 

[Idxomer]

Squad was good under mourinho too.... it just needed couple of signings at the start of 2018 to compete for the title. Had Ed bought him Maguire and Perisic we might actually had won the title.
We would need a striker and a midfielder at the end of Ole's contract too.

Maybe you don't remember but Mourinho didn't have it in him to get anywhere near 98 points, not with the kind of football he was playing.

Maguire and Perisic would've barely made a difference.

 

[Eyepopper]

every top club sign players and they are aware the manager may not be there if he doesn't perform. All top clubs change manager frequently. Lamaprd was sacked and the new signings didn't kick up a fuss. They can wait and see if he delivers silverware as he has failed good opportunities so far so there is no rush

You extend his contract to show he has the backing of the club, and to remove any noise around that question, particularly with such a young squad.

Managers are fired on the basis of results, not on how long they have remaining on their contract.

What exactly is the downside of extending his contract by 12-24 months this season

 

[Jibbs]

It’s very strange because we have a better squad now, but we’re not winning trophies and we’re not challenging for titles something isn’t adding up..

Because we have a mediocre manager.