That is a half truth. He had an offer from the owners that he didn't sign. One of the first things the new Sporting Director did was pull that offer and they did not offer a new contract proposal before or during the window.
Donkai Havertz | Arsenal Watch
- Thread starter Samid
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Weaponising Sir Bobby’s passing (may he rest in peace) is even poorer form - especially considering I wasn’t even aware that was the cause. I’ll edit the post as it was a flippant remark (referencing memes), as you quoting me made no sense.
Please be mindful of what you’re including/quoting in them posts, thank you.
I wasn’t weaponising it. Just pulling you up on using such a crass insult.
Please be mindful in the future. Thanks.
Already done it in this thread before, i said whatever position you play him doesn't matter he plays the same way in every postion. 6 months later i think i have been right.I think it matters and I like discussions about tactical stuff. If you don't, it's fine, nobody's forcing you to partake
Yeah but you completely ignore that he played completely differently. In fact, he was on the ball twice as much for us as he was for Arsenal so far where he at times has less passes than the goalie despite playing in similar systems.
And by the way, I'm not looking for excuses for him, in fact I think he had it difficult at Chelsea but at Arsenal, everything should fit so he has to deliver.
Terrible. Could've scored 5 yesterday.
I see a pattern in him and Felix, who were lauded as the most talented players of their generation and possible ballon d'or winners: people still have high expectations for them to step up and bring all types of excuses: the managers, the position, the chaos on their clubs, etc, etc.
Ballon D'Or type of players will step up no matter what happens in the pitch: their teams are playing sh*t? No problem, he will do a good use of his tactical, technical and game vision skills to help the team solves. Even if their teams don't win, they will still be a nightmare for their opponents.
Unfortunatelly we are confirming that this fella and Felix are just in fact very competent players who are good enough to be part of a top division squad, and there's nothing wrong with it. The talent you need just to have a steady career at top divison clubs as a footballer is already extremely demanding, bare in mind to be a ballon d'or.
Ballon D'Or type of players will step up no matter what happens in the pitch: their teams are playing sh*t? No problem, he will do a good use of his tactical, technical and game vision skills to help the team solves. Even if their teams don't win, they will still be a nightmare for their opponents.
Unfortunatelly we are confirming that this fella and Felix are just in fact very competent players who are good enough to be part of a top division squad, and there's nothing wrong with it. The talent you need just to have a steady career at top divison clubs as a footballer is already extremely demanding, bare in mind to be a ballon d'or.
Wirtz is the generational wonderkid from Bayer Leverkusen. Not this donkey
I think Havertz is one of a number of current players that suffers from teams playing 4-3-3.
In a 4-3-3 formation there's no obvious position for players like Havertz, João Félix, Mount, and Coutinho. They'd all be good number ten's but teams don't really play that way anymore.
They are not fast enough to play out wide, not clinical enough to play as a false nine, not good enough defensively to play as a midfielder.
Havertz will be farmed out on loan to German club in the next two years.
In a 4-3-3 formation there's no obvious position for players like Havertz, João Félix, Mount, and Coutinho. They'd all be good number ten's but teams don't really play that way anymore.
They are not fast enough to play out wide, not clinical enough to play as a false nine, not good enough defensively to play as a midfielder.
Havertz will be farmed out on loan to German club in the next two years.
Just read he's apparently on 275k base salary..what the feck.
It's amazing. Play two good seasons in the Bundesliga and you're basically set for life.
And decide a CL final, let's not forget that. He scored some very important goals for Chelsea, that gives him obviously a lot of goodwill.
I'm an Arteta / Edu fanboy... and even I am perplexed by the financial outlay we sanctioned for Havertz.
You're being generous by pluralising - he scored one very important goal but was largely an anonymous, cowardly player throughout his tenure at Stamford Bridge. Chelsea fans couldn't believe their luck when Arsenal paid them so much money to take him off their hands.
Batshuayi scored an important goal that won them the PL in 2017, but having one iconic moment doesn't earn you goodwill indefinitely.
Pretty much, yeah.
Forever grateful for that UCL winner but was kind of glad to see him go. Prior to the summer window, given the wages he was on I didn't think we'd have much chance of selling him but then almost out of nowhere there was interest from Real Madrid and ultimately Arsenal swooped in with a huge bid that not only recouped most of the money we'd initially paid for him but also got his massive salary off the wage bill.
It's only been half a season and we've already seen Cole Palmer (11G+7A) almost match Havertz' best season with us (14G+6A) as far as goal contributions go and Palmer plays a very similar role for us than Havertz did where he keeps getting rotated between RW, 10 and false 9 roles. We've done some shitty transfers over the last few years but selling Havertz and replacing him with Palmer turned out quite fine based on what we've seen so far.
Been decent for us since the new year. Still not 65m good but ignoring the value aspect he is doing ok now I guess.
His off the ball movement and physicality gives us a different dimension.
His off the ball movement and physicality gives us a different dimension.
Yep. If he was £45m and that money didn’t help out Chelsea, I’d be happy with his signing.
This exactly is the issue, need to ignore prize and Chelsea factor. He does help the team and currently it's the best option we have for that midfield role. And in big games I would pick him over Jesus at CF currently. Neither can score but he atleast creates space for others and his physicality is a huge plus.
Gets away with being bang average when you win but as soon as you lose he will rightly get singled out for not being good enough.
He looks part of the team since the Dubai break. Much better at passing and controlling the game. His finishing is still bad but apart from that he has been perfect.He will be very useful in Europe, with ESR back we can rotate both of them.
Yes, 35-45 and I would have been ok with it. Not sure if that wage quoted in some questionable sources is correct but if it's true that is perhaps an even bigger problem. Couldn't we have gotten him for cheaper? It's hard to rationalize getting him while paying half the price for Odegaard. I know football doesn't work that way but this seems off. He didn't exactly set his mark at Chelsea to say the least. We ended up paying virtually the same fee.
Anyway, he had a solid game again today. Hope he keeps improving, but when the team is off form, he is not the one that will get us back on track.
You win and lose as a team. Havertz is an expensive transfer but he is doing alright lately.
He has been very good lately and was involved in all our goals today. And scored a nice one himself. The interchange between him and Trossard, both dropping into midfield then moving up has given us a new dynamic. And his physicality has been valuable when defending and attacking during set pieces too. His off the ball movement is also good, really pulling defenders to him and giving other players space. It has taken some time but I think he's really settled in the team now. Arteta looks to have figured out how to get the best ouf of him and use his versatility. Hope he only improves.
And in a team they are individuals who are not good enough and need to be upgraded.
Think what you can say about him is that he can be a functioning cog in an effective machine.
Cant ever see him being a ‘difference maker’, a player that settles games when games are tight on a consistent basis, or helps drag team mates up a level.
Think this is where the debates about the cost on terms of fee and reported wages will always come into play.
I must've missed this. Is he good in the air now? Whenever I've watched him, I get the impression that for a tall bloke he wins very few aeriel duels.
The Premier League stats site has him in the top 4 of serial duels won this season (for attackers).
He seems like he's very good at aerial duels in midfield. Kind of like our more skilled Fellaini.
But I wouldn't call him an aerial threat on set pieces yet. He may have one headed goal. I'm not sure. But he definitely doesn't attack set pieces like Gabriel or even Jesus.
Think you've nailed it. That's probably why I don't perceive him as being good in the air as I rarely see him attack headers in the opposition's box.
He was kinda a good threat from set pieces or just crosses into the box for us, so the potential is there. I think at the moment his aerial threat for Arsenal is limited to balls lumped forward, he’s been pretty good at winning his duels and holding the ball up.
I honestly hardly notice him during games. You usually get a heavy dose of Saka, Odegaard, Martinelli, Rice etc and then there’s Havertz who plays the whole 90 mins but you don’t realise he’s even playing.
This is true, which is why he splits opinions so much. He's not a flashy player and he has that languid manner about him. I even think he might be better off the ball than on it, which doesn't help him get noticed. But this is exactly why Arteta wanted him and was willing to pay the huge fee. His off the ball movement and workrate is very good, and his versatility (being able to interchange between false 9 and midfield) has been a big reason we've scored 21 goals in our last 5 games, and only conceded 2. He drags defenders out of position with his movement - look at the Liverpool game where he got Konate sent off. In the last few games, Odegaard has taken a deeper role too, which gives him more time and space to progress the ball and pick his passes. This means that Havertz slots into Odegaard's position, though him and Trossard seem to interchange with this, confusing the defence even more.
I'm not sure what the stats are like, but if you watch how we defend and attack set pieces, Havertz is clearly a key player in how we set up. His usefulness when defending is obvious, but when we attack, it's his movement that stands out to me. He is a handful in the box. IMO Havertz is why Arteta has now decided to have Rice on set pieces and corners - he makes up for the physicality that we lose with Rice on delivery duty.
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He was genuinely an excellent near post defender on set pieces for us. Chelsea have missed someone of that ilk badly this year.
Fair enough. As I said, it must've been the lack of attacking headers that made me think he was poor in the air overall.
When he was still at Leverkusen he was quite decent attacking crosses in the box - but definitely hasn't improved and probably has regressed during his time in England.
This could be me reading into it too much - but I distinctly recall him getting absolutely clattered a couple of times post-COVID restart in Germany on high crosses and he always looked more hesitant after signing for us. He certainly hasn't stood out physically in England the way it looked like he might when he was scoring for fun aged 19 & 20.
Can he be our donkey?
He gets so much criticism, yet he's scored one more goal than Rashford who barely seems to get any criticism in the media
I'm not sure this is even close to true. Rashford is constantly criticized recently. Media and random socials.
Don't think we have room for any more
Arsenals Firminho and he is never injured.
Goal and assist. He’s not perfect but he’s having a decent patch of form and looks more confident and comfortable than he did at Chelsea