Emma Watson on Feminism

rcoobc

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I am reaching out to you because I need your help. We want to end gender inequality—and to do that we need everyone to be involved.

This is the first campaign of its kind at the UN: we want to try and galvanize as many men and boys as possible to be advocates for gender equality. And we don’t just want to talk about it, but make sure it is tangible.

I was appointed six months ago and the more I have spoken about feminism the more I have realized that fighting for women’s rights has too often become synonymous with man-hating. If there is one thing I know for certain, it is that this has to stop.

For the record, feminism by definition is: “The belief that men and women should have equal rights and opportunities. It is the theory of the political, economic and social equality of the sexes.”

I started questioning gender-based assumptions when at eight I was confused at being called “bossy,” because I wanted to direct the plays we would put on for our parents—but the boys were not.

When at 14 I started being sexualized by certain elements of the press.

When at 15 my girlfriends started dropping out of their sports teams because they didn’t want to appear “muscly.”

When at 18 my male friends were unable to express their feelings.

I decided I was a feminist and this seemed uncomplicated to me. But my recent research has shown me that feminism has become an unpopular word.

Apparently I am among the ranks of women whose expressions are seen as too strong, too aggressive, isolating, anti-men and, unattractive.

Why is the word such an uncomfortable one?

I am from Britain and think it is right that as a woman I am paid the same as my male counterparts. I think it is right that I should be able to make decisions about my own body. I think it is right that women be involved on my behalf in the policies and decision-making of my country. I think it is right that socially I am afforded the same respect as men. But sadly I can say that there is no one country in the world where all women can expect to receive these rights.

No country in the world can yet say they have achieved gender equality.

These rights I consider to be human rights but I am one of the lucky ones. My life is a sheer privilege because my parents didn’t love me less because I was born a daughter. My school did not limit me because I was a girl. My mentors didn’t assume I would go less far because I might give birth to a child one day. These influencers were the gender equality ambassadors that made who I am today. They may not know it, but they are the inadvertent feminists who are. And we need more of those. And if you still hate the word—it is not the word that is important but the idea and the ambition behind it. Because not all women have been afforded the same rights that I have. In fact, statistically, very few have been.

In 1997, Hilary Clinton made a famous speech in Beijing about women’s rights. Sadly many of the things she wanted to change are still a reality today.

But what stood out for me the most was that only 30 per cent of her audience were male. How can we affect change in the world when only half of it is invited or feel welcome to participate in the conversation?

Men—I would like to take this opportunity to extend your formal invitation. Gender equality is your issue too.

Because to date, I’ve seen my father’s role as a parent being valued less by society despite my needing his presence as a child as much as my mother’s.

I’ve seen young men suffering from mental illness unable to ask for help for fear it would make them look less “macho”—in fact in the UK suicide is the biggest killer of men between 20-49; eclipsing road accidents, cancer and coronary heart disease. I’ve seen men made fragile and insecure by a distorted sense of what constitutes male success. Men don’t have the benefits of equality either.

We don’t often talk about men being imprisoned by gender stereotypes but I can see that that they are and that when they are free, things will change for women as a natural consequence.

If men don’t have to be aggressive in order to be accepted women won’t feel compelled to be submissive. If men don’t have to control, women won’t have to be controlled.

Both men and women should feel free to be sensitive. Both men and women should feel free to be strong… It is time that we all perceive gender on a spectrum not as two opposing sets of ideals.

If we stop defining each other by what we are not and start defining ourselves by what we are—we can all be freer and this is what HeForShe is about. It’s about freedom.

I want men to take up this mantle. So their daughters, sisters and mothers can be free from prejudice but also so that their sons have permission to be vulnerable and human too—reclaim those parts of themselves they abandoned and in doing so be a more true and complete version of themselves.

You might be thinking who is this Harry Potter girl? And what is she doing up on stage at the UN. It’s a good question and trust me I have been asking myself the same thing. I don’t know if I am qualified to be here. All I know is that I care about this problem. And I want to make it better.

And having seen what I’ve seen—and given the chance—I feel it is my duty to say something. English statesman Edmund Burke said: “All that is needed for the forces of evil to triumph is for enough good men and women to do nothing.”

In my nervousness for this speech and in my moments of doubt I’ve told myself firmly—if not me, who, if not now, when. If you have similar doubts when opportunities are presented to you I hope those words might be helpful.

Because the reality is that if we do nothing it will take 75 years, or for me to be nearly a hundred before women can expect to be paid the same as men for the same work. 15.5 million girls will be married in the next 16 years as children. And at current rates it won’t be until 2086 before all rural African girls will be able to receive a secondary education.

If you believe in equality, you might be one of those inadvertent feminists I spoke of earlier.

And for this I applaud you.

We are struggling for a uniting word but the good news is we have a uniting movement. It is called HeForShe. I am inviting you to step forward, to be seen to speak up, To be the he for she. And to ask yourself if not me, who, if not now when.

Thank you
Pretty darned good speech IMO

Link
 
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Pexbo

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From a male point of view, it's great to see equality addressed as just that: male and female = equal.

Feminism for the most part, in my opinion anyway, tends to come across as anti-men. Like they have to fight their corner so much that they get into a position of strength over men rather than an equal footing. This in turn makes the male argument a more defensive one and nobody get's anywhere as it turns into a point scoring male vs female argument.


One thing I've always wondered about is male chivalry, some feminists want equal footing but also to have men treat them with a greater respect because they are female while others get offended by the act.
 

Snowjoe

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From a male point of view, it's great to see equality addressed as just that: male and female = equal.

Feminism for the most part, in my opinion anyway, tends to come across as anti-men. Like they have to fight their corner so much that they get into a position of strength over men rather than an equal footing. This in turn makes the male argument a more defensive one and nobody get's anywhere as it turns into a point scoring male vs female argument.


One thing I've always wondered about is male chivalry, some feminists want equal footing but also to have men treat them with a greater respect because they are female while others get offended by the act.
What I see an awful lot, especially on Facebook posts is that all too often there are guys who genuinely don't understand why certain things are sexist or understand this Patriachy that feminists talk about, which leads them to disagree with feminists. However all too often the feminists will then go on to attack him when to start with he was perfectly open to actually having a discussion about it, now instead he feels under attack and is never going to open himself up to a different way of thinking. I understand the viewpoint of needing to fight but to make headway you need these people on your side, and you won't do that by attacking them.
 

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Great speech, but what happens next?
Nothing substantial probably.

One thing I've always wondered about is male chivalry, some feminists want equal footing but also to have men treat them with a greater respect because they are female while others get offended by the act.
The simple solution to this is to tell people not to be a dick and to simply treat everyone well. Although, there are a few things chivalrous things which, frankly, are just cringe worthy for me, notably going out of your way to do simple tasks like move her chair back or open a car door. Why don't you do her dishes? Pretty sure everyone on the planet would rather have their dishes done than have someone open a car door for them.
 

Mockney

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From a male point of view, it's great to see equality addressed as just that: male and female = equal.
Yeah, it's about time men got the props we deserve. We've been oppressed for too long.

"HeForShe". Although now you mention it, Hermione is pretty crap, too.
UNWomen is pretty shit too. It should be called SheMales
 
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sullydnl

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Far too many men instinctively think of feminism as a negative thing when in theory it should benefit men as well as women. As Watson's speech points out, gender discrimination works both ways.

As for the chivalry thing, I guess it's best to try and carry yourself in that way regardless how people react. if someone seriously gets offended by a guy showing them polite respect then they're the one with the problem, so why should you allow it to change your behavior?
 

rcoobc

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The word normally being talked about is Feminism which is why this is very confusing topic now,

And if you still hate the word—it is not the word that is important but the idea and the ambition behind it...

We are struggling for a uniting word but the good news is we have a uniting movement. It is called HeForShe.
 
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Silva

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Far too many men instinctively think of feminism as a negative thing when in theory it should benefit men as well as women. As Watson's speech points out, gender discrimination works both ways.

As for the chivalry thing, I guess it's best to try and carry yourself in that way regardless how people react. if someone seriously gets offended by a guy showing them polite respect then they're the one with the problem, so why should you allow it to change your behavior?
I'm sorry, but traditional chivalry is cringe worthy.

http://www.wikihow.com/Be-Chivalrous

Like, if someone actually did all the shit in that article it'd be like your mum trying to pull you.
 

Walrus

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From a male point of view, it's great to see equality addressed as just that: male and female = equal.

Feminism for the most part, in my opinion anyway, tends to come across as anti-men. Like they have to fight their corner so much that they get into a position of strength over men rather than an equal footing. This in turn makes the male argument a more defensive one and nobody get's anywhere as it turns into a point scoring male vs female argument.


One thing I've always wondered about is male chivalry, some feminists want equal footing but also to have men treat them with a greater respect because they are female while others get offended by the act.
I agree with that.

There are plenty of stereotypes that men are pressured into living up to - being the breadwinner, courting - "chasing" the woman, paying for dates, being physically and emotionally strong.

I had this discussion the other day with my girlfriend and the key point I ended up with is that feminists try to see men and woman as the same. This simply isn't true. Men and women are NOT the same. Now, that does not mean they should not both be of equal "value" (for want of a better word) or that one is superior to the other, it simply means that there are inherent differences between the genders which not caused by any chauvinistic notions, bigotry or outdated opinions, but rather are caused from millennia of evolution during which gender roles were defined in ancient society.

Let me state now that this isn't a "women are housewives due to evolution" post, it is simply that men and women are inherently different, it is in our DNA. Men are naturally evolved to be physically stronger, women have evolved to have high maternal instincts just like in every other species (this is not the only difference, but it is, I would say the most commonly cited one). Over time, as society changes, these traits may well equal out again due to evolution, but in modern day society rather than trying to force absolute equality on men and women, we should recognise the inherent differences in the genders and accept them for what they are. This does not mean that if a woman wants to work full time as a bodybuilder, while the husband stays at home, that it shouldn't be allowed - far from it, I applaud both of them for not allowing society to define their roles or capabilities, but to give another example - there is a reason women don't compete with men in most sports. If one believes that men and women are identical, surely all sports, athletics etc should be unisex? No, they shouldn't (not anytime soon at least).

Another popular debate on this is about the sexualising/objectifying of women. My old housemate was a girl and had a NSFW Instagram page where she still posts saucy/provocative images to say the least. When I discussed her interpretation of feminism etc with her in this context, she said that she actually felt empowered by knowing all these hundreds of men "wanted" her and that she was the one in control, rather than feeling objectified etc.
Its an interesting area because a lot of women can make a living essentially off their looks. Is this unfair or the women in question for being objectified, or is in unfair on men who realistically don't have these sorts of.. Career opportunities? (Yes male models obviously exist, but there is a far bigger industry for female modelling, not to mention the "showgirls" who present trophies/provide eye candy, even down to the pretty girls holding up the numbers between rounds in a boxing match).

I have tried to word this post delicately to avoid offence - but for the records I believe in gender equality, that women should have more or less the same opportunities in life as men, and certainly that neither gender is superior or inferior to the other. This does NOT mean however that men and women are identical.

I doubt I will say much more in this thread, as the last feminism thread I participated in got a little more heated than I would like, and earnt me this delightful tagline.
 

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Everyone knows men and women are not completely identical. Well for all intentions and purposes other than the few obvious ones they actually are.
 

rcoobc

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Everyone knows men and women are not completely identical. Well for all intentions and purposes other than the few obvious ones they actually are.
We share 99.9% of our DNA dont we? And can share 45/46 Chromosomes, which again, are mostly completely identical in any case.
 

Mockney

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At least we almost got to 10 posts before becoming needlessly defensive of an uncontroversial idea. Well done Caf.
 

sullydnl

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I'm sorry, but traditional chivalry is cringe worthy.

http://www.wikihow.com/Be-Chivalrous

Like, if someone actually did all the shit in that article it'd be like your mum trying to pull you.
Some of those ideas are ridiculous but some aren't.

I remember some random girl in college giving out to me for holding a door open for her, which is sort of stupid as I'd hold the door open for guys too, it's just good manners. If someone has a problem with that sort of basic politeness then it's less about feminism and more about them being idiots.
 

dumbo

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Emma for President.

Russel Brand for Emperor.

Bono for Chancellor of the Exchequer.

Do me a favour love.
 

rcoobc

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Some of those ideas are ridiculous but some aren't.

I remember some random girl in college giving out to me for holding a door open for her, which is sort of stupid as I'd hold the door open for guys too, it's just good manners. If someone has a problem with that sort of basic politeness then it's less about feminism and more about them being idiots.
Yup. Never understood this. Do men normally slam the door into other mens faces?

Having said that I do treat men and women differently. It's something like this:



I don't really think Women are better off from that though.
 

DOTA

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She looks like a kid who's won a competition to make a speech to congress.
 

Silva

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Some of those ideas are ridiculous but some aren't.

I remember some random girl in college giving out to me for holding a door open for her, which is sort of stupid as I'd hold the door open for guys too, it's just good manners. If someone has a problem with that sort of basic politeness then it's less about feminism and more about them being idiots.
I'm all for politeness, I hold the door for everyone too (assuming I'm in front of them, I've always found people who jump in front of women to open a door slightly weird). I just think chivalry for chivalry's sake is pointless. The pulling the chair really grinds my gears for example. Has anyone ever pulled a chair out for you? It's not helpful, it prolongs the sitting process, most of us have been practicing sitting since before we could stand up so I'm pretty sure we've mastered it. Yet, there's people who still insist on doing it. Basically, we should be nice to everyone and not treat them differently based on the genitals they have.
 

rcoobc

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You're going to have to explain that phone one.
:lol: Basically, I have to phone people 20-50 times a day.

If a woman picks up the phone, they say "hello this is blahblah speaking" in a nice sing songy voice, I usually do my own sing songy voice: "hello, this is robo here from blahblah" (singsongy voice)

But if a man picks up the phone I'm more like "Hullo, this is Robocop here from blahblah" (deeper voice).
 

2 man midfield

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Yup. Never understood this. Do men normally slam the door into other mens faces?

Having said that I do treat men and women differently. It's something like this:



I don't really think Women are better off from that though.
I actually answered yes to all of them, for both sexes. I don't think it's the feminist in me though, probably just the fact i'm a polite apathist.
 

Scrumpet

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:lol: Basically, I have to phone people 20-50 times a day.

If a woman picks up the phone, they say "hello this is blahblah speaking" in a nice sing songy voice, I usually do my own sing songy voice: "hello, this is robo here from blahblah" (singsongy voice)

But if a man picks up the phone I'm more like "Hullo, this is Robocop here from blahblah" (deeper voice).
Fascinating. What's your opening gambit if it's you who is answering the phone? A Hello that starts deep and ends high?
I actually answered yes to all of them, for both sexes. I don't think it's the feminist in me though, probably just the fact i'm a polite apathist.
You stand up when people enter the room?
 

DOTA

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:lol: Basically, I have to phone people 20-50 times a day.

If a woman picks up the phone, they say "hello this is blahblah speaking" in a nice sing songy voice, I usually do my own sing songy voice: "hello, this is robo here from blahblah" (singsongy voice)

But if a man picks up the phone I'm more like "Hullo, this is Robocop here from blahblah" (deeper voice).
I do this in real life but dependent on millions of different things. Met a friend's nine year old boy, a week ago, for first time. Said friend was really taken aback when I greeted him with a raised hand and a rather manly, matter of fact "Hey" as opposed to the girly playful smile and "Hi" she was used to.
 

rcoobc

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Fascinating. What's your opening gambit if it's you who is answering the phone? A Hello that starts deep and ends high?
It's usually pretty sing songy to be honest.

"Good [timeofday], [CompanyName]". I dont bother to say my name.
 

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I actually answered yes to all of them, for both sexes. I don't think it's the feminist in me though, probably just the fact i'm a polite apathist.
All except that one, anyway.

Not all were resounding yeses, i don't try extra hard to make friends, but i definitely am aware of the fact i act more diplomatic and outgoing to people i've just met/barely know than people i consider friends. I'd like to think i treat everyone the same, but there's probably some subconscious inequality going on somewhere, along the lines of the things robocop posted.
 

villain

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Far too many men don't understand feminism tbh and Emma is quite right in saying how it discriminates against both sexes.

I think the "man hating" aspect comes from years of frustration at the lack of inequality, but also men AND women not understanding feminism to begin with, it's very easy to lose patience with someone who doesn't even begin to try to understand feminism and quickly brushes it aside as a man-hating movement.
Don't get me wrong - you'll find women who hate men in the feminist movement, but they aren't the majority nor should they be painted as the image of feminism, in any group/****/religion etc you'll find extremists.
 

DOTA

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Far too many men don't understand feminism tbh and Emma is quite right in saying how it discriminates against both sexes.

I think the "man hating" aspect comes from years of frustration at the lack of inequality, but also men AND women not understanding feminism to begin with, it's very easy to lose patience with someone who doesn't even begin to try to understand feminism and quickly brushes it aside as a man-hating movement.
Don't get me wrong - you'll find women who hate men in the feminist movement, but they aren't the majority nor should they be painted as the image of feminism, in any group/****/religion etc you'll find extremists.
In fairness, in all those groups it's the extremists who are the 'painted as the image' of the group.

Happens with everything. Mention liking football to a stranger who knows sod all about football and assumptions regarding racism/homophobia/thuggery form.
 

villain

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In fairness, in all those groups it's the extremists who are the 'painted as the image' of the group.

Happens with everything. Mention liking football to a stranger who knows sod all about football and assumptions regarding racism/homophobia/thuggery form.
Yep that's the point I was making, not sure if my wording made it clear.
Extreme men-hating feminists are seen as the image of feminism even though thats so far from the truth.
 

DOTA

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Yep that's the point I was making, not sure if my wording made it clear.
Extreme men-hating feminists are seen as the image of feminism even though thats so far from the truth.
Wasn't sure.

Anyway, I like repeating people's points. It gives the impression of understanding them.
 

Mockney

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In fairness, in all those groups it's the extremists who are the 'painted as the image' of the group.

Happens with everything. Mention liking football to a stranger who knows sod all about football and assumptions regarding racism/homophobia/thuggery form.
Indeed, but doesn't make it any less dumb or wrong headed. Did people think the Civil Rights movement was bullshit because The Black Panthers and the Nation of Islam took it too far? Or because they focused on the plight of blacks rather than emphasising that whites were just as good? And why does the GLBT movement focus on the rights of gays rather than everyone? Bunch of anti-straight bigots.

Now I'm sure some people did, and still do argue those points. But they were idiots, and invariably using them to vindicate their opinions, and history shows them up as such.