ETH does not have to win the Europa League this season

Desert Eagle

Punjabi Dude
Joined
Sep 25, 2006
Messages
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These injuries and the schedule is going to make it tough.

The current title odds are: Man Utd 2.5, Juventus 6.5, Roma 6.5, Leverkusen 9.5, Sporting 11, Sevilla 13, Feyenoord 15, Royal Union 31

Yes betting odds aren't really directly predictive of team quality but we are clear favorites and fully healthy the best team left.

The rewards of winning this competition are also greater than anything else we can achieve this season. We would get the first seed in the Cl groups and a chance at the Supercup. If you had to pick between top four and the Europa only a fool would pick top 4. The FA cup is tricky because it has been longer since we've won it last and I'd love for us to win it but the Europa is the objectively better prize.
 
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I don’t think he has to win it to judge this season. The squad is slowly getting depleted with energy and injuries over time and it’s fair to say we don’t have the depth to challenge for all the trophies. This season has proved he’s already a success just by him handling the Ronaldo situation, winning the league cup, fighting for the top 4 and getting to the later stages of the europa and fa cup. Rashford is going to be a big miss for us as we’re very reliant on him scoring and changing games.
 
I don't really get this kind of view. At the weekend, people said a loss to Everton would be 'unacceptable'. Things don't always go to plan in football. This is effectively saying 'Ten Hag has to win two trophies in his first season', nobody was saying that in August. The odds look great now, but if the favourites always won, then City would have at least as many Champions League titles as Manchester United. I'm sure Ten Hag is doing everything he can to win it, it's more important to him than it is to us, but let's not bring out the guillotine if something goes wrong.
 
I wouldn't say he has to win it.

Utd are in with a good shout. But should get CL qualification through the league.

Juventus are also a dangerous proposition as they will see it as their ticket to the CL next year. They aren't going to get it through the league.

I have a feeling Mourinho will scum this title over the line with Roma
 
I don't think it's ever fair to say that not winning a major cup competition is a failure in a manager's first season. Knockout competitions are hard to win - that's why Fergie only has two Champions League titles, or why Guardiola has yet to win one since leaving Barcelona.

If Ten Hag stays here ten years and never wins a European trophy, that's a failure. If we feck up the EL from here, that's just a bit of a disappointment but hardly a managerial failure. Unless he plays De Gea in midfield or something.
 
I kind of get this point of view.

I don't truly believe this but playing devil's advocate, if we don't win this or the FA Cup, the only thing he has over Ole is the Carabao Cup, where we didn't play anyone decent until Newcastle. Then there's the 7-0, which might just be the worst result we've ever had in our history. Not to mention all the other heavy losses we've had this season, which are up there with Ole final season results. :nervous:
 
The Rashford injury should raise those odds a peg or two because I still don't see where the goals are coming from. If he was fit, I would have agreed with the odds.
 
It wasn't that long ago that people were calling the Europa League a Micky Mouse competition when United won it under José Mourinho.
 
Desert Eagle said:
or it will be his first failure as manager for us.

The current title odds are: Man Utd 2.5, Juventus 6.5, Roma 6.5, Leverkusen 9.5, Sporting 11, Sevilla 13, Feyenoord 15, Royal Union 31

Yes betting odds aren't really directly predictive of team quality but we are clear favorites and fully healthy the best team left.

The rewards of winning this competition are also greater than anything else we can achieve this season. We would get the first seed in the Cl groups and a chance at the Supercup. If you had to pick between top four and the Europa only a fool would pick top 4. The FA cup is tricky because it has been longer since we've won it last and I'd love for us to win it but the Europa is the objectively better prize.
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Feyenoord are good outsiders at that price
 
Can't say I really care to be honest. Signs of progress have been clear. Getting cohesive performances week in/week out is more important to me than the Europa/FA cup. Showing that we have the mettle to see off our competitors for the league position we want is more of a positive sign for me. It might sound bad but I really struggle to hold these competitions in higher regard than our league performance. The only competition that does that for me is the CL.
 
Why does he have to win it?

At the beginning of this season the vast majority of cafites wanted to see a top four finish, obvious improvement in the way you played and maybe a cup. All three of these have been (or top 4 will probably be achieved)

There's been a massive improvement on last season's debacle and in the mood around the club, so why is it suddenly a failed season if you lose a one off game in the EL and don't win it. It would be disappointing, but wouldn't take away from the massive steps forward you've taken this season.
 
I’m not phased about any of those teams. The squad is tiring and we have injuries, but I don’t see this team losing over two legs to any of the three teams left on our side of the draws. I’d much rather play Juve/Sporting over two legs than in the final.

He doesn’t ‘have’ to win it though. That’s stupid.
 
Should definitely be winning it based on who is left in the competition. Have a fairly strong feeling that we won’t though.
 
The Boy said:
Why does he have to win it?
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Because if he doesn't, this is basically the season where we got completely and utterly humiliated by our biggest rivals in our worst ever loss. Need to somehow wash over that result with everything else.
 
Ajr said:
Where are the goals going to come from?
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I hope from Martial, Antony, Bruno and Sancho (and maybe the odd midfield goal too from Casemiro and Mctom and Fred and Sabitzer) but i'm not holding my breath.
 
Herman Toothrot said:
I don't really get this kind of view. At the weekend, people said a loss to Everton would be 'unacceptable'. Things don't always go to plan in football. This is effectively saying 'Ten Hag has to win two trophies in his first season', nobody was saying that in August. The odds look great now, but if the favourites always won, then City would have at least as many Champions League titles as Manchester United. I'm sure Ten Hag is doing everything he can to win it, it's more important to him than it is to us, but let's not bring out the guillotine if something goes wrong.
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No guillotine but it will be a failure if we don't win it. Of course things don't always go to plan but considering the opposition and our own strength we really should be winning it.
 
2.5 are some terrible odds considering how short our bench is and that there are still some decent teams/managers in the competition. We might be big favourites, but I wouldn't put money on us there!
 
Its difficult to say a manager has to win a cup competition because there are too many variables with this.
 
Skills said:
Because if he doesn't, this is basically the season where we got completely and utterly humiliated by our biggest rivals in our worst ever loss. Need to somehow wash over that result with everything else.
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If Liverpool fans make a big deal of it, point to the league and tell them they're a shit washed up team, who could only raise their game against you, that puts them on a par with teams like Burnley and Wolves and are just game raising cnuts.
 
ETH has literally gotten blood out of stones with some of our players. While winning (more) trophies in his first season would be great it shouldn't be a benchmark if he fails to win another given where we've been and where we are now. We just have to trust the process which anyone with half a brain should understand.
 
The Boy said:
Why does he have to win it?

At the beginning of this season the vast majority of cafites wanted to see a top four finish, obvious improvement in the way you played and maybe a cup. All three of these have been (or top 4 will probably be achieved)

There's been a massive improvement on last season's debacle and in the mood around the club, so why is it suddenly a failed season if you lose a one off game in the EL and don't win it. It would be disappointing, but wouldn't take away from the massive steps forward you've taken this season.
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I never said that. I said it would be his first failure as United manager if he doesn't win it.
 
The Boy said:
If Liverpool fans make a big deal of it, point to the league and tell them they're a shit washed up team, who could only raise their game against you, that puts them on a par with teams like Burnley and Wolves and are just game raising cnuts.
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In 10 years time, nobody's going to care that Liverpool finished 7th and we finished 3/4th. It's not even footnote worthy.

That 7-0 is a permanent stain on the clubs history. And he was the one who oversaw that happen, until he does something more notable in our history.
 
The Boy said:
Why does he have to win it?

At the beginning of this season the vast majority of cafites wanted to see a top four finish, obvious improvement in the way you played and maybe a cup. All three of these have been (or top 4 will probably be achieved)

There's been a massive improvement on last season's debacle and in the mood around the club, so why is it suddenly a failed season if you lose a one off game in the EL and don't win it. It would be disappointing, but wouldn't take away from the massive steps forward you've taken this season.
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Agreed. The only way this season would be disappointing in any form or fashion would be if we don't make top 4. Everything has been going in the right direction and once we do get top 4 then this season has been a success in all aspects.
 
We don't have the luxury of being able to prioritise this competition. Our schedule levels the playing field somewhat. Im quite confident about the two leg rounds, but a final is a final. Anything can happen
 
You realize that odds higher than 2.00 mean that mathematically we most likely won't win it?

According to the bookies, there's a 40-42% chance that we will be the ones winning the Europa League. So yeah, we are overwhelming favorites in the competition.

However, let's say we got to the final and lost, but were the better team throughout the match. Would you consider that to be a failure? Losing a one-off game, that can be decided by small margins. ETH could do everything right from preparing the team for the game, selecting the starting 11, to making the right substitutions during the match, and we could still lose.

So saying that he HAS to win it otherwise it's a failure is just a lazy way of thinking. ETH, or any manager cannot do anything but give his team the best possible chances of winning the game, but that doesn't guarantee anything.

This is what Ole meant when he said "trophies are an ego thing". You assess progress over the course of a season, not a one-off game where anything can happen.
 
IMO if we go through Sevilla we have a big chance to win it. Unfortunately with Rashford and Garnacho out + Martial barely fit, we look a bit "blunt" up top in terms of speed so it will be easy to push us high as there's little threat in behind.

We're still in injury crisis, I hope this situation will be much better for next round but IMO Sevilla will be tough. I think it'll be small margin win for any team.
 
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