All this talk of new contracts for underperforming players really makes me think nothing has changed at all
[Fabrizio Romano] Manchester United want to discuss a new contract with David De Gea...
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik @Rood and Imran @Annihilate Now! start with the good news by celebrating Manchester United Women's emphatic FA Cup win over Spurs at Wembley and the future of manager Marc Skinner.
Then it's the bad news and the ever worsening form of our Men with losses to Arsenal and Palace.
Finally the main debate - ETH Out now or keep him until the end of the season - if not longer. Are you Team Nik or Team Imran?
The outrage here is weird, you would think it’s Bailly or Jones getting a new contract. What if it’s already been discussed with ETH and GK will be the final piece in the puzzle? No club in the world would deliberately let a contract of the starting 11 player run out, makes no sense whatsoever.
Horrendous news. They’ll have the contract signing photo while he’s rooted to his line.
Im all for offering De Gea a new contract, assuming its halving his obscene wage he's on.
By pretty much every demonstrable metric (https://fbref.com/en/comps/9/keepersadv/Premier-League-Stats), José Sa of Wolves has been a better shot stopper than him all season. I am sure if I spent an hour looking for stats from other leagues, I'd find plenty more keepers with better shot stopping stats.
That's this season when he's been good. He certainly wasn't anywhere close to being the best shot stopper in the world over the previous couple of seasons.
And even being the best shot stopper in the world wouldn't make him a really great goalkeeper anyway, any more than being the best corner taker in the world would make someone a really great winger. Especially not when every defence that's played ahead of him for a decade, regardless of personnel, has been muck.
Eventually questions need to be asked of the only member of that defensive unit who has been ever present.
He has another 2 years on his contract and he'll never earn anywhere near what he does currently at any other club.
There's literally no rush whatsoever to give him a new one.
How much are we going to give him now? 400k p.w?A keeper who can't get into Spain National Team because Sanchez, Raya, and Barcelona B keeper are above him in pecking order doesn't deserve more than 150k p.w.
Good at saving shots doesn't equate to being one of the best keepers. Reminds me of when everyone was convinced awb was amazing defensively because he could slide tackle
From “wanting to discuss” to actually signing it will probably take a year. And I’m not saying he should earn as much as he does now. All I’m saying that people jump to conclusions and start raging way too fast here.
Still being run by clowns. Welcome to the freak show Ten Hag!
Pretty much this but most fans see the incredible reaction saves and scream how world class he is
We've been run by morons for 9 years who make mistake after mistake. It's very easy to jump to conclusions and assume the worst.
The truth with De Gea lies somewhere in the middle.
He is one of the best shot-stoppers in Europe and shot-stopping is still the single biggest way goalkeepers contribute value. But it's not so big compared to everything else that you can be as bad as De Gea is at all other aspects of his job and still be one best goalkeepers around. In his very best shot-stopping form, he levels out as a mild positive. And in worse shot-stopping form or in a team that emphasises his weaknesses, significantly less than that.
But the key point in regard to this thread is that it doesn't actually matter whether you accept that about De Gea, whether you rate him higher or rate him lower. There's still no real need to give him a new deal when we have the option to extend his current contract for an extra year anyway. What actual gain is there in doing so? Just extend it, give ETH a year with him and if he wants to keep him at that point then extend with a new deal.
He is one of the best shot-stoppers in Europe and shot-stopping is still the single biggest way goalkeepers contribute value. But it's not so big compared to everything else that you can be as bad as De Gea is at all other aspects of his job and still be one best goalkeepers around. In his very best shot-stopping form, he levels out as a mild positive. And in worse shot-stopping form or in a team that emphasises his weaknesses, significantly less than that.
But the key point in regard to this thread is that it doesn't actually matter whether you accept that about De Gea, whether you rate him higher or rate him lower. There's still no real need to give him a new deal when we have the option to extend his current contract for an extra year anyway. What actual gain is there in doing so? Just extend it, give ETH a year with him and if he wants to keep him at that point then extend with a new deal.
Exactly this.
I would say our biggest mistakes are rewarding mediocre players that should be nowhere near United, with ridiculous contracts. De Gea, for all his faults, is at least an undisputed starting 11 player who has been very consistent during the years. We are not extending his contract tomorrow, we just want to start negotiations which will probably take at least a year and most likely lowering the wage at least slightly since he will be 32 at the time. Personally I don’t see what is there to be upset about, we have bigger issues than De Gea’s contract.
Great traditional keeper but not fit for the modern game. Why do this when Henderson is capable of taking over next season.
I really struggle to understand our fan base sometimes. Goalkeeper is probably the area that needs least attention on the team right now. De Gea's distribution isn't fantastic, and needs worked on, but as a shot-stopper he is still world-class. He can only work with what's in front of him and what he has is a mess of a defence that leaves him to do all the work most of the time.
I'd dare say that without De Gea we would be far worse off than we are right now. How many times hashe pulledus out of a hole? Or saved us from dropping more points? How many times has he been voted Cafe MotM on here?
Why do so many people want him gone? Remember, last season when everyone wanted Henderson, we got Henderson and within a couple of games you were begging for De Gea again.
I don't think he should be offered a massive pay rise, and we do need to bring wages under control and be more realistic. But the hate De Gea gets lately is baffling when he has been consistantly one of the only players who seems to actually still care on the team.
I'd dare say that without De Gea we would be far worse off than we are right now. How many times hashe pulledus out of a hole? Or saved us from dropping more points? How many times has he been voted Cafe MotM on here?
Why do so many people want him gone? Remember, last season when everyone wanted Henderson, we got Henderson and within a couple of games you were begging for De Gea again.
I don't think he should be offered a massive pay rise, and we do need to bring wages under control and be more realistic. But the hate De Gea gets lately is baffling when he has been consistantly one of the only players who seems to actually still care on the team.
Its pretty simple unfortunately. DDG is a top tier shot stopped and probably C grade everywhere else. The current top teams would always take a keeper with good distribution, ability to sweep and organise a defence over a better shot stopper because thats worth more goals to them offensively and is foundational to how they play. Stick DDG in the Liverpool or City squad and he would probably save another 3-4 goals a season vs their current keeper but he would also cost them a lot of goals at the other end and probably concede a few more due to poor distribution etc. Overall both of them would concede more goals and score less.
I love DDG but unfortunately he is not well rounded enough for the modern game and he is on an absolutely eye-watering salary. If he was on £200k/week that would probably be too much but he should be the best keeper in the world in basically every area based on his current salary.
I love DDG but unfortunately he is not well rounded enough for the modern game and he is on an absolutely eye-watering salary. If he was on £200k/week that would probably be too much but he should be the best keeper in the world in basically every area based on his current salary.
We all know how Ten Hag sets his team up to play, and we all know that De Gea isn't suited to it. Therefore it stands to reason, given the ridiculous wage he's on, that if we extend his contract, even at a reduced wage, we're going to be stuck with a player for the next 3-5 years who isn't a good fit for us. It's another case of squad pegs in round holes and I for one was hoping we'd start being a bit smarter about team building and recruitment. But having seen Bruno be given a contract extension, rumours of Rashford and Shaw in negotiations, and now news of De Gea's contract being extended, it doesn't exactly fill me with much hope that anything significant is going to change at this club. It'd be fine if they were all on reasonable wages, but they aren't, meaning even if Ten Hag decides he doesn't want them it's tough, he'll be forced to keep them.
He was consistent for years, and has been better this year, but he was awful for the previous 2 years.
Bruno's contract negotiations were concluded quickly so there is no real reason to suggest De Gea's might take a year. Perhaps in the past when he was looking at going elsewhere - but De Gea of today knows nobody else in world football is going to offer him half of what he's on here.
We can trigger the extension on his deal, not have to worry about GK until next summer, and focus on all the areas we need, without stringing another 4 years of De Gea around Ten Hag's neck before we have to. Nobody is asking to get rid of him now - just to make use of the deal he has, and not offer him a new one now.
I mean, we know very little about this. We don't know if Ten Hag likes him. We don't know if De Gea wants to retire here so is ok with reducing his wages for a longer contract, while being OK with eventually being 2nd goalkeeper (remember, we have to actually get a better goalkeeper first which isn't that easy nor is it cheap or the biggest priority). We don't even know if it's true, but given he has 1 year left, probably is.
He can't pass. His distribution is shockingly bad. Like comical at times. The sort of thing that should have been fixed over the 15+ years he has been at a decent level. He is on a huge huge salary. He doesn't command his area, is suspect at corners and doesn't seem to marshal his defence that well.
He is an elite shot stopper but for any team with ambitions of overturning the current best sides in the world that isn't enough.
I don't have anything but love for DDG but hes on far too much money to be as one dimensional as he is and I think a lot of us underestimate how vital Alisson and Ederson are for Liverpool and City. The start a lot of attacks, they break the press, they sweep high up the pitch, they act as a defender at times freeing another player, they command their area.
I don't think he will be replaced this year but we need to have a plan for him and we shouldn't be offering him a new contract. Extension can wait until new manager has his say.
We would be in a far worse position if we didn't have DDG over the past X years. That speaks volumes about how bad the rest of our setup has been. Your keeper should never win POTS. Never. Thats just an indictment that you are primarily on the back foot and your most valuable player is keeping the opposition at bay instead of dictating the game in attack.
Because he is on a huge salary and if things go well under ETH then he is unlikely to have a place in the team. You do not want a player earning £375k/week and sitting on the bench. You don't want your first choice keeper asking why he isn't on more money because his deputy is earning X amount. You don't want to give a long term contract to a player you might not have a place for in the immediate future.
Its not hate, its pragmatism and the slow realisation of our fan base that DDG is not up to snuff for the modern style of football the best teams play.
I don't think he is an immediate pressing issue but I think it would be a fecking awful decision to give him any new contract let alone a pay rise.
That would be very much a United thing to do though.
The Numbers Don't Lie When It Comes To Ranking Premier League Goalkeepers
DDG is 4th in the PL, no prizes for guessing who 1st and 2nd are,
Link has quite a fair assessment of the guy I feel using statistics. so many flaws to his game. For 10 years the defence has taken all the stick when there's only been one real constant in all that time.
DDG is 4th in the PL, no prizes for guessing who 1st and 2nd are,
what's a goalkeepers primary job?
if De Gea wasn't playing for us this year god knows where we'd be, every bit as important as Ronaldo.
I don't know if things have simply changed a lot since February, or FBRef use a different stat provider, but their current stats have Sa well clear in first, De Gea 2nd and Allison 3rd.
Thats irrelevant. Every player is the sum of their positives and negatives in the team they are in.
If your team only faces 20 shots a season then having the best shot stopper in the world isn't that valuable. If you face 200 then perhaps thats more useful.
If your keeper is awful in the air, doesn't command his area, can't pass, can't sweep and doesn't instil calm in his defence then perhaps he is facing more shots than he should be and its his own fault.
You are basically looking at this as an overly simplistic issue.
What is Robertson and TAAs job? They are defenders right? Not going to lie, I think maybe you should have a word with Klopp because for some reason he is playing 2 defenders who aren't that good at defending.
Well put.
It's like keeping on a fireman who keeps setting fire to the station because he's really good at putting the fires out.
Great news. Glad that Rangnick and presumably ETH, who will have been asked their opinion on this, have some common sense 
.
.Edouard Mendy: £2.7m per year
DDG: £19.5m per year
Given that Mendy cost Chelsea a £22m transfer fee, he could have paid for himself in just over a year and then represented a net surplus after only 15 months.
Rather than compounding the Player Power created by Woodward, we should be dismantling it. I think a contract extension would be a mistake.
DDG: £19.5m per year
Given that Mendy cost Chelsea a £22m transfer fee, he could have paid for himself in just over a year and then represented a net surplus after only 15 months.
Rather than compounding the Player Power created by Woodward, we should be dismantling it. I think a contract extension would be a mistake.
No idea but I think the reason why De Gea is rightly getting the plaudits he is this season is due to how much he's being called upon, I think put a competent defence ahead of him and it'll highlight his flaws (not coming off his line being the main one)
Basic bitch comment
It's like saying a full backs primary job is just to defend, it's not really true anymore
He’s one of the few players we have that actually gives a feck
I'm not going to be getting up in arms about handing a goalkeeper a contract when he's been our most serviceable player all year. Do we need to? Probably not, it's not a decision I would make and I think his colossal wages need to take a hit to properly reflect his value. I'd need to know a lot more detail to assess whether this is a terrible thing, but the fact we may open negotiations isn't bad to me in itself.
The other thing to this is, DeGea is probably ETH's 19th biggest problem. I really don't think hes going to alight upon goalkeeper distribution as of fundamental importance to getting this side on track. Certain compromises will be made to ensure funds are going where they have the most impact. I think we have to get real about that and realise our best performers may still be here for many windows. So yes, as much as people are sniping - protecting our position with respect to DeGea and Bruno is logical.
The other thing to this is, DeGea is probably ETH's 19th biggest problem. I really don't think hes going to alight upon goalkeeper distribution as of fundamental importance to getting this side on track. Certain compromises will be made to ensure funds are going where they have the most impact. I think we have to get real about that and realise our best performers may still be here for many windows. So yes, as much as people are sniping - protecting our position with respect to DeGea and Bruno is logical.
He's been our most consistent performer, yet he's far from ideal for any high pressing team that plays out from the back. His wages are way way way too high, so I assume the club is trying to negotiate a year or two more, without triggering the one year's extension that keeps him on this ludicrous contract. He'd have to perform like prime Neuer to merit those wages.
For the love of all that is holy please don’t let this happen.
Is it just Fab reporting this?
Yep.
A shot-stopper provides more value to the side the more he has to stop shots. And as a team our goalkeeper has had to make the third most saves in the league this season while facing the fourth most average level of shot difficulty. So a platform for a shot-stopper to impress and De Gea has, which (tbf to him) wasn't a given seeing as it still required him to reverse his last couple of seasons' poor form. So all credit for that.
But if you compare that to Ederson at City (the most analogous side to ETH's Ajax in the league) or Ajax's goalkeepers themselves, they face literally half as many shots. 112 vs 52/51 so far this season. So that's immediately half the opportunity De Gea would have to do the one thing that compensates for all his flaws. At which point it becomes quite literally impossible for him to provide sufficient value over lesser shot-stoppers with a more rounded game.
I dont think this is a good idea, he isnt good with his feet and Ten Hag will need someone good with his feet.