Fans who were against today's protests

[jesperjaap]

The only way you definately force the club to sell is by the owners not making money and the club losing value.

I am only against the protest due to the covid situation inside and outside the ground with mass gatherings, that is potentially bigger than anything in the scheme of things. Fortunately less so now of course compared to other protests over the last year I was also against for the same reason.

Not going to watch games home or away, not buying merchandise/good from the club or any of its sponsors, not subscibing to Sky sports.

Of course this is unrealistic as what are the chances of majority of fans doing this as temporarily it is basically saying not supporting the club. I am all for what happened in terms of making the world aware and carigng about the club and understand it takes disruptive actions of a grand scale to make this happen....but in th egrand scheme of things, this wont make much difference to the owners whatsoever unless it is the start of much more to follow

 

[That'sHernandez]

Plastic fans like you are ruining ours.

I'm not plastic. I'm just not naive to think breaking into Old Trafford and letting off a few flares is going to do anything.

 

[Eckers99]

You will never see a Labour government push through such an anti-business policy, let alone the Conservatives. If you want to blame anyone for the Glazers, blame the FA and the PL for allowing it to happen; not just to us but to clubs like Newcastle and and even Chelsea and City.

The Glazers are not going to sell a business that generates the amount of money Manchester United does. They are businessmen, it makes no business sense.

As if Boris Johnson is above the populist move. The guy has zero integrity and is buried under constant sleaze allegations, so would probably love the positive distraction. It's all conjecture anyway, as are your ideas about the Glazers long-term plans for this club.

For all we know, they might already feel like they've rinsed us as much as possible and might've been open to selling before their grand plan to take us out of competitive football collapsed. We've already seen strong rumours that Kroenke - another Yank business man - could be tempted to sell Arsenal. Again, it's all conjecture but they might not have the stomach for clinging onto the club for much longer. Protests like this will only push their exit forward, in that case.

I just don't see the point in the negativity. People have been moaning about our owners for long enough. The vast majority are just pleased to see some action and can't be arsed with the small number of armchair critics finding holes to pick.

 

[Spoony]

That's actually not a good way to remove leeches, despite what the movies might say.

I just wanted an excuse to play Bob Marley. The scenes would be a cinematic masterpiece, HW. Flares, fireworks, Bob on huge massive loud speakers singing Revolution. Not quite an Intifada but heh....

 

[GBBQ]

First of all, protesting within the confines of the law would be a start. Trespassing, vandalism and violence is not a good look and muddles the message of the protests, while also potentially damaging the team (possible points deduction). I also think today's protests are impacting the wrong people, namely the players, the coaches and the policeman and civilians who were unlucky to run into the most uncivilised protesters.

The protests in themselves, while peaceful and legal, are fine, and the protesters have done a good job at getting attention to their cause. Personally, I fear we'd end up in worse hands (Saudis) if the protesters got their way but that's a different matter.

Do you think the protest would have the same impact if it was just a quiet group outside the stadium. It might get a quick mention in the papers and then be overshadowed by whatever happened in the game.

We’ve had multiple peaceful protests over the years and nothing has changeThe Glazers pushed forward with their plans to bleed the club dry whilst failing to address matters on and off the pitch properly.

Storming Old Trafford was symbolic and for the most part non violent (but you’ll unfortunately always get a handful of fools with any large group).

I am dead against the Saudi takeover too. In fact I think the future could still lie with the Glazers if they put in some controls and measures to ensure more is invested in the team, the club and it’s facilities as well as plans to bring the club debt down to a more manageable level. Controls that mean decisions like joining the ESL cannot be made without transparent planning, fan engagement and a vote. They can still have a healthy dividend and a prosperous business on and off the pitch.

 

[Spoony]

Or a scratch on the civil rights movement but heh football! Ja!

 

[Ekeke]

The Glazers aren't spiteful internet trolls though, they are businessmen who would never let it come to that.

Why not if they were still making money?

We'll be making money for a long time yet, we've only grown with our sponsorships

 

[That'sHernandez]

As if Boris Johnson is above the populist move. The guy has zero integrity and is buried under constant sleaze allegations, so would probably love the positive distraction. It's all conjecture anyway, as are your ideas about the Glazers long-term plans for this club.

For all we know, they might already feel like they've rinsed us as much as possible and might've been open to selling before their grand plan to take us out of competitive football collapsed. We've already seen strong rumours that Kroenke - another Yank business man - could be tempted to sell Arsenal. Again, it's all conjecture but they might not have the stomach for clinging onto the club for much longer. Protests like this will only push their exit forward, in that case.

I just don't see the point in the negativity. People have been moaning about our owners for long enough. The vast majority are just pleased to see some action and can't be arsed with the small number of armchair critics finding holes to pick.

Nah Boris isn't above a populist move, but his backers would be in this instance. It sends a really powerful message about investment in an post-Brexit UK, which the wider Tory government, and donors, would be scared to have put out. When you talk about removing ownership of businesses just because their customers have decided they don't like them, you're setting a negative precedent.

Don't get me wrong, I'd be ecstatic to see the Glazers go and actual fans/supporters having more of a say in the way we do business. But unless we manage to conjure up about £4bn, it's not happening.

 

[United442b]

I keep reading no one will be able to buy the club or future owners might be worse.

£3 billion in world finance is large amount, but not massive. Manchester United make money and any new owners will be seen as saviours - They can expect a rise in revenue as a result.

As for the new owners being worse, the Glazers just tried to kill our club.

 

[mu4c_20le]

Why not if they were still making money?

We'll be making money for a long time yet, we've only grown with our sponsorships

The club is more than just about making money though, it itself is a 2+ bn pound asset, no way they would watch billions evaporate just to make their dividends every year. Not to mention we'd lose sponsorships when players leave and we slide down the table into relegation as you said. The Glazers don't care about football but they've shown that they do care about finishing top 4 and getting that CL money, they start sacking managers and having conference calls with the CEO when we don't.

 

[Mickeza]

Why not if they were still making money?

We'll be making money for a long time yet, we've only grown with our sponsorships

Because they make money by the asset increasing in value. Them making 20m per year in dividends is small change to what they’re going to make when they sell - but the timing of when they sell is key. Oddly enough the Super League may have precipitated them selling as the club value would have skyrocketed.

 

[Roboc7]

Do you really think this will work, rather than just end up costing the players and manager any success they might have?

And would you be happy enough if it took 5 years of boycots and demonstrations by which point we're in the middle of the championship and sold all our players?

The Glazers aren’t stupid they’d sell up long before that could ever happen, if fans stop games taking place or boycott game’s their position becomes untenable fairly quickly.
Pandemic has hit club hard and they won’t put money in, they don’t have stomach or pockets for a fight.

 

[Borys]

Moaning about protest "ruining my afternoon" is okey if you're a regular football fan, focused only on football. This was expected and probably most of those regulars by now don't remember what was the fuss about with the ESL.

But it also shows this was the right moment to protest, because a lot of people will hear the message.

 

[Spoony]

To be fair boycotting games (eventually) is the best alternative so far.

 

[Varun]

Buy shares, oh man

 

[Still ill]

Not enter OT or prevent the team from leaving the hotel and ruin my afternoon

Not sure what’s pathetic about it really? I planned my day around watching this game. These pricks have ruined my afternoon/evening.

Read the room, buddy.

 

[That'sHernandez]

To be fair boycotting games (eventually) is the best alternative so far.

Is it thought? The club has just gone over 12 months without fans. They'd cope without us... they've already proven they can.

 

[Varun]

To be fair boycotting games (eventually) is the best alternative so far.

It's a pipe dream though to be fair. There are enough non hardcore locals + tourists for games to go on regardless of the few thousands who won't in protest.

 

[Spoony]

Is it thought? The club has just gone over 12 months without fans. They'd cope without us... they've already proven they can.

but for how long? Clubs are all same boat at the moment.

 

[That'sHernandez]

but for how long? Clubs are all same boat at the moment.

Until they force the PL to allow a club/PL subscription streaming service, which everyone will pay for.

 

[Ekeke]

The club is more than just about making money though, it itself is a 2+ bn pound asset, no way they would watch billions evaporate just to make their dividends every year. Not to mention we'd lose sponsorships when players leave and we slide down the table into relegation as you said. The Glazers don't care about football but they've shown that they do care about finishing top 4 and getting that CL money, they start sacking managers and having conference calls with the CEO when we don't.

They obviously do care about money and not the club, and selling our best players each summer for the next 3 or 4 seasons and cutting down on spending with the club and expectations would be enough to maintain things for years. By the time they left for business reasons we'll be nowhere near where we are

You cannot go half way with something like this. Either you're willing to burn it all the way to the ground just to get rid of the owners, ruining loads of peoples lives in the process with them losing jobs, or you cheer on the team. Because every distraction and disruption towards the players is hurting them, their chances for success and the likelyhood they'll still be here in a few years if they want to be winning trophies. You either say fine, I dont care about the players or the manager, or the staff, all I care about is not having the glazers as owners and we can start again from there even if we're a championship club. Or you support the team, the players and the staff we have and enjoy the sucess they can bring us.

 

[Spoony]

It's a pipe dream though to be fair. There are enough non hardcore locals + tourists for games to go on regardless of the few thousands who won't in protest.

Or perhaps massive protests during games.

 

[KW2006]

As I have said in another thread, they should protest directly at the office/living places of Glazers and Woodward.

 

[Sarni]

I'm against it because it's not going to achieve anything. This will be in the media for a few days and that's it. The Glazers don't care about any of this. If stuff like this continues it will hurt United more than the Glazers - they will wait it out like all the protests before. This is basically a tantrum and they will treat it like one...

The only way to force the Glazers out is to pressure the politicians to legislate 50+1, no other protest will be successful. These protesters should go to London and do this in front of the parliament, not Lowry and Old Trafford... Pressure the politicians who care about being re-elected - that's the only way to go, if you want something to change.

50+1 is impossible. How would they buy the clubs back from the owners? Besides fans running the club may sound like an amazing idea but not sure that would actually be that good in England.

 

[Ekeke]

The Glazers aren’t stupid they’d sell up long before that could ever happen, if fans stop games taking place or boycott game’s their position becomes untenable fairly quickly.
Pandemic has hit club hard and they won’t put money in, they don’t have stomach or pockets for a fight.

Everyone who has told me things like this in the past thought they'd be gone long before now. Guess what you're wrong

 

[The holy trinity 68]

I’ve said what needs to be done if you want something to change. Buy shares in the club, they are for sale.

You literally have no clue what you are talking about by the looks of it. The shares on sale are still no where near enough to have a big enough impact, as the Glazers still own a huge majority of the shares in the club.

There are currently 165 million shares outstanding, with the Glazers owning all 124 million class B shares and 41 million class A shares owned by a mixture of the Glazers and other investors.

Only the Class A shares are available on the stock exchange, which means the Glazers will always have the majority of voting rights and the decision making will always stay with them.

 

[Spoony]

Surely if they continue protests it will affect the image of United therefore the Glazers ie sponsorship?

 

[Jev]

Do you think the protest would have the same impact if it was just a quiet group outside the stadium. It might get a quick mention in the papers and then be overshadowed by whatever happened in the game.

We’ve had multiple peaceful protests over the years and nothing has changeThe Glazers pushed forward with their plans to bleed the club dry whilst failing to address matters on and off the pitch properly.

Storming Old Trafford was symbolic and for the most part non violent (but you’ll unfortunately always get a handful of fools with any large group).

I am dead against the Saudi takeover too. In fact I think the future could still lie with the Glazers if they put in some controls and measures to ensure more is invested in the team, the club and it’s facilities as well as plans to bring the club debt down to a more manageable level. Controls that mean decisions like joining the ESL cannot be made without transparent planning, fan engagement and a vote. They can still have a healthy dividend and a prosperous business on and off the pitch.

It wouldn't have gotten the same press, that's for sure. Whether today was good press or not, we'll have to wait and see, just like we'll have to wait and see whether it will be worth the consequences/punishments.

Either way, if the argument is that we had to break the law to get enough impact then that, to me, is a slippery slope.

 

[mckenzie79]

Not enter OT or prevent the team from leaving the hotel and ruin my afternoon

No one cares about your afternoon pal.

The classic,I want change but not if it interferes with my life. So what if a game gets cancelled, the message is clear, and this wont stop until change happens.

Sorry for the inconvenience.

 

[That'sHernandez]

You literally have no clue what you are talking about by the looks of it. The shares on sale are still no where near enough to have a big enough impact, as the Glazers still own a huge majority of the shares in the club.

There are currently 165 million shares outstanding, with the Glazers owning all 124 million class B shares and 41 million class A shares owned by a mixture of the Glazers and other investors.

Only the Class A shares are available on the stock exchange, which means the Glazers will always have the majority of voting rights and the decision making will always stay with them.

My point is less about buying individual shares and more about if you want to see real change you need to stump up the money for the club. Let's be real: The only reason they pulled out of ESL is because the other English clubs did, not because of the fan reaction.

 

[Paxi]

Also you didn't have the social media factor back then. Fans are harassing sponsors on there writing negative comments under their posts. They won't like that and with the constant protests outside the stadium it's all bad publicity.

Call me an optimist but I don't think the Glazers are far off cashing in if fans keep the pressure up. I'm worried who they sell to though...

We could be doing all of that. I’m not advocating violence but disruption to the club in the short term. If the fans aren’t have massive discontent then we can’t be monetised.

Plastic fans like you are ruining ours.

Aye. It’s embarrassing that anyone would be pissed off about their afternoon being spoiled.

Found myself agreeing with Howson here.

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[Paxi]

Buy shares, oh man

Yeah I mean, let’s line their fecking pockets even more...

 

[mu4c_20le]

They obviously do care about money and not the club, and selling our best players each summer for the next 3 or 4 seasons and cutting down on spending with the club and expectations would be enough to maintain things for years. By the time they left for business reasons we'll be nowhere near where we are

You cannot go half way with something like this. Either you're willing to burn it all the way to the ground just to get rid of the owners, ruining loads of peoples lives in the process with them losing jobs, or you cheer on the team. Because every distraction and disruption towards the players is hurting them, their chances for success and the likelyhood they'll still be here in a few years if they want to be winning trophies. You either say fine, I dont care about the players or the manager, or the staff, all I care about is not having the glazers as owners and we can start again from there even if we're a championship club. Or you support the team, the players and the staff we have and enjoy the sucess they can bring us.

Everyone who has told me things like this in the past thought they'd be gone long before now. Guess what you're wrong

Three words: Sir Alex Ferguson. The first part was only allowed to happen because Fergie continued to win titles without properly replacing Ronaldo. Post Fergie, they've had to come out and make "statement" signings to appease the fans. So, clearly protests and fan discontent does work to an extent.

I disagree with the second part where we have to burn it all to get the parasites out. Like i said, they are businessmen, and under the right circumstances I believe they will take the money and run. 2-3 billion pounds isn't a trivial sum

 

[Roboc7]

Everyone who has told me things like this in the past thought they'd be gone long before now. Guess what you're wrong

Nothing like this has ever been done before so let’s see what happens. I’ve always said they’ll be here until fans make a concerted effort to get rid or they can sell tv rights/joins super league so guess what I’m not wrong. You think we’d have to be relegated for them to sell and take years of boycotts, that’s laughable.

 

[alexthelion]

So what's the alternative? This thread was created for you

Pressure the PL/FA to change their ownership guidelines first.

Then protest peacefully, outside the stadium, every single home game. Do not buy any United merchandise, do not subscribe to Skt/BT.

Do not, under any circumstances moan or gripe if United are bought by the Saudis or someone just as abhorent.

 

[Ekeke]

Three words: Sir Alex Ferguson. The first part was only allowed to happen because Fergie continued to win titles without properly replacing Ronaldo. Post Fergie, they've had to come out and make "statement" signings to appease the fans. So, clearly protests and fan discontent does work to an extent.

I disagree with the second part where we have to burn it all to get the parasites out. Like i said, they are businessmen, and under the right circumstances I believe they will take the money and run. 2-3 billion pounds isn't a trivial sum

Those star signings were a marketing strategy. To make more money, not for the fans but for the Glazers. Anytime they do something for money its always going to be spun as for the fans

It may not come to losing everything - nobody knows, but you need to be prepared for your actions to cause that and the concequences. You cannot go half measures and then complain when people villify you for the club being in ruins and lots of people losing their jobs saying "Yeah well we thought they'd leave after a year". Thats the choice thats made. You ride it out till the end or you support the people who work for united and dont get to tell the glazers what to do.

 

[clarkydaz]

I am a Scouse Red. Fair play to you lot today. Right against rivalry!

I have just joined this forum, but probably wont be here very often, but wanted to give my solidarity.

We need to put rivalries aside now. You have a birth-right to hate Liverpool FC, I have a birth-right to hate MU as club too. But we are so similar as fans. and now is the time to be as one.

thanks, hopefully some good comes out of this for any of us. As you say this is above rivalry. This has come on the heels of what Arsenal and Chelsea done last week

 

[alexthelion]

We already had largely peaceful protests 10 years ago. Direct action is needed.

So what have the "top reds" done since then?

Feck all is the answer. If these fans cared so much about this, they would have been protesting at every home match, not just today.

Hypocrites, same as those crapping on anyone with a different opinion on this forum.

 

[NFM]

Two Questions;
1) If United had 9 more points this morning would there have been a protest? Annswer NO!
2) In 1956 when the FA and Football League banned United joining the European Cup on the grounds that it would destroy English Football , would you have supported that ? Answer NO!
In 1958 United's ownership changed to just about the most disliked person around Manchester. Did it stop Busby building another great team with world class stars? NO!
Stop being hypocritical, if United were winning the title, if the ESL had been handled better with obvious competitive places at risk , and 'sold' to the public, would today have happened, would it hell.
The 'butcher' didn't stop United being great, the Glazers might not be an Arab nation or a Russian mobster, or even a national government, but there are a lot worse owners out there.

 

[mu4c_20le]

Pressure the PL/FA to change their ownership guidelines first.

Then protest peacefully, outside the stadium, every single home game. Do not buy any United merchandise, do not subscribe to Skt/BT.

Do not, under any circumstances moan or gripe if United are bought by the Saudis or someone just as abhorent.

I meant realistic alternatives.