Basically it's not a true FF game?
Gaming Final Fantasy XVI (PS5)
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik @Rood and Imran @Annihilate Now! start with the good news by celebrating Manchester United Women's emphatic FA Cup win over Spurs at Wembley and the future of manager Marc Skinner.
Then it's the bad news and the ever worsening form of our Men with losses to Arsenal and Palace.
Finally the main debate - ETH Out now or keep him until the end of the season - if not longer. Are you Team Nik or Team Imran?
Frankly I think the last true FF game was 12, and that is a bit of a stretch.
I've not played for years till I tried and enjoyed FF7 remake. Surely it's at least as Final Fantasy as the 7 remake?
It's a remix. It has a lot of FF elements but at it's core it's a different style of game. FF purists will feel something missing/lacking.
The combat is even more one button mashy than FFVII remake. Essentially you press square the majority of the time and on bosses you throw in a R1 to dodge some attacks. Maybe that changes and it gets more complex but that's my takeaway so far.
Sounds like well... er... not Final Fantasy. I loved JRPGs after getting into this series.
How far are you in, because combat is far deeper than the 7 remake for example but it is completely an action game, and very hack n slash.
Combat is about chaining skills and combos together, I found myself rarely pressing just square and consistently relying on good timing and the right skill at the right time
Finished it and all side quests somewhere around 55 hours Id say but no way to check.
Best game in the series since 6 though I still have more love for og 7.
In the end I think the game adds too much on the end and there were a couple of moments where I thought to myself "can't this just be the end".
Brilliant cast and nice story. There's some really nice builds that can be had.
Side quests add some nice little pieces to the world despite not being fun to play and I like the way they all tie together.
Not being able to Sprint in town and how long it takes to actually start sprinting in areas you can was a bit of a pain.
Some minor nitpicks with the writing that are best saved till a month or so down the line but goty for me so far with bg3 the probable only competition, given I found Zelda kinda boring.
Best game in the series since 6 though I still have more love for og 7.
In the end I think the game adds too much on the end and there were a couple of moments where I thought to myself "can't this just be the end".
Brilliant cast and nice story. There's some really nice builds that can be had.
Side quests add some nice little pieces to the world despite not being fun to play and I like the way they all tie together.
Not being able to Sprint in town and how long it takes to actually start sprinting in areas you can was a bit of a pain.
Some minor nitpicks with the writing that are best saved till a month or so down the line but goty for me so far with bg3 the probable only competition, given I found Zelda kinda boring.
Glad you enjoyed it. I'm not sure how far I am in the game somewhere around late midgame I think... The last couple of main quests I've done are annoying fetch quests to gather parts for something someone wants to build, seems like filler.
I'm enjoying the game and story immensely, I am just starting to find myself wanted to b-line to the next story beat and getting annoyed by the slow movement pace.
I think I know where you are if they're quite a full on personality. There is payoff to that but it's a definite slow/low point in terms of pacing. That whole section almost felt like something that could be a sidequest.
There's a couple of spots both before and later where I felt similar.
Yes which is why it’s great
Is it great because of the story and voice actors or because of the changed mechanics?
Definitely the story and voice acting making it great.
The game mechanics are basically a poor man's god of war.
As I get further into the game I'm really struggling with it overall. The story and characters are keeping me invested but I'm not really having fun 'playing' the gameplay segments. A lot of slow running around on pointless errands (you can tell it is made by the MMORPG team here), and battles that range from uninteresting button mashing trash mobs or boss sponges that go on a little too long. Then, just as I feel like putting it down an epic story segment happens to bait me in for another few meandering hours.
I probably sound really damning, but having played every mainline Final Fantasy and being a lover of the series, this just isn't it. In an effort to bring wider appeal to the series everything from Final Fantasy XIII onward has been a step away from what made the series what it was. It's at the point now it can barely be called a JRPG.
Good question because there are good and bad points to both. The spectacle and characters are on another level compared to more recent FF games but the pacing is a little off at times. The combat can be fantastic against bosses and the moves are brilliant but on ordinary foes it's actually a bit unsatisfying.
Would definitely recommend but it is different from a lot of previous FFs.
On linearity, I like playing multiple games - half an hour here on one , couple of hours there on another - and honestly the obsession with every game needing to have character progression and rpg elements, open / semi open world fat and basically time sinks to showcase bang for buck, is a bit tiresome.
I just started playing Wolfenstein New Collosus and it’s single minded intensity is refreshing.
I know this FF16 also has those RPG elements which haven’t been well used but still, I’m all for a more linear experience in between all the other stuff.
I just started playing Wolfenstein New Collosus and it’s single minded intensity is refreshing.
I know this FF16 also has those RPG elements which haven’t been well used but still, I’m all for a more linear experience in between all the other stuff.
Yoshi P said they always found the term jrpg racist and it's always just been making an rpg to them.
I do feel some of the quests too are a little mmo but aren't the classic FFs also filled with alot of slow running around but with random battles and slow menu combat?
I mean playing through kefkas tower recently and having a random encounter every 3 steps was much worse than anything I've experienced in 16 in terms of filler (side quests aside).
I just think certain common rpg quests don't translate well to the more realistic 3d era similar issues with DQ11. Alot of the common (bridge is out etc..) quests have been done to death and don't add anything to the plot so people are sick of them.
I'm enjoying it but they did basically just use the Final Fantasy brand to create a Game of Thrones action game 
I did see that interview regarding the phrase JRPG. Was a take I'd never really considered before, having always used the term positively to describe my favourite genre. My point being though, this game is barely an RPG, if it wasn't for the name of the franchise it would be categorised as an action game akin to God of War.
I agree that more modern games struggle to interpret certain RPG quest types we'd be familiar with. I feel in modern games, fetch quests feel far worse. In this example though, a bit chunk could have been mitigated by allowing to sprint in towns and also not having so many, fetch this from point A, then return it to point B, only to then be sent to point C and D then back again.
Like I said I'm overall enjoying the game despite the negative perception my posts may give. Just saddens me that the success this game is getting probably means we'll never get another "true" final fantasy game.
It feels that way at the start but by the time get about 50% of the way through it becomes very much a Final Fantasy game IMO.I'm enjoying it but they did basically just use the Final Fantasy brand to create a Game of Thrones action game
Absolutely its certainly got more in common with GoW than FF6, right down to the boring sidequests. I agree with most your complaints actually, sprint in particular being a massive pain in the butt by the times, in the end my two big negatives were spriting and the sidequests but even some of the main quests felt side questy. The traditional JRPG is probably my most played genre (so much so I'm actually building one as a hobby) and I do feel this games success could be the final nail in the coffin for turn based FF which is a shame as I don't particularly like Octopath (it lacks a real story, both games) and always find Dragonquest too childish by times.
But SE having been pushing FF away from turn based since 10, so honestly its been 22 years without a proper turn based FF, the series has been trying to dodge traditional jrpg combat longer than it actually used it so I've kinda come to accept FF for exactly what it is. 9 is and will be the last great menu based FF in my opinion of course.
I try not to judge 16 on what it could have been for a traditional jrpg fan cause this story and this setting with amazing turn based combat would easily have put it up there with the holy trinity (ff6, Chrono Trigger and Suikoden 2)
GoW, and especially the sequel Ragnorak, have great side quests, probably the best I've seen in a game recently outside of The Witcher 3.I found the combat fun but most the quests just fairly straight forward fetch quests.
NPC - Get me this
Kratos/Clive - OK
Go over to object,
Kratos/Clive - Oh no its a monster.
monster appears, kill monster, return to npc
Or
Kill x number of hunts, Valkyries, Beserkers etc...
I mean its not just those 2 games, I think almost every game does the same. GoW's do tie in to the story a little better than FF16's early quests but in general I'm just burned out with fetch quests and hunts in all games as a lot of it these days is spill over from mmo's and boring. Why in the world do I wanna gather flowers when I'm trying to save the world? I find that spill over into single player games way over done and just padding out games for no reason these days (very likely cause I'm short on time but force myself to do them anyway).
I think its a bit weird to criticise side quests for being like an mmo. World of warcraft must be in the tens of thousands of side quests at this point, surely they've done every possible variation of a side quest at this point.
I think side quests become a chore when travelling from one place to another is boring. Traversal is important, an interesting varied environment is important.
I think side quests become a chore when travelling from one place to another is boring. Traversal is important, an interesting varied environment is important.
Some of the side quests are OK, but I got bored with a few last night which were talk to somebody, go to someone else 400 yards away, fight, go back to person 2, then person 1. That's unnecessary especially when there isn't a sprit button. The jump button is weird too, I haven't really found a use for it yet. I also don't like that it's "do a bit of the main story, get 3 side-quests", it feels more natural when you just find them randomly whilst walking around.
I am loving the central story and most of the quests in it though.
I am loving the central story and most of the quests in it though.
For me and I might be alone in this an MMO is kinda geared to having you repeatedly do the same tasks repeatedly, the social aspect is what prevents people getting tired of doing the same thing repeatedly at least for me. The rewards are also useful cause of auction houses, trading etc... By the end of ff16 I had like 800 unused/unneeded sharp teeth and bloody hides etc...
If you compare the number of sidequests in for example FF6 to FF16. FF16 has tons more, uses the above npc says get x, go to x, fight monster, pick up x and return x or talk to npc a, b, c, do the aforementiond and return to a.
FF6 by comparison does indeed have a hunt the 8 legendary dragons and Death Gaze but it also has the auction house, the colosseum, uncursing the shield. Its not just default fetch quest 01 x 1000. 2 of those have completely unique mechanics. What it doesn't have is "get me 3 of x please" quests. The wounded soldier quest, the clock puzzle in zozo. All are unique things that happen in the game as opposed to doing the same thing for the 100th time.
FF7 has the gold saucer, only 3 weapons iirc to hunt but they are worth it, going on a date. Quests in older games are far fewer but far more interesting and unique.
Modern game sidequests feel lazy by comparison to me, when they're just "kill 3 goblins so I can make goblin stew". They all feel like they are in there to pad playtime but not in a way that makes the game more interesting, in a way thats "Do what you did before again cause we need to put 50+ hours on the box"
Then it's not a Final Fantasy game.
To add to this which o completely agree on.
The side quests in the game also just don't match thematically. Your character is kind of a big deal in the universe and their organisation. Yet if someone needs an ingredient for soup it's your job to travel the world to get it.
If a message needs to be passed between two people, it's your job.
Blacksmith is sad, only you can cheer him up.
As well as boring I just find them quite immersion breaking, an because of how linear the game is, they really aren't needed. The worst type of padding.
Don’t mind that tbh
Anyone else feel they really overdid the bearer story? I feel it's almost as overdone as "enemies of cocoon" in XIII. I get it, the slaves have terrible lives and are unable to fight and rebel against the cruel world but it loses any potency when it keeps getting done over and over. Next they'll be throwing them to the lions in an arena next
Looking forward to the last boss. A bit of a flawed gem of a game i'd say.
that actually happens in the last quest i played. I couldn't help but loudly shout FFS game
Looking forward to the last boss. A bit of a flawed gem of a game i'd say.
I like that it’s a game I can pick up after a couple of days and not need a learning curve to get back into.
Finished. The ending will probably be a bit divisive but i kind of liked it:
Very solid 8 out of 10 for me. Not quite in my top 5 FFs but had it not felt so bloated at times it could have easily been in there.
It's very ambiguous isn't it?! I don't think Joshua survived at all. Someone else wrote the book in his name. The bit with kids making their own fires was a nice touch with the age of magic at an end. Clive lives but doesn't have long left?
Very solid 8 out of 10 for me. Not quite in my top 5 FFs but had it not felt so bloated at times it could have easily been in there.
I think Joshua lived, I think Clive using the power to bring him back and that was what in the end did Clive in.
He pretty much says when speaking of Ultimas power being too much for a man after he can't turn off his magic fire hand when he welds closed the hole in Joshua's chest.
I think Clive dies so Joshua can live which is a nice ending for him given he tears him apart early in the game.
Jills reaction when the baby is born is what sells me on this, I feel its her no longer sensing Clive and knowing he's gone.
He pretty much says when speaking of Ultimas power being too much for a man after he can't turn off his magic fire hand when he welds closed the hole in Joshua's chest.
I think Clive dies so Joshua can live which is a nice ending for him given he tears him apart early in the game.
Jills reaction when the baby is born is what sells me on this, I feel its her no longer sensing Clive and knowing he's gone.
I haven’t played GoW, but both CDPR games - Witcher 3 (no game has reached its levels when it comes to side quests) and Cyberpunk - do side quests the way they should be done. And that’s mainly because the context and writing is strong. Like I’m sure you could dumb down a lot of W3s side quests to talk to A or kill B but there’s so much more nuance to it - little stories that build the world, culture and characters presented. RDR2 is also a good example - I have many issues with the basic gameplay - but I think it’s side quest’s served to flesh out the games word from what I remember.
Now from what I read GoWRangarok does this well but I’m yet to play it. Bottom line is that most games aren’t excellently written and hence you’re basically just fetching A or just killing B without the contextual relevance adding weight to those tasks.
How is everyone getting on with this? I completed it a bit back and now summoning the energy to do a platinum run. Am seeing a few mixed opinions on the game with some really loving it and some quite critical.
Almost finished ng+ for fun, then gonna do a FF mode run to see what it's like. Then it'll be time for bg3 so not bothered about platinum unless it's easy.
Just finished it yesterday. You can tell how much work they put into this. The best voice acting, graphics, combats, characters, cutscenes and those fecking brilliant boss battles were a lot of fun. Stellar game really. I don't care for the open world to be honest. I'm completely burnt out on them so I just played the story. The ending boss fight was insane. It has to be a 10/10 for me.
See the post on here I never thought of. I actually like the idea of Joshua being alive as Clive gave him the last of his strength. As a shield would. I knew it wasmt going to have a happy ending but bittersweet. 15's ending made me fecking emotional
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26 hours in and discovered my the first annoying bug. The fact that it's taken this long for a mildly annoying bug to occur is a real credit to the developers. One of the beasts that I'm hunting has evaded twice and reset both times so I'm reloading on pots and going to make sure I keep it in the same place it initially engaged me.
That beach scene with Jill.
The game really comes into its own when you get more eikons and can vary it up a bit. I think some of the Eikon battles though despite looking fantastic can get a bit boring. The titan one for example was way too long.
Nearly finished it. I like it, but it could've been a lot better. Square doesn't know how to design open spaces. The environments look pretty, but they're barely interactive and full of invicible walls. It also should've been more difficult and have more meaningful equipment choices than, here take this, the numbers are a little higher and that's all.
Whinging aside, I loved it though. Except Jill, my God, the 1920's called they want their gender roles back.
Whinging aside, I loved it though. Except Jill, my God, the 1920's called they want their gender roles back.