German Football 22/23 | 2. Bundesliga returns | Hamburg vs Schalke 20:30 |

[Blackwidow]

While I agree, I also think that this doesn't really matter for most of their Bundesliga games. Remember, Pep played Thiago as the lone DM in his 4141.
And I also believe that Mazraoui (while not being as much a 3rd CB as Pavard basically is) can play conservative. So expect the asymmetric shift, with Davies pushing forward, to continue.

Or Nagelsman plays 3 at the back and it is a pointless exercise anyways.

Neuer
Pavard - de Ligt - Hernandez
Mazraoui - Kimmich - Goretzka - Davies
Coman - Gnabry - Mané

Every year again I see lineups without Müller - at the end of the season he is one with the most minutes who started every match but one or two when he is rested when he was available...

It does not balance it more if Müller is out and therefore Goretzka or Kimmich play much more offensively and the pressing does not function like it does with him.

Müller - when you substract the assists for Lewy from him - has had still as much assists as Gnabry, Mane and Coman in the league together.

 

[2ndTouch]

But against esteemed wide attackers like Donyell Malen or in the CL I could see it running into problems.

Yes, yes. Drawing up a working Malen solution is among the biggest and toughest challenges Nagelsmann has ever faced.

 

[HerrLeinad]

While I wholehartedly agree with what you wrote, Bayern might just need the money from a Pavard-sale.

Even if you look just at the balance of the current transfer period our net spent isn't that high (De Ligt included):

In:
De Ligt ~80m
Mane ~32
Gravenberch ~19m
Mazraoui 0

Total in: 131m €

Out:
Lewandowski 45m
Roca ~12m
Richards ~8,5
Mai ~1,6

Total out: 67,1 €

Total net spent: ~63,9m €

Before COVID Bayern was able to handle a net spent of around 80-100m € and that was with less TV income from the CL (the new CL deal that has been in effect since then brings in quite a bit more, not to mention the normal revenue growth).

So we could probably sign Laimer and Tel and still be fine without ANY additional sales and "fine" for Bayern means still making a profit.

That means we only "need" to sell Pavard if we want to make another big signing OR if we think he is just not needed.

We also need to keep in mind that there are a few other players which could still be sold (C. Richards, Sabitzer, Sarr, Nianzou, Zirkzee).

 

[Blackwidow]

Yes, yes. Drawing up a working Malen solution is among the biggest and toughest challenges Nagelsmann has ever faced.

Especially if he watched Stanisic take care of Mbappe and later Coman in the Croatia-France match... - I had to mention that as somehow everybody seems to forget him... You need a Croatian to win the CL...

Bayern has different options for different situation

 

[do.ob]

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Poor guy.

 

[Red the Bear]

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Poor guy.

Could be worse, he could have been french!
I have no fecking idea why I just made this joke.

 

[Acrobat7]

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Poor guy.

This is just a ploy from Leipzig to make Bayern pay more for Laimer.

But yes, Goretzka is starting to look a bit like Tolisso. Injury-wise, not ability -wise.

 

[do.ob]

This is just a ploy from Leipzig to make Bayern pay more for Laimer.

But yes, Goretzka is starting to look a bit like Tolisso. Injury-wise, not ability -wise.

The last three seasons he played 1500, 1700 and 1400 minutes in the league. It seems that Bayern might have to start treating him like a luxury player, rather than an integral part of their plans. I guess the signing of Gravenberch and potentially Laimer are already aimed in that direction.

 

[Chief123]

How did Upamecano get on last season? He was the talk of the town last summer. I remember him getting more hype than his team mate Konate at the time. Konate has looked impressive so far.

 

[Red the Bear]

How did Upamecano get on last season? He was the talk of the town last summer. I remember him getting more hype than his team mate Konate at the time. Konate has looked impressive so far.

He's been ok.
But just that, nothing more, he still has some ways to go before being a very solid defender.

 

[PedroMendez]

I like de Ligt as player, but now I am really worried, we end up playing with a back3/5 permanently. I am not a fan.

 

[Chief123]

He's been ok.
But just that, nothing more, he still has some ways to go before being a very solid defender.

Ah ok. I remember ESPN talking about him last summer saying he’ll be the best defender in the world in a few years. I always fancied Konate over him though. Shame he went to TooWindyPool though.

 

[do.ob]

I like de Ligt as player, but now I am really worried, we end up playing with a back3/5 permanently. I am not a fan.

Isn't the Mazraoui signing, potentially replacing the hybrid player Pavard with a much more attacking option, the much bigger worry in that regard? De Ligt by himself just means the club replaced Süle and distrust Upamecano / Nianzou.

 

[Red the Bear]

Ah ok. I remember ESPN talking about him last summer saying he’ll be the best defender in the world in a few years. I always fancied Konate over him though. Shame he went to TooWindyPool though.

I doubt he'll ever become the best defender in the world but he has the potential to be a very good one, still have no idea how he develops.

On konate, yeah , he was one of the bright spots of their losing final against Real fore example, i actually wished we tried for him last summer as I really like the look of him, shame he went to pool.

 

[PedroMendez]

Isn't the Mazraoui signing, potentially replacing the hybrid player Pavard with a much more attacking option, the much bigger worry in that regard? De Ligt by himself just means the club replaced Süle and distrust Upamecano.

I have no idea what kind of player Mazraoui is. I thought, that he is a "normal" right back, who prefers to join the midfield instead of hugging the touchline.
We already played quite a bit with a back3 last season and I hated it. Now we have essentially three CBs, who want to start games. Upa can certainly get benched, but I am not sure that this is the plan. I don't think that anyone has given up on him.
I don't have any fundamental objection to a back3, but it didn't fix any defensive weaknesses, while hardly any player benefitted from it (maybe with the exception of Sane at times). I am a bit worried about Nagelsmann, if he is determined to double down on this.

 

[do.ob]

I have no idea what kind of player Mazraoui is. I thought, that he is a "normal" right back, who prefers to join the midfield instead of hugging the touchline.
We already played quite a bit with a back3 last season and I hated it. Now we have essentially three CBs, who want to start games. Upa can certainly get benched, but I am not sure that this is the plan. I don't think that anyone has given up on him.
I don't have any fundamental objection to a back3, but it didn't fix any defensive weaknesses, while hardly any player benefitted from it (maybe with the exception of Sane at times). I am a bit worried about Nagelsmann, if he is determined to double down on this.

I wouldn't call myself an expert on the topic either, but my impression is that Mazraoui's strengths and instinct firmly lies in attack, which with Davies on the other side, would make a back three seem more likely. On the other hand Bayern also seems to be going for a second CM signing and another striker in addition to Mane, so maybe there isn't one distinct setup that Nagelsmann has in mind and they just plan to cover every eventuality that he might come up with during the season.

Despair.

 

[2ndTouch]

Despair.

Phew, what a relief. Couldn't think of the BVB youtube channel without Jule. He's your supastar, have some respect.

 

[do.ob]

Phew, what a relief. Couldn't think of the BVB youtube channel without Jule. He's your supastar, have some respect.

You've made me check the content and as far as I can tell the pairings this season are Öz/Can, Kobel/Sülinho, Adeyemi/Schlotterbeck and Bellingham/Reyna. Brandt is more or less entirely absent.

 

[PedroMendez]

I wouldn't call myself an expert on the topic either, but my impression is that Mazraoui's strengths and instinct firmly lies in attack, which with Davies on the other side, would make a back three seem more likely. On the other hand Bayern also seems to be going for a second CM signing and another striker in addition to Mane, so maybe there isn't one distinct setup that Nagelsmann has in mind and they just plan to cover every eventuality that he might come up with during the season.

In theory it sounds good, but it didn't convince me last season. While Upa made a comical amount of errors, the general instability wasn't caused by any individual. The three CBs often had to defend the whole width of the pitch against 2-3 attackers, while the rest of the team was bypassed and too far away. They had way too much ground to cover and consequently there was too much distance between the players. At least in my opinion the shape of the team is a bit more solid, when playing with a back4. I have still doubts about our midfield, especially about the players who play next to Kimmich, but switching to a back3 doesn't fix that problem. The team needs a second player, who is aware of his own defensive positioning. Most of the players, who play next to Kimmich are good at pressing forward, but suck at positioning/providing safety. On top of that having a second player, who is a competent passer would help to build up from the back. What I am trying to say is, that Bayern should buy Frenkie or clone Kimmich.

 

[do.ob]

In theory it sounds good, but it didn't convince me last season. While Upa made a comical amount of errors, the general instability wasn't caused by any individual. The three CBs often had to defend the whole width of the pitch against 2-3 attackers, while the rest of the team was bypassed and too far away. They had way too much ground to cover and consequently there was too much distance between the players. At least in my opinion the shape of the team is a bit more solid, when playing with a back4. I have still doubts about our midfield, especially about the players who play next to Kimmich, but switching to a back3 doesn't fix that problem. The team needs a second player, who is aware of his own defensive positioning. Most of the players, who play next to Kimmich are good at pressing forward, but suck at positioning/providing safety. On top of that having a second player, who is a competent passer would help to build up from the back. What I am trying to say is, that Bayern should buy Frenkie or clone Kimmich.

The caf meltdown alone would make that worth it

I think in the end we just have to wait and see what Nagelsmann comes up with. When your squad is as good as Bayern's there usually isn't just the one correct approach and a lot will depend on balancing different factors against each other.

 

[2ndTouch]

You've made me check the content and as far as I can tell the pairings this season are Öz/Can, Kobel/*beep*, Adeyemi/Schlotterbeck and Bellingham/Reyna. Brandt is more or less entirely absent.

The season hasn't even truly started yet. Think of these guys as being appetizers for the main act.

 

[do.ob]

The season hasn't even truly started yet. Think of these guys as being appetizers for the main act.

I can already tell that Kobelinho are a match made in heaven and will drive social media expansion this year.

 

[2ndTouch]

I can already tell that Kobelinho are a match made in heaven and will drive social media expansion this year.

There certainly is potential for a series of Burger eating contests. Can someone outwhopper Niklas?

 

[do.ob]

The game you've all been waiting for:

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There certainly is potential for a series of Burger eating contests. Can someone outwhopper Niklas?

Talk like that is why you lost the mountain that moves.

 

[Hansi Fick]

It took a couple of months to sink in, but now I feel that finally I fully comprehend, and appreciate, the fact that BVB sacked their much hyped and highly rated managerial conquest in Marco Rose, the next big thing, whom they were so proud of, after one season and replaced him again with the mediocre interim predecessor nobody who almost had them crashing out of top 4 the season before

God, this is going to be one trainwreck of a season for them. And I'll love every single minute of it.

 

[uamini]

So Sebastien Haller just got diagnosed with a tumor in his testicles, a few days after Hertha's Richter got diagnosed with the same thing..weird coincidence.
Hope they both make a speedy recovery..
Obviously this makes any talk about sports a bit irrelevant but I suppose this might completely derail what Dortmund was trying to achieve this season.

 

[WeePat]

Shocking news. Wish him an easy and speedy recovery.

 

[kaiser1]

I see too many people that act like Mazraoui is a nailed on starter. I do rate him but Pavard is no scrub, not to mention that Mazraoui has had quite a few injuries in the last few years.
So there is really no reason to sell Pavard, we would lose a very flexible player that might even be a better option as RB if we want to play more defensive considering the rest of the team and our very attacking focused style. On top of that he is also a very good option if Nagelsmann does want to go for 3ATB.
There would need to be an extremely good offer or else it's just weakening our squad strength too much.

We will sell C. Richards and imo Nianzou is the player who needs to be sold/loaned. His (limited) performances have been so bad overall that I have no hope of him suddenly being a viable option but he obviously needs match time to develop.

If we sell Nianzou, But Pavard wants to be guaranteed a shirt and that will not happen with Mazroui and Deligt

 

[Blackwidow]

You all forget Stanisic. He might be the more defensive fullback solution that gives more balance with an offensive Davies on the left...

 

[sglowrider]

So Sebastien Haller just got diagnosed with a tumor in his testicles, a few days after Hertha's Richter got diagnosed with the same thing..weird coincidence.
Hope they both make a speedy recovery..
Obviously this makes any talk about sports a bit irrelevant but I suppose this might completely derail what Dortmund was trying to achieve this season.

I am really surprised they didn't do any of these cancer marker tests at his Dortmund medicals before the transfer was completed..

 

[do.ob]

So Sebastien Haller just got diagnosed with a tumor in his testicles, a few days after Hertha's Richter got diagnosed with the same thing..weird coincidence.
Hope they both make a speedy recovery..
Obviously this makes any talk about sports a bit irrelevant but I suppose this might completely derail what Dortmund was trying to achieve this season.

I wasn't aware that Richter had it, too. That's what always bothers me a little bit, most people can have the most cruel misfortune and "no one" gives a feck, apparently even within the microcosm Bundesliga, but if they play for the right club (or starred in the right movie, etc), then "everyone" brings out thoughts and prayers.

What this means for Dortmund's season is hard to tell. I don't want to speculate on Haller's personal fate, so I'll just say that he is obviously seen as an integral part of the plan and considering his age probably also has/d the expectation of a short term impact. So from that point of view his absence is indeed derailing. On the other hand Dortmund have a few too many "strikers" in the squad, Malen, Adeyemi, Moukoko, even Reus had the occasional good game there, so Terzic still has some options for improvisation.

Looking a bit at the bigger picture, Timo Baumgartl, Marco Richter and Sebastien Haller are three cases of testicular cancer in Bundesliga this year alone. A couple of years ago Marco Russ had it, too. Makes you wonder if it's coincidence.

 

[stefan92]

Looking a bit at the bigger picture, Timo Baumgartl, Marco Richter and Sebastien Haller are three cases of testicular cancer in Bundesliga this year alone. A couple of years ago Marco Russ had it, too. Makes you wonder if it's coincidence.

As this is the most common cancer in this age group I don't think it's statistically significant. About a quarter to half a case a year is to be expected for a professional league if I calculated it right.

 

[uamini]

I am really surprised they didn't do any of these cancer market tests at his Dortmund medicals before the transfer was completed..

Apparently cancer is not being checked, the medicals are only meant to determine whether or not you're able to play professional sports.

 

[do.ob]

Some good news for Richter and Hertha at least:

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[strongwalker]

Apparently cancer is not being checked, the medicals are only meant to determine whether or not you're able to play professional sports.

So basically ligaments and veneric diseases

 

[do.ob]

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[stefan92]

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RIP

Truly a great player and a great man as well. Sad that he didn't see his beloved HSV return to the first league before his death.

 

[do.ob]

RIP

Truly a great player and a great man as well. Sad that he didn't see his beloved HSV return to the first league before his death.

Yes, Germany had many great footballers, but as far as I'm aware he stood out among them as a symbol of integrity and humility.

 

[do.ob]

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Big test for Dortmund coming up. If Villarreal can't stop them I don't see which German team could hope to.

 

[2ndTouch]

Big test for Dortmund coming up. If Villarreal can't stop them I don't see which German team could hope to.

Wonder if they have a solid plan to contain Malen