German Football 22/23 | 2. Bundesliga returns | Hamburg vs Schalke 20:30 |

[do.ob]

Not a wholly new system but still risky. Probably takes a bit of time and confirmation until coaches in the Bundesliga adapt to it.

Also, I believe that Bundesliga coaches tend to focus less on build up than transitional elements and pressing so they might also be more likely to adapt innovations in that part of the game than a new and risky build up pattern. In general I noticed that Bundesliga 2 seems to put a heavier emphasis on build up. With Kiel, Bremen, Magdeburg and Hamburg there have been at least four examples of that in recent years while I can't really think of something similar in the Bundesliga bar Nagelsmann.

Sure, it's not really something for the poor clubs to try, but there have always been a few coaches in whose system it would fit, Favre, Bosz, Tuchel, Nagelsmann being obvious candidates. It's not an entirely new or wild idea either, it's more like the obvious next step in the evolution of the game.

I'd say all of them belong to the category "WTF".

You have to look at the context of the situation. Dortmund are probably assuming/hoping that Haller will be back in 2023 at the latest, so they would want someone for half a year, who doesn't cost a lot of money. They also already have three "nimble" strikers in Adeyemi, Malen and Moukoko, so they are looking for a big fella to complement them.

Dzeko and Cavani are just that, they are experienced strikers with a physical presence. Icardi and Milik maybe a bit less so, but still more of a classical 9 than what Dortmund have without Haller and they bring a bit of quality. Icardi appears to be an idiot, but that probably wouldn't be a huge deal if they loaned him for 6-12 months, especially with a world cup to play for. Jhon Cordoba is another name I have read, who would probably also make sense, especially if they can get him for free, since he's still under contract hat Krasnodar.

 

[Zehner]

Sure, it's not really something for the poor clubs to try, but there have always been a few coaches in whose system it would fit, Favre, Bosz, Tuchel, Nagelsmann being obvious candidates. It's not an entirely new or wild idea either, it's more like the obvious next step in the evolution of the game.

Tuchel has left the league quite some time ago, Favre is also more about transitions and Bosz was actually quite conservative about committing full backs to attack, probably because it left his team prone to counters (especially with rather slow full backs like Bender, Sinkgraven, Wendell or Weiser). So I wouldn't expect him to adapt a new build up pattern that's risky. I don't think he was particularly innovative but more traditionalist in terms of positional play. Which was one of the reasons the team became so dull in the absence of Brandt and later on Havertz.

 

[uamini]

Jhon Cordoba is another name I have read, who would probably also make sense, especially if they can get him for free, since he's still under contract hat Krasnodar.

Krasnodar still owe money to Hertha for that transfer though so that might mess things up.
Also Cordoba is a decent player but he's not that much of a scorer...I heard Dortmund is more interested in a typical poacher so then someone like Piatek would actually make sense since being a clinical finisher is the one thing he's good at.
One would probably expect Dortmund to go for bigger names but as you said they might want a cheap short-term option instead and he would fit that bill..

 

[do.ob]

Krasnodar still owe money to Hertha for that transfer though so that might mess things up.
Also Cordoba is a decent player but he's not that much of a scorer...I heard Dortmund is more interested in a typical poacher so then someone like Piatek would actually make sense since being a clinical finisher is the one thing he's good at.
One would probably expect Dortmund to go for bigger names but as you said they might want a cheap short-term option instead and he would fit that bill..

As far as I know players from Russian or Ukrainian clubs can unilaterally put their contracts on hold for the season, so whatever Krasnodar may owe is of no concern to Cordoba or Dortmund. Hertha themselves seem quite happy to make use of that as far as I can tell.

I don't think a poacher would help Dortmund at all, Malen, Adeyemi and to perhaps a lesser degree Reus and Moukoko are supposed to deliver that quality. I think it's more about having a physical and/or aerial presence in the box.

Tuchel has left the league quite some time ago, Favre is also more about transitions and Bosz was actually quite conservative about committing full backs to attack, probably because it left his team prone to counters (especially with rather slow full backs like Bender, Sinkgraven, Wendell or Weiser). So I wouldn't expect him to adapt a new build up pattern that's risky. I don't think he was particularly innovative but more traditionalist in terms of positional play. Which was one of the reasons the team became so dull in the absence of Brandt and later on Havertz.

Risk aversion is the obvious answer. But I think for some coaches it would be a natural consideration, given their football. Especially Favre, who I wouldn't call transition based at all: if there's a counter attack to be had he wants to take it, but otherwise he wants to methodically build up and circulate until there's an opening, even if it bores everyone to death. Aggressive pressing isn't really his thing either.

 

[PedroMendez]

You have to look at the context of the situation. Dortmund are probably assuming/hoping that Haller will be back in 2023 at the latest, so they would want someone for half a year, who doesn't cost a lot of money. They also already have three "nimble" strikers in Adeyemi, Malen and Moukoko, so they are looking for a big fella to complement them.

Dzeko and Cavani are just that, they are experienced strikers with a physical presence. Icardi and Milik maybe a bit less so, but still more of a classical 9 than what Dortmund have without Haller and they bring a bit of quality. Icardi appears to be an idiot, but that probably wouldn't be a huge deal if they loaned him for 6-12 months, especially with a world cup to play for. Jhon Cordoba is another name I have read, who would probably also make sense, especially if they can get him for free, since he's still under contract hat Krasnodar.

Non of these players enough is good and non of these players offer what Haller is supposed to offer. I like Haller; he is a striker who frequently plays well even if he doesn't score. He contributes a lot to the team and has the potential to make players around him better. That being said, all the positives aside, there is a reason why he played for Frankfurt, WestHam and Ajax. He isn't the kind of player Dortmund should build everything around. He is a very function player and good addition, not the star of the show. He shouldn't need some urgent half-arsed replacement.

Icardi is a shitty version of pippo inzaghi. He is the anti-haller in the sense, that doesn't contribute anything but poaching. Cavani was a great player, but the amount of injuries + his strong preference to play for Uruguay means that he is extremely unreliable. Piantek had at best one good season and is also more of a poacher. Not good enough. The only one I would "kind of" understand is a short-term loan of Dzeko.
Maybe I am a bit to harsh and just don't understand the strategy, but Dortmund's recent transfer are not making any sense at all and its the first time since Klopp lifted the club, that I could see you dropping out of the CL. Loaning or even worse buying any of these players feels like another step in the wrong direction. (all of this is probably a bit over the top and too dramatic)

 

[do.ob]

Non of these players enough is good and non of these players offer what Haller is supposed to offer. I like Haller; he is a striker who frequently plays well even if he doesn't score. He contributes a lot to the team and has the potential to make players around him better. That being said, all the positives aside, there is a reason why he played for Frankfurt, WestHam and Ajax. He isn't the kind of player Dortmund should build everything around. He is a very function player and good addition, not the star of the show. He shouldn't need some urgent half-arsed replacement.

Icardi is a shitty version of pippo inzaghi. He is the anti-haller in the sense, that doesn't contribute anything but poaching. Cavani was a great player, but the amount of injuries + his strong preference to play for Uruguay means that he is extremely unreliable. Piantek had at best one good season and is also more of a poacher. Not good enough. The only one I would "kind of" understand is a short-term loan of Dzeko.
Maybe I am a bit to harsh and just don't understand the strategy, but Dortmund's recent transfer are not making any sense at all and its the first time since Klopp lifted the club, that I could see you dropping out of the CL. Loaning or even worse buying any of these players feels like another step in the wrong direction. (all of this is probably a bit over the top and too dramatic)

I don't entirely disagree with you, I wouldn't have a great feeling about Milik or Icardi either and Piatek has to be a desperate "leak" by Hertha. But I don't think wanting to have a classical no9 at your disposal means "building the team around Haller", it just means the club wants to have a bigger spectrum upfront.
I think Dzeko would look like a smart signing on paper, if Inter aren't asking for too much. Cavani would probably be much more of a role player and his fitness issues would make this a real gamble, but if the finances reflect that, then it could make sense, too.

There are a few question marks about the squad and Terzic in particular. Haller's illness wasn't just catastrophic news for him either. There's just so much that remains to be seen that things could go either way, but if they go sideways the club will have to take some blame for spending €60m on Adeyemi and Malen, but nothing on proper wide players.

But I think the other signings all make sense and I find it hard to fault the club for signing defensive players after conceding 50 goals.

 

[ForEverEleven]

Pohjanpalo might still be available if Dortmund act quick.

 

[Hansi Fick]

Maybe we can interest them in a certain Eric-Maxim Choupo-Moting?

 

[do.ob]

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Probably just not a very meaningful prediction, right? I mean Leverkusen with title odds? Come on..
But what caught my eye is how similar the teams from Stuttgart to Augsburg and Union to Wolfsburg are.

 

[2ndTouch]

Maybe we can interest them in a certain Eric-Maxim Choupo-Moting?

And why would we part with him exactly?

 

[Hansi Fick]

And why would we part with him exactly?

Because we need to have better players than him, even on the bench.

 

[2ndTouch]

Because we need to have better players than him, even on the bench.

For a bench player, his stats are really good. He also scored 2 goals in an important CL QF, something our departed superstar was never able to pull off.

 

[Hansi Fick]

For a bench player, his stats are really good. He also scored 2 goals in an important CL QF, something our departed superstar was never able to pull off.

Yeah guess he's alright.

As for the last point, we all know Lewandowski was basically holding us back all these years. Good riddance, free at last!

 

[Zehner]

As far as I know players from Russian or Ukrainian clubs can unilaterally put their contracts on hold for the season, so whatever Krasnodar may owe is of no concern to Cordoba or Dortmund. Hertha themselves seem quite happy to make use of that as far as I can tell.

I don't think a poacher would help Dortmund at all, Malen, Adeyemi and to perhaps a lesser degree Reus and Moukoko are supposed to deliver that quality. I think it's more about having a physical and/or aerial presence in the box.



Risk aversion is the obvious answer. But I think for some coaches it would be a natural consideration, given their football. Especially Favre, who I wouldn't call transition based at all: if there's a counter attack to be had he wants to take it, but otherwise he wants to methodically build up and circulate until there's an opening, even if it bores everyone to death. Aggressive pressing isn't really his thing either.

Yes, Favre's system revolves around high percentage shots both in defense and attack. He for example allows many shots in his own box, instructing his defenders to block the shot instead of going for the tackle or pressure. But to do that, you can't commit too many players to attack because you need numerical superiority when you lose possession.

Moreover, I think for many Bundesliga teams this build up pattern isn't that important because opponents rarely play a high line against them. Against Bayern for instance, most teams let them do what they want in their own half. Of course it still has benefits but it is most effective when the opponent tries to press you.

 

[do.ob]

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Another day another set of candidates.

 

[do.ob]

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UEFA allows German clubs to use standing areas in their competitions. Amazing news for a lot of clubs, unfortunate for Hertha fans, who may lose the opportunity to watch European football at their stadium.

 

[do.ob]

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Sounds like he's either sick or getting canceled?! @stefan92

Fans must be over the moon.

 

[Tacitus56AD]

Seems like Jens Lehmann has decided to go into timber sports after his career in football.

 

[stefan92]

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Sounds like he's either sick or getting canceled?! @stefan92

Fans must be over the moon.

Well... as kicker writes he isn't any longer CEO of the Hannover 96 Management GmbH. He still is the sports director of the actual team (Hannover 96 GmbH & Co KGaA).

This sounds more like the next episode of our power struggles and in no way like a reason to celebrate.

 

[do.ob]

Well... as kicker writes he isn't any longer CEO of the Hannover 96 Management GmbH. He still is the sports director of the actual team (Hannover 96 GmbH & Co KGaA).

This sounds more like the next episode of our power struggles and in no way like a reason to celebrate.

Isn't the Management GmbH the "Komplementär" of the KGaA? Meaning if he's out of the former he's probably also out of the other?

 

[stefan92]

Isn't the Management GmbH the "Komplementär" of the KGaA? Meaning if he's out of the former he's probably also out of the other?

That likely depends on who will be his successor in the Management GmbH and why he is really gone. Right now I don't think there is a definitive answer to your question.

 

[Acrobat7]

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Another day another set of candidates.

Just do it and sign Popp. What a fantastic striker she is.

 

[SV_Planegg]

Seems like Jens Lehmann has decided to go into timber sports after his career in football.

Onwards and upwards!




For those who missed out on the latest adventure of Jens Lehmann...

Spoiler: Mad Jens - (alleged) Serial Chainsawist

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...0QFnoECAoQAQ&usg=AOvVaw09J-ypVYC9R_yp2RhXTl8H

 

[GhastlyHun]

"Die Mannschaft" is no more
Die Mannschaft, die!

 

[do.ob]

A grave mistake.

 

[Hansi Fick]

Free at last!

 

[do.ob]

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Looks like someone didn't like Pilawa's move and talked to Bild about it.

 

[CookieMonster]

"Die Mannschaft" is no more
Die Mannschaft, die!

People just don't understand Bierhoff's genius and contributions for German football.

Who but Bierhoff has the vision to book such grand hotels as the campo bahia to assure the success of die Mannschaft?

Doubters may say that the players, coach and tactics matter - but Bierhoff knows better. If you want to win a world cup you need a new, exciting marketing campaign and a brand new world class hotel!

 

[2ndTouch]

Onwards and upwards!




For those who missed out on the latest adventure of Jens Lehmann...

Spoiler: Mad Jens - (alleged) Serial Chainsawist

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...0QFnoECAoQAQ&usg=AOvVaw09J-ypVYC9R_yp2RhXTl8H

I've always seen him as an Axe Man, based on his regular gaze, but the Chainsaw doesn't look half bad on him either

 

[do.ob]

Is he still a Hertha board member?

 

[Tacitus56AD]

Is he still a Hertha board member?

No. They axed him.

 

[uamini]

Well, it's that time of the year again...how many Bundesliga teams will make the Hall of Shame this weekend?
I never realized that Werder managed to get kicked out in the first round three seasons in a row a few years ago...that's quite a feat.

 

[do.ob]

Cheeky first round defeat from KSC?

 

[hellhunter]

Cheeky first round defeat from KSC?

Mate...

Yes.

 

[do.ob]

Duisburg and Essen, two cities only separated by a lone Mülheim an der Ruhr, are playing each other next Friday and after Duisburg have apparently set the away contingent at 5'000 tickets, which sold out quickly, they are now concerned of having a "mes que un club" scenario on their hands. So the club has decided to extend the member's only phase of the ticket sale and fans have created a "Zebra fund", where they collect donations to buy up as many tickets as possible, just to get them off the market.


https://rp-online.de/sport/fussball...e-mehr-karten-bekommt-reaktionen_aid-73741969

 

[stefan92]

Duisburg and Essen, two cities only separated by a lone Mülheim an der Ruhr, are playing each other next Friday and after Duisburg have apparently set the away contingent at 5'000 tickets, which sold out quickly, they are now concerned of having a "mes que un club" scenario on their hands. So the club has decided to extend the member's only phase of the ticket sale and fans have created a "Zebra fund", where they collect donations to buy up as many tickets as possible, just to get them off the market.


https://rp-online.de/sport/fussball...e-mehr-karten-bekommt-reaktionen_aid-73741969

To give a little more context, Essen is quite a big city and RW Essen just returned to professional football. Just looking at their "hometown potential" they are bigger than any other club in the area (Dortmund, Schalke, Bochum, Duisburg...)

 

[Kasper]

Why is Schick specifically mentioned in the title?

 

[Igor Drefljak]

Why is Schick specifically mentioned in the title?

I think LuckyScout paid DO.OB to do it

 

[2ndTouch]

Why is Schick specifically mentioned in the title?

Look, someone hasn't heard of the 4 Kings, tsktsk

 

[Swarm]

To give a little more context, Essen is quite a big city and RW Essen just returned to professional football. Just looking at their "hometown potential" they are bigger than any other club in the area (Dortmund, Schalke, Bochum, Duisburg...)

Dortmund has more inhabitants than Essen ;-)