Well so far they have restricted him to one great chance, which is impressive enough against a player of his calibre.
German Football 22/23 | 2. Bundesliga returns | Hamburg vs Schalke 20:30 |
- Thread starter do.ob
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Dortmund seem to have the sheer defensive problems as usual
I am just looking at the starting line up and I am in awe. No proper dm/cm. Little quality out wide. No one can really dribble. No proper CF, who can lead the line. But they have Malen, Adeyemi, Reus and Brandt.
They should buy Werner to complete their collection of forwards.
Pretty sure it will happen. Werner wants out, Tuchel wants Werner out, and there is a vacancy @die Schwarz-Gelben. A prolific and charismatic German striker who's still to reach his peak? That's an irresistable proposition for Aki, for sure. Guess it's gonna be some loan with a 35.40m obligation to buy next year. Can't wait to see him in their kitThey should buy Werner to complete their collection of forwards.
I think we are all aware why Dortmund didn't play with a more classical no9.
That being said I thought the game was somewhat encouraging in the first half, the idea to attack the channels with quick players actually worked quite well, leading to numerous 1on1s with the keeper, the team had the ball plenty around Villarreal's third, pressing created a bunch of turnovers and the opposition, on the other hand they gave away two fairly easy counter attacks. Second half was a bit shit. Since it's pre season with a new coach and plenty of new players and things were neither amazing nor terrible I don't think this game says a whole lot.
That being said I thought the game was somewhat encouraging in the first half, the idea to attack the channels with quick players actually worked quite well, leading to numerous 1on1s with the keeper, the team had the ball plenty around Villarreal's third, pressing created a bunch of turnovers and the opposition, on the other hand they gave away two fairly easy counter attacks. Second half was a bit shit. Since it's pre season with a new coach and plenty of new players and things were neither amazing nor terrible I don't think this game says a whole lot.
They have the same issues year after year. This defence with Meunier, Hummels and Süle is beyond slow. Getting caught out again and again. It will be targeted all season long even now they look like they can't score any goals.I am just looking at the starting line up and I am in awe. No proper dm/cm. Little quality out wide. No one can really dribble. No proper CF, who can lead the line. But they have Malen, Adeyemi, Reus and Brandt.
They should buy Werner to complete their collection of forwards.
Süle isn't slow and played in a high line in Munich. CBs are the least of their worries.
Their fullbacks are dodgy when it comes to defending. Additionally they don't have a proper CM since Axel Witsel declined. Thats an issue for a long time now. Weigl had one really strong season as DM (either 15/16 or 16/17, I don't remember), but couldn't replicate his performances + Gündogan leaving, left a massive hole in the squad. Dahoud, who is still around, never kicked on. Witsel joined them and managed to fill the gap for a while, but after ~2 years, he declined pretty substantially. Bellingham is a great talent, but more offensive minded and Emre Can is shit. Maybe Özcan can save them, but I don't really know him.
I actually think their squad is fine. They have quality in almost every position and great talents with potential to become world clas coming through, such as Adeyemi, Reyna, Moukoko, Bellingham and Bynoe-Gittens. The team has pace, quality on the ball and a football brain. It will be interesting to see how they utilize it.
The only thing that really baffles me is that they still haven't signed a class RB. Sure, Raum would have been great as well since Guerreiro wasn't that good last season, but it was clear how important Hakimi was to them and to this date they haven't replaced him. Morey is very talented but after this horror injury, it is a real gamble to trust him to solve their problems there. Maybe it's a also sunk cost effect with Meunier. I recently read he was one of their top earners which is pretty hillariouy to be honest.
That's by the way the one thing I'd criticize at their transfer strategy. They burned lots of money by prioritizing experience over quality in some cases.
The only thing that really baffles me is that they still haven't signed a class RB. Sure, Raum would have been great as well since Guerreiro wasn't that good last season, but it was clear how important Hakimi was to them and to this date they haven't replaced him. Morey is very talented but after this horror injury, it is a real gamble to trust him to solve their problems there. Maybe it's a also sunk cost effect with Meunier. I recently read he was one of their top earners which is pretty hillariouy to be honest.
That's by the way the one thing I'd criticize at their transfer strategy. They burned lots of money by prioritizing experience over quality in some cases.
While I agree that Dortmund's squad is not bad at all they are IMO missing quality wing play. Well, that an FBs...
And Moukoko, Adeyemi, Malen, Haller are a bit like different age versions of a similar player.
The "problem" with Süle has always been that he often just doesn't use his physical gifts properly. Too many times he just strolls around the field and is mentally(!) slow because he simply doesn't anticipate situations. In that area he is the opposite of a (younger) Hummels, a player who was excellent at that and could thus compensate for his lack of speed. With Süle you always feel like he needs a kick up his butt to properly put his quality on the field and that can be frustrating and is certainly what frustrated our leadership.
You think so? I believe the only ones who are similar at Adeyemi and Malen as both are dynamic striker/winger hybrids who are strong in one on ones. Moukoko is IMO an Aguero or maybe Lautaro type of striker while Haller is a Lewandowski or Benzema type (only lesser of course). And thenbthere's also Bynoe-Gittens who is a bit similar to Sancho. Add to that Reus, Reyna, Brandt anf Hazard and you have lots of variety in the attack. Playmaking, goal threat, pace, technique, long shots.. it is all there. The only thjng that's missing is crossing quality which I believe is why they were after Raum.
For me the next season will be about how they set up. Terzic surely has a wide arsenal of attacking options to pick from, at least once Haller is back.
I agree they don't have a good midfield but they have had problems with their highline for years it's nothing new. This defense will have huge problems again this season. Fullbacks will have problems and it showed yesterday Vs Villarreal where they constantly found spaces out wide. Hope I am wrong here but Bayern will walk this again.
Dortmund were never looking like title contenders, given the rebuild they are triyng to do and Bayern buying half the Dutch team certinaly hasn't helped things on paper.. That's not the benchmark for this season.
I think the obvious weakness of the squad is that it's light in wide areas. Other than that it's a collection of quite talented players, of which quite a few have certain flaws. So to me it's quite pointless to discuss individual players, because none of them will make or break things by themselves (other than Julian Brandt, occasionally). In the end it all comes down to whether Terzic can find some form of balance.
I agree this squad lacks speed and trickery.
If he can repeat his late Cologne performances he can, the question is only how fast he'll be integrated from my point of view. He excelled in a system which is probably the most demanding for a DM (playing the lone DM in a highly attacking 4-1-3-2 system) so he has experience and proven quality covering for a bunch of attacking players with little support in deep positions. Something which is similar to Dortmund's style of play in many cases.
So what happened in the #H96SCSP match yesterday? I only just saw the highlights, Jude Bellingham must have enjoyed watching them.
Yeah, that penalty didn't really make sense, though I haven't watched 342 different slow-motion replays.
Btw, do you think it makes sense to promote Bellingham to third captain?
Given the injury history (and the possible decline in playing ability) of Hummels and Reus, I can very well imagine that he will be on the pitch quite often with the armband. And in the games in which I have seen him, he did not appear as captain material. Simply too impulsive.
I don't think it's a big deal either way: a captaincy doesn't begin and end with the referee's whistle. I imagine for professional footballers the work they do outside of the games is more important anyway. Reus and Hummels can do that even if they don't happen to play.
Since Reus and Hummels are heading towards the end of the career there may also be a bit of a risk of a disconnect with the younger generation (of which Dortmund always have plenty of). I know Hummel's - being a model professional - is doing his best to stay up do date by working his way through the influencer scene, but I can still see the point of having one of their own as a conduit between old players/coaches and the youngsters.
Bellingham calling Schulz flat out "shit" was of course toxic behaviour, but in general I don't think we can judge captains from the outside. There are just too many different ways to successfully lead a team and too many conversations (well, basically all of them) we aren't privy to. And is being impulsive really a bad thing per se? Kahn for example was always glorified for being a complete psycho on the pitch. I remember overhearing Kehl once shouting at a team mate to always stop laughing like an idiot. Dortmund's typical problem is naivety and a lack of focus in certain games. Let's pick a completely random example and say Julian Brandt is having one of his rare bad days, where he's giving the ball away during build up and killing off precious counter attacks. Would it necessarily be so bad if someone told him to pull it together? That despite his best efforts at delusion he's in fact not the reincarnation of Ronaldinho?
Another factor could also be that the club sees this as a sign of appreciation that may entice him to stay a bit longer.
Indeed puzzling why Bellingham isn't loudly on the case - clearly Zwayer was installed to referee this 2. BuLi top game in order to rig the competition for Bayern.
Obviously still holding a grudge over this Weltpokalsiegerbesieger
@do.ob I agree that it makes sense to have a younger player step up in the hierarchy for Dortmund. Bayern does the same with Kimmich and Coman.
I just question the choice of Bellingham. Whenever I watch BVB (granted, it is not that often) he is always looking for a fight, moaning, diving and collecting fouls. He just seems unpleasant but might be one of those players that you love, when they are on your team.
I just question the choice of Bellingham. Whenever I watch BVB (granted, it is not that often) he is always looking for a fight, moaning, diving and collecting fouls. He just seems unpleasant but might be one of those players that you love, when they are on your team.
Oh yes, he's definitely a cnut on the pitch. I'm just saying that doesn't necessarily make him a bad captain for his own team.
Gotcha! The classic Mark van Bommel case.
Looks like we're going to have brilliant head to head race in the 2nd division:
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This season can do one
You have to look at the positives, the season can't get any worse now. It's all upwards from here on..
Second half still to come, mate
You think it's going to be worse than 0:3?
This is getting a bit hilarious now, with Bielefeld falling behind right before half time.
They are faking the "can a loss be a win scenario" only to concede two more in the last minutes.
Feels like it, yeah
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It's not the first time I've seen a keeper used like this, but it's usually in the second division (#Pollersbeckenbauer), why is that? Are Bundesliga teams just too good at pressing for coaches to use their keepers in such an advanced way?
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Maybe the technical quality of the CBs is better in the first division? If two technically good players can play the same passes as three technically "just ok" players (2 CB+GK) together there is no need to involve the GK that way.
Probably a mix of reasons i the end, but that'so thought I had.
To be honest that doesn't sound convincing to me. Build up is first and foremost about geometry. It's about creating situational numerical superiority that leads to clean passing angles, that make progressive passes relatively safe and easy. That's why it has become so common for the #6 to drop between defenders, to retain that numerical superiority and by that same logic there's always great value in an active goal keeper, because if it's the goal keeper who steps up properly during build up, then you have an "extra" midfielder. And if your CBs can spread wider, that means they have diagonal passing angles into the center (usually much harder to cover than just orthogonal passes) and the attackers who press them have longer distances to cover, which means they get more time on the ball, which means they can pick better passes or even get the time to go past their presser.
If you look at Reimann's pass map there's only two vectors that go (significantly) beyond the halfway line.
Maybe they're just more adventuresome. I mean, it is rare that tactical innovation happens first in first divisions, isn't it? Arguably even Klopp and Guardiola tested their systems in lower leagues before bringing them to the big stage. I imagine most clubs want some "proof of concept" before trusting a new system.
It's not some brand new system that requires overhauling of the squad though. All you need is a GK, who is comfortable on the ball, most better teams have someone like that already. The rest is instructions.
I could see 2nd division clubs having a more daring mind set in general, since it's promotion or bust at the top (4th (maybe even 3rd) place is almost as worthless as 14th place) and with relatively balanced finances being a step ahead of the competition tactically can make all the difference.
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It's like a game of "which one doesn't belong".
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Not a wholly new system but still risky. Probably takes a bit of time and confirmation until coaches in the Bundesliga adapt to it.
Also, I believe that Bundesliga coaches tend to focus less on build up than transitional elements and pressing so they might also be more likely to adapt innovations in that part of the game than a new and risky build up pattern. In general I noticed that Bundesliga 2 seems to put a heavier emphasis on build up. With Kiel, Bremen, Magdeburg and Hamburg there have been at least four examples of that in recent years while I can't really think of something similar in the Bundesliga bar Nagelsmann.
I'd say all of them belong to the category "WTF".
Piontek sounds about right, both as winner of the game of who doesn't belong, and as winner of the game of who will BVB sign
I‘d pay money to watch the Icardi soap opera unfold at Dortmund. Wanda looking for nice houses in Dortmund…