German football is turd

TwoSheds

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When are we going to accept this truth? Bayern are the best team in world football, let's be clear about that. Dortmund and Leipzig are ok. The rest of the league is shit and make Dortmund and Leipzig look good. The French league is stronger than the German league, at what point does this become universally accepted?

There are lots of good players from the German league, but not many top class ones. Werner, Havertz, Brandt, Draxler, Upamecano, Konaté, Suele, Hummels etc - all the ones that got hyped, some of them are top 4 quality in the UK, but not really title winning quality. Exceptions outside of Bayern would be Haaland, Pulisic and maybe Sancho on a good day. Same goes for their managers outside of Klopp and Flick.
 

VeevaVee

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It’s a travesty that Berlin doesn’t have a better side.
 

RashyForPM

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It is. Bayern are sensational but they wouldn’t win something ludicrous like 7-8 titles in a row if they were an English or Spanish team. I think that just says it all.
 

Pep's Suit

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I agree, it's a terrible league. And last CL Bayern had big advantage in finishing their league so early.
 

Murder on Zidane's Floor

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Must admit been feeling this way ever since the massive online hipster drive to make their league seem amazing. (Coincidentally around the same time BT Sport started showing Bundesliga fixtures and they wanted to push viewing figures).

The reality is, the teams cannot defend or don't bother defending and the league is the most top-heavy of any league in Europe, besides from perhaps Serie A.
 

TwoSheds

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There are 8 better teams in the Prem than Leipzig and Dortmund.
 

Bwuk

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They don't defend.

I wouldn't be surprised if we slapped Leipzig again when we play them. They are so open.
 

Lyricist

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When are we going to accept this truth? Bayern are the best team in world football, let's be clear about that. Dortmund and Leipzig are ok. The rest of the league is shit and make Dortmund and Leipzig look good. The French league is stronger than the German league, at what point does this become universally accepted?

There are lots of good players from the German league, but not many top class ones. Werner, Havertz, Brandt, Draxler, Upamecano, Konaté, Suele, Hummels etc - all the ones that got hyped, some of them are top 4 quality in the UK, but not really title winning quality. Exceptions outside of Bayern would be Haaland, Pulisic and maybe Sancho on a good day. Same goes for their managers outside of Klopp and Flick.
You saying this shows exactly how knowledgeable you are about German football. Sancho started over Pulisic when both were at Dortmund together. Pulisic was never the star player for Dortmund not amongst the top Bundesliga players. Just because he’s finding it easy in the PL he’s suddenly one of Bundesliga’s exceptional players when he never did that much in the Bundesliga?

I’m also wondering what you’re basing this comparison with the French league on when French teams haven’t exactly performed well against Bundesliga Teams recently.

Last but not least, this post of yours is a reaction to United beating Leipzig in one game. So did last season’s performances by British teams in the CL also mean that Ligue 1 is streets ahead of the Premier League. I assume you wouldn’t say so.

Before everyone starts going mad again because German posters are coming out of their holes to defend the Bundesliga. Please look at the ridiculous topics that are being made on this matter. No wonder people are so defensive.
 

James Peril

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I would say Bayern, then Dortmund, then a long way down to Leipzig, in terms of player material. They are currently leading, but so do Everton so who cares. Leipzig have only played relegation fodder in their first games and look far away from last season with Werner and co. Dortmund have quality and a few huge x-factors, Leipzig have absolutely none of them this year. In terms of England, I think they would struggle to break top 9, and that says everthing. Bayern would win, Dortmund would challenge for 4th - 5th with United and Chelsea, Tottenham.
 

harms

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When are we going to accept this truth? Bayern are the best team in world football, let's be clear about that. Dortmund and Leipzig are ok. The rest of the league is shit and make Dortmund and Leipzig look good. The French league is stronger than the German league, at what point does this become universally accepted?

There are lots of good players from the German league, but not many top class ones. Werner, Havertz, Brandt, Draxler, Upamecano, Konaté, Suele, Hummels etc - all the ones that got hyped, some of them are top 4 quality in the UK, but not really title winning quality. Exceptions outside of Bayern would be Haaland, Pulisic and maybe Sancho on a good day. Same goes for their managers outside of Klopp and Flick.
I like that Pulisic, who got benched for Dortmund, is suddenly a better player than those who outperformed him consistently in Germany. A lot of players that you've mentioned are more than capable of playing in title-winning sides. Firmino has been crucial for Liverpool's rise to the top (before turning a bit shit) & De Bruyne is easily the best player in the league.

Will every hyped out star from Bundesliga end up as a top player? Of course not. Does it mean that the whole league is overrated? Not really, it's rated quite fairly – it's not the best, but it's not that far off Premier League or La Liga (neither of them have been very impressive in the last couple of years).

Is Hummels, 5 times BL winner, CL finalist and a World Cup winner not good enough to start ahead of, say, Morgan, Gomez, Otamendi, Stones etc.?
 

cyberman

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They need to sort out their habits of leaving shit loads of space when a few goals down. They literally give up
 

Piratesoup

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Name them? Because I seem to remember Leipzig having spanked Tottenham just last season.
Let him have his gloating moment after United spanked Leipzig. It's only natural. There's no point to engage in this weird imaginary dick measuring contest.
 

TwoSheds

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Name them? Because I seem to remember Leipzig having spanked Tottenham just last season.
We got spanked by Spurs, we also spanked Leipzig, maybe Spurs are twice as good this year?
 

Lyricist

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You know what, forget it. No point to argue when there’s a circle jerk like this going on on the back of a single game. Especially considering Pulisic is being mentioned as one of only two top players the OP can think of that came from the Bundesliga (again, Pulisic was a useful player and a great prospect for Dortmund, but most of the time he couldn’t even make the starting 11).
 

Piratesoup

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We got spanked by Spurs, we also spanked Leipzig, maybe Spurs are twice as good this year?
Hoffenheim spanked Bayern this season and are thus clearly the best team in the world. Checkmate. /thread please
 

TwoSheds

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I like that Pulisic, who got benched for Dortmund, is suddenly a better player than those who outperformed him consistently in Germany. A lot of players that you've mentioned are more than capable of playing in title-winning sides. Firmino has been crucial for Liverpool's rise to the top (before turning a bit shit) & De Bruyne is easily the best player in the league.

Will every hyped out star from Bundesliga end up as a top player? Of course not. Does it mean that the whole league is overrated? Not really, it's rated quite fairly – it's not the best, but it's not that far off Premier League or La Liga (neither of them have been very impressive in the last couple of years).

Is Hummels, 5 times BL winner, CL finalist and a World Cup winner not good enough to start ahead of, say, Morgan, Gomez, Otamendi, Stones etc.?
The French league is much better than the German league outside of Bayern.
 

krautrøck

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They don't defend.

I wouldn't be surprised if we slapped Leipzig again when we play them. They are so open.
Except for Bayern all German teams have been set-up in a very naive way in Europe these last couple of seasons. Loads of terrible results in the Europa League.
 

Kasper

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Agree wholeheartly. With @TwoSheds arguments I`ll put an UN motion forward tomorrow, so that this becomes finally universally accepted.
 

ROFLUTION

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When are we going to accept this truth? Bayern are the best team in world football, let's be clear about that. Dortmund and Leipzig are ok. The rest of the league is shit and make Dortmund and Leipzig look good. The French league is stronger than the German league, at what point does this become universally accepted?

There are lots of good players from the German league, but not many top class ones. Werner, Havertz, Brandt, Draxler, Upamecano, Konaté, Suele, Hummels etc - all the ones that got hyped, some of them are top 4 quality in the UK, but not really title winning quality. Exceptions outside of Bayern would be Haaland, Pulisic and maybe Sancho on a good day. Same goes for their managers outside of Klopp and Flick.
Uh oh, had the same debate in the Currently Best player in the World thread, as I claimed it was hard to point to Lewandowski when most of his season is a walkover. But.. it is..

That did not go down well. Apparently midtable/bottom german sides are as good as english ones. I just dont see it.
 

TwoSheds

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You know what, forget it. No point to argue when there’s a circle jerk like this going around on the back of a single game. Especially considering Pulisic is being mentioned as one of only two top players the OP can think of that came from the Bundesliga (again, Pulisic was a useful player and a great prospect for Dortmund, but most of the time he couldn’t even make the starting 11).
Pulisic' performances for Dortmund have as little bearing on his ability as Salah's and De Bruyne's performances for Chelsea. He's a top player, just too injury prone.
 

TwoSheds

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Agree wholeheartly. With @TwoSheds arguments I`ll put an UN motion forward tomorrow, so that this becomes finally universally accepted.
Thanks Kasper, much appreciated. Let me know if you need any extra facts about German football to make the case.
 

ForEverEleven

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Let him have his gloating moment after United spanked Leipzig. It's only natural. There's no point to engage in this weird imaginary dick measuring contest.
It´s just so reactionary. Only 3 months ago, we had two CL Semi-Finalists alongside two French teams while all english top teams were swept aside at this point. Leipzig beat an Atletico side that beat the Premier League champions twice. But one bad game of a still rather inexperienced RB and suddenly all german football is shit.
I know that this thread is pure bait but well.
 

jamesjimmybyrondean

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I'm not really a fan of going toe to toe with an opponent no matter how much better he is than you which German teams are fond of. That high press high line football can't work every game. I like Ole for that as he is not ashamed to sit back and counter when it is the safer option instead of him going all "this is Manchester United we should always attack" like some here suggest
 

passing-wind

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I disagree the league isn't rubbish but defensively many of the teams seem very poor in approaches to nullify a teams attack. Typically I think an attacker in the Bundesliga would be awarded far more space compared to other top leagues in Europe but that for me doesn't equate to the league being crap (another reason why Sancho's numbers has to be taken with a sense of modesty). I think the highlight of forward thinking coaches has come as a result of that footballing environment which is certainly a positive.
 

Zehner

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Bayern played 0:0 and 1:1 against Leipzig last time they faced, so Leipzig has to be as good as them. However, Bayern won 7:2 against Tottenham last season. Tottenham beat United 6:1 recently, so Bayern has to be 21 times as good as United and since Leipzig is their equal, Leipzig also has to be 21 times as good as United.
 

Nani Nana

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German teams are very consistent. 3-4 make CL knockout stage every year.

OP is turd...
 

Wonder Pigeon

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The Bundesliga consistently produces some of the most talented and high profile players in world football. Their national team, one of the strongest in the world, features players from the league almost exclusively. The current Champions League holders play there, and don't have the issue frequently cited for PSG where lack of local competition prevents them from being ready to compete with top opponents at the highest level.

Would Wolfsburg be able to beat West Ham or whatever? I don't know. But this kind of worm-brained all or nothing thinking is just ridiculous. Why do people who think this way even enjoy football if they think that every league is shit, every team that isn't winning immediately in front of their eyes is overrated and every player who doesn't finish a game breaking several records is a bottler?
 

meamth

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Basically German league is English league if United were able to control the TV money by themselves.

The main difference is always the TV deals.
 

Nani Nana

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Basically German league is English league if United were able to control the TV money by themselves.

The main difference is always the TV deals.
For all that TV money, there have been as many CL finalists from PL and Bundesliga in the past 10 years.