giggs-beckham
Clueless
- Joined
- Sep 9, 2007
- Messages
- 6,965
It's cool to hate our legends, co92 etc.You'd think they all want it to be true about Giggs
It's cool to hate our legends, co92 etc.You'd think they all want it to be true about Giggs
He's guilty because he's got money? That's not how the universe worksYet another multi millionaire footballer walks away.
There must be a common denominator ….wonder what it is?
it's a good day for the wrongfully accused though.As another poster said, this is not a good day for victims of domestic abuse.
see @sullydnl's post literally 9 posts before yours.Because one is innocent until proven guilty
I can assure you, it's entirely possible to have smoke without fire - case in point one of my closest friends of over 20 years who was accused of sexual assault by a female colleague when he had the sheer audacity to turn down her drunken approach on a work night out. He was lucky, because he was calling a friend as she approached and interrupted him, and the call went to voicemail, recording the entire interaction and proving his account of what happened was true. Had he not been dialling that friend, and had his friend not had the foresight to not delete the voicemail, things could have been very different.We will await Depay coming out in support of his former teammate/coach. No smoke without fire and I believe the same in the Mendy case as well. Truth is no one will ever know exactly what happened so it’s hard to judge or draw any sort of conclusion from media reporting.
Innocence perhaps?Yet another multi millionaire footballer walks away.
There must be a common denominator ….wonder what it is?
Prove to me God doesn't exist...see you can't!see @sullydnl's post literally 9 posts before yours.
the presumption of innocence is a legal principle which is designed to put the burden of proving someone's guilt on the prosecution, beyond a reasonable doubt.
failing to prove guilt does not prove their innocence of the charge. the prosecution either proves guilt or does not - hence guilty or not guilty - there is never, in a criminal matter, a finding of 'innocence'.
And prove to me God does exist ....see you can't - and no Eric doesn't count!Prove to me God doesn't exist...see you can't!
I don't think anyone is saying that they're all definitely guilty. If anything, the prevailing opinion on many social media platforms (even in the "ridiculous post Metoo" world") can be that all the women in these cases are automatically liars and their footballing heroes are innocent.I can assure you, it's entirely possible to have smoke without fire - case in point one of my closest friends of over 20 years who was accused of sexual assault by a female colleague when he had the sheer audacity to turn down her drunken approach on a work night out. He was lucky, because he was calling a friend as she approached and interrupted him, and the call went to voicemail, recording the entire interaction and proving his account of what happened was true. Had he not been dialling that friend, and had his friend not had the foresight to not delete the voicemail, things could have been very different.
This ridiculous post-metoo notion that all women must be believed and thus all allegations by women must be true can be extremely damaging. Thankfully we have a competent legal system where the burden of proof is high and more often than not, justice is served, but I urge you all to think twice before just assuming the likes of Mendy or Giggs are guilty.
Innocence perhaps?
I think this is because the burden of proof is high and these sorts of cases are extremely difficult to prove guilt - personally I think this is an example of things going right, not wrong. These cases very often boil down to he said/she said, with very little in the way of actual evidence, and I don't know about you but for me a society that is prepared to ruin lives on the basis of one person's word over another is far worse than the alternative that some people get away with such crimes. It's unfortunate, but as William Blackstone is often attributed with saying, it is better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer.when so few cases result in guilty verdicts, people have every right to question whether something is going wrong
I think you mean deemed not guilty, rather than innocent, but for the same reasons I've stated above, I'm not going to be worrying 30 years from now about who I believed or didn't believe. Ultimately that's for courts and juries to decide, all we can do is believe neither accuser nor accused until evidence and legal process determines one way or another. Personally I think it would be better for everyone concerned, if both parties remained anonymous until trial, or at least until charges are made with intention to prosecute, but I appreciate this is essentially impossible in today's world of social media and global audiences.A theory I've explored elsewhere but when looking at a variety of historic cases in the entertainment world, very few were ever found guilty of anything (even when police investigations happened). They were deemed innocent, even though many now claim that they had their own suspicions etc. How many cases will we look at in 30 years with everyone kicking themselves that they didn't believe the victim and placed trust in the courts/police.
You do make some valid points here.I think this is because the burden of proof is high and these sorts of cases are extremely difficult to prove guilt - personally I think this is an example of things going right, not wrong. These cases very often boil down to he said/she said, with very little in the way of actual evidence, and I don't know about you but for me a society that is prepared to ruin lives on the basis of one person's word over another is far worse than the alternative that some people get away with such crimes. It's unfortunate, but as William Blackstone is often attributed with saying, it is better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer.
I think you mean deemed not guilty, rather than innocent, but for the same reasons I've stated above, I'm not going to be worrying 30 years from now about who I believed or didn't believe. Ultimately that's for courts and juries to decide, all we can do is believe neither accuser nor accused until evidence and legal process determines one way or another. Personally I think it would be better for everyone concerned, if both parties remained anonymous until trial, or at least until charges are made with intention to prosecute, but I appreciate this is essentially impossible in today's world of social media and global audiences.