[sglowrider]

According to David Ornstein just now, Charlie Patino wants to leave Arsenal and doesn't want to go on another loan.

He's literally being a Big Time Charlie now!! Is Paul Ince by any chance his agent?

 

[kundalini]

Some strange opinions in this thread. The ones mainly unable to see Hannibal's talent. I'm staggered they can't see his qualities.

It's not like:

- Ten Hag sent him out on loan rather than keep him this season. And used him in a strange way during the tour while Zidane Iqbal and Charlie Savage got mins in CM.

- He has 20 Championship starts (which is fine but not amazing). Birmingham's results don't seem, at first glance, to be any better when Mejbri starts.

- He went to the World Cup (a decent achievement given his age) yet only got 10 mins for Tunisia.

- Last season Rangnick gave him his first start (in a wide role rather than CM/AM) in the dead final match of the season and 6 mins as a late sub in the 0-4 loss at Liverpool.

- Since Sir Alex retired almost 10 years ago, only 4 players have come through the United youth system to go on to make 50 PL starts for United (without being bought back) and another 3 have made 20+ PL starts for United.

That's a lot of managers that could have given Mejbri more mins than they did and two United managers that haven't used him in the role that many of the posters in this thread expect him to play in the medium to longer term.

The thing that really surprises me is that so many posters seem to believe that Mejbri will be given a fair chance, when you only need look at Ten Hag's team selections this season to see that he, like Solskjaer before him, gives far more opportunities to players he likes (brought to the club - Antony and Weghorst for example), regardless of form, than their competition. Mejbri will have to win an unfair fight, be so much better than the alternatives when he gets a chance, that Ten Hag is almost forced to continue to select him.

Antony had a spell of 13 PL games without a goal or assist yet kept being selected. Ten Hag didn't even bother to give Pellistri a chance in case he could contribute more. Pellistri started 2 matches for Uruguay at the World Cup so clearly isn't completely useless. He's had a few good moments and a couple of errors in the very limited playing time he's been given.

 

[Red00012]

'Boro under Carrick would be better as Ipswich might be under the cosh from the get go in the Championship.

You could say the same about Boro if they get promoted

 

[OrcaFat]

It's not like:

- Ten Hag sent him out on loan rather than keep him this season. And used him in a strange way during the tour while Zidane Iqbal and Charlie Savage got mins in CM.

- He has 20 Championship starts (which is fine but not amazing). Birmingham's results don't seem, at first glance, to be any better when Mejbri starts.

- He went to the World Cup (a decent achievement given his age) yet only got 10 mins for Tunisia.

- Last season Rangnick gave him his first start (in a wide role rather than CM/AM) in the dead final match of the season and 6 mins as a late sub in the 0-4 loss at Liverpool.

- Since Sir Alex retired almost 10 years ago, only 4 players have come through the United youth system to go on to make 50 PL starts for United (without being bought back) and another 3 have made 20+ PL starts for United.

That's a lot of managers that could have given Mejbri more mins than they did and two United managers that haven't used him in the role that many of the posters in this thread expect him to play in the medium to longer term.

The thing that really surprises me is that so many posters seem to believe that Mejbri will be given a fair chance, when you only need look at Ten Hag's team selections this season to see that he, like Solskjaer before him, gives far more opportunities to players he likes (brought to the club - Antony and Weghorst for example), regardless of form, than their competition. Mejbri will have to win an unfair fight, be so much better than the alternatives when he gets a chance, that Ten Hag is almost forced to continue to select him.

Antony had a spell of 13 PL games without a goal or assist yet kept being selected. Ten Hag didn't even bother to give Pellistri a chance in case he could contribute more. Pellistri started 2 matches for Uruguay at the World Cup so clearly isn't completely useless. He's had a few good moments and a couple of errors in the very limited playing time he's been given.

Hannibal is a favourite of mine so you’re probably not going to get a completely impartial view from me. However you’re trying to assess him using logic - the “if he was any good then X would happen or Y wouldn’t happen” method. It’s not worth my arguing against that stuff but I’ll tell you why I like him.

He has fantastic close control and strength on the ball in tight areas, under pressure from multiple players. He plays forward as much as possible, with his head up, sees passes that split defences and plays them. He fights for his team like few others and puts in full-on effort (yes, all players should do that but he really wastes no time getting stuck in). He strikes the ball very cleanly, has a decent shot on him and, for example, takes good corners. He can beat his man for skill and then carry the ball 30 yards, at pace. All in all, he plays like he believes in his talent.

EtH is, I would suggest, not a total idiot. He has his favourites but any player can become one of his favourites. He picks the team he thinks will win.

On the other hand, Hannibal does lack maturity, plays with quite a lot of risk, and makes errors. Whether he follows instructions and plays to a team plan, we don’t know. I think he has what it takes but time will tell - there is no rush to promote him or release him - his talent justifies a patient approach at the very least.

 

[Davie Moyes]

It's not like:

- Ten Hag sent him out on loan rather than keep him this season. And used him in a strange way during the tour while Zidane Iqbal and Charlie Savage got mins in CM.

- He has 20 Championship starts (which is fine but not amazing). Birmingham's results don't seem, at first glance, to be any better when Mejbri starts.

- He went to the World Cup (a decent achievement given his age) yet only got 10 mins for Tunisia.

- Last season Rangnick gave him his first start (in a wide role rather than CM/AM) in the dead final match of the season and 6 mins as a late sub in the 0-4 loss at Liverpool.

- Since Sir Alex retired almost 10 years ago, only 4 players have come through the United youth system to go on to make 50 PL starts for United (without being bought back) and another 3 have made 20+ PL starts for United.

That's a lot of managers that could have given Mejbri more mins than they did and two United managers that haven't used him in the role that many of the posters in this thread expect him to play in the medium to longer term.

The thing that really surprises me is that so many posters seem to believe that Mejbri will be given a fair chance, when you only need look at Ten Hag's team selections this season to see that he, like Solskjaer before him, gives far more opportunities to players he likes (brought to the club - Antony and Weghorst for example), regardless of form, than their competition. Mejbri will have to win an unfair fight, be so much better than the alternatives when he gets a chance, that Ten Hag is almost forced to continue to select him.

Antony had a spell of 13 PL games without a goal or assist yet kept being selected. Ten Hag didn't even bother to give Pellistri a chance in case he could contribute more. Pellistri started 2 matches for Uruguay at the World Cup so clearly isn't completely useless. He's had a few good moments and a couple of errors in the very limited playing time he's been given.

Thanks for the reply and reasoning with fair points.

My post was aimed mainly at those posters who say they can't see what the fuss is about Hannibal which makes me think they have not watched him much. My view is that someone only has to watch him for 5 mins to see his qualities using the good old-fashioned eye test. This lad is a baller, top technique, can do everything and on top of that has aggression which is quite a rare combination these days. I think he just needs to bring it all together consistently and we have some player on our hands. Alongside Amad he is our most talented young player (over 18) and if either of them does not make it at Utd then serious questions would have to be asked about our development of young players.

I think Sir Alex would have loved a player like Hannibal and integrated him into the first team squad much quicker. I acknowledge Sir Alex was the greatest and always had better teams to drop young players into but I think he would have had a plan for someone like Hannibal.

 

[kundalini]

Thanks for the reply and reasoning with fair points.

My post was aimed mainly at those posters who say they can't see what the fuss is about Hannibal which makes me think they have not watched him much. My view is that someone only has to watch him for 5 mins to see his qualities using the good old-fashioned eye test. This lad is a baller, top technique, can do everything and on top of that has aggression which is quite a rare combination these days. I think he just needs to bring it all together consistently and we have some player on our hands. Alongside Amad he is our most talented young player (over 18) and if either of them does not make it at Utd then serious questions would have to be asked about our development of young players.

I think Sir Alex would have loved a player like Hannibal and integrated him into the first team squad much quicker. I acknowledge Sir Alex was the greatest and always had better teams to drop young players into but I think he would have had a plan for someone like Hannibal.

I would rather the likes of Mejbri, Amad, Pellistri be given a fair chance in the first team than buy Antony, get Eriksen on a free and so on.

However, I'm sceptical as to whether any of them are so good that Ten Hag will abandon his favourites in the near future. As we have seen, some of the back-up players end up being unused subs for big chunks of the season.

 

[kundalini]

Hannibal is a favourite of mine so you’re probably not going to get a completely impartial view from me. However you’re trying to assess him using logic - the “if he was any good then X would happen or Y wouldn’t happen” method. It’s not worth my arguing against that stuff but I’ll tell you why I like him.

He has fantastic close control and strength on the ball in tight areas, under pressure from multiple players. He plays forward as much as possible, with his head up, sees passes that split defences and plays them. He fights for his team like few others and puts in full-on effort (yes, all players should do that but he really wastes no time getting stuck in). He strikes the ball very cleanly, has a decent shot on him and, for example, takes good corners. He can beat his man for skill and then carry the ball 30 yards, at pace. All in all, he plays like he believes in his talent.

EtH is, I would suggest, not a total idiot. He has his favourites but any player can become one of his favourites. He picks the team he thinks will win.

On the other hand, Hannibal does lack maturity, plays with quite a lot of risk, and makes errors. Whether he follows instructions and plays to a team plan, we don’t know. I think he has what it takes but time will tell - there is no rush to promote him or release him - his talent justifies a patient approach at the very least.

You may not believe this but I like Mejbri and would have had him in the squad this season as a PL sub and regular starter in Europa League and domestic cup competitions. I have no idea if he would have been able to cope with PL football but I would have been willing to take the risk.

I think that convincing Ten Hag will turn out to be the most difficult aspect. In that sense, Mejbri should look to have a strong season on loan at PL/Serie A/La Liga/Bundesliga/ Ligue 1 level before competing for a place at United. That would likely involve another two seasons out on loan.

 

[OrcaFat]

You may not believe this but I like Mejbri and would have had him in the squad this season as a PL sub and regular starter in Europa League and domestic cup competitions. I have no idea if he would have been able to cope with PL football but I would have been willing to take the risk.

I think that convincing Ten Hag will turn out to be the most difficult aspect. In that sense, Mejbri should look to have a strong season on loan at PL/Serie A/La Liga/Bundesliga/ Ligue 1 level before competing for a place at United. That would likely involve another two seasons out on loan.

Yeah that’s probably true.

 

[top1whoisman]

 

[Glorio]

Well done to him!

 

[OrcaFat]

Not many players in the world would even try that. He’s got the X factor.

Just needs to take a deep breath and channel all that talent and effort into more focused and controlled performances. Which he will.

 

[Dempsey19]

Not many players in the world would even try that. He’s got the X factor.

Just needs to take a deep breath and channel all that talent and effort into more focused and controlled performances. Which he will.

I remember Fabio Aurelio doing it against Petr Cech years back. Was a great goal.

I wouldn't expect any of our starting XI to manage it even with no GK. Some terrible FKs this season.

 

[top1whoisman]

 

[sglowrider]

I dont think he had any clue on how long a grind and difficult men's football is. They stopped selecting him for the starting 11 in the last couple of months. Amad had a dip but basically started most matches from October onwards and finished the season strong.

 

[Davie Moyes]

I hope we can integrate both him and Amad into the squad next season. Both are highly technical, quality players and something we lack compared to other teams. I would accept some initial drop off in overall team performance next season whilst trying to bed them in for overall long-term gains.

 

[nemanjaa]

Will for sure have toughened up a bit after a year in the Championship. However I think he needs a season similar to what Amad has had in order to evolve. Preferably to a side that might hold the ball a bit more than Birmingham - they were the team dead last when it comes to possession this season.

The top 10 looks like this possesion wise (team vs opponent)

1	Burnley	46	64.71%	35.29%
2	Swansea	46	63.89%	36.11%
3	Middlesbrough	46	58.16%	41.84%
4	Norwich	46	56.73%	43.27%
5	Sunderland	46	53.98%	46.02%
6	Blackburn	46	53.50%	46.50%
7	West Bromwich Albion	46	53.36%	46.64%
8	Stoke	46	53.18%	46.82%
9	Watford	46	52.47%	47.53%
10	Sheffield United

Swansea, Watford, Norwich could all be a good shout based on this table (haven't really watched too much Championship if I'm being honest)

 

[top1whoisman]

Will for sure have toughened up a bit after a year in the Championship. However I think he needs a season similar to what Amad has had in order to evolve. Preferably to a side that might hold the ball a bit more than Birmingham - they were the team dead last when it comes to possession this season.

The top 10 looks like this possesion wise (team vs opponent)

1	Burnley	46	64.71%	35.29%
2	Swansea	46	63.89%	36.11%
3	Middlesbrough	46	58.16%	41.84%
4	Norwich	46	56.73%	43.27%
5	Sunderland	46	53.98%	46.02%
6	Blackburn	46	53.50%	46.50%
7	West Bromwich Albion	46	53.36%	46.64%
8	Stoke	46	53.18%	46.82%
9	Watford	46	52.47%	47.53%
10	Sheffield United

Swansea, Watford, Norwich could all be a good shout based on this table (haven't really watched too much Championship if I'm being honest)

That is one way of looking at it for sure, as one big factor is to find him a team that plays decent football.

So much more to take into consideration though.

Regarding Watford & Norwich, the mood around the clubs is pretty negative. That happens quite often when clubs get relegated from PL and fail to get back immediately. Those clubs have huge pressure to get back and I doubt either the fans or the coaching staff would have the required patience to develop a player that's not theirs and might make a mistake or two.

The other one is the competition for places, who he'd be fighting against.

Who the manager is, how patient he'd be with a young player on loan.

Would they see Hannibal's best position the same way EtH does.

Right now I'd trust Mowbray and Sunderland the most.

 

[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

I wish a mowbray could pick him up on loan next season.

 

[Fabio Rochemback]

What's the consensus then? Did well enough that we shouldn't look to sell but isn't ready for the PL yet?

 

[red woppit]

What's the consensus then? Did well enough that we shouldn't look to sell but isn't ready for the PL yet?

I think the consensus is:-

No one knows .

He will certainly appear in the pre season, and will play games, but the bottom line is that he will have to prove to Ten Hag that he has learned from his spell in tough Championship matches, has, as it seems, curbed his volatile reaction to fouls etc, and can give something to the team.
It will be interesting to see where Ten Hag plays him in the team.

 

[kundalini]

What's the consensus then? Did well enough that we shouldn't look to sell but isn't ready for the PL yet?

If you go on Transfermarkt and check how many players were bought (for a fee) by Championship clubs this season , it turns out to be 46. They seem to have the fees in euros which confuses the issue slightly. Anyway, 6 players under 500K euros, another 7 between 501K and 999K, 8 between 1m and 1.99m, 8 between 2m and 2.99m euros, 7 between 3m and 3.99m euros, 5 players priced between 4m and 4.99m, 2 players between 5m and 8m euros, and finally the two most expensive purchases priced at 10.5m and 11m euros.

In simple terms, Championship teams pay such small transfer fees that it isn't worth United selling unless it gets to the + 1 year option stage of a contract. In order to sell for a reasonable fee, we need players to be one of the best performers in the Championship, or ideally playing in a top 5 European league (PL, La Liga, Ligue 1, Bundesliga, Serie A).

As I mentioned in previous posts, convincing Ten Hag is the main issue, otherwise Mejbri will find himself in a similar situation to VDB in the first half of the season, Elanga 2nd half of the season or Pellistri, where he gets so little playing time that it is very difficult to make progress.

 

[top1whoisman]

Interesting to see that Birmingham had three of the top five in the whole division and all of them are either central midfielders or attacking midfielders. Having that much own talent in one area of the pitch definitely played its part in Hannibal's minutes dropping during the last weeks of the season.

 

[mav_9me]

I hope we can integrate both him and Amad into the squad next season. Both are highly technical, quality players and something we lack compared to other teams. I would accept some initial drop off in overall team performance next season whilst trying to bed them in for overall long-term gains.

I would too. But the vast majority wouldn't. Esp in his 2nd season.

 

[Onerealunited]

Rather him on the bench than VdB, Mainoo (should be loaned), Iqbal (should be loaned), Fred, McTominay and Savitzer. At least he would be training with class players and learn from Eriksen and Casemiro while getting a few minutes during the games and games in cups and Europe

 

[OrcaFat]

Rather him on the bench than VdB, Mainoo (should be loaned), Iqbal (should be loaned), Fred, McTominay and Savitzer. At least he would be training with class players and learn from Eriksen and Casemiro while getting a few minutes during the games and games in cups and Europe

I rate him very highly. Preseason is going to be very important, in my opinion. If he can hold his own, I’d like to keep him until the last day of the window and if we send him on loan do it late with a view to, possibly, recalling him in January.

As others have said, everything depends on where EtH sees him playing but my hunch is that he is the player being developed to play the FDJ role and will replace Eriksen.

 

[jesperjaap]

It's not like:

- Ten Hag sent him out on loan rather than keep him this season. And used him in a strange way during the tour while Zidane Iqbal and Charlie Savage got mins in CM.

- He has 20 Championship starts (which is fine but not amazing). Birmingham's results don't seem, at first glance, to be any better when Mejbri starts.

- He went to the World Cup (a decent achievement given his age) yet only got 10 mins for Tunisia.

- Last season Rangnick gave him his first start (in a wide role rather than CM/AM) in the dead final match of the season and 6 mins as a late sub in the 0-4 loss at Liverpool.

- Since Sir Alex retired almost 10 years ago, only 4 players have come through the United youth system to go on to make 50 PL starts for United (without being bought back) and another 3 have made 20+ PL starts for United.

That's a lot of managers that could have given Mejbri more mins than they did and two United managers that haven't used him in the role that many of the posters in this thread expect him to play in the medium to longer term.

The thing that really surprises me is that so many posters seem to believe that Mejbri will be given a fair chance, when you only need look at Ten Hag's team selections this season to see that he, like Solskjaer before him, gives far more opportunities to players he likes (brought to the club - Antony and Weghorst for example), regardless of form, than their competition. Mejbri will have to win an unfair fight, be so much better than the alternatives when he gets a chance, that Ten Hag is almost forced to continue to select him.

Antony had a spell of 13 PL games without a goal or assist yet kept being selected. Ten Hag didn't even bother to give Pellistri a chance in case he could contribute more. Pellistri started 2 matches for Uruguay at the World Cup so clearly isn't completely useless. He's had a few good moments and a couple of errors in the very limited playing time he's been given.

Agree with a lot this and appreciate what I am saying isnt a point you are even making, jsut one you havent. Hedid only stop being a teenager a few months ago, maybe the hype people have expected too much too soon (and its modern society after all). I also think people read too much into the performances from loans. Amad at Rangers barely played and when he did he wasnt good enough it seemed to make it here, now people want him straight in the squad...he obviously was and is a talented player, but very much so, so is Hannibal. Would even argue when you look at the current squad and options in there positions, Hannibal probably has more chance of getting opportunities than Amad.

I do agree though, that the chances of them getting opportunities realistically could be pretty low and part of that is that we are not challenging for big trophies or winning games easily, that its more experience being called on than excitin gyoung talent, like we have seen or not, with Pellestri who I really like the look of

 

[top1whoisman]

 

[OrcaFat]

Thanks for posting this. He is my favourite kid to come through our youth set up since the 92 boys. Even though he’s not a local lad, he’s just such an exciting prospect.

I know we’re looking at highlights here but it’s great to see these massive championship cloggers trying to bully him off the ball and failing, half of them end up on the deck in a heap.

 

[Fortitude]

Seems like the forgotten kid. All the talk was of him rounding out his game and being readied for our ‘23 - ‘24 campaign.

What of that?

 

[AltiUn]

Seems like the forgotten kid. All the talk was of him rounding out his game and being readied for our ‘23 - ‘24 campaign.

What of that?

I still think he’s quality tbh.

 

[pascell]

Seems like the forgotten kid. All the talk was of him rounding out his game and being readied for our ‘23 - ‘24 campaign.

What of that?

Hasn't progressed as expected, realistically he needs another year or two on loan.

 

[Big Ben Foster]

Seems like the forgotten kid. All the talk was of him rounding out his game and being readied for our ‘23 - ‘24 campaign.

What of that?

Honestly, it's no different to what we hear on the Caf about every academy player in his age range every season. Chances are, he won't make it at the club and will have a good career elsewhere at a lower level.

 

[Rozay]

Seems like the forgotten kid. All the talk was of him rounding out his game and being readied for our ‘23 - ‘24 campaign.

What of that?

Think he’s been very unfortunate. He’s had spells where he was on our bench every week but we were so rubbish we couldn’t get him off of it. Then Ten Hag has not been great for him so far IMO. For whatever reason, he hasn’t fancied him. He was the outstanding youth midfielder at the club and in pre-season, Savage and Iqbal were repeatedly picked ahead of him, with Hannibal only getting the odd opportunity as a fecking centre forward. Naturally, he didn’t really make a claim in pre-season, and then went on loan to Fight Club for the year. He also found himself injured or on international duty at moments where he would have likely gotten a first team opportunity.

Sliding doors, but I feel things could have gone so differently for him if he had just had some opportunities to play, or even if he went on loan to better footballing side. I remember his brief cameo debut the season before last off the bench at Wolves and he was pure class. I have/had no doubt that he could play at the top level, but from 18/21 - it is so important that players are in the best environments for them if they are to make it to the top, and poorly managed years and bad luck in this period can do irreparable damage to even the most talented youngsters.

I think we will sell him this summer. Talk of Dortmund sniffing around. I’d always said that I didn’t think Bellingham was more talented than him, however - Bellingham’s career has been perfectly managed by his father at the most crucial times. If Hannibal goes to Dortmund I hope it isn’t too late for him to become the player I believe he can.

 

[andersj]

Think he’s been very unfortunate. He’s had spells where he was on our bench every week but we were so rubbish we couldn’t get him off of it. Then Ten Hag has not been great for him so far IMO. For whatever reason, he hasn’t fancied him. He was the outstanding youth midfielder at the club and in pre-season, Savage and Iqbal were repeatedly picked ahead of him, with Hannibal only getting the odd opportunity as a fecking centre forward. Naturally, he didn’t really make a claim in pre-season, and then went on loan to Fight Club for the year. He also found himself injured or on international duty at moments where he would have likely gotten a first team opportunity.

Sliding doors, but I feel things could have gone so differently for him if he had just had some opportunities to play, or even if he went on loan to better footballing side. I remember his brief cameo debut the season before last off the bench at Wolves and he was pure class. I have/had no doubt that he could play at the top level, but from 18/21 - it is so important that players are in the best environments for them if they are to make it to the top, and poorly managed years and bad luck in this period can do irreparable damage to even the most talented youngsters.

I think we will sell him this summer. Talk of Dortmund sniffing around. I’d always said that I didn’t think Bellingham was more talented than him, however - Bellingham’s career has been perfectly managed by his father at the most crucial times. If Hannibal goes to Dortmund I hope it isn’t too late for him to become the player I believe he can.

Could it be, and I mean this the least disrespectful way possible, that you was just wrong? I mean, Bellingham at 16 looked better than Mejbri at 20. At Birmingham.

Maybe at a stretch, you could argue that they were just as talented, but I think it is very evident that Bellingham made better use of it and was consequently better. (And how a player make use of his talent is probably a big part of talent.)

 

[Rozay]

Could it be, and I mean this the least disrespectful way possible, that you was just wrong? I mean, Bellingham at 16 looked better than Mejbri at 20. At Birmingham.

Maybe at a stretch, you could argue that they were just as talented, but I think it is very evident that Bellingham made better use of it and was consequently better. (And how a player make use of his talent is probably a big part of talent.)

That’s for you to draw your own opinion on. Clearly, I have mine.

 

[andersj]

That’s for you to draw your own opinion on. Clearly, I have mine.

Obviously. Sometimes, when people make a statement like that, I get curious if they have ever considered such a possibility.

 

[Remember the geese]

That’s for you to draw your own opinion on. Clearly, I have mine.

For what little it's worth, I'm with you.

 

[Rozay]

Obviously. Sometimes, when people make a statement like that, I get curious if they have ever considered such a possibility.

Why would I, or anyone, consider that what I’ve seen with my eyes is not what I’ve seen with my eyes?

If I watched both players as young teenagers and concluded that I didn’t think Bellingham was more talented than Mejbri - that doesn’t mean that they will level out at exactly the same level as each other or that Mejbri will end up at a higher level. He may not end up at a higher level than McTominay, James Wilson hasn’t ended up anywhere near the level of Weghorst - but that doesn’t change my view that I think they have comparable levels of talent. Whatever happens from there is down to them, and a number of other factors quite frankly, which do not necessarily determine ‘who had the most talent’ of the two.

 

[andersj]

Why would I, or anyone, consider that what I’ve seen with my eyes is not what I’ve seen with my eyes?

If I watched both players as young teenagers and concluded that I didn’t think Bellingham was more talented than Mejbri - that doesn’t mean that they will level out at exactly the same level as each other or that Mejbri will end up at a higher level. He may not end up at a higher level than McTominay, James Wilson hasn’t ended up anywhere near the level of Weghorst - but that doesn’t change my view that I think they have comparable levels of talent. Whatever happens from there is down to them, and a number of other factors quite frankly, which do not necessarily determine ‘who had the most talent’ of the two.

It is the assessment of what you have seen you should question. But I think that was an answer to my question.

 

[Rozay]

It is the assessment of what you have seen you should question. But I think that was an answer to my question.

It sounds more like I should make a revised assessment based on their respective levels now. Which I think is a different assessment altogether.

For the record, I said similarly a year or two back that I didn’t think there was much between Amad and Foden in terms of talent either. Of course, Foden was flying at the time and I was told that Foden has ‘three times the ability’ as Amad - but ultimately I think the course charted by young players is so delicate and dependent on many factors. Nothing is guaranteed, and if anything, determining the most talented amongst young teenagers is probably far easier than determining who will have the better careers. I could list several players who achieved far less than players with less ability. And that goes from professional players to the kids I grew up with. I don’t think it’s that hard to watch guys at youth footy or in the park and make a determination on ability. It’s like me saying Ravel Morrison was not less talented than Mason Mount - which I will maintain he wasn’t.