To be fair, at least he's trying something different. We're so bloody predictable I actually see the value in Rojo right now.
Having any kind of standards
- Thread starter noodlehair
- Start date
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik @Rood and Imran @Annihilate Now! start with the good news by celebrating Manchester United Women's emphatic FA Cup win over Spurs at Wembley and the future of manager Marc Skinner.
Then it's the bad news and the ever worsening form of our Men with losses to Arsenal and Palace.
Finally the main debate - ETH Out now or keep him until the end of the season - if not longer. Are you Team Nik or Team Imran?
There are no standards at United. There is no direction.
We are a club that has been built to chase titles and has given up on that, as a consequence nobody quite knows what the objective is or what we should be playing for.
Players no longer treat defeats as crises. Why would they? They are not chasing the league. You can afford to lose a dozen times if you are only chasing fourth place or something like it.
The reduced expectations have ruined the club and allowed complacency and laziness corrupt the dressing room. Its pure vomit.
We are a club that has been built to chase titles and has given up on that, as a consequence nobody quite knows what the objective is or what we should be playing for.
Players no longer treat defeats as crises. Why would they? They are not chasing the league. You can afford to lose a dozen times if you are only chasing fourth place or something like it.
The reduced expectations have ruined the club and allowed complacency and laziness corrupt the dressing room. Its pure vomit.
This was part of the 'freedom' that players didn't enjoy under LVG or Jose and were glad to experience in abundance under Ole. The very freedom that our fans were applauding Ole for just a few months ago.
We went from managers who gave too many instructions to someone who seemingly doesn't have any.
We have no standards.
We're probably the only big club in the world that would have a really bad season, sell a couple of first-teamers and not bother to replace them... That's our standards.
Rojo didn't give two shits last night, but we're currently a club that doesn't give a shit about improving.
We're probably the only big club in the world that would have a really bad season, sell a couple of first-teamers and not bother to replace them... That's our standards.
Rojo didn't give two shits last night, but we're currently a club that doesn't give a shit about improving.
It's a painful comparison, but as we're the 2 biggest clubs in the country and fiercest rivals it's important to keep in mind.
Since Liverpool last won the league, is our current crop of players worse than every single dreadful Liverpool side in that time?
I'm being totally honest. For me, the worst Liverpool team on paper in that period managed to win them the Champions League.
Not saying we're bound for 30 years of relative domestic failure, but right now we're in the pits across the whole club.
Since Liverpool last won the league, is our current crop of players worse than every single dreadful Liverpool side in that time?
I'm being totally honest. For me, the worst Liverpool team on paper in that period managed to win them the Champions League.
Not saying we're bound for 30 years of relative domestic failure, but right now we're in the pits across the whole club.
Rojo always tried long shots, he did all his career even at Sporting Lisbon. He took few more in last 2 games but him shooting from distance is not something new. Someone posted the compilation last year or before that, all the long shots he took since he was at Sporting. Scored 0 goals btw.
Agree with the point OP is making, we have let the standards fall in every department and also with players.
That's one way of looking at it!
Playing with a bit of freedom is one thing but that's why you have standards. You can play with freedom and still work hard for the team and have a responsibility to the team.
No one seems to have that under Ole, except for the younger ones who are more likely doing it off their own backs to try and impress.
Even then, Chong clearly isn't ready for the first team yet. Again, there is no standard there. Young players getting a chance yes, but if or when they are good enough surely? Otherwise it's unfair on both them and the team.
I mean is there a bar that a player can be below at the moment? If someone came out the next game, passed the ball to the opposition every time they got it, waved at their mum in the crowd as someone ran past them to score, started splitting pies in the faces of their team mates? Would they even be subbed off?
Mate, that's a mad statement.
You're saying the worst Liverpool team since they last won the league is their 2005 team? So you rate Souness and Hodgson's Liverpool teams more highly than Rafa's? Nah mate.
This squad is not great but its not rubbish either. The problem is not quality. The problem as @noodlehair says is that there is no responsibility and no drive in this team.
Do these players really need to be coached to overlap each other? Or to go on the inside if your teammate makes a run to the outside? That's stuff they learn as kids.
We're talking about competing with West Ham and Rochdale. I cannot look at our squad and say we don't have the quality for that. The mentality though..? Never in a month of sundays. There's more fight in a ball of string.
But then why fight? We're not chasing titles so what difference do a few defeats make..?
The worry is that new players come in at a good Standard as we have seen Dan James, AWB, Greenwood and Maguire. Then 6 months in all of them will srop standards to suit the rest of the team, we are seing AWB dropping his from what we saw in Pre Season already.
The biggest fear I have is Greenwood. He looks like a top player, but I don't think United is the club for him if he wants a successful career. I would love him to stay and do well, but we have a history of fekcing up these players. Last thing I want is him at 20 and not progressed, he needs a manager who will get him to his potential.
The biggest fear I have is Greenwood. He looks like a top player, but I don't think United is the club for him if he wants a successful career. I would love him to stay and do well, but we have a history of fekcing up these players. Last thing I want is him at 20 and not progressed, he needs a manager who will get him to his potential.
I'd forgotten the Hodgson period in fairness, but I think our current squad has less quality and depth than Liverpool's 90s teams.
We have 2 world class players on their day, but they've not performed in months (DDG & Pogba). We've got lots of potential (James, Rashford, McTominay, Gomes, Greenwood, AWB, Martial), but this is counteracted by woeful squad depth and experienced players who are a drain to everything we do on the pitch (Matic, Young, Mata). Add to that the fact we are packed full of absolute passengers (Jones, Lingard, Pereira, Rojo).
On top of that, I love him to pieces and think he's a decent shout for DoF, but Ole seems to be digressing from the positive football that got him the job and is - in all honesty - looking more and more out of his depth with each match. It pains me to write this, and I don't think that this is in anyway his fault but more so a result of mismanagement from the very top of the club, but our football is more like LvG/Jose than anything else I've seen United play over the last 20 years.
Looking at Ole's face I feel like he's lost faith in these players. Following the tradition of every manager who has come in since Moyes, started positively and very rapidly lost it with the dressing room.
You see his eyes, you see his facial expressions, you can just tell he's had it with this group. You talk about positive football but its impossible when the team is full of players who a) are scared to take charge of the ball and b) seemingly too mollicuddled to think for themselves e.g. run in different directions to one another to create options.
People talk about 'coaching patterns of play' but I doubt he doesn't do that, certainly the first 17 matches under him suggests he does. The players themselves talked extensively about how they prepared for the Spurs away and Arsenal away games. However, you can do what you want at Carrington. If you get stage fright and shrink at Old Trafford then it doesn't matter. I think Ole looks at these players and thinks they don't have the mentality to play for United and, much like Mourinho, he's in a position now where he's picking players who a) he doesn't trust and b) know he doesn't trust them and we're just getting stodgy, stale performances as a result.
Hodgson's side is probably the closest, could probably argue it either way but Hodgson is atleast an established Prem manager and the side still had Rafa's leftovers, Agger Skrtel Carra Kuyt Reina etc, and Gerrard trumps anything at Utd now.
Was thinking maybe 94ish toward the end of Souness reign but even then the talents coming through far eclipse Utd's. Fowler, Macca, Redknapp etc. plus two greats in Barnes and Rush.
See, here's the thing. United are in a rebuilding phase. Not only is this probably obvious to all of us, but this is a stated fact by our manager, as well as the fact that this rebuilding phase will take time -- as in, a few years minimum. As much as I'd love to, we can't wave a magic wand and suddenly transform the squad into champions. We knew going in that this season would be painful, that there would be a lot of mediocre or bad performances, and that players we wouldn't want to play for United would have to do so either because there simply aren't better options available, or because Ole is trying things in an effort to make the team work the best it can.
Now, we can shout on the forums about mediocrity until we're blue in the face, but that won't change any of the above. This season (and possibly the next couple) will still be painful. We don't have to like it, but we can't change it. We can call Rojo a shite wasteman all we want, and that won't make him any better, or make him go away.
There is only one Fergie in this world. A manager who could get all his players to sweat blood and give 120% every game. Enjoy that era as we may never see the likes again.We as fans certainly got value for money all those years.
I mean yes there may never be a manager as great as Fergie, but there are still managers who get players to give 120%, unfortunately one of those manager is at Liverpool.
Well we certainly need one here, as well as 5 top players.
If there ever was an appropriate time to post this picture again, it’s this:
That’s a good call but it’s obviously down to the lack of coaching as well. Either that or he doesn’t respect what the coaches are trying to relay to him and the team.
This is Rojo in a nutshell.
At least Rojo is kinda fun to watch because he's so bizarre. I prefer him to most of our soulless bores.
He's shit, don't get me wrong, but at least he's interesting.
He's shit, don't get me wrong, but at least he's interesting.
He's our Eboue
Where's Brandon's thread on player performances?
Anyway get the lad in. Streets ahead of Rojo from what i read on here last night.
Anyway get the lad in. Streets ahead of Rojo from what i read on here last night.
We lack the mentality of winners. Would rojo get away with that shite years ago. Not a chance. Phil Neville who was a more capable footballer got trimmed by Keane for chancing a step over twice in a game. Which he pulled off. Massive difference, we have no one on the pitch setting standards. Say what you like about Henderson as a player but he is a winner, knows his limitations and excels as part of a team. That is utd player attributes. Attributes lacking in most of our guys. Our squad is full of the opposite.
Perform shite, they can look at their bank account, and they're happy.
No accountability, when even some fans celebrate these players get bumping wages as world class players, even after a shite season. Then combine it with the Club just extended the contract of pointless players just because it's cheaper to keep them then buying new ones, or for 'resale' values.
How do you keep yourself motivated in this kind of work environment?
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