Any article written unfavourably towards the Glazers gets my thumbs up whatever the angle, the more the better.
Henry Winter's attack on Joel Glazer
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Do you know Joel Glazer personally to back up that personal attack. Don’t get me wrong i am not defending the glazers here. They have done a lot wrong with the club and its fans. But that article is a bullet fired at Project Big Picture wrapped up as concern for United fans. Henry winter does not care about united fans.
An article explaining an article, interesting.
The reality is the Glazers own Manchester United. Unless somebody comes along to offer them insane money to take it off their hands, that is going to remain the case. They won't want to sell something that is a cash cow for them. The only real protest I ever saw was the Green and Gold campaign when we had lowered our standards after winning three league titles in a row, including the CL during that period, we still finished second that season of the protests. Now a decade later, a large section of our fanbase feels that finishing third is an achievement.
Whilst he’s mostly right. He’s no friend of United and the language used to try and rile up united fans is as disingenuous from him as anything the Glazers have said or done. Make no mistake this guy is not on the clubs side.
Exactly - Do you feel angry towards Sony, Microsoft, Zara and other big companies? There are 2 main scenarios where anger is possible outside the company: As a customer who is not happy with the product and service or as a shareholder pissed off at your stock returns. Now, fans are almost customers but not the only ones: Arguably, United's customers are the advertisers especially in a time where stadium attendance is not likely. Are these customers happy with what they're getting out of the United marketing platform? And are the investors happy with out financial performance? These are the critical questions. Fan power, in my view, is only as important as their impact on marketing. If growth of global metrics of our fan power start to plateau, the investors and advertising customers would take notice and the bottom line would be impacted. Otherwise, fans are not as important as some posters would think. Heck, a big chunk of the "fans" considered by advertising customers are not even in Manchester or the UK but in high growth markets in Asia where devotion to United is quite fleeting, to be frank. Folks want to be associated with victories. Let's not forget Woodward once argued that success on the pitch is not necessary for commercial growth, such is the popularity of the sport and United. You can argue against the merits of that claim - I for one think he was ignoring the new reality of competition backed by state funds - but fan power is quite a few steps removed from the business model of United. It is the basis of the club's commercial appeal, for sure, but the perception and metrics of "popularity" goes well beyond the immediate, visceral anguish that us fans feel.
I did wonder why Evra defended the Glazers, it still makes no sense to me
Exactly. People like Henry Winter in the media are as conning and disingenuine as the Glazers themselves.
Agreed. i mean Winters is talking about Joel pushing through fans at the stadium so it means it happened at least prior to lockdown in March. Would it not have been logical to write that story at the time it happened. Or after the disastrous window we have had. Its a bit cheap to sit on this rhetoric until it suits your agenda in my opinion.
(disclaimer, I think the Premier league is due a shake up and that ideas should be put forward and argued as democratically as possible but I don't think that should extend to giving absolute voting rights to a minority, its a bad road to go down).
Bang on. The idea manifested itself from the hedge fund that is FSG not the Glazers (they are not sophisticated enough). But true to form the parasites have seen a bigger fruit machine when Henry & co said howdy!.
We need these hillbilly's out of the club & this should be the sole focus of fans end of. Forget Ole & signings, we heading for the bottom 3 anyway after the break anyway so Ole will be gone come Crimbo.
We need the leeches out.
There is an argument that not only are fans not the customers but part of the actual product that is being sold to advertisers.
You are correct - fans are the eyeballs and walking billboards for advertisers. I think United has always positioned our brand as a premium one and our advertisers reflect that - blue chip companies, no low end products (One's personal take on Chevy's quality aside). That is to say, we don't rely on betting companies or sketchy lenders for advertising dollars. That might change if we don't have the commercial pull for premium brands anymore. And that is a slippery slope: The more lower tier advertisers we sign on, the less likely premium brands want to be associated with us. How that might lower our valuation is a big question mark - my guess is that the global popularity of the sport and our cash flow will continue to make us untenable purchases for all but the largest investors - those that care more about prestige than immediate cashflow. Until the younger generation of Glazers move on, United will probably remain their primary source of income unfortunately. My only hope is that the Glazers will realize that the current strategy (Whatever that is) is really not the most profitable. They are better off putting operations (football) people in charge of squad construction. Looking at the Bucaneer's performance in the NFL, however, I am not optimistic.
Overly dramatic garbage.
We have spent £1.1bn on signings since Ferguson retired, which is an average spend of £157m per season. The investment is not the issue at all.
I don't actually think they have been bad; it is a myth born out of not understanding how business ownership works. They have every right to take out a dividend and so would any owner because that is how it works. They have not starved the club of cash as shown by the £1.1bn investment, which is more than enough to build a squad.
The issue has mainly been from the recruitment committee, who have identified inadequate targets. Remember that the manager is far from solely responsible for determining what players will be signed.
This issue has been made worse because we have not only failed to sign players suitable for the managers present at the time. Now, we also decided to sign a manager way out of his depth.
Changing the owners will change nothing; people are dreaming. Making the correct managerial choice and actually buying the right players will.
We have spent £1.1bn on signings since Ferguson retired, which is an average spend of £157m per season. The investment is not the issue at all.
I don't actually think they have been bad; it is a myth born out of not understanding how business ownership works. They have every right to take out a dividend and so would any owner because that is how it works. They have not starved the club of cash as shown by the £1.1bn investment, which is more than enough to build a squad.
The issue has mainly been from the recruitment committee, who have identified inadequate targets. Remember that the manager is far from solely responsible for determining what players will be signed.
This issue has been made worse because we have not only failed to sign players suitable for the managers present at the time. Now, we also decided to sign a manager way out of his depth.
Changing the owners will change nothing; people are dreaming. Making the correct managerial choice and actually buying the right players will.
Spot on, his only on the Glazers back because it suits him and his agenda. All sudden it's SIR Alex.
https://www.independent.ie/sport/so...e-punishment-lets-everyone-down-28951971.html
‘You’re not fit to spend a second in the distinguished company of Sir Alex Ferguson and Sir Bobby Charlton, legends who have given so selflessly to club and sport."
distiguished= mark of excellence, so make your mind up Winter.
Given the fact that Joel Glazer will control United's fate as long as he is alive and working, he remains the club's best hope in turning things around. I just fear that whatever turmoil us fans see now is tolerable to him - this endless cycle of squad mismanagement, hiring and firing - as long as Woodward stumbles to Top 4 every other season. There is a better way to this madness and the Glazers can make more money with wiser spending. Pool has done so and they come from a similar cultural background as us, without the commercial muscle.
And who is ultimately responsible for the managerial appointments?
Who sets the rules on how the club should operate?
It will solve one of the problems. If you've x amount of big problems, do you just sit and think, I'll not doing anything about any of them because I can't solve them all?
theyve turned us into a laughing stock and couldnt give 2 shits. Instead of trying to improve the football club which gives them so much they are now more concerned thinking of ways to take over the fecking league. Every failure of Woodward running the club is a failure of the Glazers. Who gave the job to a manager out of their depth?
They really are a depressing bunch. So fixated and passionate about one detail, so oblivious to the big picture.
It's the owners who are supposed to do that. They just don't seem to understand that, that's why people are frustrated and see a change of ownership as the only way for things to improve.
Lot's of advertisers pull out from their sponsored person/team due to bad image by the later. Advertisers listen to people/fans. So if there's enough voice from fans to continuously protesting, it will affect advertising income.
But then, the Glazers would just reduce the transfer warchest to offset this deficit. Then our team would be shite, which fans don't want to see. So it's a bit of catch 22.
With the whole new United/Liverpool scheme currently off the table, my first reaction was, what is the actual set of changes they want to put through.
Classic practice to drop some hardcore version that they know will get rejected, and then come back with a lighter version later.
But I wonder if this was purposely dropped the day after the PPV nonsense, to make people forget that. As they have to some extent.
I don't think anyone thinks that. The club is badly managed at board and ownership level. That's evident to most of us apart from maybe the staunch est of top reds. What most Ole out think is that we would be better off with a manager then without one.
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What if Joel was actually a really nice guy but was bursting for a shit at the time he brisked past the United fans just to get home and finally take a dump
Nothing wrong with our current manager.
Problem is the people who call themselves ‘supporters’ who want our manager who has demonstrated progress on every front sacked.
Bizarre way of showing ‘support’ if you ask ne
It is not that straight forward. They are willing to sack and hire managers, and who knows who else has been replaced (potentially recruitment staff)? The fact of the matter is: most managerial appointments will be wrong; history shows this.
Manutd doesn't compete in a one-team league where being at the top is only a matter of buying all your opposition's best players. Bayern Munich has an enormous advantage in their league, but even they have gone through periods of bringing in poor fits. But most of the time they can win because of their financial dominance, so they can strip teams like Dortmund of their best players. Real Madrid and Barcelona also have this advantage. Manutd doesn't because of how rich the other Premier League clubs are, and so this is not possible.
I can see a change in recruitment methodology this summer. We are refusing to pay extortionate fees for players, learning from what we did with Maguire. This is an understandable decision, considering the way a lot of these massive signings have gone. We have still invested a considerable amount this summer. No, we didn't get Sancho, but would people give credit to the Glazers for paying £100m if he flopped? No, they would be criticised for it.
In the end, I think the actual management of the club is fine. We just have to find the right football manager, and that means sacking and appointing until you get it right. Also, changing the recruitment staff if it hasn't been done already.
Remember, it took 30 years for Liverpool to find the right manager, and people forget it took us 25 years to win the top league after 1967. It took 25 years to find the right manager. Though, I don't think it will take us that long this time, but it can take a while to get the right person.
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The problem we have as supporters is the amounts taken out whilst the club is still in debt this has not been addressed along with not investing in Old Trafford which needs expansion and huge investment.
A good Director of football could have solved some of the strange player signings that have been made, and the wages of that have been given to these players.
Although not perfect Ole has been the only manager post Sir Alex to get a team that I have enjoyed watching (Obviously not recently) but I will support the team and the manager whilst not supporting the Glazers and Woodward who are parasites.
I won't be judging about who is supporter and who is not. You seem an expert about that, not me. All I can say is its very possible to not have faith in both the manager and the board. Actually the former might be seen as yet another mistake done by the latter.
Ole spent 130m on 2 defenders that are mid table club level at best, he wanted a 100m signing to bench the most promising kid we had since the class of 92 and all his signings had tanked few months he and his coaches got their chance of working with them. That's pretty concerning isn't it? Not to forget that he seem to think that money grow on trees as well. Which might explain why he thought that United could afford Jadon, Grealish and probably Upamecano as well, in a transfer window in the middle of a pandemic.
Also note that nearly every manager post Sir Alex managed to qualify in the CL one way or another. Most did so by winning a trophy while at it.
Its not all about lack of investment on the pitch. What about the actual pitch? I don't go to Old Trafford as much as I might like, but when I have gone in recent years there doesnt seem to be a lot of working going on or investment into the stadium
Well done for digging this one up.
No United fan should be under any illusions that these Journalists and media in general have any respect for Manchester United fans.
How dare he called for Fergie to be banned and then when it suits his narrative refers to Fergie as a special person.
These journalists are not on our side. If as United fans we rely on these hypocrites to defend our interests then we are doomed.
When did these journalists realise that Joel Glazer was bad for United?
All these years their narrative has been that the Glazers have given the club money. Proper nonsense. Every one of us remembers SAF with his value for money statements.
The Glazers are bad owners but that did not start a few days ago. Cancel these useless journalists.
it's very easy to be an expert on whom is a 'supporter'. Just look up the actual definition of the word 'supporter' and judge from that
The quantitative facts are Ole improved the team on every single attribute. All the rest of what you write is just subjective personal opinion.
I think most fans would have been fine with not getting Sancho in these difficult times as long as we'd pulled out early and made suitable other arrangements once Dortmund made it obvious they weren't selling for any cheaper. That would have looked like a club with a plan that was in control of what was happening. Instead we seemed to keep trying to make it happen to the last day as if we thought Dortmund would panic sell, made a late half-arsed play for Dembele on loan, and panic bought two kids and Cavani. I try to give the benefit of the doubt with Cavani as maybe by leaving it so late his demands dropped significantly, but in that case what were our choices if he hadn't (or somebody else picked him up before that)?
At the end of the day it just all looked like a huge mess, yet another example of a club that has consistently looked poorly run for many years.
I think that each and every one of us wants what is good for the club. We might disagree on how that can be achieved but that doesn't mean we're not supporters. As said I am not an expert in judging whose a supporter is and whose not. All I can say is that United is second only to family, that its normal for a United's defeat to ruin my weekends and to see us in this sorry state makes me physically sick.it's very easy to be an expert on whom is a 'supporter'. Just look up the actual definition of the word 'supporter' and judge from that
The quantitative facts are Ole improved the team on every single attribute. All the rest of what you write is just subjective personal opinion.
Nearly every manager we had after Sir Alex retired enjoyed some sort of success followed by an inevitable dip in performance. All had evident flaws that made them unsuited for the job and all of them wasted the club's money big time. Irrespective of that my original argument stand. It's not that crazy to think that the owners, the board and the manager are not good enough. If you take emotions out of the picture then such line of thinking makes sense. Owners who know nothing about football are at a high risk of hiring a shit CEO which in turn has a high risk of hiring the wrong manager.
If I have to choose between Woodward/Judge and Ole I'd rather see sack Woodward and Judge and bring in a decent CEO & a DOF. However I won't be surprised if once we added a top CEO/DOF, Ole would be the next one to go.
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Show us one person claiming this.
You're giving them undue credit based on ... basically nothing.
There's no guarantee that the next managerial appointments will be better than the previous, and even if it is there is no guarantee that a good manager will be willing or able to work with this shambles of a board.
Change in recruitment policy? We've had plenty of those, and we very likely will again.
We need to restructure, then if we want to change the manager as part of a larger vision, so be it. Throwing shit at the wall and hoping it sticks isn't really a vision.
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The problem is that whatever United do stink of panic and incompetency. We overpay in terms of salaries and fees, we take ages to sign players, we engage ourselves into panic signing at the end of the transfer window and when we want to sack a manager, we engage ourselves in weeks of leaks to make the manager look bad rather then do the thing and get on with it. That makes us look silly and unprofessional. I am not Ole biggest fan. I think his signings were meah, his choose in terms of coaches had been abysmal and he lack tactical acumen to make it at the highest level. However there's absolutely no doubt that this board is crap.
What United need is football people who are already successful in their job. We can't have accountants taking football related decisions and former players covering managerial/coaching roles based on nearly no experience whatsoever. The restructuring we need is radical and from top to bottom ie a CEO, a DOF, a manager and a new coaching staff. This on the job training need to stop. We can't afford it. United should bring the best in the job.
Agreed, though very unlikely under the current owners.
Henry is a little late with this tirade I think. Yes the Glazers have taken money from the club, too much money. As mentioned earlier, they own the club so they are legally entitled to do that. Morally though is another question. Other owners reinvest in their clubs. The executives have ruined the club, lead by Woodward who is out of his depth. They hire and fire at will instead of recruiting for the long term as Liverpool did with Klopp. If we lose anymore games, Ole will be gone and it will start all over again.
This is for me the biggest mystery of all. Why wouldn't they want a top football CEO who can make the most out of the money given? Do they like wasting money?
Woodward should return to whatever he used to do (commercial and media operations) or the club should split with the financials from the football side