by the time i started watching football,barnes became a bit useless, but many here don't seem to have seen Giggs consistently over his career. he is inconsistent yes but supremely talented, and as someone said if i had to choose someone to affect a single match (not just in terms of goals and stats), it would be giggs
If you turn one of our current golden oldies into their prime, who would it be?
- Thread starter Rossa
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Very interesting thread. Should have been a poll to actually see easily what the caf feels.
Rio for me btw, easy choice. We would be set at the back for 10yrs with him.
Rio for me btw, easy choice. We would be set at the back for 10yrs with him.
In our current situation you'd have to say Rio over Giggs, the side is already jam packed with attacking talent at their peaks.
Philip Neville? 
I would choose Ryan Giggs.
I would choose Ryan Giggs.
My heart says Giggs but my head says Rio Ferdinand. Rio at his best had almost no flaws in his pace, great in the air, pace, strength, tackling when needed albeit rare but fantastic reading.
Evra. Followed by Rio. If we could cheat a bit and go back a year, then it would be Scholes. If we could cheat a lot, then it would be Keane.
Rio. He was literally the best defender in the world at his peak. We could have a non-existent midfield and we still wouldn't concede goals with a Rio in his prime and De Gea in goal.
Is this like a scouse war cry ?
Please come and help me prove that Barnes is worthy of being in the list of top 5 wingers of all time.Anybody that laughs at the suggestion of Barnes being better than Giggs obviously has mental issues
But the Bale comment, my God, Gasmanc is a special breed.
Barnes, is everything Giggs wanted to be, the archetypal winger of the 80's who thrived as a playmaker later on in his career. I don't even need to argue about the mans ability, United greats like Robson or Ferdinand would tell you themselves(Barnes was his idol growing up).
I don't think its an exaggeration to say from 87-90 he was top 5 players in the world, honestly.
Giggs is a great player as well but i don't think he reached the peaks Barnes did.
Giggs has been doing it for over 20 years, Barnes came in peaked and faded like a normal human, you may well think that Barnes peak was better than Giggs but you really have no comparisons, Giggs has been doing it at the top table for 20 years and doing it at a very very high level. Barnes has literally no European pedigree (through no fault of his own granted) Bale has at least been doing it consistently a few years now, but if he wanted to squeeze his token ex Liverpool player in then I would have been less likely to laugh if Steve Heighway had cropped up.
Barnes is everything Giggs wanted to be
oh my.We still have Phil Neville's peak years to comePhilip Neville?
I would choose Ryan Giggs.
I think people are going overboard with Rio. Whenever he played next to anyone else besides Vidic he was hardly consistent. It was only until Vidic joined he started showing consistency. Before that there was always a mistake coming.
We go on about our attacking talent. But how many of them could beat a man? Giggs in his peak did that for fun.
We go on about our attacking talent. But how many of them could beat a man? Giggs in his peak did that for fun.
Giggs every time!
Anybody that laughs at the suggestion of Barnes being better than Giggs obviously has mental issues
But the Bale comment, my God, Gasmanc is a special breed.
Barnes, is everything Giggs wanted to be, the archetypal winger of the 80's who thrived as a playmaker later on in his career. I don't even need to argue about the mans ability, United greats like Robson or Ferdinand would tell you themselves(Barnes was his idol growing up).
I don't think its an exaggeration to say from 87-90 he was top 5 players in the world, honestly.
Giggs is a great player as well but i don't think he reached the peaks Barnes did.
If you ask the foreign neutrals to choose between Giggs and Barnes in their prime, they would choose Giggs every single time.
You wont find any Italian saying that Costacurta is everything Baresi wanted to be or a Spanish saying that Busquets is everything Guardiola wanted to be. The difference between an excellent player and an absolute great player is so clear that no one need to ask. Yet in magic Britain one can discuss whether Lampard was much better then Scholes, Barnes was much better than Giggs, whether Carragher deserved to be a first teamer in a national team which pride players like Rio, Campbell and Terry as CBs and if Terry was a better defender than Rio. This can be done without anyone risking of being laughed at, or thrown in a mental house. With such mentality no wonder why British football is in shambles.
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Can I call Nani 'old'?
Either way, him.
Either way, him.
Giggs was very good but he was never Ronaldo, I think Ferdinand reached a higher ceiling but u love Giggs, it has to be..
Giggs was one of the best wingers of his generation. He may not be Ronaldo, however I can't think of anyone (apart Best and Messi) who could reach/beat that level.
Rio was the best CB England had for many many years. If he was an Italian he would be considered nearly at par to the likes of Maldini and ahead of defenders like Cannavaro. Unfortunately in Britain brute force and 'passion' is preferred to great technique, positioning and brains.
Its apples and oranges. However we need more of a Giggs in this side then a Rio.
Disagree. Our need for a top CB is much greater than another top attacker.
The problem with picking Giggs is that his game has evolved so much over the years, and that the best part of Giggs the winger and Giggs the midfielder never had the chance to to be displayed by him.
I disagree. We currently have 3 very promising defenders coming through in Evans, Smalling and Jones. However we lack quality in the creativity department. Giggs magic and pace on the left flank would do wonders to the side.
Scholes any day... That player can´t be replaced. As I cannot be sure he had quit, he might come back!
Neither of whom are likely to reach Rio's level. And we dont lack in the creativity department at all, its how we're using them that's the problem. Mata, Kagawa, Rooney, Van Persie, Nani etc. No lack of creativity there even if you take the 2 strikers out.
I hope you don't believe what you write. Giggs was one of the best wingers of his generation? I didn't say he wasn't, so not sure why you are bringing up random sentances? There are several who have surpassed his ceiling, if you can't see that you either don't know enough footballers or have red tinted glasses.Agreed about Rio? That's what my post said?
We lack width, pace and creativity. Mata and Kagawa are no 10s, Rooney/Van Persie are strikers, Nani is erm meah.
The option was to choose from someone who hasn't yet retired... I know the OP is difficult being 4 pages away but throwing random names in don't really make sense fella.
Not every side needs width, in fact the modern game takes more towards flair/inside forwards than touchline huggers, so that's pointless.
You don't believe Mata, Kagawa, Rooney, Januzaj, Nani are creative? and Pace? All are pretty quick, Rooney, Kag, Welbeck, it's out midfield that's slow.
Agreed about Rio? That's what my post said?
Name me 5 wingers of his generation who were better than Giggs.
Also were have I said that I agreed with you?
More than we need a CB? I really rate Jones and Smalling but I'd be amazed if they ever turn out to be as good as Rio was, he was just superb at his peak. Also, what we have are talents that will mature with time, a Rio now at his peak would just give us so much more stability at the back, and for years.
What the feck? Why 5 in his generation? if wingers are outside his generation they what? Don't exist? You're a loon.
I never said you agreed with me, I stated I agreed with you after you just repeated my sentence? You have to be the strangest poster I've come across.
Defenders has a funny way how to develop. I remember SAF's laughing at Leeds spending 18m on Rio and claiming that if Rio is worth 18m then Wes is worth 30m. Guess what, Wes turned out being pretty average and United spend 30m on Rio.
I believe that we've got a very solid defense to build on. If you ask me I believe that if we sort the rear flanks problem the defense will get much stronger. I am not saying that a Rio in his prime wouldn't be needed. Hell any club would need someone like Rio in his prime. However priority should be given to the lack of creativity and pace in this side.
Its a matter of preference so I'l leave it at that but regarding the creativity bit, how can you say we lack creativity when we have the player we do? Pace, I'd agree with, a rampaging Giggs on the left would give us a great dimension but we do not lack creativity at all.
Has he retired for good?? That is the question..
Agreed about Rio? That's what my post said?
You're acting very strange.
And aren't there bans and infractions for anyone insulting other posters?
Ah apologies, yes Paul Scholes is a full time coach, had he still been playing FWIW, I'd imagine all would have chosen him.
Dont you think that we lack creativity from the flanks?
Also as said, comparing Giggs and Rio is madness. Both players were magnificent in their line. However I believe that we need more of a Giggs because I am confident in Smalling/Evans/Jones ability (only if we will sort the rear flanks issues) to provide a solid defense to times to come.
Rio.
I'd pick Giggs then play him as a number 10, just to see if it would have turned out any better or worse.
It's relative, I call it how I see it, I've never been infracted yet and if loon upset's you, I apologize. What do you call someone who can't follow a coherent set of sentences and just throws random phrases back? I'll make this simple for you. When I said "agreed about Rio", that means I agree with you, no where did I say you agree with me, perhaps try reading this again as I think you clearly struggle with a few things, anyway, I've never said this about a poster in the FF, but I will not address you again, I've never met someone so incapable of having a discussion, my 10 year old nephew at least answer's the question in hand and doesn't throw random words or phrases, if there was something you didn't understand, you were more than able to ask, anyway I'll leave you be.
yawn.
We have shit wingers so yes. But if we change the way we play, it wont be a problem. Am not dissing the fact that Giggsy would be a great addition, just that we dont lack creativity as you first said. Then you've moved the argument to creativity out wide which we lack ofcourse because our wide players are poor. It wasnt your first statement though.
Regarding the 2nd bit, comparing them is madness, yes which is why I said its a matter of preference based on what you think the side needs more. I dont think there's any doubt that we need a top cB more than another attacker but you think otherwise, fair enough.
If we change the way we play then I agree. However I cant see us going that route. In my opinion we do lack pace, unpredictability and quality in midfield. Ryan Giggs in his prime could contribute in that (Ryan in his prime was a winger in 4 - 4 - 2 system). After all Giggs 20-25 years of age was the most feared player United had in the CL (the double side had Keane and Ince in CM who were hard as nails but hardly very creative. Also for the earliest part of Scholes career he was more renowned for his fantastic ability to infiltrate in the opponent's defense and score rather than being a world class playmaker, hence why SAF bought JSV).
Its all about priorities. Your argument is well thought and I agree with it. However I still think that a young Giggs would do us more good then a young Rio.
Just out of interest, where have you gotten that stat from and what's the validity of it?