Without sounding harsh, when you act like a cnut for so long, players and manager won't tolerate it forever.
In hindsight, why do you think Mourinho failed?
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With Real, definitely but again no one can compete with that Real side when it comes to personnel. With Chelsea, the difference is the competition. His Chelsea competed in a league that Leicester could win and managers like Rogers and Pellegrini. That makes a huge difference to a league campaign.
The game has moved on both tactically and the way players are man managed, he never kept up with either.
I think Mou's biggest failure was his total incompetence on the transfer market. He spent 72m on defenders and he cane begging for more. He spent 180m in midfield and he thought we lack bite. That creates a toxic environment were on one hand you have the money men thinking they are throwing money in an endless pit while on the other hand you have players who feel they weren't given a fair shot. The fact that the manager never owned his mistakes and shifted all the blame on others didnt help
Noticed that nobody addressed this postThe last five PL winning managers list is interesting.
Pep
Conte
Ranieri
Jose
Pelligrini
So yeah, I guess high intensity pressing attacking football is what wins the EPL
The primary reason is the incompetence all around him, and at times from himself.
This was his third season, they extended his contract earlier this year. They clearly didn't want to sack him. Would you have given him more time? Or am I reading this wrong.
The answer to all of this simple. It's 15 years since his rise as a manger began and it's probably 10 years since his peak. How many managers actually sustain success that long across multiple leagues and clubs?
Given how his previous stint at Chelsea had gone, there was ample warning too.
I thought he'd change for Manchester United, but the truth is, he was already done.
He did the exact same thing in second Chelsea stint. He’s notorious for creating an unworkable environment, throwing everyone under the bus if he runs out of ideas and wants his severance money.
His toxic negativity which crept in approximately one and a half years into his tenure.
He pretty much wrote this season off before it even started.
He pretty much wrote this season off before it even started.
Pretty much, he had no ability to bend or accept compromise and work with a situation he might not be completely happy with. It ultimately end up in him self destructing. For what it is worth I think tactically he's one of the best. A team in his image going up against a top team I'd always expect a chance of a result.
Someone mentioned pressing, the bizarre thing is some of our best play came in the big games where he pressed the opposition, and then we'd go to some lowly team the next week and step off them. Utterly mind boggling at times.
Fair comment. I just dont think we should all pin 100% of the blame at Jose's door. Many players in that squad are not good enough, and it will take a long time to rebuild (again), but even more worrying how much time will it take to recoach these guys. People expecting that we will just flick a switch and start playing attacking football
The greatest sports team in history, the All Blacks have a simple mantra 'Stay Humble'. I'm not sure he ever took the job seriously tbh, he's become more obsessed than ever with enforcing his own personality. Me, me, me the whole time and when it didn't work out it was everyone else fault.
I wonder just how much actual work he did on the training field. And I wonder how much thought he put into his transfers. Not settling in the area and just lately travelling to games separate from the team doesn't sound like a man trying to build a team.
The mask had slipped at Madrid and fell off completely at Chelsea. He came to us with something to prove and should've wound his neck in and knuckled down instead he went the other way, slagging the club at every opportunity and being more obnoxious than ever.
A lot of fans, myself included, tried to get behind him and indulge his moods as anti-media or anti-establishment but the truth is that he was a wanker from day one really and never 'our wanker' either
I wonder just how much actual work he did on the training field. And I wonder how much thought he put into his transfers. Not settling in the area and just lately travelling to games separate from the team doesn't sound like a man trying to build a team.
The mask had slipped at Madrid and fell off completely at Chelsea. He came to us with something to prove and should've wound his neck in and knuckled down instead he went the other way, slagging the club at every opportunity and being more obnoxious than ever.
A lot of fans, myself included, tried to get behind him and indulge his moods as anti-media or anti-establishment but the truth is that he was a wanker from day one really and never 'our wanker' either
And fans, press etc. The guy just looks miserable as sin 90% of the time and created a horrible atmosphere around the club.
Would also say, it appears he just wants ready made players and doesn't coach players to any kind of decent level.
Yeah forgot club too. He should have been sacked after Sevilla game press conference.
His tactics and football philosophy are badly outdated and he never managed to catch up. Then his attitude and how he treats players. He never managed to build up players or bring them in form, actually he threw them under the bus at every opportunity
I’ll feel much better if our next manager chooses not to live in a hotel away from his family and become disillusioned with football and life in general.
He was shit toxic cnut.
Because he is JM and we in his eyes werent worthy enough for him to be 80% JM.
The board doesn't like him, the players don't like him, the fans don't like him.
That's when my opinion changed. Still wanted him to succeed but wasn't arsed if he went.
Mourinho failed a few years ago when he started to believe his own hype and no longer realized that the trainer, even though he's called "boss" is infinitely less important than the players on the pitch. He's there to make them look good, not the other way around. There's a reason Cruijff is more famous than Rinus Michels and Maradona is more famous than whoever it is that coached them during that world cup. A trainer should be in the shadows, making sure that the players are put in their best positions, work together as a team, and have a clear style of play and that's it. He's honestly failed to do any of this.
The special one lost his mojo
He didn't want to be here after the summer. There were some issues prior but nothing that couldn't be resolved imo.
It's the defence thats cost him his job but i don't think he cared about fixing it or we'd have seen a tactical shift. I think he was just sulking and waiting for January, wouldn't be shocked if he and woody had fallen out over this coming window.
It's the defence thats cost him his job but i don't think he cared about fixing it or we'd have seen a tactical shift. I think he was just sulking and waiting for January, wouldn't be shocked if he and woody had fallen out over this coming window.
I just felt we had no attacking tactic. We were clueless. As if we didn’t train attacking drills ever.
We have not scored one counter attack this season.
He was clueless as Moyes this season.
We have not scored one counter attack this season.
He was clueless as Moyes this season.
When the chips were down, he responded by stubbornly sticking to the tactics and players that he felt had served him well, instead of trying something new or different.
It's right to say that Jose didn't want to adapt. But from what to what he refused to adapt is the more interesting question.
He didn't want to accept the new defensive approach involving intensive pressing. It is a cornerstone of Jose's understanding of the game that the opposition should be allowed to enjoy possession in certain zones in order to free spaces that can be exploited with fast transitions. This passive defensive approach has become dated with Guadiola, Klopp, Simeone, Poch, etc. - they are very different managers but all of them are adamant that the oppopsition shouldn't be alowed to play and should be intensively pressed.
He tried to counter the new tactical developments by assembling a team of giants, especially in midfield, and failed. No other modern manager would have all of Matic, Fellaini, Pogba, McTominay, Lukaku in the same team as they can't properly press. Fellaini and Matic might cover 11 km per game but mostly by jogging around.
I started to think that Jose is out of his depth already in the first few games at United when he lined up with Fellaini as a DM, Rooney and Zlatan. It was obvious that playing with intensity wasn't particularly important for him.
He didn't want to accept the new defensive approach involving intensive pressing. It is a cornerstone of Jose's understanding of the game that the opposition should be allowed to enjoy possession in certain zones in order to free spaces that can be exploited with fast transitions. This passive defensive approach has become dated with Guadiola, Klopp, Simeone, Poch, etc. - they are very different managers but all of them are adamant that the oppopsition shouldn't be alowed to play and should be intensively pressed.
He tried to counter the new tactical developments by assembling a team of giants, especially in midfield, and failed. No other modern manager would have all of Matic, Fellaini, Pogba, McTominay, Lukaku in the same team as they can't properly press. Fellaini and Matic might cover 11 km per game but mostly by jogging around.
I started to think that Jose is out of his depth already in the first few games at United when he lined up with Fellaini as a DM, Rooney and Zlatan. It was obvious that playing with intensity wasn't particularly important for him.
The man has an ego the size of Everest. When he doesn't get what he wants (which is a blank cheque book) he can't stand it and gets really petulant.
He started moaning in the preseason itself once he knew he wouldn't get his CB and then systematically dragged down the morale of the entire squad and fanbase whole falling out with the board. We've seen this happen at Chelsea (twice) and at Madrid as well.
Honestly if he tried to actually motivate the players he had instead of shitting all over them, we would easily have been in the race for top 4 instead of turning the whole thing into a media circus (leaking that he called Pogba a virus through his mouthpiece ffs).
I honestly think once he realized he isn't going to get the players he wanted this season, he was ready to take the early payout and leave. Combined with being away from the family and living in a hotel, it was an easy decision.
He'll probably take the rest of the season and then go to Inter or international management and put the blame on everyone but him for his failure at United.
Which is so sad considering there was real improvement in his first two seasons after the state of our squad after Lvg left.
He started moaning in the preseason itself once he knew he wouldn't get his CB and then systematically dragged down the morale of the entire squad and fanbase whole falling out with the board. We've seen this happen at Chelsea (twice) and at Madrid as well.
Honestly if he tried to actually motivate the players he had instead of shitting all over them, we would easily have been in the race for top 4 instead of turning the whole thing into a media circus (leaking that he called Pogba a virus through his mouthpiece ffs).
I honestly think once he realized he isn't going to get the players he wanted this season, he was ready to take the early payout and leave. Combined with being away from the family and living in a hotel, it was an easy decision.
He'll probably take the rest of the season and then go to Inter or international management and put the blame on everyone but him for his failure at United.
Which is so sad considering there was real improvement in his first two seasons after the state of our squad after Lvg left.
He spat his dummy out at the beginning of this season because he wanted certain players and went the extra mile to try and prove he was right even sabotaging our team constantly shuffling the defence and playing midfielders there to say "I told ya so".
Then obviously wanted out and was kicking up a fuss left-right-centre.
Then obviously wanted out and was kicking up a fuss left-right-centre.
I think himself he failed tactically. Outdated tactics. Footballers are top athletes and we don’t run. We never looked to boss games even vs bottom teams. No intensity or pace to us. Finger in the wind approach to tactics. Players drawn into their positions from a tombola machine.
Also he inherited a patchwork squad from three previous managers full of shit like darmian Jones and rojo but then signed questionable new players.
For example, why sign an 80m striker who is shite at holding up a ball and has been at Everton for seasons but who is murderous running in behind onto one when you know you want him to be target man and hold up player in the system you play? Can you imagine playing Vardy in our system? Just because he’s big and strong doesn’t mean he’s a target man. Some quick fix signings like matic and Ibrahimovic as well were never going to be part of a long term stable picture. I agree that there was a huge rebuilding process needed when he took over but I don’t understand why the players we signed don’t play - why can’t Bailey and lindelof play behind a midfield of pogba matic and Fred? Why did those players get signed? No clear picture of how players were going to fit a system
Also he inherited a patchwork squad from three previous managers full of shit like darmian Jones and rojo but then signed questionable new players.
For example, why sign an 80m striker who is shite at holding up a ball and has been at Everton for seasons but who is murderous running in behind onto one when you know you want him to be target man and hold up player in the system you play? Can you imagine playing Vardy in our system? Just because he’s big and strong doesn’t mean he’s a target man. Some quick fix signings like matic and Ibrahimovic as well were never going to be part of a long term stable picture. I agree that there was a huge rebuilding process needed when he took over but I don’t understand why the players we signed don’t play - why can’t Bailey and lindelof play behind a midfield of pogba matic and Fred? Why did those players get signed? No clear picture of how players were going to fit a system
Did fine in his first two years, won some trophies. Third year he clearly had a breakdown with Ed and then player revolt. Don't think there was any real way back without some serious squad surgery.
He just isn't that great of a manager anymore. We should've seen what happened at Chelsea and taken heed.
He's probably still good enough to do a reasonable job for a kind of mid-level big club like Inter but I think he's done at the very top level now, too many managers have come in at other top clubs and made his style look prehistoric.
He's probably still good enough to do a reasonable job for a kind of mid-level big club like Inter but I think he's done at the very top level now, too many managers have come in at other top clubs and made his style look prehistoric.
The board and players failed him, simple as that. Give Mourinho the right tools and he can achieve everything but the management didn't and the players care more about their self interest than playing for the badge. A yes man like Ole can stroke their egos until a proper coach come in and sort them out properly.
I think the reason why he failed is Jose being Jose.
He moaned about being a victim in the media then then calculatingly used the media for his own devices. I think he lost the pair of balls he originally had when he came here. When things went wrong he could not take the blame himself, he'd blame the agenda from the media, the board the players, anyone because he is not a big enough man to take it on the chin.
He'd blame the owners for not spending the the money on the players he wanted, which some could say they were right in doing as most of his players he wanted were in their late twenties at exorbitant fees which we would need to replace as has happened now he was going anyway.
He needs to buy into the traditions of the club he is managing and get down off hid high horse and embrace them.
His ego is too big and he thinks he is bigger than anyone/thing in football including Manchester United. He needs to learn to how to build a team from what you've got, as not every club is going to give him as generous backing as we have.
Also he needs to learn to stop throwing players under the bus if he he has a problem he should keep it in house \s this lets our rivals know that that we have a problem, he should be intelligent and experienced enough to know this is not the right way to go about things. Between him and Ed they seemed clueless and didn't know what the plan was.
I think he should realise that we needed to take the game to the other team as when we wait for for them to make a mistake it may only be once or twice a game and when this happens we have to score. Most of his signings didn't work as well as they could have for one reason or another.
Due to hid previous defensive record I thought we were going to do well, to counter attack well you have have to be able to absorb the pressure then hit them like lightning on the break, when did try and counter the transition was so slow that that we lost all momentum. Considering we were supposed to be a counter attacking team it is strange that per Whoscored we never scored a goal from a counter attack all season. When he decided to play midfielders in defense because we didn't get him Alderweireld just stunk of spite.
By him not getting a home here and staying at Lowry made it seem that he wasn't here for long term and i think that probably irritated a number of fans. Football evolved and due to being an arrogant narcissistic git he could move with the times.
He moaned about being a victim in the media then then calculatingly used the media for his own devices. I think he lost the pair of balls he originally had when he came here. When things went wrong he could not take the blame himself, he'd blame the agenda from the media, the board the players, anyone because he is not a big enough man to take it on the chin.
He'd blame the owners for not spending the the money on the players he wanted, which some could say they were right in doing as most of his players he wanted were in their late twenties at exorbitant fees which we would need to replace as has happened now he was going anyway.
He needs to buy into the traditions of the club he is managing and get down off hid high horse and embrace them.
His ego is too big and he thinks he is bigger than anyone/thing in football including Manchester United. He needs to learn to how to build a team from what you've got, as not every club is going to give him as generous backing as we have.
Also he needs to learn to stop throwing players under the bus if he he has a problem he should keep it in house \s this lets our rivals know that that we have a problem, he should be intelligent and experienced enough to know this is not the right way to go about things. Between him and Ed they seemed clueless and didn't know what the plan was.
I think he should realise that we needed to take the game to the other team as when we wait for for them to make a mistake it may only be once or twice a game and when this happens we have to score. Most of his signings didn't work as well as they could have for one reason or another.
Due to hid previous defensive record I thought we were going to do well, to counter attack well you have have to be able to absorb the pressure then hit them like lightning on the break, when did try and counter the transition was so slow that that we lost all momentum. Considering we were supposed to be a counter attacking team it is strange that per Whoscored we never scored a goal from a counter attack all season. When he decided to play midfielders in defense because we didn't get him Alderweireld just stunk of spite.
By him not getting a home here and staying at Lowry made it seem that he wasn't here for long term and i think that probably irritated a number of fans. Football evolved and due to being an arrogant narcissistic git he could move with the times.
There's probably a multitude of reasons, but in my opinion the main ones are he's terrible at man management over a longer period. And keeps falling out with and alienating players he doesn't like personally. He seems to be unable to avoid a meltdown in his 3rd year at clubs, where he starts fighting with the board and players and just generally being a miserable cnut.
That and he never settled on one formation or style. This season being the worst where he has switched formations and line-ups by the week.
Results wise his first two seasons were relatively successful, two trophies and CL in his first season. If not for City breaking the points record last year, in most other seasons we probably could have won the league or came close.
That and he never settled on one formation or style. This season being the worst where he has switched formations and line-ups by the week.
Results wise his first two seasons were relatively successful, two trophies and CL in his first season. If not for City breaking the points record last year, in most other seasons we probably could have won the league or came close.
I think his downfall was due to his complete contempt for everyone.
When he arrived at Chelsea the first time he was charming and always had something witty to say. You look at him as United manager and it appeared as though he trusted no one and took every opportunity to push the blame on someone else because he was worried to death someone would call him a busted flush.
I would question how much he actually enjoys management anymore, he seems to have fallen out of love with the game. The constant pressure to watch everything you say and do probably takes its toll on you after 15 years.
All in all, I think trying to live off your past achievements instead of trying to win people over and support them was his downfall. When you turn on your own players there's no reason for them to go out and perform for you.
When he arrived at Chelsea the first time he was charming and always had something witty to say. You look at him as United manager and it appeared as though he trusted no one and took every opportunity to push the blame on someone else because he was worried to death someone would call him a busted flush.
I would question how much he actually enjoys management anymore, he seems to have fallen out of love with the game. The constant pressure to watch everything you say and do probably takes its toll on you after 15 years.
All in all, I think trying to live off your past achievements instead of trying to win people over and support them was his downfall. When you turn on your own players there's no reason for them to go out and perform for you.
Because he's a 3 season manager, always had been and always fails in his 3rd season. I have little doubt that had he stayed 1 more season in Porto and Inter he would have failed in those clubs too. His methods are designed to squueze the max potential out of the squad, but in an manner that is unsustainable. And sooner or latter his players get tired of playing under a dictator like him and rebel.
Pretty much.
One of the biggest issues was not properly replacing his assistant. He has one who would robustly challenge his ideas/ team selections etc. That's why I think he went off the rails this time.
He is just past it in every way. What worked 10 years doesnt work now.
In the summer, he was a great pundit for the World cup i thought. Excellent analysis for thr games. When you look at him here, he seems like he has no clue. He has his methods and he doesnt deviate from it, he doesnt want to adapt. He gets top jobs, has more often than nit success and instead of building on it, he just doesnt seem to care. Gets sacked, takes the money and he goes again. He doesnt look like he loves football, maybe his private life has something to do with it living alone in the hotel. It takes a toll on everyone. He is a weird guy and a complete misfit here, should have never been hired. His best days are behind him
In the summer, he was a great pundit for the World cup i thought. Excellent analysis for thr games. When you look at him here, he seems like he has no clue. He has his methods and he doesnt deviate from it, he doesnt want to adapt. He gets top jobs, has more often than nit success and instead of building on it, he just doesnt seem to care. Gets sacked, takes the money and he goes again. He doesnt look like he loves football, maybe his private life has something to do with it living alone in the hotel. It takes a toll on everyone. He is a weird guy and a complete misfit here, should have never been hired. His best days are behind him
He is a miserable, negative, life sucking demon. Forget everything else. If he just showed an ounce of praise and positivity he wouldn't have been sacked. It like he sank into depression and pulled the club with him. Dark days, long nights.
That's what I thought in february 2016, I was still willing to welcome him and as hopeful as anyone else but to me there were question marks over his head. He has the wrong mentality for clubs that are expected to be at the top, basically Juventus, Real, Bayern, Barcelona, United and now City and PSG. He is probably perfect for perennial outsiders, he creates a mental siege for a couple of seasons achieve something deemed special for this club and then leaves because everyone is tired to be treated like minnows, he has continuously failed to go from outsiders to assumed favorites and it's demonstrated by his tactical approach during big games and when his team is on top, he will retreat in the fetal position.