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I think England would do much better without him, if they hired a modern, progressive manager. Much like Ole, he'll have his defenders who will point to his 'achievements'.Funnily enough that's what started the debate.
@Dion seems to think hes competent which I find astounding.
It started from me saying Southgate is an international equivalent of Ole. Both shit mangers.Perfectly average manager, like middle of the Championship tier.
I saw Dion's posts btw and thought he was mainly trying to say that the standard of international managers tends to veer on the 'average' side generally. I don't think it's an outrageous point because the best managers overall tend to be active at club level not international level. It pays more, brings better rewards, and suits more ambitious, younger managers, etc.
In that area he could be considered competent. He's had his time with England and done okay. I'd like to see a change though after the world cup
It's still an (unironically) shit thread. You're still presenting people with a false binary choice of someone being shit or not shit, which people are going to default to "good" because not-something is such a vague concept to articulate. Anyone with anything negative to say about Southgate is then going to vote shit as if it's a binary choice.Retitled the thread because @Dion wanted it to be clear we are referring to him as England manager.
Not that I think it changes much.
A myth for me. Don’t think this group is especially exceptional. Kane, Foden probably the only two truly world class players there.I wouldn’t say he’s crap, but he’s certainly no better than average and he is in my opinion wasting this generation of England players with his crap defensive football
It’s been pretty sensational when you compare to every England manager post 1966. Blew the chance of a generation at the Euros. Fear it could be 20 years + until England get an opportunity like that again but Italy worthy winners.I can't stand his boring style but anyone saying he has been shit for England is just not real with themselves. He has had a decent tenure. Euro finals and WC semis isn't shabby. Just like with Ole. Very limited manager but far from shit. You don't finish 2nd and 3rd and reach europa finals being shit. Average , yes but a shit United manager is just rewriting history.
England's overall talent is incredible, but they're one of those countries where the talent is really poorly distributed. No #8 type midfielders like a Modric, Brozovic, Kimmich, Verrati, Koke, Gundogan or Eriksen who can run a game from there, no great CBs and the star striker doesn't seem to fit well with the wingers around him.It’s been pretty sensational when you compare to every England manager post 1966. Blew the chance of a generation at the Euros. Fear it could be 20 years + until England get an opportunity like that again but Italy worthy winners.
England having some sort of incredible squad or golden generation is a myth for me. Fair play to him for how well he’s done.
If you can't imagine a manager making a sub and changing the formation 25-35 minutes in when the game is going really poorly for his team like Potter today, I don't know if you can be a good manager.We can appreciate being England manager isn’t easy but with such an array of talented players to choose from right now, I’m surprised how mentally rigid Southgate’s become. He’s the complete opposite to how any modern successful coach works, preferring not to rotate the squad or adjust tactics to suit the conditions of a game. It makes life a lot simpler for the opposition when they know who’ll be selected by default.
I feel this would bs the most accurate assessment of himI think he’s a terrible manager but when it comes to international football luck is very important and he clearly has spades of it.
A better manager might have gotten better results for England, but I doubt they’ll get such an easy draw that England has had under Southgate.