I get what you're saying but he's regressed this year - we have no time for sentimentality in our current state. Same as with DDG, great players at the club at the wrong time.
Is it sensible to carry on with Bruno as the focal point of our team next season?
- Thread starter Bastian
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He's output has declined massively over the last 18 months, both in terms of goals and assists.
He's only scored 3 league goals this season, and 8 the season before. The simple matter is, if he is not scoring or assisting, he's a bit useless.
I think we need to start looking for a replacement.
He's only scored 3 league goals this season, and 8 the season before. The simple matter is, if he is not scoring or assisting, he's a bit useless.
I think we need to start looking for a replacement.
I think we are currently 5 goals under out expected, we clearly have no good finishers.
But don't you think requiring someone of Haaland's calibre in itself is an issue? Only one team has him and most other teams manage just fine.
Miles past his prime.
I think it’s more the quality of chances De Bruyne creates compared to Bruno. Bruno creates a lot of half chances that are not easy finishes where as DeBruyne lays them on a plate for someone to finish.
Anyone who watches them can see DeBruyne is miles ahead in ability and quality but you know what stats say Bruno creates more.
I'm not being sentimental. If you look at the statistics his having an almost identical season to Ødegaard, who appears to be flying at Arsenal. Yet he is superior to him defensively and still creating more. It serves to show just how our bad season as a team has made some of our better performers like him appear average to poor.
The point was though, De Bruyne racks up more assists because he has someone like that finishing them of. Fernandes has Rashford… who isn’t as clinical.
Bruno is on the decline, I think that’s obvious to see, he might still be racking up the chances created but his overall performances are an issue as he gives the ball and therefore control of the game away far to much.
If we are talking about evolving as a team we should look to move him on and replace with someone who can control the game more and spread chance creation throughout the team.
If we are talking about evolving as a team we should look to move him on and replace with someone who can control the game more and spread chance creation throughout the team.
Haaland is just a represenation of the ideal though. At the very least a highly creative has to behind an attack with decent goal scoring and coordinating ability to shine. Bruno right now plays behind our worst combined in decades. With strictly Rasmus looking like the only able to deliver goals consistently and combined consistently with the rest.
Whilst KDB since reaching City has never operated behind such a mostly mpotent attack in terms of chance taking
Assists have nothing to do with Bruno’s chance creation; it’s not his fault the chances aren’t finished.
The point is a lot of the chances he "creates" based on that rubbish metric are not good chances or even half chances.
He passes out to Antony who waddles around a bit and hits a rubbish shot from 25 yards that goes 5 yards wide. Still counts as a chance created for Bruno. Same when he passes to Rashford or Garnacho and they maybe do a stepover and smash it into someones shins.
I just don’t know with him.
Where’s the data on this? I was in here earlier & saw some claim he only creates ‘half chances’.
I love him
There’s a decent post from @Zehner in the Fernandes thread which basically illustrates that Fernandes’ quality of chances created are basically the same/a little worse than the other major playmakers in the league, and a bit more worse than KDB directly: https://www.redcafe.net/threads/bruno-fernandes-2023-24-performances.478034/post-31683517
You can see it just looking at Bruno leading 'chances created' in seasons gone by, but he never leads on 'big chances created' and is even further away from the top on assists.
It's a reflection on how we play as a team as well. Bruno plays a lot of short passes around the edge of the box in front of the defense. ETH's (and Ole's) football relies so much on wide players creating chances and goals out of nothing. Like Rashford did today, Garnacho did vs Everton, all of Antony's goals, lots of Rashfords goals last season.
It's not like Bruno plays a lot of crosses that set up brilliant chances on the 6 yard line, like De Bruyne does. Of course we havent had a proper striker for ages which partly explains that.
It’s the wrong role for Mctominay really, surely Amrabat at DM and pushing Mainoo up a bit would be better
No, but we cannot sell until we find a replacement. I would keep him for another 1 to 2 years before selling him off.
Anonymous today.
The only reason he's the focal point is because we don't have a striker. Stick an RvP, RvN, Rooney type player into the mix and it alleviates much of the perceived reliance on Bruno, since we would be scoring a hell of a lot more goals and accruing more points along the way.
Thanks.
‘So in essence, Bruno makes up for a slightly lower chance quality with a higher frequency. In terms of raw output, he's on a similar level to Ödegaard and Saka but significantly behind de Bruyne.’
He’s on a similar level to the Arsenal boys with more frequency & is bested by a generational player in KdB. I don’t read that data as him creating ‘half chances’ as opposed to others creating ‘full’ ones.
In his last season played as a 10 he created nearly a chance more than his contemporaries, bar KdB, with 0.01 less xG. I’m not clued up on xG but can someone explain what it a difference of 0.01 actually means because for chance creation I’d rather have the player creating one more a game.
Bar KdB, we don’t consistently see any of Bruno’s peers serve up goal after goal anywhere near the rate though.
Everybody cites Arsenal as something extraordinary. By the EPL Big Chances Created table he’s created the same amount as Odegaard & 1 less than Saka, I’d say both those players are performing in a better coached side with better players.
Bruno is suffering from the ‘Not as good as X player who is generally an outlier’ syndrome. Is he the world’s best midfielder? Well obviously not but he creates for lesser players at a higher consistency than his replacement level opponents.
We need to eventually replace him [sooner rather than later hopefully] but saying he creates ‘half chances’ just doesn’t stand up to scrutiny.
I dont mind anyone saying he's important because he creates as many good chances as Saka, Odegaard etc, even if hes worse in possession and way too careless with the ball to fit into an Arsenal or City team.
Part of that issue also stems from having a manager who plays him too deep and doesn't control his disjointed pressing and roaming. I'd be interest to see him in a team that all presses high up the pitch where he's only ever in our half when defending set pieces.
He’s literally never had a good game against a top side.
This for me is the main issue. The tactics being deployed actually accentuate his shortcomings instead of empowering the better parts of his game.
He’s a 10. If his lack of performance in a different role were a standout with other players excelling I’d be far more ready to criticise him but the tactic is shite for the squad available.
I’d keep him and buy his replacement so we can phase him out, Florian Witz is the obvious choice.