Is the PL now like La Liga?

[432JuanMata]

I know it hasn’t been 10 never mind 5 years but looking at this season most of the top 6 big teams have been poor. For example we have 3 wins in 10 league games and we are ahead of Spurs.

Let’s face the fact only 2 teams can win the league this year, like last year and for the foresee able future. While I still think the PL is the best league in the world it has become a 2 horse race like most leagues(some are 1)

 

[Jericho]

It pretty much always has been a two horse race. Spurs threatened one year, and Leicester won it in a year where everyone was shit. Beyond that, there's usually only two teams that look like winning it each year in my opinion.

 

[RUCK4444]

The difference being the two challenging can vary far more in the PL.

 

[DVG7]

I don't think it has to be honest, and this is recency bias plus a hypothetic outlook on the future which doesn't always end up yielding what you would expect it to. I think its a bit unfair to think the league has become a two horse race when you consider that the only time Liverpool and Man city have finished first and second was 6 months ago. Prior to that you had top 2's of;

17/18: 1st Man city 2nd Man Utd
16/17: 1st Chelsea 2nd Spurs
15/16: 1st Leicester 2nd Arsenal
14/15: 1st Chelsea 2nd Man City

It's easy to jump on the bandwagon of "City and Liverpool are the two strongest sides to ever grace the premiership" but the reality is they are both very beatable, and Liverpool in particular are one or two injuries away from having some serious problems with the quality of their squad ( Van Dijk and any one of the front three). City have been beaten off Norwich and Wolves this season, and Liverpool will probably drop some unexpected points so i'd stop short of proclaiming them the top two just yet. After all, you only have to look at the table above to see just how crazy this league can be, and who's to say Leicester can't do it again? It's what is so spectacular about this league, the unpredictability, and even though on paper it would seem like Man City and Liverpool are streets above everyone else, it would take a sustained period of domination before the league could be considered a genuine two horse race every year.

Also, in recent times La Liga has begun to shake off its two horse race shackles, with Atletico Madrid now firmly established as a club that can genuinely compete with the big two. I'm not sure if your comparison was meant to reflect modern times or what the Spanish league was for so long, and even then there always comes a time when other teams step up (Valencia, Deportivo, Villareal)

The premier league is always a couple of moments away from turning a season on its head, lets hope that it continues to deliver on that front and brings a few people back down to earth.

 

[Dr. Dwayne]

Mo' money, mo' problems.

 

[padr81]

It pretty much always has been a two horse race. Spurs threatened one year, and Leicester won it in a year where everyone was shit. Beyond that, there's usually only two teams that look like winning it each year in my opinion.

This ^^^^

First it was United v Arsenal, than United v Chelsea, than United v Chelsea v City and now City v Liverpool. Bar the odd blip season and a couple where teams overlapped (the downfall of Arsense and rise of Chelsea). Though the teams have changed unlike other leagues.

The top 6 thing and 6 potential challengers is a myth pushed by Sky, just like the old "Big 4" etc.. The PL is usually 3 leagues within 1, (the 2-3 teams going for the title, the teams better than everyone else but not good enough to win a title, the rest) During the Fergie, Jose heyday this would be (United, Chelsea -- Arsenal, Liverpool, Everton under Moyes -- the rest). The only difference with the prem is over time the teams competing changed where as Barca and Real are mainstays in Spain.

The closest team the prem has had to a 3 horse title race is when Leicester and Spurs were in a 2 horse race and Spurs came 3rd. Other than that its been a 2 horse race or a procession.

 

[el3mel]

It pretty much always has been a two horse race. Spurs threatened one year, and Leicester won it in a year where everyone was shit. Beyond that, there's usually only two teams that look like winning it each year in my opinion.

Agree. The "top 6 battling all for it" idea was just a dream by the English media but it has been a 2 horse race for as long as I can remember. There have always been 2 teams better than the rest each season.

 

[Sky1981]

It has always been a 2 horse race everywhere, just that the 2 horse changes every 5 years.

Live with it.

 

[stepic]

Is there a team with the financial might of United in La liga that isn’t Barca or Madrid?

 

[thepolice123]

Very rare we will get to see a title race that has more than two teams.

The only one from recent times was the 13/14 season when Atletico won the title with Real and Barca behind. It went down to the final day for all 3 teams.

 

[Stepney73]

This ^^^^

First it was United v Arsenal, than United v Chelsea, than United v Chelsea v City and now City v Liverpool. Bar the odd blip season and a couple where teams overlapped (the downfall of Arsense and rise of Chelsea). Though the teams have changed unlike other leagues.

The top 6 thing and 6 potential challengers is a myth pushed by Sky, just like the old "Big 4" etc.. The PL is usually 3 leagues within 1, (the 2-3 teams going for the title, the teams better than everyone else but not good enough to win a title, the rest) During the Fergie, Jose heyday this would be (United, Chelsea -- Arsenal, Liverpool, Everton under Moyes -- the rest). The only difference with the prem is over time the teams competing changed where as Barca and Real are mainstays in Spain.

The closest team the prem has had to a 3 horse title race is when Leicester and Spurs were in a 2 horse race and Spurs came 3rd. Other than that its been a 2 horse race or a procession.

I think Utd v Leeds then Utd v Blackburn was the first so called top 2 fighting for the league over more than one season(even though the Leeds comparison started on the last year of the old division 1).

 

[KirkDuyt]

This is what, the second season that it seems to be between City and Pool? So, no, needs about 10 more years for that.

 

[Tostao_80]

I don't think it has to be honest, and this is recency bias plus a hypothetic outlook on the future which doesn't always end up yielding what you would expect it to. I think its a bit unfair to think the league has become a two horse race when you consider that the only time Liverpool and Man city have finished first and second was 6 months ago. Prior to that you had top 2's of;

17/18: 1st Man city 2nd Man Utd
16/17: 1st Chelsea 2nd Spurs
15/16: 1st Leicester 2nd Arsenal
14/15: 1st Chelsea 2nd Man City

It's easy to jump on the bandwagon of "City and Liverpool are the two strongest sides to ever grace the premiership" but the reality is they are both very beatable, and Liverpool in particular are one or two injuries away from having some serious problems with the quality of their squad ( Van Dijk and any one of the front three). City have been beaten off Norwich and Wolves this season, and Liverpool will probably drop some unexpected points so i'd stop short of proclaiming them the top two just yet. After all, you only have to look at the table above to see just how crazy this league can be, and who's to say Leicester can't do it again? It's what is so spectacular about this league, the unpredictability, and even though on paper it would seem like Man City and Liverpool are streets above everyone else, it would take a sustained period of domination before the league could be considered a genuine two horse race every year.

Also, in recent times La Liga has begun to shake off its two horse race shackles, with Atletico Madrid now firmly established as a club that can genuinely compete with the big two. I'm not sure if your comparison was meant to reflect modern times or what the Spanish league was for so long, and even then there always comes a time when other teams step up (Valencia, Deportivo, Villareal)

The premier league is always a couple of moments away from turning a season on its head, lets hope that it continues to deliver on that front and brings a few people back down to earth.

You just said that Liverpool are very beatable. That doesn't square with reality. Theyve lost one of their last 50 league games, and that was to Man City. From Citys last 103 league games, theyve only lost 9. Those arent stats of very beatable teams.
And Leicester are not winning the league again, that was just a one off. Can you see them getting the 90 to 95 points needed to win the league? Even when they won it, didn't they barely just get over 80?

 

[Zlaatan]

Agree. The "top 6 battling all for it" idea was just a dream by the English media but it has been a 2 horse race for as long as I can remember. There have always been 2 teams better than the rest each season.

Having all 6 teams battling for the championship every season, or even one season, is never going to happen. But all of the top 6 teams have finished either 1st or 2nd over the past 5 years, with Leicester thrown in once for good measure which gives at least some truth to the statement.

It's most likely going to be nothing but City and Liverpool for a few years now though.

 

[Number4.]

no - because there isn't the wealth divide that there is in la liga.

PL is in a cycle to two teams miles ahead. Liverpool have shown that two years of excellent management and signings can propel a team in the PL and as soon as the Klopp / Pep cycles end over the next few years they will move back to the 85 points mark i'd imagine

 

[UweBein]

Top 4 was a proper title race, for a certain period.
We had several top3 races, e.g. City Liverpool Chelsea.
Only recently it‘s reduced . But there are reasons for that: Spurs‘ new Stadium, Arsenal and United post-BestManager-hangover, Chelsea‘s transfer ban.
As soon as these issues are cleared, the top 3 race (at least) will be on.

 

[Needham]

It's defo a top 2 for the moment. That will end when City and Liverpool's managers leave. Especially Liverpool. We are like the conservatives waiting for Blair to feck off.

 

[Massive Spanner]

Is there a team with the financial might of United in La liga that isn’t Barca or Madrid?

No but Atletico are getting there with their new stadium and increased success. Probably equivalent to Arsenal/Chelsea.

 

[el3mel]

It's defo a top 2 for the moment. That will end when City and Liverpool's managers leave. Especially Liverpool. We are like the conservatives waiting for Blair to feck off.

City will keep challenging after Pep easily. Not to the 100 points degree of course but they have a top tier squad, most of the old players have their replacements ready and they have ton of money to spend in case something went wrong with their team.

Liverpool yeah but when will Klopp leave? I honestly can't see him leaving for the next 5 years.

 

[Needham]

City will keep challenging after Pep easily. Not to the 100 points degree of course but they have a top tier squad, most of the old players have their replacements ready and they have ton of money to spend in case something went wrong with their team.
Liverpool yeah but when will Klopp leave? I honestly can't see him leaving for the next 5 years.

It concerns me that Liverpool's squad is not an aging one. But their chequebook is rational, they can be matched in recruitment.

 

[Warlord]

City will keep challenging after Pep easily. Not to the 100 points degree of course but they have a top tier squad, most of the old players have their replacements ready and they have ton of money to spend in case something went wrong with their team.

Liverpool yeah but when will Klopp leave? I honestly can't see him leaving for the next 5 years.

Klopp is contracted till 2022 and wants to manage the German national team so in 2022 he might leave

 

[BlueMoonOutcast]

No. This is only the second year Liverpool are even competing at the top. In 17/18 they finished 25 points behind us. Things can change in a heartbeat. City won ten in a row in Pep's first season and Chelsea romped the league.

 

[DVG7]

You just said that Liverpool are very beatable. That doesn't square with reality. Theyve lost one of their last 50 league games, and that was to Man City. From Citys last 103 league games, theyve only lost 9. Those arent stats of very beatable teams.
And Leicester are not winning the league again, that was just a one off. Can you see them getting the 90 to 95 points needed to win the league? Even when they won it, didn't they barely just get over 80?

With Leicester I was more insinuating that they could make it more than a two horse race, not necessarily win the thing.

In today’s world and on this forum in particular, I think too many people jump straight to a conclusion. Like when a team goes 2-0 down, all the comments are “game over” and in some cases you get that at 1-0. I think it’s much better as a fan to keep in mind that the narratives can change, no matter how likely something might seem.

 

[Dancfc]

The PL was never streets above La Liga in the first place, it was just a hype machine.

It looked easy for the top two because Barca and Real were that good, not because the midtable/relegation sides were so bad, they were average but no less average than what we see in the bottom half of this league. Now the PL have two outstanding teams the league in which "anyone can beat anyone" aswell as 3 teams in 3 years hit points in the 90s and a further hit 100. Not only that, put of City, Liverpool and Chelsea last season, they between them won 55 out of 60 games against the bottom half sides (yes Chelsea for all our troubles under Sarri had 17 wins and 2 draws out of 20 against teams in bottom half who can apparently best anyone on their day), doesn't exactly scream competiveness.

In other words, PL and La Liga are two of the best leagues in the world, if not the two best, however PL was never streets ahead in quality/competiveness and it certainly isn't now.

 

[romufc]

Agree. The "top 6 battling all for it" idea was just a dream by the English media but it has been a 2 horse race for as long as I can remember

The media has never said there is 6 teams fighting for the league. It is top 6 in terms of quality of teams in the league.

The top 6 refers to the 6 clubs who have chances of winning silverware, not just in the league.

Chelsea were champions 3 seasons ago and liverpool were nowhere to be seen and then Liverpool 3 years on are top.

You don't see this in La liga generally, RM, Barca and Athletico are a given in the top 4.

 

[Green_Red]

Without the sunshine obviously

 

[Tostao_80]

With Leicester I was more insinuating that they could make it more than a two horse race, not necessarily win the thing.

In today’s world and on this forum in particular, I think too many people jump straight to a conclusion. Like when a team goes 2-0 down, all the comments are “game over” and in some cases you get that at 1-0. I think it’s much better as a fan to keep in mind that the narratives can change, no matter how likely something might seem.

You think Leicester could make it a three horse race for the league with this City, and this Liverpool? 2 teams so good that they got 197 combined points last season? That is far from possible. They would do well to finish top 6, never mind challenge the runaway top 2.

 

[Bocca9978]

Klopp is contracted till 2022 and wants to manage the German national team so in 2022 he might leave

Fixed it for you

 

[SweetRightFoot]

Really weird thread, it's almost the opposite.

La Liga has been a 2 and a half horse race since I was a young'un and started taking notice of Spanish domestic football. It's always Real & Barca and a rising star, usually with a good manager and a core of a team in their prime.

Just because we have, probably, the two best coaches in the world in the PL doesn't mean the rest of the league lacks quality like they do in La Liga. We have Marco Bielsa in our 2nd division! The PL is the most competitive league in the world bar none, right now more than ever. Real and Barca can go on beating Sociedad and Legantes 5-0 every fixture but you won't find another league where little teams like Norwich and Sheffield Utd come up and really get the big teams shook.

 

[Dancfc]

Really weird thread, it's almost the opposite.

La Liga has been a 2 and a half horse race since I was a young'un and started taking notice of Spanish domestic football. It's always Real & Barca and a rising star, usually with a good manager and a core of a team in their prime.

Just because we have, probably, the two best coaches in the world in the PL doesn't mean the rest of the league lacks quality like they do in La Liga. We have Marco Bielsa in our 2nd division! The PL is the most competitive league in the world bar none, right now more than ever. Real and Barca can go on beating Sociedad and Legantes 5-0 every fixture but you won't find another league where little teams like Norwich and Sheffield Utd come up and really get the big teams shook.

The top three's combined record against the bottom half sides in the PL last season was W55 D2 L3 with Liverpool winning all 20 of their's. The eventual Champions usually win a minimum 16 games against the bottom half sides.

It's no where near as competitive as made out, even Chelsea with all the troubles we had under Sarri won most of the bottom half games with minimum fuss.

If any of the big clubs are constantly finding games against relegation fodder "battles" that says more about them than anything else.

 

[Daysleeper]

Really weird thread, it's almost the opposite.

La Liga has been a 2 and a half horse race since I was a young'un and started taking notice of Spanish domestic football. It's always Real & Barca and a rising star, usually with a good manager and a core of a team in their prime.

Just because we have, probably, the two best coaches in the world in the PL doesn't mean the rest of the league lacks quality like they do in La Liga. We have Marco Bielsa in our 2nd division! The PL is the most competitive league in the world bar none, right now more than ever. Real and Barca can go on beating Sociedad and Legantes 5-0 every fixture but you won't find another league where little teams like Norwich and Sheffield Utd come up and really get the big teams shook.

The hell? In la liga you aren’t getting 8-0 9-0 matches like you do on the epl

And this is probably the worst top ten epl has had since the Leicester season. Pool and city are amazing but the rest leave much to be desired

And Sevilla was crushing it on Europe not that long ago multiple years in a row whole epl teams for the longest time were absolute crap in CL.

the EPL has plenty of mediocre teams, and la liga has a much much closer top ten where epl already has two teams head and shoulders above the rest this early in the season again

 

[MrEleson]

It's always been a "top 2 and the rest" with the exception of the 15/16 season when Leciester won (partly because the other top teams were utter trash).

Even when the premier league was the undisputed best league in the world between 2006-2010, it was literally a tussle between Man Utd & Chelsea. The 3rd and 4th placed teams on average finished 15-20points behind the top 2 and coming nowhere near winning the league like the media tried to push.

Now we have Liverpool & City as the undisputed top 2. With La Liga at least it was somewhat understandable with Barcelona & Madrid having those two freak of natures in Messi & Ronaldo and some all-time historic teams with historic players. This liverpool team doesn't have that calibre of players yet still blow the opposition away or win 9 times out 10. When the spanish giants were doing it, the quality of la liga always got questioned. Shouldn't the same people also question the quality of the rest of the premier league when liverpool with a lesser team are doing pretty much the same?

 

[romufc]

The hell? In la liga you aren’t getting 8-0 9-0 matches like you do on the epl

And this is probably the worst top ten epl has had since the Leicester season. Pool and city are amazing but the rest leave much to be desired

And Sevilla was crushing it on Europe not that long ago multiple years in a row whole epl teams for the longest time were absolute crap in CL.

the EPL has plenty of mediocre teams, and la liga has a much much closer top ten where epl already has two teams head and shoulders above the rest this early in the season again

The 9-0 was a freak result that doesnt happen often. Anyway these are the results from La Liga this season:-

Barca 5 - 2 Betis
Barca 5 - 2 Valencia
Villareal 5 - 1 Betis
Barca 4 - 0 Sevilla (whom are 4th)
Barca 5 - Valladolid
Villareal 4 - 1 Alaves

The reason PL top 10 looks swewed is because how good City and Pool are, similar to when Barca were dominating under Pep. The difference is that within the top 10 we have teams that can go to Pool or City and upset them, this wasn't the case under pep when Barca were flying.

Secondly, this is because the top 2 in La liga have dropped in quality, this is seen by the drop in champions league form too.

I dont think Liverpool or City would be scared to play Barca or Real but if you offered those teams the 2 english teams they would be nervous.

The fact you talk about Sevilla crushing it in Europe, English teams had 4 finalist in European competitions last season. This season we have 7 teams doing reasonably well.

 

[Daysleeper]

The 9-0 was a freak result that doesnt happen often. Anyway these are the results from La Liga this season:-

Barca 5 - 2 Betis
Barca 5 - 2 Valencia
Villareal 5 - 1 Betis
Barca 4 - 0 Sevilla (whom are 4th)
Barca 5 - Valladolid
Villareal 4 - 1 Alaves

The reason PL top 10 looks swewed is because how good City and Pool are, similar to when Barca were dominating under Pep. The difference is that within the top 10 we have teams that can go to Pool or City and upset them, this wasn't the case under pep when Barca were flying.

Secondly, this is because the top 2 in La liga have dropped in quality, this is seen by the drop in champions league form too.

I dont think Liverpool or City would be scared to play Barca or Real but if you offered those teams the 2 english teams they would be nervous.

The fact you talk about Sevilla crushing it in Europe, English teams had 4 finalist in European competitions last season. This season we have 7 teams doing reasonably well.

EPL has had far more lopsided scores this season than La Liga. There was also the 8-0 vs Watford. I know those aren't the norm, but I'll take the current top 10 in La Liga over the current top ten in EPL overall.

And City have choked constantly in CL, I'm far more worried about Liverpool who play with toughness than City who are all over the place although they have their share of injuries.

The top 10 in La Liga has far more parity than the top ten in EL.

 

[romufc]

EPL has had far more lopsided scores this season than La Liga. There was also the 8-0 vs Watford. I know those aren't the norm, but I'll take the current top 10 in La Liga over the current top ten in EPL overall.

And City have choked constantly in EPL, I'm far more worried about Liverpool who play with toughness than City who are all over the place although they have their share of injuries.

The top 10 in La Liga has far more parity than the top ten in EL.

Only time will tell, come the business end of the season and March time we will see how much difference there is.

It will be interesting to see how the EPL squads develop like Chelsea, Spurs in CL and United in EL

It will also be interesting how Real and Barca shape up, Barca as we know are desperate to win the champions league and Real Madrid is a question of how good is Zidane really?

 

[Aidan Azar]

Name a season in one of the big leagues recently where more than 2 teams fought for the title, there aren't many. At least the top 2 in England are changing regularly.

 

[giorno]

Really weird thread, it's almost the opposite.

La Liga has been a 2 and a half horse race since I was a young'un and started taking notice of Spanish domestic football. It's always Real & Barca and a rising star, usually with a good manager and a core of a team in their prime.

Just because we have, probably, the two best coaches in the world in the PL doesn't mean the rest of the league lacks quality like they do in La Liga. We have Marco Bielsa in our 2nd division! The PL is the most competitive league in the world bar none, right now more than ever. Real and Barca can go on beating Sociedad and Legantes 5-0 every fixture but you won't find another league where little teams like Norwich and Sheffield Utd come up and really get the big teams shook.

Barcelona lost to teams that were relegated in both the 08/09 season(treble) and 10/11(probably the best club side ever)

 

[Daysleeper]

Only time will tell, come the business end of the season and March time we will see how much difference there is.

It will be interesting to see how the EPL squads develop like Chelsea, Spurs in CL and United in EL

It will also be interesting how Real and Barca shape up, Barca as we know are desperate to win the champions league and Real Madrid is a question of how good is Zidane really?

All valid points, with Ronaldo gone and Messi most likely 3-4 years from retirement it will be interesting to see the future of these teams

 

[cyberman]

Na, Spain have been a glorified one horse race for a while now.
Big difference.

 

[Dancfc]

The 9-0 was a freak result that doesnt happen often. Anyway these are the results from La Liga this season:-

Barca 5 - 2 Betis
Barca 5 - 2 Valencia
Villareal 5 - 1 Betis
Barca 4 - 0 Sevilla (whom are 4th)
Barca 5 - Valladolid
Villareal 4 - 1 Alaves

The reason PL top 10 looks swewed is because how good City and Pool are, similar to when Barca were dominating under Pep. The difference is that within the top 10 we have teams that can go to Pool or City and upset them, this wasn't the case under pep when Barca were flying.

.

Can they? Since Liverpool have started challenging for the league only Leicester out of "lesser" sides have got results at Anfield and since City have come great under Pep only Wolves, Huddersfield, Palace and Everton out of "lesser" sides have got results at City in nearly two and a half season's.