Jadon Sancho| Staying at Dortmund for now

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dove

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Please show me where i said i could do his job, he is an inept moron because we have blown a billion pounds under his watch while seeing our club's stature in football plummet. I am sure there are competent people in football who could win titles with a billion pound spend or is that expecting too much.
Because even though our fans are crying of managers not being backed enough, I think it's kind of the opposite, they are being backed too much sometimes. We give all the power to them and try to get the targets no matter what, even though all 4 managers we had since SAF have failed.
 

Ikon

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In all honesty as fans we should be absolutely seething that we’ve left it this late in the window to make any attempt at a move, frankly it’s a fecking joke.
We have been in a Europe wide lockdown since March, and in my view, those additional could have been spent arranging this windows transfers, both inwards and outwards, but here we are end of September, less than a week of the window remaining, and we are still scrambling about trying to bring in Sancho and possibly Telles, and still, the situations of Jones, Rojo, Smalling, Romero, Perreira, etc have not been concluded.

If this is a deliberate tactic, more often than not, it backfires, because unless the selling club are desperate for cash, United will be the ones under most pressure to get a deal concluded.
 

UncleBob

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We have been in a Europe wide lockdown since March, and in my view, those additional could have been spent arranging this windows transfers, both inwards and outwards, but here we are end of September, less than a week of the window remaining, and we are still scrambling about trying to bring in Sancho and possibly Telles, and still, the situations of Jones, Rojo, Smalling, Romero, Perreira, etc have not been concluded.

If this is a deliberate tactic, more often than not, it backfires, because unless the selling club are desperate for cash, United will be the ones under most pressure to get a deal concluded.
1: Sancho will be a new british transfer record signing, during a fecking pandemic where our income during the next 12 months could be reduced by a feckton. It would bring our spending close to £150-160mill this summer.
2: How in the name of jesus fecking christ do you expect to force players out against their will and without paying for it?
 

Synco

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Dortmund keep moving the goalposts. August 10th was the deadline yet they're telling people he's still for sale at €120m. Does that change to €120m upfront with more add-ons if we turn up with that amount in cash on day one? What leads you to believe that Dortmund will keep their word at this point?
To the best of my knowledge, they didn't make any such statement whatsoever after August 10th. All transfer news since then were journos and twitter ITKs coming up with all kinds of supposed inside knowledge, usually contradicting each other (and sometimes themselves).
 

Ivor Ballokov

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Did you say any of those things when we signed Di Maria, Sanchez, Falcao, Sweinstiger, Schniderlin, Depay, Pogba or Lukaku? It's amazing how quickly that has become £1b blown when at the time it was well spent.
Fans will always be happy with shiny new toys, it's up to the club to get the right ones in.

We have squandered money for sure on players who aren't right for United but you can blame the managers for that. You can blame the board for backing the managers when they should have said "No Moyes, you're not having Fellani, he's shit."
Who hires the managers?
 

SmallCaine

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Did you say any of those things when we signed Di Maria, Sanchez, Falcao, Sweinstiger, Schniderlin, Depay, Pogba or Lukaku? It's amazing how quickly that has become £1b blown when at the time it was well spent.

We have squandered money for sure on players who aren't right for United but you can blame the managers for that. You can blame the board for backing the managers when they should have said "No Moyes, you're not having Fellani, he's shit."
Much of that waste is on him as he was the one who picked those managers, the only one he didn't pick is also the only one who he did not waste too much money with. No sane football minded executive will go from LVG to Mourinho to OGS, most of the big spend has been down to him picking managers whose style of play is polar opposite of what the previous manager did. Every new manager we have signed comes in and has to then do a rebuild of the squad to play their football. I am not excusing the managers for their poor spend but much of the blame lies on the shoulder of the guy who hired them.
 

Ikon

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1: Sancho will be a new british transfer record signing, during a fecking pandemic where our income during the next 12 months could be reduced by a feckton. It would bring our spending close to £150-160mill this summer.
2: How in the name of jesus fecking christ do you expect to force players out against their will and without paying for it?
Good God almighty, I shake my head in fecking disbelief....!!
Staggering..!!
 

crossy1686

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Much of that waste is on him as he was the one who picked those managers, the only one he didn't pick is also the only one who he did not waste too much money with. No sane football minded executive will go from LVG to Mourinho to OGS, most of the big spend has been down to him picking managers whose style of play is polar opposite of what the previous manager did. Every new manager we have signed comes in and has to then do a rebuild of the squad to play their football. I am not excusing the managers for their poor spend but much of the blame lies on the shoulder of the guy who hired them.
You think a footballing institution like United allows a former banker the sole autonomy to select a manager?

I agree we have been poor at hiring managers with different styles but let's not pretend all the blame lies at Woodwards door. I don't remember Gill getting any shit for the signings of Obertan, Bellion, Dejmba-Dejmba, Kleberson or the likes.
 

Sphaero

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I think the most telling thing actually is how you come to the conclusion that Funke is some tabloid, just because you're being ignorant about a perfectly common German surname, because it happened to have been once used on a sitcom.

It's a local media group, which also publishes "derwesten" and "waz" which afaik rank relatively high among that reddit journo tier list.
Sebastian Weßling, who is Funkes responsible reporter for Dortmund is certainly well connected and pretty high up when it comes to reliability. Probably on the same level as Kickers Matthias Dersch, just below Röckenhaus.
 

BluesJr

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Yes I’m sure Dortmund would reject the best offer they’re ever going to get for years.
 

Brownie85

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Yes I’m sure Dortmund would reject the best offer they’re ever going to get for years.
Doesn't matter what you say to some people. They'll deny its happening, even if the club announced it on their website they'd still be in denial.

Seeing as Dortmund have changed from not for sale at all to not for sale unless our price is met is very telling
 

Brownie85

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Maybe you should read the tweet again.
I did, according to a German newspaper it seems. The same German newspapers that have said its been off for a long time and that Dortmunds 10th August deadline was firm...

Yet Dortmund themselves have reportedly said we won't accept anything except the price we've told United we want. So who's lying? Dortmund or the papers?
 

Skåre Willoch

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Wait a minute, you're embarrassed by a club not wanting to spend €120m before August 10th during a pandemic? I think you need to reevaluate what embarrasses you.

There are many reasons, the reality is that we don't know, but I'll give you a few anyway.

Dortmund keep moving the goalposts. August 10th was the deadline yet they're telling people he's still for sale at €120m. Does that change to €120m upfront with more add-ons if we turn up with that amount in cash on day one? What leads you to believe that Dortmund will keep their word at this point?

What do you think would happen if we had offered €120m on the first day of the window and Dortmund rejected? What happens then? We go from club to club asking about Dembele, Costa, Coman and Sarr, while all these clubs know for a fact we were about to pay €120m for a player. How do you think those negotiations would go?

"Hi there, it's Ed. The pandemic has hit us hard, we've only got £40m to spend on your player". Yeah, course you have Ed...

No one is selling their good players the first week of the window, but after a few league games, you've got players who want to play more and are now agitating for a move because they've not been picked for the opening fixtures.

We've also got a load of players we have to shift off the books.

There are your reasons.
Good post, sir.
 

Eckers99

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You don't get to be in charge of one of the biggest sporting institutions in the world and be so inept you couldn't run a local chippy. There are things going on behind the scene's we know absolutely nothing about.

Ed may be trusting the wrong people, and Evra may have a valid point but at the end of the day, Evra should stick to putting the ball in the back of the net and drop kicking racists.

We'll see if there was a plan or not this week. There's no reason to start getting mental about us now making a bid.
If the last few years of Western politics has taught us anything, it's that people in the right circles have a tendency to fail upwards. Just because Woody is good at leveraged buy outs doesn't automatically make him the right person to run a football club.

Only the most wildly optimistic fans would ignore how fecking useless we've been at the basics of running a football club for so long and think that present failings are actually part of some elaborate strategy.

If it looks like shit and it smells like shit, it's probably just shit.
 

OleBoiii

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"The deadline is this date."
"Suuuuure..."


*makes bid after the deadline and gets refused*

"What the hell? You can't just mean what you say! God damn no-nonsense Germans!"
 

Brownie85

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"The deadline is this date."
"Suuuuure..."


*makes bid after the deadline and gets refused*

"What the hell? You can't just mean what you say! God damn no-nonsense Germans!"
So you truly believe that if United offered them a deal equalling €120m in a structured format that they like, they're going to reject it??
 

SmallCaine

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You think a footballing institution like United allows a former banker the sole autonomy to select a manager?

I agree we have been poor at hiring managers with different styles but let's not pretend all the blame lies at Woodwards door. I don't remember Gill getting any shit for the signings of Obertan, Bellion, Dejmba-Dejmba, Kleberson or the likes.
The footballing institution has a former banker doing negotiations for it, so I am going to say yes. Not that others don't have say but he will definitely be the guy who chooses the manager and most likely gets a veto on name he might not like.

For every kleberson or obertan there was a evra and a vidic. Under woodward, I don't see who can be called a great cheap signing.
 

krautrøck

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RN also having an eye on Sky bloke and his wacky adventures.
 

OleBoiii

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So you truly believe that if United offered them a deal equalling €120m in a structured format that they like, they're going to reject it??
Is that so strange? They would have a really hard time replacing him now. And he's an important part of that Dortmund team.

Unless Sancho desperately wants to leave, it only makes sense from a financial point of view to sell him now.
 

kirk buttercup

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how about 1 billion dollars ,what horse shit ! Dortmund know this may well be there last chance in quite a while that they will sell any player for that ridiculous amount . Every club no matter how big are going to feel the effects of the Pandemic ,Football Transfers may have survived this window but going forward if the revenues start to dry up what then ? Dortmund are more solid than most but 100 million is alot of money going forward. We are nearly there , one final push .
 

Sphaero

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How was Dembele to Barcelona deal structured? Upfront fees+ guaranteed addons or Upfront + Performance linked addons?
95 Mil. € (I believe in two? installments)+ performance based addons, that were largely very easy to meet (league+CL appearances)+a sell on participation.
 

Brownie85

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Is that so strange? They would have a really hard time replacing him now. And he's an important part of that Dortmund team.

Unless Sancho desperately wants to leave, it only makes sense from a financial point of view to sell him now.
So why have Dortmund now changed their tune from not for sale to not for sale at anything less than our asking price?
 

do.ob

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95 Mil. € (I believe in two? installments)+ performance based addons, that were largely very easy to meet (league+CL appearances)+a sell on participation.
Also a clause that has Barca pay out the performance bonuses in case he leaves before the end of his initial contract. Which makes the takes that United are threatening Dortmund with the signing of Dembele a bit amusing.
 

Tincanalley

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Because even though our fans are crying of managers not being backed enough, I think it's kind of the opposite, they are being backed too much sometimes. We give all the power to them and try to get the targets no matter what, even though all 4 managers we had since SAF have failed.
How great is Ed, really? Dove? EvoD? Hm.
 

do.ob

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I did, according to a German newspaper it seems. The same German newspapers that have said its been off for a long time and that Dortmunds 10th August deadline was firm...

Yet Dortmund themselves have reportedly said we won't accept anything except the price we've told United we want. So who's lying? Dortmund or the papers?
Well I personally trust Dortmund's local media more than English journalists when it comes to communicating the club's positions, but it's up to you who you want to believe.
 

OleTheGreat

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Wait a minute, you're embarrassed by a club not wanting to spend €120m before August 10th during a pandemic? I think you need to reevaluate what embarrasses you.

There are many reasons, the reality is that we don't know, but I'll give you a few anyway.

Dortmund keep moving the goalposts. August 10th was the deadline yet they're telling people he's still for sale at €120m. Does that change to €120m upfront with more add-ons if we turn up with that amount in cash on day one? What leads you to believe that Dortmund will keep their word at this point?

What do you think would happen if we had offered €120m on the first day of the window and Dortmund rejected? What happens then? We go from club to club asking about Dembele, Costa, Coman and Sarr, while all these clubs know for a fact we were about to pay €120m for a player. How do you think those negotiations would go?

"Hi there, it's Ed. The pandemic has hit us hard, we've only got £40m to spend on your player". Yeah, course you have Ed...

No one is selling their good players the first week of the window, but after a few league games, you've got players who want to play more and are now agitating for a move because they've not been picked for the opening fixtures.

We've also got a load of players we have to shift off the books.

There are your reasons.
Am I allowed to believe that you are more than confident that we will make it our goal to succeed this upcoming season from what you are saying? My only question to you is, if Sancho was our primary target, and that has been the case for over a year now, I'd think United would be more than prepared to overcome all these hurdles. What's more concerning is Glazers, they have not been the ones investing in the club but instead are getting the club to pay the dividends.

I'm pretty sure that the pandemic has hit us hard more than any other club in Europe but even so, I think we are more than capable of getting a few deals over the line easily. Also, if you believe we cannot get the player it is certain that we should go looking for players while we still have a chance to negotiate and not in the final week when it is tough to get the target and there is no time to actually get into a negotiation. I'm pretty sure Smalling, Jones, Perriera and Romero knew full well that their services were not required and could've moved on earlier than they are.

Also, BVB set the earlier deadline of Aug 10th because they wanted to find replacements and it would now be very difficult for them to negotiate with any club and that's the sole reason they have decided to keep the player and maybe sell him next summer. I'm sure he'll payback even more then. What's embarrassing for us fans more than anything in the world is that, the club is run by a bunch of idiots and I'm sure you cannot deny that!
 

Chief123

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If Utd offer 120m euro as guaranteed payments and Dortmund reject it, then I have absolutely no issues with Utd walking away from the deal. I would be gutted but I’d have no issues with the board trying.

I’d be incredibly shocked if Dortmund do turn down a guaranteed 120m euro deal though. Which is why I’ve always believed we will bid the asking price which will be accepted.
 

OleBoiii

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So why have Dortmund now changed their tune from not for sale to not for sale at anything less than our asking price?
I thought it was the opposite? At least based on the latest article from that German newspaper that's very trustworthy when it comes to Dortmund.
 
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