Film Joker (2019)
- Thread starter Ahsan_6386
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Dammit
Fun movie, JP is great in this.
Also @ reading script line from earlier in this thread.
Also
@ reading script line from earlier in this thread.Ryan Reynolds just posted this to congratulate them in becoming the highest grossing R rated film
Haha that's brilliant. Deadpool is still one of the best...much more blockbuster appeal than this, which is whats made it even more surprising to me. I guess the Joker character himself is part of the draw.
Ryan Reynolds just posted this to congratulate them in becoming the highest grossing R rated film
Well, there were actual concerns about the movie inciting violence from the police and security was stepped up. You might remember the Aurora shooting in 2012 where a guy shot up a movie theater dressed up as Joker.
https://www.dw.com/en/joker-film-opens-in-us-amid-security-concerns/a-50707512
Obviously the director knew that "Joker" would generate this controversy. I don't really understand the incel stuff though and how that's connected with the movie.
I loved it. The cinematography, the acting, the mood just worked so well for me. I watched it on my own in a cinema and genuinely left the place blown away.
Actually it seems he wasn’t trying to be joker.
https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/2019/10/joker-aurora-shooting-rumor/amp
Thing about that movie is it's rather more gratuitous violence than this film. The Joker's terrorism is so much more glamorized than in this rendition.
That's just going into the debate of violence in entertainment. The shooting itself is a tragedy, irrespective of what one faults as the impetus.
Great post man. You get it. Hopefully people takes the time to actually get it. It is a fine movie, one that it's worth thinking about. You won't find an answer just handed to you, as there is not really a big reward in knowing the subtext, but to get it actually is its own reward, imo. In a way it offers something deeper than most subtexts do. Some people probably can't process the subtext of the movie until they get that the only solution offered to the viewers is 'conversation'. You have to take the movie up on that to get it. Especially if you have little knowledge about mental health issues.
I loved the movie, thought it was great. Had a brutal emotional effect in the cinema, forgot all about the Joker and suddenly everything fell into place the last 20 minutes or so. Emotion was put first both in the storytelling and throughout the cinematography. A lot of details in the story that were there just to misdirect, to drive us away only to pull us back in. Just a well thought out story script and directing was probably great. Acting was good, a little bit annoying guy personally but undeniably good acting so no complaints. The movie just raises a lot of questions about the main character. You'll only understand the depth that is there if you analyse with the purpose of understanding it, not analyse just to do it because its almost a superhero movie or, a hipster thing to do.
Just got back from watching it.
Still not totally sure how I feel about it. It's clearly a good film with a good central performance but I'm really not sure it's anything more than that. Good first and final act but I'm not sure the middle completely earned the payoff myself.
As others have mentioned it lacked subtly to a fault at times, the flashback scene genuinely disappointed me as it played out, surely the director didn't think that needed spelling out? The more I think about it, I wonder if the director has influenced my opinion as I've not always enjoyed his previous work and he often comes across as a bit of a prick whenever I read about him. I'm sure I have some bias there.
I did enjoy it overall but I doubt it'll be something I rewatch any time soon
Still not totally sure how I feel about it. It's clearly a good film with a good central performance but I'm really not sure it's anything more than that. Good first and final act but I'm not sure the middle completely earned the payoff myself.
As others have mentioned it lacked subtly to a fault at times, the flashback scene genuinely disappointed me as it played out, surely the director didn't think that needed spelling out? The more I think about it, I wonder if the director has influenced my opinion as I've not always enjoyed his previous work and he often comes across as a bit of a prick whenever I read about him. I'm sure I have some bias there.
I did enjoy it overall but I doubt it'll be something I rewatch any time soon
Watched it yesterday. Just wanted to say that it's a masterpiece and JP is a genius
Agreed.
I thought it was great as it set up the entire film in making you think none of it was real and it was all just Arthur's imagination which I think makes more sense as the story gets a bit far fetched in the last act.
"We are all clowns"
Lebanese anti-government protests taking on a Joker theme. Life imitating art.
Courtesy of The Atlantic:
https://www.theatlantic.com/photo/2019/10/protests-lebanon-anger-over-years-economic-crisis/600670/
Lebanese anti-government protests taking on a Joker theme. Life imitating art.
Courtesy of The Atlantic:
https://www.theatlantic.com/photo/2019/10/protests-lebanon-anger-over-years-economic-crisis/600670/
I think the film is incredibly overrated.
The fatal flaw for me in the idea of this Joker film is that the Joker character is most powerful and evil (and makes the most sense) when we know nothing about him.
So doing an origin film, and arguably humanising him, reduces the power in the character. Spending 2 hours explaining the Joker and creating sympathy for the character just makes him boring to me. Explaining that everything is due to his mother's illness and the abuse he suffered as a kid is just obvious and meh IMO.
The fatal flaw for me in the idea of this Joker film is that the Joker character is most powerful and evil (and makes the most sense) when we know nothing about him.
So doing an origin film, and arguably humanising him, reduces the power in the character. Spending 2 hours explaining the Joker and creating sympathy for the character just makes him boring to me. Explaining that everything is due to his mother's illness and the abuse he suffered as a kid is just obvious and meh IMO.
That's not a very cohesive argument about why the film is overrated. You're merely opining that it shouldn't/needn't exist. Which you're fully entitled to do, but it has nothing to do altogether with the quality of it. I may believe that superhero films are bullshit that needn't exist, but still among superhero films there's marked difference in quality with some being piss poor and others bordering on excellent. And there's difference of opinion on them.
Also, on the bolded bit, that's not at all what this film suggests let alone explains. Those were merely some of the events that made Arthur Fleck who he was. His treatment by his boss and colleagues, his mental health problems, his financial situation, his lack of father figure, his lack of access to vital medication and abandonment by the Social Care structure, his beatings by strangers... these all clearly affected him to great extent. And those can't be blamed on his mother any more than anyone's problems can be traced back to their mother giving birth to them.
Weird how the more left leaning undertones haven't really been discussed in the media as far as i'm aware e.g social care needs, government cuts, divide between rich and poor etc. The non-existent incel thing has been discussed to death though.
A lotta incels in Lebanon.
They’re not celibate, they get fecked by their government on a daily basis.
Loved it. Great film. This is exactly why I love cinema - it's taken one of pop cultures most recognisable characters and come up with a creative new direction for him. It's a showcase piece and it nailed what it set out to do, which shows a hell of a lot of conviction from the production team for something that is, let's face it, a risky project.
Best film of the year for me. 8.5 packets of Quavers out of a Family Pack of 12.
Best film of the year for me. 8.5 packets of Quavers out of a Family Pack of 12.
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Correct. Though one suspects that link still played a part in whatever small fraction of Joker's pre-release angst was real.
Finally watched this. Really good film.
Quite risky as it's basically a one man show but Phoenix pulls it off brilliantly. Very easy to either under act and be boring, or over act and make it ridiculous. He manages to make the character feel disturbing, extreme but still human and real.
I can absolutely see how this character could become the Joker of Ledger in years to come. For example when he's dancing on the stairs or doing the practice interview in his apartment. It's the first signs of the confident / arrogant maniac genius we saw the Batman film.
I'd love to see them do a sequel which shows his transition into a criminal genius and also maybe gives his first introduction to Batman.
Quite risky as it's basically a one man show but Phoenix pulls it off brilliantly. Very easy to either under act and be boring, or over act and make it ridiculous. He manages to make the character feel disturbing, extreme but still human and real.
I can absolutely see how this character could become the Joker of Ledger in years to come. For example when he's dancing on the stairs or doing the practice interview in his apartment. It's the first signs of the confident / arrogant maniac genius we saw the Batman film.
I'd love to see them do a sequel which shows his transition into a criminal genius and also maybe gives his first introduction to Batman.
When people say this I really struggle to see it. I can see this Joker growing to be a classic Joker from the comics, but not Ledgers version.
Good movie for a superhero film but so overrated. My mate told me it was the best film he ever saw which made it even worse as I had very high expectations.
The best part was when the midget couldn't reach the door lock.
The best part was when the midget couldn't reach the door lock.
I thought he was going to kill him after that!I've never watched Batman or anything like that so it was all new to me but I really enjoyed it.
I have read that quite a few times, and am quite surprised. I actually think it is a very good movie, but never the best i saw. Maybe 2019 and even a year or two back, but best ever is a bit too much.
Yeah all these crazy superlatives are weird.
Did nobody else find the most disturbing thing of all to be a man losing his mind with a revolver by his bedside table?
I mean, perhaps an American audience are less perturbed by that, but for me, it hit home how easily others can be fatally injured by someone else on the brink.
I mean, perhaps an American audience are less perturbed by that, but for me, it hit home how easily others can be fatally injured by someone else on the brink.
I’ve never said that about any movie.
Only after years after a release, with several viewings I can think about a movie making my top 5.
Grosses
DOMESTIC (32.8%)
$279,700,429
INTERNATIONAL (67.2%)
$574,100,000
WORLDWIDE
$853,800,429
Looks like it will cross 1 billion which is actually pretty great for a standalone movie that is not exactly a mainstream entertainer like the Marvel movies
DOMESTIC (32.8%)
$279,700,429
INTERNATIONAL (67.2%)
$574,100,000
WORLDWIDE
$853,800,429
Looks like it will cross 1 billion which is actually pretty great for a standalone movie that is not exactly a mainstream entertainer like the Marvel movies
And its Rated R so a whole bunch of people who could watch it are wiped out (Although I think its a 15 in UK).
Yeah, 15 here. There was a kid who couldn't have been older than ten at our showing. Mental.
Imagine being told your life was spared, only for you to be unable to leave a murder scene without asking for another favour from the crazed killer who just killed your friend, only for you to be killed when you actually have to talk to the crazed killer himself?
That would have been funny. Which makes me think Joker should've killed him right there and then just for the laughs.
Finally got around to seeing this last night. It was worth the wait. I was completely absorbed through the entire running length and I thought the slow first hour or so only enhanced the impact of the final 30.
Side note - 3 people walked out at various points during the screening. I mean - I deliberately ignored all trailers and whatnot for this but I had a pretty decent idea of what I was walking into - do people just rock up and watch whatever is up next? Mixed reviews for this, but in no way was it bad enough that anyone could be compelled to leave.
Its all been said before. Phoenix, the photography, score, lighting etc all outstanding. I think I'm far enough past release that this won't spoiler anything for anyone who cares, but I certainly had the impression watching it that almost the entire last hour or so (after the subway scene with the bankers) was potentially not reality, and reading this thread back today ive seen one or two other posts that have added to that feeling. I would need to watch it again, but I certainly got a strong Shutter Island feeling at the time.
Best movie I've seen this year for certain
Side note - 3 people walked out at various points during the screening. I mean - I deliberately ignored all trailers and whatnot for this but I had a pretty decent idea of what I was walking into - do people just rock up and watch whatever is up next? Mixed reviews for this, but in no way was it bad enough that anyone could be compelled to leave.
Its all been said before. Phoenix, the photography, score, lighting etc all outstanding. I think I'm far enough past release that this won't spoiler anything for anyone who cares, but I certainly had the impression watching it that almost the entire last hour or so (after the subway scene with the bankers) was potentially not reality, and reading this thread back today ive seen one or two other posts that have added to that feeling. I would need to watch it again, but I certainly got a strong Shutter Island feeling at the time.
Best movie I've seen this year for certain
In terms of profit is that going to make it the most profitable comic book film in history? Because it was made in peanuts in comparison to Marvel and even Dark Knight I assume.
Probably but the thing is the success of this film shows that there is an audience for dark gritty twisted movies and that it doesn't have to be all happy and funny like the Marvel movies. This will help DC take more risks. Tbf, I'm really surprised that it is about to cross 1 billion when films like Deadpool and Logan made way less money. I'm guessing the stellar early reviews played a big part.
I definitely need to watch it again myself.
I wonder why those folks left. Even if it wasn't the light summer comic book spin they expected, it's a good film worth watching in it's entirety. However, I wouldn't exclude the possibility that the material was too heavy for them to stomach. There were some very uncomfortable moments.
I've been wondering about the graphic novel that loosely influenced Phillips in Joker : Batman: The Killing Joke. Has anyone read it? Because I can't imagine that it takes a whole lot from the book, outside of names and backstory. Joker, the film, is a standalone and in many ways to me a comic villain origin story in an even more realistic sense than Unbreakable. The notion in Unbreakable, one of my favorites, is that comics are hyperbole of reality. So M Night tries to separate the layers to leave just enough of the superhuman behind. Joker is one step further towards reality. So I understand why it might have been originally written as a standalone film.
If we do have to force the superhero narrative, then I'd expect the act of coming off medications leading to growing clarity and moving away from the simpleton Arthur is portrayed as originally.
It will only help DC (DCCU) if they get good directors / writers and have a plan.