Jose Mourinho - Was He Right?

[spiriticon]

So what trophies are we going to win this season.
And the answer is Fcuk all.

Exactly right. And Jose was manager for half of that.

Look, he was done here after 2 years. With him, you're looking to win the title within the first 2 years or its bust. The ultimate high stakes gamble.

 

[Eddy_JukeZ]

Right on some things sure, but he failed.

He brought in some terrible players and couldn't improve a single player he inherited.

He's a has-been of a manager and has been since Real.

 

[Reddy Rederson]

Right on some things sure, but he failed.

He brought in some terrible players and couldn't improve a single player he inherited.

He's a has-been of a manager and has been since Real.

Well, thats not at all true. He improved felliani, shaw and for a short time he got martial improving. He has since turned back to being shit.

 

[Eddy_JukeZ]

Well, thats not at all true. He improved felliani, shaw and for a short time he got martial improving. He has since turned back to being shit.

Fellaini, I'll give you though he was also good under Van Gaal relatively.

Martial did not improve under Jose overall though.

 

[breakout67]

Lingard had his best season ever under Moaninho. I would also say Rashford improved under him. Herrera also had his best season for us under him. He also had a few duds in there, Mkhi and Sanchez being the major ones, Bailly was great at the beginning and eventually became the Ivorian Phil Jones.

 

[Reddy Rederson]

Fellaini, I'll give you though he was also good under Van Gaal relatively.

Martial did not improve under Jose overall though.

Martial, did. He was running more, tracking back, doing a lot more for the team. Granted, it wast for very long. He has since gone backwards.

 

[finneh]

As is generally the case the point is more nuanced than "was he right " or wrong.

The truth is almost certainly that no manager apart from Mourinho has us second last season. To get that much out of that group was a minor miracle.

However the reason for that miracle was that we bought on his say so... Lukaku, Pogba, Bailly, Lindelof, Matic, Mkhitaryan, Sanchez. We could have bought (known from the PL alone) Walker, De Bruyne, Bernardo, Salah, V.Dijk, Mane.

Anyone who looks at our squad and decides we need more lazy & immobile players deserves the sack (almost) irrespective of how well they're managing said lazy sacks.

 

[Random Task]

Imagine that your post is subject to someone elses whims. So instead of getting to say what you want to say, you get to say some of what you say and the rest is edited by someone else. Thats how I see united over the past 6 years. I dont think any of our managers have had the total control that we all think they did. Thats just my opinion of course. But I think its woodwards backs seat driving thats drove us off the cliff. Not moyes, not LVG, not jose, and not Ole.

The club, specifically Woodward, have always maintained that Jose had chosen every player brought in during his time in charge of the club.

Are you saying Woodward is lying?

 

[Cliche Guevara]

Fellaini, I'll give you though he was also good under Van Gaal relatively.

Martial did not improve under Jose overall though.

He did. First half of this season Martial seemed to finally step up. Since Ole came in Martial has shown himself to be the waster ultimately he is.

Jose 100% had Martial’s number.

 

[Reddy Rederson]

The club, specifically Woodward, have always maintained that Jose had chosen every player brought in during his time in charge of the club.

Are you saying Woodward is lying?

I am. At the very least, hes sticking his ore in which we know to be true since he told us about his vetoing new signings.

 

[Boycott]

He may have diagnosed some problems, but he was the cause of plenty others, and his solutions were not fitting of the level elite modern teams are at.

Moyes said a lot of things ridiculed at the time but in hindsight don't look bad, but that doesn't vindicate his reign.

 

[Random Task]

Well, thats not at all true. He improved felliani, shaw and for a short time he got martial improving. He has since turned back to being shit.

I wouldn't go as far as saying he improved Fellaini, rather he made use of his 'unique' abilities.

LVG also got a tune out of Fellaini.

 

[NeQuient]

Its the managers who pick players they want i cannot imagine the club buying and woodward saying "oh yea lets get this one"the club usually buy very young prospects.

 

[Mal donaghy]

He was right calling a certain player a virus, cause the whole place is Infected from top to bottom with the "look at me I'm so rich,and my hairstyle is hench,virus" we all know who the reference is too.

 

[haram]

Right on some things sure, but he failed.

He brought in some terrible players and couldn't improve a single player he inherited.

He's a has-been of a manager and has been since Real.

If he got them to second place and a FA Cup final he probably did get as much out of them as possible.

 

[Reddy Rederson]

I wouldn't go as far as saying he improved Fellaini, rather he made use of his 'unique' abilities.

LVG also got a tune out of Fellaini.

I would disagree. Before jose, Felliani was a yellow card waiting to happen. His elbows getting him into all kinds of trouble. Jose came and he was like a new player. Still a shit player, but a different shit player. He even got him defending well, making some great challenges for us. And of course the important goals. He still couldnt actually play worth a feck, always passing the ball off quickly to a team mate close by.

 

[Sayros]

He was right calling a certain player a virus, cause the whole place is Infected from top to bottom with the "look at me I'm so rich,and my hairstyle is hench,virus" we all know who the reference is too.

Haha, is it really them who's infencted or is it you?

Mourinho was both right and part of the problem as well. I don't think any managers will make a big difference until there's a serious investment into a DoF with a solid team around him that makes decisions with the managers on how to improve the team.

 

[Mal donaghy]

Haha, is it really them who's infencted or is it you?

Mourinho was both right and part of the problem as well. I don't think any managers will make a big difference until there's a serious investment into a DoF with a solid team around him that makes decisions with the managers on how to improve the team.

What you on about ??? My post states that its players like pogba that makes everything about this club wrong, too much pay for too little gain that's what I interperate Mourinhos comments to be about

 

[Random Task]

I am. At the very least, hes sticking his ore in which we know to be true since he told us about his vetoing new signings.

I think Woody and the board had lost faith in Jose's ability to identify the correct transfer targets, due to every one of his previous targets being either the wrong fit or simply not good enough. They were reluctant to hand him more money and they had every reason to be.

 

[Mal donaghy]

Haha, is it really them who's infencted or is it you?

Mourinho was both right and part of the problem as well. I don't think any managers will make a big difference until there's a serious investment into a DoF with a solid team around him that makes decisions with the managers on how to improve the team.

I'm not a Jose fanboy, he was a dick, he was right about pogba though

 

[breakout67]

I think Woody and the board had lost faith in Jose's ability to identify the correct transfer targets, due to every one of his previous targets being either the wrong fit or simply not good enough. They were reluctant to hand him more money and they had every reason to be.

Very strange conclusion to make. Won two trophies in his first season and improved considerably in the league in his second season. Pogba and Lindelof have been standout players for us this season, Zlatan and Lukaku performed far better than Rashford and Martial as strikers.

He was improving us with his signings, they were not perfect (Mkhi and Sanchez) but we were getting better.

 

[Sayros]

What you on about ??? My post states that its players like pogba that makes everything about this club wrong, too much pay for too little gain that's what I interperate Mourinhos comments to be about

Then clearly Mourinho didn't know the player he was getting in Pogba if he thought he would be the solution to all of his problems, not to mention he's the one player along with Martial who helped him keep his job longer than he should have and never lowered himself to Mourinho's incessant talking. No one who has ever played with Pogba will tell you he was a locker room cancer. General statements like pogba is what makes everything wrong this club is just nonsense, you're talking about a player that has 30 goals/assist this season playing with a team completely devoid of confidence or ideas without him. No one even comes close, even in a game like today he was the only one who created something. You're just venting at the wrong player, but Pogba's always been THE scapegoat for this team. He deserves slack, they all do but you need to have a look at what you're saying because you don't have an embarrassment of riches and if you think getting rid of Pogba and finding someone who can even come close to what he's capable of is going to be an easy task for a club with no CL and not much momentum, you are in for a rude awakening.

 

[haram]

I think Woody and the board had lost faith in Jose's ability to identify the correct transfer targets, due to every one of his previous targets being either the wrong fit or simply not good enough. They were reluctant to hand him more money and they had every reason to be.

Win two trophies, then finish second and reach a final and someone like Woodward tells you you’re targets are wrong?

What do they say if Ole turns around and says he wants Martial sold? Do they say no?

 

[NeQuient]

3 weeks ago everyone wanted team build around Pogba,now everyone wants Pogba gone,he is a world cup winner playing crucial role for France getting rid of him would be a joke.

 

[Z1L3]

Mourinho was right about everything and had every right to feel let down when he wasn't backed by the board in the off-season. Some signings were not good, but he brought results; and after all, some of Guardiola's signings didn't work out either, so what.

Guardiola finished 4th with a team that won 2 PL titles in the last 5 years, and was given a blank check. Mourinho won trophies and brought back Champions League football while at the same time rebuilding a squad full of deadwood, and he wasn't backed.

 

[steffyr2]

Mourinho was right about everything and had every right to feel let down when he wasn't backed by the board in the off-season. Some signings were not good, but he brought results; and after all, some of Guardiola's signings didn't work out either, so what.

Guardiola finished 4th with a team that won 2 PL titles in the last 5 years, and was given a blank check. Mourinho won trophies and brought back Champions League football while at the same time rebuilding a squad full of deadwood, and he wasn't backed.

Which makes me wonder if Ole is in for a surprise this summer, when he says something like "I'm a winner, but some players won't be here to enjoy it".
Jose thought the board would back him too.

 

[Reddy Rederson]

I think Woody and the board had lost faith in Jose's ability to identify the correct transfer targets, due to every one of his previous targets being either the wrong fit or simply not good enough. They were reluctant to hand him more money and they had every reason to be.

I think thats the excuse they used, but I think woodward only wants to spend money on players he deems to be the right ones or a bargin. For example why did jose buy Miki? He didnt use him straight way, in fact he seemed to have no idea what to do with him. Same with fred. Why would he buy players that he didnt know how to use? Theres lot of things you can say about jose, but hes more often than not gotten good players for his teams. So what changed here? I suppose you could say it was the scouts suggesting dog shit to him, but that excuse can only go so far.

Obviously I dont know anything for sure. I can only look at whats happened and make a guess. In my mind we have failed again and again and the only thing that hasnt changed is woodward. We have three managers who had complaints about how the club has been run. They cant all be the issue. But even if they were, who hired them? A lot of people around here wanted to sack jose because of the players "he" bought. Yet, woodward doesnt seem to be getting the same measuring stick. Hes brought in 3, maybe 4 failed managers in a row. So if hes not guilty of anything else, hes at the very least guilty of that and should be on his way.

 

[The Nani]

Yes he was right to buy Lukaku and Sanchez and Mkhitaryan and Matic and Bailly. If only he could’ve brought Willian and Perisic and Maguire as well.

Thanks, Jose.

 

[Random Task]

Win two trophies, then finish second and reach a final and someone like Woodward tells you you’re targets are wrong?

What do they say if Ole turns around and says he wants Martial sold? Do they say no?

Jose made it publically known that he was in search of a new central defender last summer, this is after signing Bailly and Lindelof who had both of failed to make a positive impression - along with a host of other big money signings such as Miki, Sanchez, Matic and Pogba, with the latter being the only success and even that is debatable. He spent $£400 million and failed to make a single successful signing.

Is it not the manager's perogative who he wants to get rid of? If Ole wants Martial gone, the board will have to accept. At least I hope so

 

[breakout67]

Jose Mourinho signed two defenders for 35m each and wanted another one. How blasphemous of him. This nonsense keeps getting trotted out despite it making a lick of sense. Bailly turned into a sick note, so he wanted another defender to partner Lindelof, how dare he.

 

[Canagel]

Yes he was right to buy Lukaku and Sanchez and Mkhitaryan and Matic and Bailly. If only he could’ve brought Willian and Perisic and Maguire as well.

Thanks, Jose.

And if only he was allowed to get a experienced fullback.. oh wait hang on Young was supposed to play 50 games this season anyway.

 

[haram]

Jose made it publically known that he was in search of a new central defender last summer, this is after signing Bailly and Lindelof who had both of failed to make a positive impression - along with a host of other big money signings such as Miki, Sanchez, Matic and Pogba, with the latter being the only success and even that is debatable. He spent $£400 million and failed to make a single successful signing.

Is it not the manager's perogative who he wants to get rid of? If Ole wants Martial gone, the board will have to accept. At least I hope so

Yes, a CB to partner Lindelof who was progressing. Centre backs work in partnerships. If Bailly is not the answer you move on. City went and broke the transfer record for a goalkeeper when Bravo failed and he was more proven than Bailly.

Alexis was signed after the club turned down Jose’s proposals for a winger. Woodward would agree to signing Alexis because he is a big name wouldn’t he? He is a clown.

He didn’t make a single successful signing, he did not improve any of our players yet we still finished 2nd? Something isn’t adding up.

 

[Irwin99]

Right about some things but won't take ownership of his own mistakes. The atmosphere around the club was horrendous pre-season, and he played a big part in that. I don't think any United fan looked forward to this season with his constant negativity before the season had even started.

 

[Random Task]

I think thats the excuse they used, but I think woodward only wants to spend money on players he deems to be the right ones or a bargin. For example why did jose buy Miki? He didnt use him straight way, in fact he seemed to have no idea what to do with him. Same with fred. Why would he buy players that he didnt know how to use? Theres lot of things you can say about jose, but hes more often than not gotten good players for his teams. So what changed here? I suppose you could say it was the scouts suggesting dog shit to him, but that excuse can only go so far.

Obviously I dont know anything for sure. I can only look at whats happened and make a guess. In my mind we have failed again and again and the only thing that hasnt changed is woodward. We have three managers who had complaints about how the club has been run. They cant all be the issue. But even if they were, who hired them? A lot of people around here wanted to sack jose because of the players "he" bought. Yet, woodward doesnt seem to be getting the same measuring stick. Hes brought in 3, maybe 4 failed managers in a row. So if hes not guilty of anything else, hes at the very least guilty of that and should be on his way.

That's the thing, isn't it? We don't really know anything. We're spoonfed tidbits of information via the media (who naturally put their own spin on it) and are then left to draw conclusions which more often than not turn out to be false.

You make some good points though. It's genuinely perplexing for a manager with Jose's ability in the transfer market to get so many targets wrong.

 

[haram]

Right about some things but won't take ownership of his own mistakes. The atmosphere around the club was horrendous pre-season, and he played a big part in that. I don't think any United fan looked forward to this season with his constant negativity before the season had even started.

Yes, it’s his confrontational attitude which he has to take responsibility for, but that’s who he is. Everyone knew that already. It doesn’t happen if the board back him though.

He could have handled things better at the start of this season, I think perhaps someone like Poch would have gone about it differently.

Then again, someone acting as a yes man for the Glazers and Woodward, that does not appeal to me either. Woodward telling these managers which players are and aren’t good enough is insulting. Jose was never going to roll over for Woodward, or even resign considering the pay out.

 

[DLE]

Of course, it's not as if Ole is some unknown quantity like Guardiola or Zidane who took a short time in the B team to move onto their first big job. Ole is a standard coach, relegated with Cardiff, went to a smaller league and did very well with Molde. He's not a miracle worker.

That's the point really. It's not about Ole or Mourinho, it's about the players. But a few months ago when Mourinho was sacked, that was not the general opinion on here.

 

[Bilbo]

It doesn't matter whether he was right or not. Mourinho was in it for himself. He didn't respect the club.

Had to go, not because of the job he did or didn't do, bit because the guy was in it for himself.

A million miles from what a United manager needs to be

 

[Lentwood]

Of course he was right

Every single one of you who gloated over Jose's sacking are contributing to the slow death of this club

 

[Canagel]

Well tbf to LvG and Jose they haven't been losing games either since neither has managed another club!

I accept Moyes wasn't right. He didn't look or sound like a United manager and he actually looked beaten towards the end. LvG and Jose however are proven winners. I don't buy this 'outdated' nonsense....we're talking about a manager who reached a WC semi-final 3-mnths before joining Utd and a chap who had won the PL 2yrs prior to joining us!

We need the structure first, then we can assess whether our managers are doing a good/bad job

Probably no-one wanted LVG so he retired and no big clubs appears to want Mourinho. mourinho didn't win/challenge for the PL for 4 years long time in football and did nothing of note in the CL for even longer. We can safely say they're both outdated.

 

[Born2Lose]

Embarrassing thread, as bad as that was today, it wasn't anywhere close to going to Klanfield and playing like a 3rd division team who'd drawn a giant in an FA Cup tie.