So your only objection was with India Today using ‘Path to Kashmir is open’ as headlines and not with the misogyny comments he made. Righto I get your priorities.
Kashmir
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According to ANI he said:
"Our Minister Dhankar ji used to say we shall have to bring daughters-in-law from Bihar if the number of girls decreases and the number of boys increases. Now people say that since Kashmir is open we can bring girls from there. Jokes apart, if there is a good (sex) ratio the balance in society will be set right."
"The state of Harayana has been infamous for the skewed sex ratio. People used to say that girl children are killed there. We launched a campaign to save girl children in the state. Earlier the sex ratio was 850 against every 1000 boys. Now it stands as 933."
"The state of Harayana has been infamous for the skewed sex ratio. People used to say that girl children are killed there. We launched a campaign to save girl children in the state. Earlier the sex ratio was 850 against every 1000 boys. Now it stands as 933."
So he seems to have said it as a crass joke while promoting Harayana's unrelated success in approaching sex parity.
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Misogyny? He was taking about in improving girl and boy sex ratio. Stop going in circles. You are attributing quotes which were never said nor does he say we will get girls from kashmir. He said people said it about bihar and now will say about kashmir.
Is not about priorities. It's using articles which are not really the truth with headlines just to cause unrest to win some brownie points on the Internet.
Carry on man. Nothing more to add from my end.
If he was so serious about improving sex ratio his solution should be to stop female foeticide which is rampant in Haryana and not joke and talk about solving it by bringing girls from Kashmir and Bihar for marriage.
Also I’ve posted the video which also explains in detail why it was a terrible thing to say. But keep ignoring the obvious while shouting fake news. It’s like engaging with a Trump supporter.
HuffPost India spoke with women’s rights activist Kavita Krishnan, who has returned from a five-day fact finding mission from Kashmir, along with economist Jean Dreze, Maimoona Mollah from the All India Democratic Women’s Association, the women’s wing of the Communist Party of India (Marxist), and Vimal Bhai, a social activist.
From August 9-13, Krishnan, who is secretary of the All India Progressive Women’s Association, and a member of the Communist Party of India (Marxist-Leninist), traveled to Srinagar, Sopore, Bandipora, Anantnag, Shopian and Pampore.
Describing the situation as grim, Krishnan said, “Frankly, it looked like occupied Iraq or occupied Palestine.”
Frankly, it looked like occupied Iraq or occupied Palestine.
What did you see?
The situation is absolutely grim. Kashmir is under military siege. There are paramilitary forces on every street, outside homes, outside localities. The situation is really quite alarming. There is no scope for anyone to speak, no scope for peaceful protests.
On the day of Eid, there was desolation. No one except tiny children were in festive clothing. They were not allowed to go to the mosque to do their prayers in rural areas. The azaan was not permitted so they just had to do their namaz at home. People feel a complete sense of anger and betrayal. There is helplessness, frustration.
In the Kashmir Valley, we did not meet a single soul who was happy with the decision. They were upset with the media coverage. They said, ‘Everyone is saying that it’s a great thing for Kashmir, but whose wedding is it and who is celebrating? It’s supposed to be our wedding, at least ask us whether we are happy? How come no one is asking us what we think?’ It is seen as an act of humiliation and violence against the people of Kashmir.
What is the curfew like?
I can tell you that there is a complete and total curfew. Even in the street where we were staying which is an upmarket locality of Srinagar, Rajbagh. Even that was under complete curfew on the day of Eid. Across Kashmir, there is a sense that this is an assault and an act of aggression against the people of Kashmir.
Did you speak with Kashmiri pandits?
Yes, we did. We spoke to several Kashmiri pandits. We have video documentation of one of them. He is trying to explain that Kashmiriyat is a thing and that means celebrating Eid. He is a pandit, who is saying ‘our festival Eid is coming.’ We met Sikhs. We met Hindu migrant labourers. They all spoke about the safety and the terrible situation that everyone was in.
The Modi government has said that Kashmir is mostly calm, but there are sporadic protests involving a handful of people. They came out against the BBC’s video footage that suggested there was a large protest in Soura.
Yes, but they are not allowing protests. Protests have been sporadic, I agree. There was one huge protest in Soura near Srinagar. That was correctly reported. It was a very large protest. We met pellet gun victims, who were not protestors, but bystanders there. We met some of those kids. You can’t gag and bind people and say there are no protests.
We met people in villages all over Kashmir, where little kids have been… there is no other word to use… they have been abducted by the police. They have been picked up from their homes in the middle of the night from their beds and they are held indefinitely, illegally, either in army camps or in police stations. They are being beaten up. Their parents have no way of ascertaining whether their children will disappear or be returned. There is no case that is registered, no FIR. I can say that to every village we went, there were arrests that had happened.
You are saying that a class 7 boy was arrested?
Not one. We met one Class 7 boy, who was arrested. He told us that there are others — younger than him — who have been arrested and who are still in custody. It’s total terror.
Why would the authorities be picking up children as young as that?
As an act of intimidation. Their parents assured us that their children have not thrown stones. Their parents said they have been picked up on the way to mosques, from their homes, from their beds at night. That kind of thing. They are making it a point to raid houses in the night and take away young boys in the night. It creates immense fear, especially among the women. The women have whispered to us that they have been molested during such raids. This was the story in every village that we visited. My question is what is the Indian media doing? Why are they not visiting these places? We could visit them.
This is very grave news and serious accusations. Have you brought back proof?
Yes. We have video documentation of family members and of a child who had been released one day before. We do have documentation.
Could you elaborate?
I’ll tell you two things. One video is of a 11-year-old child who was released one day before Eid and he is saying that he was kept in custody from fifth onwards and beaten up, and there were children younger than him in custody. Then, we have video of family members, we are not identifying them because they are scared, but their teenage boy has been picked up in the middle of the night from his bed and he is being kept illegally. They have gone to the thana but they keep taaloing them, saying it is not in our hands, we cannot do anything. They are really afraid because there is no record of their arrest. Tomorrow, if something happens to him or he just vanishes, there is no record that he was arrested at all. We have that on record.
My question is what is the Indian media doing? Why are they not visiting these places?
These arrests that you spoke of are are being done by the police or the CRPF (Central Reserve Police Force)?
What we were told was that it is the police as well as army. We did not go to the police stations because we were begged by the people not to. They were in two minds. They want someone to intervene but they fear it could make life worse for their boys. They said, ‘We are hoping against hope that they will be returned safely, but please do not make inquiries right now.’ They are not even sure where they are kept. They are guessing that some of them are in the thaana, some of them are in the army camps which are cheek by jowl to these villages. They are saying an illegal detention, by the police or the army, is a crime. And given Kashmir’s history, it is immensely dangerous. We know that there have been mass graves, mass custodial killings, mass disappearances, in Kashmir.
From August 9-13, Krishnan, who is secretary of the All India Progressive Women’s Association, and a member of the Communist Party of India (Marxist-Leninist), traveled to Srinagar, Sopore, Bandipora, Anantnag, Shopian and Pampore.
Describing the situation as grim, Krishnan said, “Frankly, it looked like occupied Iraq or occupied Palestine.”
Frankly, it looked like occupied Iraq or occupied Palestine.
What did you see?
The situation is absolutely grim. Kashmir is under military siege. There are paramilitary forces on every street, outside homes, outside localities. The situation is really quite alarming. There is no scope for anyone to speak, no scope for peaceful protests.
On the day of Eid, there was desolation. No one except tiny children were in festive clothing. They were not allowed to go to the mosque to do their prayers in rural areas. The azaan was not permitted so they just had to do their namaz at home. People feel a complete sense of anger and betrayal. There is helplessness, frustration.
In the Kashmir Valley, we did not meet a single soul who was happy with the decision. They were upset with the media coverage. They said, ‘Everyone is saying that it’s a great thing for Kashmir, but whose wedding is it and who is celebrating? It’s supposed to be our wedding, at least ask us whether we are happy? How come no one is asking us what we think?’ It is seen as an act of humiliation and violence against the people of Kashmir.
What is the curfew like?
I can tell you that there is a complete and total curfew. Even in the street where we were staying which is an upmarket locality of Srinagar, Rajbagh. Even that was under complete curfew on the day of Eid. Across Kashmir, there is a sense that this is an assault and an act of aggression against the people of Kashmir.
Did you speak with Kashmiri pandits?
Yes, we did. We spoke to several Kashmiri pandits. We have video documentation of one of them. He is trying to explain that Kashmiriyat is a thing and that means celebrating Eid. He is a pandit, who is saying ‘our festival Eid is coming.’ We met Sikhs. We met Hindu migrant labourers. They all spoke about the safety and the terrible situation that everyone was in.
The Modi government has said that Kashmir is mostly calm, but there are sporadic protests involving a handful of people. They came out against the BBC’s video footage that suggested there was a large protest in Soura.
Yes, but they are not allowing protests. Protests have been sporadic, I agree. There was one huge protest in Soura near Srinagar. That was correctly reported. It was a very large protest. We met pellet gun victims, who were not protestors, but bystanders there. We met some of those kids. You can’t gag and bind people and say there are no protests.
We met people in villages all over Kashmir, where little kids have been… there is no other word to use… they have been abducted by the police. They have been picked up from their homes in the middle of the night from their beds and they are held indefinitely, illegally, either in army camps or in police stations. They are being beaten up. Their parents have no way of ascertaining whether their children will disappear or be returned. There is no case that is registered, no FIR. I can say that to every village we went, there were arrests that had happened.
You are saying that a class 7 boy was arrested?
Not one. We met one Class 7 boy, who was arrested. He told us that there are others — younger than him — who have been arrested and who are still in custody. It’s total terror.
Why would the authorities be picking up children as young as that?
As an act of intimidation. Their parents assured us that their children have not thrown stones. Their parents said they have been picked up on the way to mosques, from their homes, from their beds at night. That kind of thing. They are making it a point to raid houses in the night and take away young boys in the night. It creates immense fear, especially among the women. The women have whispered to us that they have been molested during such raids. This was the story in every village that we visited. My question is what is the Indian media doing? Why are they not visiting these places? We could visit them.
This is very grave news and serious accusations. Have you brought back proof?
Yes. We have video documentation of family members and of a child who had been released one day before. We do have documentation.
Could you elaborate?
I’ll tell you two things. One video is of a 11-year-old child who was released one day before Eid and he is saying that he was kept in custody from fifth onwards and beaten up, and there were children younger than him in custody. Then, we have video of family members, we are not identifying them because they are scared, but their teenage boy has been picked up in the middle of the night from his bed and he is being kept illegally. They have gone to the thana but they keep taaloing them, saying it is not in our hands, we cannot do anything. They are really afraid because there is no record of their arrest. Tomorrow, if something happens to him or he just vanishes, there is no record that he was arrested at all. We have that on record.
My question is what is the Indian media doing? Why are they not visiting these places?
These arrests that you spoke of are are being done by the police or the CRPF (Central Reserve Police Force)?
What we were told was that it is the police as well as army. We did not go to the police stations because we were begged by the people not to. They were in two minds. They want someone to intervene but they fear it could make life worse for their boys. They said, ‘We are hoping against hope that they will be returned safely, but please do not make inquiries right now.’ They are not even sure where they are kept. They are guessing that some of them are in the thaana, some of them are in the army camps which are cheek by jowl to these villages. They are saying an illegal detention, by the police or the army, is a crime. And given Kashmir’s history, it is immensely dangerous. We know that there have been mass graves, mass custodial killings, mass disappearances, in Kashmir.
Reading that gave me chills, they are literally arresting kids and beating them up to keep the parents in line. And you have Indians here defending the move or getting annoyed at people pointing out human rights violations.
"It looks like occupied Iraq or Palestine". Wonder what agenda she has.
https://m.huffingtonpost.in/entry/k...wEm3daPCCxMNhPdIXEWqGJxlHQoYTGa1g5uOPikndJ15k
Disgusting.
That's real bad.
If that's true, it's bad. But @MJJ let's not be naive, everyone commenting on this conflict has an agenda - either oblique or out in the open. Just like you and the other Pakistani posters, and me and other Indian ones.
Similarly HuffPo or a communist party spokesperson certainly have theirs. I put much higher credibility in the BBC reports than HuffPo
Similarly HuffPo or a communist party spokesperson certainly have theirs. I put much higher credibility in the BBC reports than HuffPo
I guess you and the indians will be better placed to comment on the credibility of kavita krishnan? This is the first time I have read her name.
Video released by them which was prohibited from being played today in Delhi’s Press Club Of India.
No way. Some have no agenda and are holier than thou. All they care is about the human rights and people rights all over the world.
Look at the guy at 2:00 minute mark. I have definitely lost respect for some posters on here who defend this. Have a word with yourself in the mirror you know who you are.
You just have to watch the video.What the feck?
I would like to bitchslap you all the way to angmar
You can feck off then.
Cheers, just stahp with the 'he was talking about the boys and girls ratio lulz'
Boss, that's the context in which he said it. The quotes are there.
https://www.indiatoday.in/india/sto...ana-cm-khattar-article-370-1579374-2019-08-10
That's all I meant. Didn't want to deviate.
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Most Indian journalists are joking about this arrest rather than talking about how ridiculous this is
I like how it is so hard for you to believe that some people can just care about kashmiris and human rights violations without treating it like a sporting rivalry.
I guess that comes from seeing a group of people like animals for half a century.
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legend. She said Sanghis brain are filled with shit and they can’t talk with logic.Looks like it's emerging this is another debacle just like demonetisation.
Brilliant article, summing up most of the indians here.
I still want to know, who does the land belong to originally? Which country?
From my reading, Pakistan was originally part of India. Is this correct? Then something happened around 1947 (independence from Britain) and that part of the land was given over to the Muslim community. Is this correct?.
Kashmir has been in dispute since then, neither country wants to give Kashmir up for what ever reason(lets leave the reasons out of this for now).
After a few wars, they decided to split the land and administer it. Is this correct?
So, the people where happy with the Indian administered part of Kashmir as well as the Pakistan administered part of Kashmir. Is this correct?
Sorry for the questions, i'm just trying to get my head around the dispute.
From my reading, Pakistan was originally part of India. Is this correct? Then something happened around 1947 (independence from Britain) and that part of the land was given over to the Muslim community. Is this correct?.
Kashmir has been in dispute since then, neither country wants to give Kashmir up for what ever reason(lets leave the reasons out of this for now).
After a few wars, they decided to split the land and administer it. Is this correct?
So, the people where happy with the Indian administered part of Kashmir as well as the Pakistan administered part of Kashmir. Is this correct?
Sorry for the questions, i'm just trying to get my head around the dispute.
Agree about the 1st para but this line in the 2nd one had me in splits
That's not the idea of India and never has been. That might be the idea of a few right wing organizations and parties including the BJP, but Government and country are two very different things. For starters, had we not been secular in the past 72 years, the Hindu population wouldn't have gone down from 85% in 1947 to 80% in 2011. Compare the population percentage changes of the majority countries in any of the South Asian countries and you'd realize how wrong that line is.
I'd agree the manner in which the step took place is wrong, but there was no resolution in sight. Most Pakistanis say that as per UN recommendation, there was to be a vote to be held but you guys forget you were the ones who had to take the 1st step for that- by removing your nationals who had entered the Kashmir region for the sake of fighting. Since that did not take place, the second step and consequently the 3rd cannot take place.
Even if we just go to polls now (which India wouldn't agree to as we've seen the results of Brexit and US elections), there is no way those polls will be free and fair. Elections today are driven on propaganda and our government knows that way too well, as they've been the biggest benefactors. Add to that the chances that the side that loses those elections would simply agree and stop fighting for that region are slim.
The idea of India as a secular democracy with enshrined constitutional principles is anathema to the Hindu nationalists whose ideological parents looked up to the Nazis for the inspiration of a pure nation.
Hindu nationalists haven't been in power constantly from 1947.
As for the rest its historical bs which you are using to justify the human rights violation. If you want to go even further back nehru promised the people a vote. All of which doesn't matter. Kashmiris in pakistan are happy whereas in india they arent even allowed to use a phone, internet or stay outdoors. Oh all thay when their children arent being kidnapped.
I would love to see if you would be justifying it by saying there was no resolution in sight so something had to be done if the same was done in your home town.
It’s just that Pakistan going crazy over human rights violations in other countries is like Donald trump complaining about someone’s lack of humility
Last I checked 1) that doesn't make it okay to kidnap kids and 2) we are not treating a whole population as animals 3) it takes a person seriously lacking in empathy to hear the news coming out of kashmir and be more concerned with the nationality of the person reported it.
Ok, but this cant be true, that nobody had claim to the land before this dispute? @MJJ
If you consider the modern iterations, neither india or pakistan existed 60 years ago.
You're opening a big can of worms but I can correct you on one common misconception. Pakistan did not belong to India, ever. The old "region of India" that the British ruled was finished when two different nations of Pakistan and India came into being. This India is not the same as the region of India, it's a nation.
Also, apart from the people of Punjab Pakistan and India have a ton of differences culturally. This goes back to all the way to the Indus valley civilization as far as I know.
But that’s exactly why no one in the world believes Pakistan has any care for people. They can see right through Pakistan’s agenda.
Lets talk about you, do you believe that kashmiris are being treated horribly? They have no internet, arent allowed to go out, missed eid, their kids are being kidnapped. Do you believe all these are human rights violations?
Officially land belonged to no one but J&K were always under Indian administration. People in J&K paid taxes in India. They received grants from central govt in India and so on.
I’ve made myself quite clear on this before. I like a huge number of people don’t support atrocities in any part of India and Kashmir is no different in that regard.
But most Importantly my post was in response to this
It has to be quite obvious why people can’t really take Pakistan seriously when they say they care about people. Exactly. Because their past actions suggest otherwise
I never asked if you support atrocities or not, I am asking if you believe they are being committed in Kashmir right now.
Yes they are. I’ve mentioned that before when I said I don’t agree with the way things are being handled around there, which as far as I’m aware is being echoed by most of the Indian posters here.
What about the second part to my earlier post?