[giggs-beckham]

As with any young talent, one has to preach caution. He’s being hyped to the high heavens, and the only thing that serves is to establish a fantastical benchmark against which the same people tear him down later. We’ve seen it so many times.

What Kobbie is, is a brilliant talent who still has a lot of developing to do. He’s extremely calm and confident and seems fazed by nothing. Yet he has got loads of areas where he can grow and develop his game. We are yet to even fully understand his best position. Most suspect it’s as an 8, but time will tell. Regardless, he needs to be allowed to develop without such a preposterous level of expectation. Expectation that’s going to lead to unnecessary pressure, vitriol from the same people spouting the hyperbole if he has a bad patch, and the very dangerous prospect of overplaying him.

I’d wager nearly anything that at some point in the next couple of years, he’ll have a subpar spell (all young players do as they adapt to the men’s game and opposition players get more familiar with them), and people will tear into him because of their unrealistic expectations. It’d be lovely if we didn’t do that with just one young player for once. But I won’t hold my breath.

If he's a great player in the making then it won't make a difference as it didn't with all the other great young players that were hyped when they were young.

 

[simonhch]

If he's a great player in the making then it won't make a difference as it didn't with all the other great young players that were hyped when they were young.

That logic assumes that there are no great young players who didn’t become great players because of the pressure heaped on their shoulders at any early age. That no careers were adversely affected by overwhelming expectations or being overplayed. It’s right in that it didn’t affect some great young players who went on to become great players irrespective of the amount of pressure out on them, but to say it doesn’t matter ignores an entire data subset of great young players who amounted to nothing, or much less than the hype anticipated, and makes no commentary on how much that pressure and expectation was to blame for their failure to make it. Your post basically says, if he’s great, then he’s going to be great regardless. And if that’s the case, then why not ignore all aspects of his environment? Or indeed all aspects of player development.

In short, your post is worthless.

 

[Gabriel Djemba-Bebe]

Didn't Cole Palmer grow up a United fan and he is from around that area. The Keane brothers were from Stockport I think.

Palmer is from Wythenshawe (same place as Rashford), which is mainly full of reds. Stockport is more blue than red but still there's a decent percentage of people living who are United fans.

 

[TheNewEra]

You see. Look at this. How on Earth is Kobie Mainoo a £120m player?

How much is Halaand valued at then? Or Bellingham?

Let's just relax a bit. He's a v v good talent but steady on.

Haaland is probably 200m in today's market if no buyout clause.

 

[Who's Kissing Cameras?]

Long established at what? Being a decent midfielder for West Ham that is close to almost filling Xhaka's boots?

More intelligent in that he positions himself far better to receive a pass, shows far better knowledge on when to be expansive and when to be conservative, reads space better and understands when he can attack it. Not to mention just having drastically better technique with the ball.

Longevity is a silly metric. Messi was clearly a better player than Saviola within 6 months of his professional debut. Mainoo (not comparing him to Messi) is clearly a significantly better player than Declan bloody Rice.

Rice and Mainoo are different players. Like comparing Busquets and Yaya Toure.

 

[The Red Thinker]

If he's a great player in the making then it won't make a difference as it didn't with all the other great young players that were hyped when they were young.

This.

Mainoo has all the tools. If his name was Mainoovinga, half the Caf will be pleading United to get him.

Why is he worth so much? Look around the world and find a midfielder who is hard to press, strong on the ball, technically strong, efficient in passing, good in the air, intelligent, humble and… doing it all at 18 in the Premier League, against the best of the best, in an extremely fluctuating form team.

Gold. They are very very rare.

 

[Rojofiam]

Long established at what? Being a decent midfielder for West Ham that is close to almost filling Xhaka's boots?

More intelligent in that he positions himself far better to receive a pass, shows far better knowledge on when to be expansive and when to be conservative, reads space better and understands when he can attack it. Not to mention just having drastically better technique with the ball.

Longevity is a silly metric. Messi was clearly a better player than Saviola within 6 months of his professional debut. Mainoo (not comparing him to Messi) is clearly a significantly better player than Declan bloody Rice.

The bolded part is just nonsense, sorry.

It's a pointless comparison anyways. Mainoo will never be able to do the job Rice does at #6, and Rice will never be able to do what Mainoo does at #8. Both can play in each other's positions, but then they are both somewhat wasted. Funnily enough, they're basically the perfect midfield partners for each other.

 

[Raoul]

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

The kid is wise beyond his years. Ditto with Bellingham.

 

[NoPace]

De Bruyne is a significantly better football player than Rodri.

I think it's really close and I'd probably take Rodri, because relative to his position he's better. The gap between Rodri and say the 10th best DM in the world is bigger than the gap between De Bruyne and the 10th best #10.

Like if you control for ages/future value on Transfrmarket, the 10th best DM right now would be like Ruben Neves, Calhanoglu or Kamara at Villa. The 10 best AM would be like Paqueta or Olmo, and I'd probably slightly prefer:

Olmo/Paqueta-#8
------------Rodri-------

than:

#8----------De Bruyne
---Neves/Kamara---

 

[GazTheLegend]

From what I saw last night was the England players looked a bit hesitant to pass to Mainoo at first - he was in the middle and Stones and Maguire could have given him the ball a few times but they looked like they didn't trust him / didn't want to push it with him just yet. That will come with time. But Mainoo settled in there extremely quickly against Brazil who are, at the end of the day, still a great side, and he had a LOT of touches in that last 15 minutes, and didn't misplace many if any. Couldn't have asked for more, really.

 

[Pericles]

That logic assumes that there are no great young players who didn’t become great players because of the pressure heaped on their shoulders at any early age. That no careers were adversely affected by overwhelming expectations or being overplayed. It’s right in that it didn’t affect some great young players who went on to become great players irrespective of the amount of pressure out on them, but to say it doesn’t matter ignores an entire data subset of great young players who amounted to nothing, or much less than the hype anticipated, and makes no commentary on how much that pressure and expectation was to blame for their failure to make it. Your post basically says, if he’s great, then he’s going to be great regardless. And if that’s the case, then why not ignore all aspects of his environment? Or indeed all aspects of player development.

In short, your post is worthless.

My name is Pericles. And I co-sign this message.

 

[Matt851]

I've heard dozens and dozens of arsenal fans describe Rice as being a deep lying player who can dictate the tempo and has great technique and passing from deep yes. All of those things I believe Mainoo walks all over him even at the age of 18.lķ

Also to say opposite skills I'd be hard pressed to name a skill Rice has that Mainoo hasn't shown outside of winning a few more headers.

This is pretty mad after mainoo has played a few games. Now if you were to compare him to hendo...

 

[christinaa]

So happy for Kobbie.
Give him time as he needs to develop more aspects of his football knowledge but the boy is doing good.

 

[DomesticTadpole]

Palmer is from Wythenshawe (same place as Rashford), which is mainly full of reds. Stockport is more blue than red but still there's a decent percentage of people living who are United fans.

It's Foden that comes from there isn't it. I got it wrong.

 

[TrustInJanuzaj]

20/20 passes. 4 fewer than Gallagher all game

If the option is him or Gallagher, then there’s really no option at all. The only players who should be potentially starting in midfield for England potentially over him is a change of system to incorporate foden of Maddison, or a player like Trent. Other than that he should be slotted in between Rice and Bellingham. Players like Gallagher for England are exactly why we never win anything.

 

[giggs-beckham]

That logic assumes that there are no great young players who didn’t become great players because of the pressure heaped on their shoulders at any early age. That no careers were adversely affected by overwhelming expectations or being overplayed. It’s right in that it didn’t affect some great young players who went on to become great players irrespective of the amount of pressure out on them, but to say it doesn’t matter ignores an entire data subset of great young players who amounted to nothing, or much less than the hype anticipated, and makes no commentary on how much that pressure and expectation was to blame for their failure to make it. Your post basically says, if he’s great, then he’s going to be great regardless. And if that’s the case, then why not ignore all aspects of his environment? Or indeed all aspects of player development.

In short, your post is worthless.

I didn't say ignore all aspects of a players development or player development did I now really? Also you chucked in being overplayed while young which wasn't what I was saying either, you're just trying to bulk up your side to win. Which is in my opinion a worthless endeavour.
My point simply is when people say look let's not get carried away. I'm like hey why not these are exiting times for these young lads and us fans as well.

 

[VivaObertan]

It's Foden that comes from there isn't it. I got it wrong.

Rashford and Palmer from Wythenshawe, Mainoo and Foden from Stockport (Cheadle, Edgeley)

 

[Hoof the ball]

 

[lex talionis]

Oh I can, he is much, much better. In 18 months when Arsenal fans stop bugging up the bare minimum from Rice to justify his transfer fee and everyone looking at things on merit the common consensus will he that Mainoo is obviously twice the player because he clearly is.

This is assuming mainoo doesnt gave some freak fall off cause of some random personal issue but he has already shown himself to be drastically better at football than Rice ever has in years.

I think talent in midfielders is the most obvious thing to judge yet the one people get most confused about for some reason. Like I said all summer that Bissouma was clearly as good as Ceicedo and just recieved pelter after pelter then never mentioned it until now.

Mainoo is a better midfielder than Decland Rice. If they both played in the same midfield right now, Declan Rice would be aiming to be a good teammate for the best player in the midfield.

I can’t refute your point but isn’t it possible that the sample size from Mainoo just isn’t large enough yet to come to this conclusion? To each our own but the way I would put it is that Mainoo at his age vastly superior to Rice at 18, and “vastly superior” is is no way an exaggeration.

 

[DRJosh]

Mainoo seems to have that fluidity of movement when under pressure that you just can’t coach. My only worry is if he gets his head turned by Madrid at some point in the next couple of seasons.

 

[Berbasbullet]

Mainoo seems to have that fluidity of movement when under pressure that you just can’t coach. My only worry is if he gets his head turned by Madrid at some point in the next couple of seasons.

Ffs so many of you have Madrid PTSD.

They can’t sign everyone! He is a local lad, if we’re back to winning ways he won’t go anywhere.

 

[DRJosh]

Ffs so many of you have Madrid PTSD.

They can’t sign everyone! He is a local lad, if we’re back to winning ways he won’t go anywhere.

that’s a big “if” but I hope you’re right!

 

[Donut]

Mainoo seems to have that fluidity of movement when under pressure that you just can’t coach. My only worry is if he gets his head turned by Madrid at some point in the next couple of seasons.

Is this a joke? He's a manc, he'll be here for life unless we get relegated.

 

[Paul778]

Do you reckon Gareth actually has plans for him in the short term? Or was the turnaround just to get him locked down in an england shirt and avoid any chancd of him beinv poached by the other country in the frame (forget which)

 

[horsechoker]

If we have a player who Madrid will spend close to nine figures on then we're finally doing something right. Who was the last player Madrid would have dropped a £100m+ on that played for us?

 

[Prodigal7]

If we have a player who Madrid will spend close to nine figures on then we're finally doing something right. Who was the last player Madrid would have dropped a £100m+ on that played for us?

Rooney maybe, but not in his later years.

 

[horsechoker]

Rooney maybe, but not in his later years.

More than a decade ago

 

[Raven]

Do you reckon Gareth actually has plans for him in the short term? Or was the turnaround just to get him locked down in an england shirt and avoid any chancd of him beinv poached by the other country in the frame (forget which)

I'd say he's recognised what every other coach has recognised, Mainoo is a prodigy with a cool head on his shoulders. He plays the game like he's well into his prime, never takes unnecessary risks but absolutely backs his own talent, which is massive. Even Southgate isn't blind enough to miss what this lad is about.

 

[VP89]

I'd say he's recognised what every other coach has recognised, Mainoo is a prodigy with a cool head on his shoulders. He plays the game like he's well into his prime, never takes unnecessary risks but absolutely backs his own talent, which is massive. Even Southgate isn't blind enough to miss what this lad is about.

Hel probably still start Henderson or Gallagher ahead of him

 

[Raven]

Hel probably still start Henderson or Gallagher ahead of him

Maybe, he's easily better than both of them though.

 

[CallyRed]

Rewatched his cameo. Hold my hands up, was harsh on the lad. Apologies for any offence caused.

 

[mav_9me]

https://www.reddit.com/r/reddevils/s/PbW1VKrXQq

It's Martin Samuel, and I haven't read the article, and don't intend to.

But I agree that England need to start Mainoo. More so if the alternatives are Gallagher and Henderson.

 

[glazed]

Mainoo Rice Bellingham is perhaps the best midfield in international football. So Southgate will play Henderson.

 

[Prodigal7]

A lot of our fans tend to overlook (or just don’t understand) how much Mainoo needs to work on his off the ball game to really compete at the highest level. That being said Henderson and Gallagher are really limited and Mainoo should still start ahead of them.

 

[Donut]

I’d be excited if he gets to start at the EC, or if he at least makes the squad. It’d be a great experience for him, he could learn a lot from Rice and he’d be even more awesome for us next year.

 

[Von Mistelroum]

I know he's only 18 but his class is obvious. I'm usually very cautious about United players and err on the side of caution, but with Mainoo I would have him in midfield alongside Bellingham and it doesn't really matter that much who else is in there out of the other midfielders, that is a top class midfield.

 

[Josh 76]

Mainoo Rice Bellingham is perhaps the best midfield in international football. So Southgate will play Henderson.

That could have been the Manutd midfield had some people not fecked up!

 

[flameinthesun]

A lot of our fans tend to overlook (or just don’t understand) how much Mainoo needs to work on his off the ball game to really compete at the highest level. That being said Henderson and Gallagher are really limited and Mainoo should still start ahead of them.

Yeah I agree that is the area where you would target him to improve on. It should develop more as he gets more experience both at united and for England. I think we have seen signs of that side of his game coming along as the seasom has gone on so I'd expect it to get better. I think he has the talent to potentially dominate games, just needs to work on those off the ball skills/movements.

 

[glazed]

That could have been the Manutd midfield had some people not fecked up!

Bellingham is too smart to ever go anywhere but City or Madrid. Glazers would never have paid for Rice - he's a title winner not a scrape top four player.

 

[hellhunter]

Bellingham is too smart to ever go anywhere but City or Madrid. Glazers would never have paid for Rice - he's a title winner not a scrape top four player.

Nothing screams title winner like Declan fecking Rice