In his last season at Milan where he scored the most goals in Italy he only had Robinho around him. The brazilian was garbage in that season. Zlatan was the main source of goals. Milan had Nocerino playing in a boxbox-role similar to Ballack here. He got 10 goals. Four more than Robinho.
To me the BuLi has a bit of slower pace in general compared to La Liga, for Seria A you certainly have a point of course but that's really contrast in styles compared to the two other leagues. Of course have no idea how it was in the 80's. Judging by the amount of goals scored/conceded on average it might that be the case.
What does that have to do with his play making ability?
Principle remains the same, though. You field a shoddy core, and you get fecked over when you meet a great team. Gio's midfield is balanced and contains top players. Yours is imbalanced and contains two top players and one Khedira. That's how I see it - sorry.
Well, it was probably when you compared them and used them as an example that your midfield would work in a defensive set-up?
You arent aware of the concept of context are you?
I don't think that's true outside of Bayern games and Bayern games under Guardiola's style aren't really a good representation for the league. It's at the moment quite clearly dominated by fast and direct transition tactics influenced by Klopp's Dortmund side more than anything else. La Liga is a lot more technical and well thought out in the build-up than the Bundesliga. Guardiola actually made that comparison a few times when he complained how much a counterattacking league it is.
Thanks.
No my argument was that he isnt using ibra's playmaking ability to the best of its ability. Not that he wont score goals you nutter!
Pep's barca which dominated la liga didnt really have two workhorses doing the donkey work either. Khedira's work rate is fine, his quality is another matter. And both pep and sneijder were excellent positionally.
Rightio! Well, i think the post explains how that would work as well. I'm sure Nedved/Ballack/Michel had a couple seasons each with 10+ goals so i don't see it as a problem.
I was generally referring to Bratseth dealing with Eto'o type of strikers - fast and technical on daily basis during that time, not the midfield in hand. For example if Werder in those years had more of a counter attacking approach with Bratseth being a no nonsense defender that is tall and strong, which would make more sense given they will soak pressure it will give him the best stage to excel. In this game Gio's side will be pushing up and probably having a higher defensive line - hence a bit vulnerable to counter attacks.
wow, excellent run, has a huge step that lad when gaining pace.Found this 13 second run on another page I was researching him at. Insane goal if nothing else
Both Nedven and Michel arent regular goal scorers(one goal in five/four games for each), infact ballack has a better goal scoring record than either. Thats why I believe in a game where there wont be too many goal scoring chances for either side, we will edge this as we have more clinical players.
In Muller and Eto'o you probably do have more combined goalscoring in there. My counter argument is that they'll be starved of service because the midfield will be throttled. And the game is really set up for Ballack to get on the end of something from out wide, or for Ibra to tee up one for him or Veron or Nedved. Or for Ibra simply to translate the midfield control into goal(s).
Will it be though? Deschamps is playing deeper so will be marking sneijder in all likelihood. That leaves ballack or veron to try and stop pep. Not the best choice of players. Given how deep he is playing and against the players he is playing against, he will get enough time of the ball to pick the passes through. This is where savicec comes into play as well, his dribbling is going to be crucial in giving us breaks in play as he can carry the ball a long way.
Sums up how voters work in this game. Get a good midfield and the rest matters nothing because possession possession possession. Thank god you gave a feck and read any of the tactics regarding that
You aren't being destroyed, actually. And I predict this match will end up closer than it is presently, vote wise. It seems like a trend - most of the matches so far have attracted voters who seemingly disagree rather strongly with the other side in the debate(s).
The way I base the player performance is his whole form during his peak at the set period. For example Roy Makaay. I don't take into consideration his Deportivo days but I do take into his European and NT form during his Bayern peak. I don't think you can discount one thing when it's all connected. It gets a little more difficult when you have a player like Ciro Ferrara who might not have had a definitive peak at Juve but more of the same kind of consistency throughout his whole time there. Isolating one season out of all that shebang would be fine by me but not necessarily enough for others.
What do you suggest? Should I stick Sensini on him?
How not? By playing him as the line-leader with space to drop into? By flanking him with genuine width to create space? By combining him with hard workers to do the dirty work for him? It's a pretty tasty fit for Ibra I have to say.
I don't think that's true. Enigma and I beat AldoStain and he had the best midfield paring in the draft. There are more factors at play. Sometimes its as simple as having a single player in your team to get one vote. People have a massive hard-on for Riquelme for example in these drafts despite him being far behind many, many players in a similar position in his career.
My game against Enigma_87 was exactly the opposite.
Yeah, not questioning that. Like I said your midfield is perfect.What do you suggest? Should I stick Sensini on him?
Let's be honest, both Ballack and Veron are good fits in there and Ballack in particular has a superb engine.
How not? By playing him as the line-leader with space to drop into? By flanking him with genuine width to create space? By combining him with hard workers to do the dirty work for him? It's a pretty tasty fit for Ibra I have to say.
With muller, I dont think it matters that much. Lke you said he is the best footballer in the world when he doesnt have the ball so it doesnt matter which position he starts in as long as he is allowed to roam which is the case here. he is going to hunt for weaknesses in gio's backline and capitalize on it.
That's a pretty compelling argument to be fair.
That's the thing - your midfield can work, but Pep's Barca (again you comparing your midfield with the one that's totally different from yours) never sat back and soaked pressure, like you intent to. Busquets/Toure + Xavi + Iniesta played to their strengths - which is ball retention, passing and pressing. From your midfield three only Snejider is comfortable playing like Inter did, for example, and he wasn't the key defensive player for them - Pep would be very uncomfortable playing that way and even Khedira impressed me more when he played for a dominating team (not surprisingly and not that he impressed me greatly tbf, he is by far the worst midfielder on the pitch, especially when we point out that it isn't even La Liga's Khedira)
That comparison matters a lot because it's the best that we have to judge the players job. When you say he's going to be exactly like that it suggests that other roles need to be compensated for in order to allow Sneijder to function exactly like you describe.
Well, it depends on how one rates and judges the poor bastard, of course. And - not least - on how one interprets the totality of the thing: Even if he's underwhelming and/or not a good fit, can they get away with it - because they make up for it elsewhere?
I'll also add that Khedira is also instructed to help Sagnol against Nedved and given their tactic of keeping Dejan forward the whole time Khedira inevitably would have to help out or else it will be 2v1. A giant task for him all things considered and I don't really rate him all that much to be able to accomplish that.
I think it's obvious throughout the league right now. Teams like Hertha, Augsburg, Mainz, even Hannover a few years ago when they reached the EL quarterfinals were direct teams that excelled through quick transitions. Leverkusen right now is an even more extreme example. If we go back through the decade it's a bit more difficult to determine, because the Bundesliga didn't have a defining style compared to the other 3 top leagues in my opinion, at least since the 70's. The 60's and 70's were different but that's a complex discussion for a different time.
I'd start by pointing out that the comment about Eto'o type strikers seems a bit misleading because no defender in any league at any time faced a striker like him on a daily basis. If we look outside the league, then it might be worth mentioning that Brathseth did a damn brilliant job in the Cup Winner's Cup final against Wenger's Monaco side with Weah upfront. I'm not sure why Gio's team is supposed to push up though? You don't have to play a high defensive line that could expose your defenders to counterattacks just because you got more control in midfield?
In their write up Viva/MJJ already conceded that area and they are soaking pressure and playing counter attack. It's not a question if the will win or lose the midfield battle as it is already conceded but more if Khedira/Pep protecting the area in front of the defensive line and if they are capable of doing that at this level, while at the same time if they can score more from the fewer chances they will get going forward.
If I could vote twice against you I would. I know plenty well how these drafts work and whilst I did read how you thought you would combat the midfield area, I disagreed and now wish I hadn't and just voted regardless, the post was made with a slight amount of jest as most who have played these drafts know my predispostion towards the Ali G looking talented Argie twat.
Müller's always awesome. Not the biggest fan of him on the left for the simple reason that his game is more one dimensional than on the right. On the right he can still work like a typical winger, run down the line, cut back or put a cross in. His left foot is pretty weak though (good enough for weird finishes in the box of course, but not that much more) and when he played on the left, his strength as a free roaming forward were still there. But from a right footed winger played on the left, you expect more dribbling, cutting inside with the ball. He doesn't offer that.
Yes, obviously. I'm not suggesting they're deluded, simply that the answer to the question in bold is "no".
I think out of all sides I've watched in the last 20 years or so the most appealing at least to me were Toppmöller Bayer, Löw's Stuttgart and probably Dortmund's Hitzfeld side, which IMO was stark contrast to his Bayern job and although successful was underwhelming as a playing style for me.
But what do you think about VJ?
To avoid getting a perm i'll merely suggest that his post was a cnut.
Agreed.
