When Moyes signs Barkley next summer and he turns out to be the new Gerrard for us and makes us a force to be reckoned with.......a lot 'fans' on here will pretend that they had backed Moyes and Woody from day 1.......We are in transition FFS.....Maybe Moyes didn't really want Herrera once he knew we had Fellaini as that would have made life very hard to fit everyone in..........Moyes will get it right even if we have a season of frustration before things gel....this was always going to happen...Moyes and Woody will have the last laugh 1 year from now
Let's all laugh at... Manchester United
- Thread starter lilcurt
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I don't think anybody here is blaming Moyes. Everyone has pretty much said it wasn't Moyes fault and feel sorry for Moyes.
My goldfish has more business sense ffs
Whats so funny?.
What is this imposters thing?
Did you really expect a summer where our longest serving manager, assistant, first team coach and chairman leaving was going to go smooth?
lets start being judgmental end of next summers transfers window.
lets start being judgmental end of next summers transfers window.
Transition? yes
Do I give him time? yes
But let's not pretend the whole summer is not a shamble, wtf are we doing negotiating and making the boy issue a come and get me plea if our own manager don't want him??
It's not FM
fecking disgraceful, can't believe Arsenal signed Ozil. He was exactly the type of player we needed.
This thread.
This. fecking this
The whole Herrera thing reminds me of that feckwit Peter Kenyon dealings with PSG for the Ronaldinho transfer. We agreed a fee only to feck PSG with a lower bid. If Woodward was another Kenyon then I hope he doesn't stay long.
You almost wonder if this was some kind of Jackass/Jerky Boyz style prank, and that maybe these same guys were the ones who led us to believe we'd have a chance at signing Fabregas.The thing that really irks me is the stuff that was rolled out at the start of the transfer window.
At the end of the day, yes we signed a midfielder. Finally, after wanting for years and years to sign a midfielder we did. Maybe he's not the one that we wanted, but we signed a midfielder. That's progress, in some way shape or form.
However, that could have been done straight off the bat. We could have activated his clause, gotten him into the team and had him train with us and used him in our matches. Instead we start a 39 year old Giggs in CM and we get exposed again. We could have saved money on his transfer by getting him cheaper which to me isn't that big a deal but when you look at the way we've handled our business this summer it looks like a few million here and there is some kind of life or death matter. So surely it would have made sense to do that. So that silly decision aside, if we wanted Fellaini from the start then that should have been what we did. Bid, buy, done. No-one would have batted an eyelid at us. Our transfer window would have been okay. No circus antics, no messing about.
It's all the shit around that that's made us look amateurish. First of all the bravado from Woodward. Business WILL be done. We have important transfer business to take care of, we have as much money as we need, Moyes can spend £60 million on one player if he wants to. Excellent.
So we let Thiago slide through the net, one of the most promising players widely seen as Xavi's successor. We let him go. Fair enough, it was disappointing but hey we must have a plan right. Woodward said so. He said we had urgent business to attend to. Clubs miss out on some people or let some people go all the time. So let's move on. The next day we place a bid for Fabregas. As if someone said 'hey you know what... Barca really didn't want to let this midfielder go. They thought they needed him, but they're now a midfielder down. I reckon right, no wait hear me out, I reckon they'll sell us another one. I reckon they'll let 2 of their CMs go in 2 days. Seriously.' As if that sentence isn't idiotic enough, we then bid a pathetic figure even lower than what we paid for Fellaini. This whole debacle was ridiculous and we got laughed at.
So we move on to thinking 'it's okay, there must be a plan. They've said there's a plan. They've said there's a war chest, they've said there are big plans. It's not like they've said there's money available and no value or they've said there's money available but we're keeping our eye out for the right player because those kind of lines tell us not to expect anything but it's the big plans we apparently have.
It's not like it even ends there. It just carries on. The Strootman/Ronaldo/Modric/Ozil/Khedira/Gundogan rumours aside because I have no idea how legit those rumours were or whether there was ever any interest there or just papers making shit up we arrive at the Herrera situation. A lad who wants to play for us, who was prepared to take a pay cut, who was prepared for his medical and we backed out. We made a fool out of him. Apparently we don't agree on his valuation, it's a buy out clause. You don't barter them down. You either pay it or you don't. We could have settled that ages ago by just saying sorry we're not paying that much. We probably got this lads hopes up only to piss on him. The whole saga is again a shambles.
We also bicker about his valuation, yet we pay £27.5 million for Fellaini. We are happy to pay £27.5m for Fellaini but we will only offer £25m for Fabregas. A player of such higher quality. We pay £27.5m for Fellaini when we didn't think Thiago was worth it at £25. We originally offered much lower than this, pissing off Everton and also made a low bid for Baines. It's amateur hour all round.
We then lodge a last minute loan bid for Coentrao who we must have wanted for a lot longer than one day. He's a LB/LM for christ sake, we haven't been linked with many of them this transfer window besides Baines. That wasn't a last minute rush to fill the gap of someone we got rejected for or fecked up on like it was with Harrera/Fellaini, that's a position we could have strengthened at any time yet we chose to do it last minute when we've had the entire transfer window. The same can even be said of Fellaini. We had the entire transfer window yet we chose to feck about and do everything at the last minute. Then the antics today with these three bell ends in Spain. If that's actually true, and they were imposters then they've succeeded in making our club a laughing stock when we could simply have moved to deny it earlier in the day. We could have just come out and say 'err no' and that gets shut down quickly. Instead it drags on in every news outlet all day and nothing gets done until people are laughing at us again.
It's just like we were sold some story about big plans and big money and at the end of the day, none of it happened. Either it was bullshit to begin with, or the guys in charge just weren't competent. Fabregas aside, we weren't going for anybody unrealistic. Fellaini we got, Baines we probably could have got, Thiago we could have gotten I feel if we actually placed a bid and Herrera wanted to come here. The onus was on us to get it done.
So big money big plans = none of it came to fruition.
We don't want to meet the valuations of certain players yet we will happily pay close to it for Fellaini, a player of lower ability than the aforementioned that would have costed a similar price. It's contradictory.
Tl;dr just a lot of musings put into one wall of text. Maybe I've talked a lot of shit, but it's 2am and I'm trying to write everything at once. It wouldn't have been so bad if we'd have just done some business quietly and left it at that. Without all the public bollocks of trying and failing for everything like a stereotypical prom kid geek nervously asking popular girls one after the other if they'll go to the prom with him under pressure because it's in 2 days and he doesn't have anyone to go with yet and it's spread around everywhere how he's desperate and being rejected.
The end result wasn't terrible. I mean come on, we all said a month ago that we were going to get Fellaini. We knew it. The end result is fine. It's the stupid retarded way they decided to go about everybody they tried to get. It gave us hope because we actually thought these guys knew what they were doing, and then they messed it all up publicly. It's the antics we made as a club, and the poor choice of how we went about it that's the stupid thing.
People won't think about this transfer window 'hey you remember when United bought Fellaini?' Which could have been the case if we'd have just done it properly. They'll think 'hey do you remember when United passed on Thiago, bid a pathetic figure for Fabregas, allowed Fellaini's clause to run out so that it cost them more and he missed the first few games even though Moyes was his manager forever, went round all of Europe trying to buy midfielders and kept getting rejected, said no to Herrera because of his valuation, then paid pretty much that for Fellaini anyway and then couldn't even get a loan bid through in time, and let those 3 nobs in Spain pretend to be United for a day after saying they had big plans and big money..
Like you said, getting Fellaini probably is an upgrade at the end of the day, but I'm not sure it's enough. We're still a Carrick injury away from being fecked (unless you think Cleverley can do that job, which I don't.) I'm not going to pretend to know much about Herrera, but if he's good enough to have piqued our interest in the first place, then surely an extra 6 million or so, shouldn't have been such a deal-breaker, especially when we then ended up overpaying for Fellaini. Unless of course, Herrera is nowhere near that kind of player, but then why did we bother in the first place? The whole thing smacks of incompetence, whichever way you look at it. Hopefully, Fellaini will provide a boost to our midfield, and Rooney and Nani get back to their best, while Kagawa begins to fulfill his potential. However, there a lot of 'ifs' at play there.
Smooth? It couldnt have been any more rocky if we signed rocky mountain
I don't think it has quite sunk in yet just how much of a shambles this summer has been.
Think back to the weeks following the Swansea game when all the talk was of big business and a massive budget to ease Moyes into the job, building on an already successful squad - can you imagine if someone had told us back then what was about to unfold over the next two months? Nobody would have believed it, nobody!
As many have said already, only getting Fellaini isn't the problem; the problem is the way we have conducted ourselves and the amateur nature of almost everything we have done since Sir Alex retired. I'm not blaming Moyes individually, or even Woodward particularly, but everyone involved with the process of identifying and pursuing transfer targets needs to hold their hands up and admit, "We got this badly wrong."
It's hard to imagine that this scenario would have played out the same way under Fergie and you have to wonder if there is literally no continuity of his ideas and systems at the club at all. Surely someone must have thought to speak up and point out that this was just not right - not the Manchester United way. I also think we can all see now that it would have been much better if we could have kept David Gill on for at least one more season - possibly even just until Christmas or something, in order to help the transition.
I would love to hear Fergie's perspective on all of this.
Think back to the weeks following the Swansea game when all the talk was of big business and a massive budget to ease Moyes into the job, building on an already successful squad - can you imagine if someone had told us back then what was about to unfold over the next two months? Nobody would have believed it, nobody!
As many have said already, only getting Fellaini isn't the problem; the problem is the way we have conducted ourselves and the amateur nature of almost everything we have done since Sir Alex retired. I'm not blaming Moyes individually, or even Woodward particularly, but everyone involved with the process of identifying and pursuing transfer targets needs to hold their hands up and admit, "We got this badly wrong."
It's hard to imagine that this scenario would have played out the same way under Fergie and you have to wonder if there is literally no continuity of his ideas and systems at the club at all. Surely someone must have thought to speak up and point out that this was just not right - not the Manchester United way. I also think we can all see now that it would have been much better if we could have kept David Gill on for at least one more season - possibly even just until Christmas or something, in order to help the transition.
I would love to hear Fergie's perspective on all of this.
Come on now. Fergie leaving isn't an excuse.
It's Gill leaving thats the problem.
Gill was a excellent Chief Exec but more importantly a football man, who understood how things are done and had a passion for the game.
Woodward is no doubt very good at the commercial aspects but it's clear he has no fecking clue how transfers work in the football world.
So let's replace him with someone competent. I'm afraid if this is how were going to operate in the transfer market then well very quickly slide down the ladder we've fought so hard to climb.
I was embarrassed about the way we did business.
Bid £26m & £30m for Fabregas and end up paying £27m for Fellaini. Perfectly normal 
Bid £26m & £30m for Fabregas and end up paying £27m for Fellaini. Perfectly normal
It's not perfectly normal, but there is an explanation. Fabregas was in the middle of the transfer window when we had several other targets, Fellaini was signed in the last minute when no other targets were available anymore, supply and demand.
A lot of people are wasting time here getting angry over unconfirmed rumours from the press. If anyone's actually embarrassed then you need to reassess your life. The press know they can get away with shit now Fergies gone.
I wonder how many people are embarrassed to go to work today.
I know! Barcelona accept the bid(s), and Fabregas himself said he wanted to leave! Can't believe it!Bid £26m & £30m for Fabregas and end up paying £27m for Fellaini. Perfectly normal
It is not. Some points I think that matter...
1) Fellaini had a £23.5m release clause, which we let lapse in the hopes of getting him cheaper. backfired and we ended up paying nearly £4m more.
2) Though it was obvious to everyone that we desperately needed a midfielder (esp after Liverpool loss) we still let Everton hold us over a barrel by dicking about till the last minute where we had no possible options for negotiations.
3) The double bid we launched for Fellainin+Baines was exactly as Everton boss said. Insulting. Valuing Fellaini less than his release clause and bidding the same amount that was rejected previously for Baines. Even a miracle would not have helped that bid to succeed. It only pissed off Everton and made them push us further.
4) If Fellaini has a £23.5m release clause, bidding £26m & £30m for Fabregas is just ridiculous.
Every attempt we made during this window was worse than amateurish and never had a whisper of a chance of success.
The way we've handled our transfers this summer has made Garry Cook look like a genius.
1) which we let lapse in the risk of signing a better player.
2) the fee would have been the same had he signed straight after the Liverpool loss or in the last minute of the transfer window.
3) Bidding the same amount that was rejected for Baines. I think we told Everton that no other buyers were interested in Baines and that was our final price.
4) That's not really comparable. Cesc has a 100 million pound (unless I'm mistaking him for someone else) release clause, does that mean bidding 80 million pounds for Modric is ridiculous. Release clauses are useless when it comes to comparing players' values.
Hey, it could have been so much worse. At least Woodward managed to keep Chelsea away from Rooney.
I found that the most frustrating transfer window of many a frustrating transfer window but, like others have pointed out, we kept Rooney. Of course, while standing still is not good enough for a top team and could be seen as going backwards, it was the most crucial action of the summer. It was galling to read feeds last night because while they were the source of news, they were also the source of a load of pathetic, spineless ABUs getting the boot in to Moyes with 20 league wins worth of jealousy festering in their hearts. So, yes, the transfer dealings this summer, in terms of bringing players in, was beyond, way beyond pathetic. But the silver lining of keeping an iconic and, given what little business we did, crucial player is a pretty good silver lining. Oh, and Bebe is gone for at least a season so that's something to heave a sigh of relief about anyway.
The moment it turned from incandescent rage to hilarity was when the Coentrao deal collapsed. How apt, given the summer we've had.
We were the laughing stock of the window in the PL, which is not nice.
really a joke. how come we will pay a few more millions to everton given there is a release course. w those a few more millions, we can sign the one in spain
They'll probably get him for peanuts next season
Woodward?
Why don't they bring Sir Alex as a director of football. Just let him deal with talking to players, like Real use Zidane. Keep him involved with the club, but without the pressure of picking the team.
I was really expecting our Fellaini bid to have been fecked up in some way too.
Other than paying 4 million more than we needed too
Other than paying 4 million more than we needed too
I'm going to pretend that we actually put in a €25 million bid for Thiago and Moyes even flew out to meet him. Ultimately though he chose his old manager Guardiola. Nothing wrong with that. Then we put in a £38 million bid for Fabregas, which was accepted. This triggered clauses in his contract which mean he could negotiate with ourselves and Arsenal, but ultimately he decided to stay at Barcelona and signed a new contract doubling his money. Nothing wrong with that. Also, when we took Moyes from Everton we had a gentleman's agreement not to use Fellani's buy-out clause, and instead negotiate like gentleman. Nothing wrong with that. Also, Roma, Madrid and Athletic Club have acted like real jerks and completely fecked us about, probably. We negotiated like gentleman, but they kept tagging on an extra million or so random fees, after we thought we had already agreed a deal. So we walked away. Nothing wrong with that.
This is what I am going to pretend has happened.
This is what I am going to pretend has happened.
What really hurts is that every live news feed and every TV and radio programme last night was full of it. We have become a laughing stock and our standing in the world has diminished.
Really?
No we haven't. Do you really think this institution is that fragile? We are Manchester United, and the media have, and always will as hysterical about our perceived weaknesses and victories. Manchester United are box office. All stories are exaggerated. We've been on the brink of collapse for the last 15 years.