Agreed. He also annoys me. I don't know why, he just does. It's irrational, I have to deal with it.
I think we need to upgrade the RB position this summer.
Let's say INEOS go full fire sale this summer: Who are your untouchables?
- Thread starter Valencia Shin Crosses
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I think we need to upgrade the RB position this summer.
Yes agree. Shaw and Martinez are good consistent players, but injury prone. All the rest are either too old, not good enough or too inconsistent.
In a hypothetical world, Garnacho,Hojlund,Mainoo, Martinez, Bruno.
Martinez
Mainoo
Garnacho
Hojlund
Mainoo
Garnacho
Hojlund
Hojlund - no brainer due to age and potential
Garnacho - no brainer due to age and potential
Shaw - he’s very good and we have very little depth at LB so selling Shaw would cause unnecessary disruption
Martinez - excellent at what he does. Question marks over his fitness but with Varane OOC, Maguire below required level, we require a major CB refresh this summer and Martinez needs to be the constant
Mainoo - no brainer due to age and potential
Bruno - you could argue he might be one that would need to make way to form a new team as he is such a key cog of the current one but I think it’s too early for that. There are far bigger problems than our captain and often best player
Rashford - similar to Bruno really. His wages could make a sale tempting if he continues to frustrate with his performances but there’s plenty of other players that could significantly reduce the wage bill such as Varane, Casemiro, Sancho, Martial, Antony, Maguire so the money doesn’t need to be a factor this summer. Only if he has a negative influence on the dressing room should he be sold but I don’t think that has been the case yet
Dalot - just a really useful player to have even if used as a squad player. Can play both full back positions, good attitude, rarely injured, only 24, not on a massive wage and tied up until 2028.
Garnacho - no brainer due to age and potential
Shaw - he’s very good and we have very little depth at LB so selling Shaw would cause unnecessary disruption
Martinez - excellent at what he does. Question marks over his fitness but with Varane OOC, Maguire below required level, we require a major CB refresh this summer and Martinez needs to be the constant
Mainoo - no brainer due to age and potential
Bruno - you could argue he might be one that would need to make way to form a new team as he is such a key cog of the current one but I think it’s too early for that. There are far bigger problems than our captain and often best player
Rashford - similar to Bruno really. His wages could make a sale tempting if he continues to frustrate with his performances but there’s plenty of other players that could significantly reduce the wage bill such as Varane, Casemiro, Sancho, Martial, Antony, Maguire so the money doesn’t need to be a factor this summer. Only if he has a negative influence on the dressing room should he be sold but I don’t think that has been the case yet
Dalot - just a really useful player to have even if used as a squad player. Can play both full back positions, good attitude, rarely injured, only 24, not on a massive wage and tied up until 2028.
No one is untouchable if a big enough offer comes in
Based on the posts so far, sounds like we need to sign the following based on priority:
Urgent: 2 CBs, 1 strong midfielder, 1 wide attacker
Depth: fullbacks, another winger, another striker, maybe goalkeeper
Urgent: 2 CBs, 1 strong midfielder, 1 wide attacker
Depth: fullbacks, another winger, another striker, maybe goalkeeper
I like having him around. A player who's actually won the league. I'm only half serious.
To be fair, he's very low maintenance. Not a great reason to keep him, but it pushes him up the list compared to some of his overpaid, underperforming teammates.
This isn’t really about “who is untouchable” from a fan favorite point of view, more so who are the ones that should be kept in a full rebuild scenario and why.
Not really what I meant, obviously if Barca offer 200m for Garnacho well off you pop.
Moreso saying who shouldn’t we be looking to move on in a big selling situation where we clear out a bunch of players.
He’s really not as poor defensively as people think, he’s better than AWB at basically everything bar 1v1 tackling ability and even then he’s hugely improved as a 1v1 defender. The biggest knock on him is that he’s simply very poor creatively in the final third, especially on delivery of crosses. But he’s quite good progressing play through the first and middle third, a solid passer, good dribbler, and is more two footed than most fullbacks which makes him versatile in the positions he takes up.
Add in his excellent attitude and work rate and I just don’t think that’s the sort of player you should be looking to move on. Note: this doesn’t mean I think he’s world class or unsellable
Mainoo, Garnacho, Licha, Bruno.
Shaw, Martinez, Mainoo, Bruno, Garnacho, Hojlund.
Fill in the blanks with 5 solid players, and this team can maybe begin to be a major player in determining who wins the league.
Fill in the blanks with 5 solid players, and this team can maybe begin to be a major player in determining who wins the league.
Honestly I’d class Gk as urgent. As of now I’d absolutely look to replace Onana this summer
Varane
Casemiro
Hoijlund
Garnacho
Mainoo
Shaw
Bruno
Martinez
Really not arsed for anyone else.
Casemiro
Hoijlund
Garnacho
Mainoo
Shaw
Bruno
Martinez
Really not arsed for anyone else.
Sir Jimmy Ratcliffe
Agree with that list. Dalot, Martinez, Shaw, Mainoo, Garnacho, Hojlund is it. There are other class players in our squad, but when this is asked, the things you consider are how much could somebody bid for someone like Case/Bruno/Rashford, what their current wages are, what their age is, what their style of play is and if that is perfect for your aspirations on the journey to be one of the best clubs around...
Dalot - right backs are a horrible market, not many impressive guys around Europe who are attainable in any way, not even loads of young promising guys. He's not perfect, but he's good, and it's unlikely we find someone to replace him as starter for a few years. Also at a very good age.
Martinez - top player as a very good age.
Shaw - world class player, perfect fullback for top clubs style wise, just fitness issues. Would be open to a big bid if there were some obvious alternatives out there, but it'd be a big downgrade anyway.
Mainoo/Garnacho/Hojlund - world class prospects already operating at a good premier league level, have no concerns there, they're the core of our future.
Of course, there are many others in our squad who are worth keeping whether as starters or depth players, or future growth guys. But in terms of the full package, the others all have some question whether it's wages don't match the level or squad role, or fitness and age are too problematic, or player style potentially is a limiting factor for us as a team (we have far too few players who are press resistant players who can carry the ball, in fact I'd say 5 of the 6 above are pretty much all but a few in our squad who have those qualities). So those guys all have a point at which it makes sense to sell and replace depending on balance of fees. For example Bruno, if we get a bid where we can replace him with Wirtz pretty much 1 for 1 at worst in wages and fees, then it's a better club decision due to age and press resistance/ball carrying ability. Same with Rashford and someone like Kvara/Leao (with some extra give in terms of fee).
The absolute musts for me this summer are replacing:
Dalot - right backs are a horrible market, not many impressive guys around Europe who are attainable in any way, not even loads of young promising guys. He's not perfect, but he's good, and it's unlikely we find someone to replace him as starter for a few years. Also at a very good age.
Martinez - top player as a very good age.
Shaw - world class player, perfect fullback for top clubs style wise, just fitness issues. Would be open to a big bid if there were some obvious alternatives out there, but it'd be a big downgrade anyway.
Mainoo/Garnacho/Hojlund - world class prospects already operating at a good premier league level, have no concerns there, they're the core of our future.
Of course, there are many others in our squad who are worth keeping whether as starters or depth players, or future growth guys. But in terms of the full package, the others all have some question whether it's wages don't match the level or squad role, or fitness and age are too problematic, or player style potentially is a limiting factor for us as a team (we have far too few players who are press resistant players who can carry the ball, in fact I'd say 5 of the 6 above are pretty much all but a few in our squad who have those qualities). So those guys all have a point at which it makes sense to sell and replace depending on balance of fees. For example Bruno, if we get a bid where we can replace him with Wirtz pretty much 1 for 1 at worst in wages and fees, then it's a better club decision due to age and press resistance/ball carrying ability. Same with Rashford and someone like Kvara/Leao (with some extra give in terms of fee).
The absolute musts for me this summer are replacing:
- CBs - get rid of Maguire and Varane, replace with younger guys who can also start. Lindelof can stay as a backup with Kambwala, but need at least a reliable and younger, potentially top CB like Todibo or Branthwaite, ideally also a 2nd who is left footed to cover for Martinez (Pavlovic is a popular buy on FM...)
- CM - Casemiro on his wages and age while we are doing a rebuild doesn't make sense. If we can get a big fee, replace with a younger guy who can start next to Mainoo long term. Also need long term functional depth and competition in there behind that pairing, Eriksen can't really be used, McTominay isn't really either of those types...
- Wingers - fine with keeping Rashford and Garnacho as the 2 starters, but the depth behind him needs adjusting. Be honest with Pellistri, sell Antony and Sancho, give Amad a role as a squad player, but buy a guy to compete and eventually replace Rashford probably like Nico Williams. Olise also an option, but I'm not convinced.
- CF backup - Taremi on a free would be fine for me.
I'd be disappointed if they were sold: Mainoo, Hojlund, Garnacho and Shaw
Everyone else, I'd be completely fine with if they were sold.
Everyone else, I'd be completely fine with if they were sold.
The young 3 everyone has named, Martinez, Bruno and Shaw.
Fans like to talk about a clearout happening in one summer but no club ever does it because its a bad idea. If we get good enough to win the league again, it'll be gradually done over multiple summers (similar to what Klopp did with Liverpool). Anything else would be counter productive.
Chelsea and look how that's gone.
Fans like to talk about a clearout happening in one summer but no club ever does it because its a bad idea. If we get good enough to win the league again, it'll be gradually done over multiple summers (similar to what Klopp did with Liverpool). Anything else would be counter productive.
Who leaves is likely to be hugely influenced by who we can recruit. You can't change almost the entire squad at once, even f you could afford to, and you certainly don't sell players with out buying/having an upgrade (or possibly an adequate replacement already within the ranks).
I'd be ok with anyone but the kids and Martinez leaving. Obviously don't sell Varane, Bruno, etc. for cheap but if there's a good offer, off they go.
Kind of a silly question with ffp- but ill respond in terms of who is good enough and young enough to build from
Martinez
Mainoo
Garnacho
Shaw - barely
Hojlund - need more time to evaluate simce hes been starved of service
id focus on
Cm
Cb
Cdm
Lw
Martinez
Mainoo
Garnacho
Shaw - barely
Hojlund - need more time to evaluate simce hes been starved of service
id focus on
Cm
Cb
Cdm
Lw
martinez injuries worrying you mate?
They are, and I don't know how he'll look upon recovering from his latest injury.
Injury prone? It's not like Martinez is pulling muscles all the time. He broke his foot, then had to have another surgery on it and he's come back and got injured weird challenge.
The young core of Højlund, Mainoo and Garnacho for me, too — that's something we could genuinely build around. And some of the U-18 and U-23 lads, they're the future of the club (along with the previously mentioned trio)! 
Wouldn't callously argue that everyone else is disposable, most of them are decent professionals at the very least. But I wouldn't be completely opposed to selling them if the club is strapped for cash, there's scope for improvement, they're not appropriate tactical fits, we need to lower the financial burden or age profile of the collective, or the right offer comes along.
For added context, they had previously moved on from the likes of Carlos, Helguera, Beckham, Émerson, Bravo, Cicinho, Pavón, Woodgate, de la Red, Mata.
The Head Coaches weren't spared either. Capello was sent packing after he won La Liga in 2007. Bernd Schuster was fired despite winning La Liga in 2008. As regards their replacements, Ramos lasted less than a year and they parted ways with Pellegrini because Mourinho's Internazionale project had reached its zenith with an unprecedented treble (for Italian clubs) in 2010.
Wouldn't callously argue that everyone else is disposable, most of them are decent professionals at the very least. But I wouldn't be completely opposed to selling them if the club is strapped for cash, there's scope for improvement, they're not appropriate tactical fits, we need to lower the financial burden or age profile of the collective, or the right offer comes along.
Real Madrid as well. They underwent extensive surgery despite retaining La Liga in 2008 (for the first time in more than a decade). Raúl and van Nistelrooy (their two top scorers in those campaigns), Salgado, Robben, Sneijder, Cannavaro, Robinho, Heinze, Javi, Parejo, Huntelaar, Baptista, Granero, Negredo, Soldado, Cassano, Saviola — all of them, among others, were sold over the course of the following couple of transfer windows.
For added context, they had previously moved on from the likes of Carlos, Helguera, Beckham, Émerson, Bravo, Cicinho, Pavón, Woodgate, de la Red, Mata.
The Head Coaches weren't spared either. Capello was sent packing after he won La Liga in 2007. Bernd Schuster was fired despite winning La Liga in 2008. As regards their replacements, Ramos lasted less than a year and they parted ways with Pellegrini because Mourinho's Internazionale project had reached its zenith with an unprecedented treble (for Italian clubs) in 2010.
Rasmus, Mainoo, Garnarcho, Martinez.
I’m 50/50 on Bruno tbh.
I’m 50/50 on Bruno tbh.
For me the names below must be kept: -
Hojlund, Garnacho, Mainoo, Martinez, Shaw. (I would like to include Amad in this list but I don't have a strong case for it but we can argue he is young and should be kept)
Can be kept until a better replacement is found: -
Rashford, Bruno, Casemiro, Varane, Dalot, Maguire, AWB, McTominay, Eriksen, Lindelof, Onana, Malacia, Altay (from this list i think Casemiro is the hardest to replace and might be elevated to the must be kept category for awhile)
Should be sold as they are not good enough and too expensive to keep and won't be missed: -
Antony, Sancho, Mount.
The young players who been in and around the senior squad who are went on loan now should be sold like Hannibal and Pellistri but a buyback clause or something similar might be a good idea, the more younger ones like Gore should be allowed time to develop on loan and then discussion about their future should be revisited.
Hojlund, Garnacho, Mainoo, Martinez, Shaw. (I would like to include Amad in this list but I don't have a strong case for it but we can argue he is young and should be kept)
Can be kept until a better replacement is found: -
Rashford, Bruno, Casemiro, Varane, Dalot, Maguire, AWB, McTominay, Eriksen, Lindelof, Onana, Malacia, Altay (from this list i think Casemiro is the hardest to replace and might be elevated to the must be kept category for awhile)
Should be sold as they are not good enough and too expensive to keep and won't be missed: -
Antony, Sancho, Mount.
The young players who been in and around the senior squad who are went on loan now should be sold like Hannibal and Pellistri but a buyback clause or something similar might be a good idea, the more younger ones like Gore should be allowed time to develop on loan and then discussion about their future should be revisited.
not sure if it is realistic to expect a fire sale. I honestly think our first eleven are pretty good except for the goal keeper.
We would be much higher up the table if not for those injuries. But let's say if we do have a fire sale. I'll keep the following as first team (not necessary starters):
Shaw, Malacia, Dalot, Martinez, Casemiro, Mainoo, Bruno, Mount, Garnacho, Hojlund
From the above list, the absolute must keep would be Martinez and Shaw.
We would be much higher up the table if not for those injuries. But let's say if we do have a fire sale. I'll keep the following as first team (not necessary starters):
Shaw, Malacia, Dalot, Martinez, Casemiro, Mainoo, Bruno, Mount, Garnacho, Hojlund
From the above list, the absolute must keep would be Martinez and Shaw.
Onana
Ten Hag
Phil Jones
Anthony
Martial
Maguire
Mount
Sancho
Rashford
Ten Hag
Phil Jones
Anthony
Martial
Maguire
Mount
Sancho
Rashford
I really like Shaw and we play much better with him in the team but he is misses far too many games every season to be ‘untouchable’ and that’s not something that’s going to improve as he approaches his thirties.
So who are going to buy these players?
I see people wanting to sell players all the time, but the fact is that we wont be able to sell most of the players , because they are on high salaries and they are not good enough for the league they are playing in.
Keep: Mainoo, Høilund, Garnacho, Fernandes, Shaw
Give one more season: Onana, Mount, Martinez (see if injury prone)
Keep as Back up/Rotation : McTomminay, Maguire
I see people wanting to sell players all the time, but the fact is that we wont be able to sell most of the players , because they are on high salaries and they are not good enough for the league they are playing in.
Keep: Mainoo, Høilund, Garnacho, Fernandes, Shaw
Give one more season: Onana, Mount, Martinez (see if injury prone)
Keep as Back up/Rotation : McTomminay, Maguire
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I think so as well. But we have too many vital players that are injury-prone or players too old to expect them to play every game. This is a real problem as we don't have much quality on the bench. We should have fixed that in the summer, but our signing didn't work.
We can't rely on Shaw and Varane for the whole season, but it would be fantastic having those two as cover in the squad. Our midfield would look much better with another young dm ready to challange Casemiro for his place in the team. Our front 3 can be really dangerous but they need competition and cover but we have noone to seriously do that at the moment.
So I also don't think we need a real firesale, our first 11 is quite good - apart from Onana. But even he has proven in the past, that he has quality and may still turn it around. If we can add 2 defenders with a comparable quality to Shaw and Varane but with more resilience plus a couple of good midfielders and attackers then we should be fine.
Idealy, we should in general keep our first 11. But I don't know if we can afford that and bringing in some quality players without breaking ffp-rules, as I can't think of a way to get rid of our big failed signings (Antony, Sancho).
The thing about our squad is that there aren't that many likeable or consistent players. If there ever was a proper clearout, I think the only ones I would keep are:
Mainoo - obviously
Garnacho - duh
Højlund - potential is huge
Martinez - brilliant player and great character
I'd keep at least another season
Bruno
Dalot - versatile, can play both left and right
Mount - versatile midfielder, hasn't been able to prove his worth
ETH - if he improves this season
Mainoo - obviously
Garnacho - duh
Højlund - potential is huge
Martinez - brilliant player and great character
I'd keep at least another season
Bruno
Dalot - versatile, can play both left and right
Mount - versatile midfielder, hasn't been able to prove his worth
ETH - if he improves this season
Think you've covered it all really. That's the base of players that are good enough for a top team (Casemiro and Bruno too but if we got good offers I'd still sell).
Pretty much what has been said so far. Everyone 21 and under, plus Shaw and Martinez. Dalot, too. Meanwhile, priority sales should be Maguire, McTominay, Rashford, Antony. The likes of Sancho and Donny go without saying. Time to cut out the dross.
Nobody. If someone behaves unprofessionally before then they can go too. But as things stand these would be the players I’d look to having part of a squad for the next few years. It doesn’t mean they’re worldbeaters but for now they have qualities we need.
Mainoo
Holjund
Bruno
Martinez
Garnacho
Shaw
And I think that’s it. I wouldn’t even have a problem if they let take a call for example that we can’t control the midfield consistently with Bruno and he can’t be a squad player. But as of now he’s very valuable to this team.
Mainoo
Holjund
Bruno
Martinez
Garnacho
Shaw
And I think that’s it. I wouldn’t even have a problem if they let take a call for example that we can’t control the midfield consistently with Bruno and he can’t be a squad player. But as of now he’s very valuable to this team.
I don't think any player is "untouchable" per say, but I would like to keep:
(1) Mainoo
(2) Garnacho
(3) Hojlund
(4) Martinez
(5) Dalot (Not because I like him but because he can be a back-up for both FB positions and signed a new contract recently)
(6) Mount (Just because we haven't seen him enough)
(7) Diallo (Because on limited showings he has the talent)
(8) One of the CB's (We need backups and won't be buying 3)
(9) Bayindir (back-up Goalie)
(10) Onana (Don't think we'll win the league next year and there are other priorities)
(11) Rashford (Goes if we can get Mbappe or Vinicius Jr in return)
(12) Malacia (Back-up)
(1) Mainoo
(2) Garnacho
(3) Hojlund
(4) Martinez
(5) Dalot (Not because I like him but because he can be a back-up for both FB positions and signed a new contract recently)
(6) Mount (Just because we haven't seen him enough)
(7) Diallo (Because on limited showings he has the talent)
(8) One of the CB's (We need backups and won't be buying 3)
(9) Bayindir (back-up Goalie)
(10) Onana (Don't think we'll win the league next year and there are other priorities)
(11) Rashford (Goes if we can get Mbappe or Vinicius Jr in return)
(12) Malacia (Back-up)
Onana/Bayindir
Dalot/RB RCB/Existing CB LCB/Martinez LB/Malacia
Mainoo/CM DM/Gore
RW/Amad AM/Mount Rashford/Garnacho
Striker/Hojlund
Too many positions to fill, so I am sure we are going to keep more players from the current squad. However, we need 9/10 new players in the next couple of summer windows to go back to competing for big things again.Dalot/RB RCB/Existing CB LCB/Martinez LB/Malacia
Mainoo/CM DM/Gore
RW/Amad AM/Mount Rashford/Garnacho
Striker/Hojlund
Martinez
Shaw
Mainoo
Garnacho
Hojilund
Bruno
Shaw
Mainoo
Garnacho
Hojilund
Bruno