Levelling Down

[ThehatchetMan]

- Higher wages for southerners
- Less annual leave
- Scrapping jobs which increase diversity and inclusion.
- Banning Union representatives from paid time of work

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-62390009

 

[The Corinthian]

Never understood why ‘where’ people carry out the work is such a political issue (I’m talking about office type of work). Especially in a time where >90% of the work can be done remotely with a good internet connection.

 

[sun_tzu]

- Banning Union representatives from paid time of work

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-62390009

That seems pretty reasonable... if an employee is not doing the job their employer is paying them for and is working for the union it seems totally correct that the union rather than the employer should pay them for that.

Regional pay exists in many businesses already so that should ne workable and in theory could be used to encourage departments at looking at leaving London based offices therefore helping a Levelling up agenda

Compared to most of her ideas these are not that terrible

 

[Xeno]

Just because something exists doesn't make it fair.

 

[sullydnl]

She's already backtracked on the regional pay idea.

 

[ThehatchetMan]

That seems pretty reasonable... if an employee is not doing the job their employer is paying them for and is working for the union it seems totally correct that the union rather than the employer should pay them for that.

Regional pay exists in many businesses already so that should ne workable and in theory could be used to encourage departments at looking at leaving London based offices therefore helping a Levelling up agenda

Compared to most of her ideas these are not that terrible

There already is wage disparity in public services based on where you live in the UK. Do we need more of it? That just feeds into rich southerners earning more money buying cheap property up north to rent for profit. Solves nothing.

As for Union representatives, they aren't taking holidays for a jolly, they're working on behalf of the union and representing their members. It's not like they're taking £500,000 private jets to Australia in Lizs case or taking carribbean holidays paid for by the tax payer like Boris.

This is the party which has spent the last 18 months shouting about levelling up too.

If the goverment wants to save money then it's quite simple really. Why not target the tax havens, the tax avoidance and all the loopholes which are costing the country billions. Why not target the landlord? Why not target companies like amazon who have their staff working in applaing conditions while paying barely any tax. (and you want the union representstives fighting for these people to do it for free at their expense?)

 

[ThehatchetMan]

She's already backtracked on the regional pay idea.

Lucky @sun_tzu isnt in the running for PM. He thinks it's a great idea.

 

[That'sHernandez]

She's already backtracked on the regional pay idea.

Strong and stable

 

[Swedish_Plumber]

She’ll be worse than Boris.

 

[Sweet Square]

Lucky @sun_tzu isnt in the running for PM.

Don't know about that.

 

[UnrelatedPsuedo]

It’s not Fcuking difficult to do some of this shit. A few random ideas….

1. Universities need to be regional hubs for education in certain industries.

2. Companies should be offered huge tax breaks for investing in these areas. Sunset tax breaks of course.

3. People in London public sector jobs that are transferable need to be offered bumper relocation packages. Move entire departments. NONE of these things should be in London by 2050. It’s too goddamn expensive. Let them move on salaries that see them buy expensive houses in the north. It’s ok.

4. Move Parliament regionally, every 10(?) years. There is absolutely no reason for MP’s to have second homes, huge expense accounts and to spend so much time in London. 80% of them don’t need to be there daily. Voting on anything should be remote. They all do whatever they’re whipped to do anyway. Those 2m spaced queues to vote on shit during Covid, should have been a national embarrassment. It doesn’t need a forever home until they can prove they can act for everyone. 100 years of touring would stop this soppy Eton Cnuts enjoying it quite so much.

5. Parliamentary recess should be regionalised. There is Fcuk all reason for the whole place to shut down. Ever. Everyone deserves a holiday. But as a maximum, 5 in 6 MP’s should be doing shit all the time.

6. Aim to Divide the country into federal regions inside 50(?) years.

7. For the every living Fcuk, start to accept the idea that we are one country. Kind of. Fair go for Scotland wanting to Fcuk off. But get people to Edinburgh, Cardiff, Belfast. Invest in transport to those places.

I’m probably posting in the wrong thread But I’m in the spirit of this one. Levelling up is so Fcuking easy. More fool me for assuming it’s actually a meaningful policy rather than a catchphrase.

 

[UnrelatedPsuedo]

That seems pretty reasonable... if an employee is not doing the job their employer is paying them for and is working for the union it seems totally correct that the union rather than the employer should pay them for that.

Regional pay exists in many businesses already so that should ne workable and in theory could be used to encourage departments at looking at leaving London based offices therefore helping a Levelling up agenda

Compared to most of her ideas these are not that terrible

It’s still a Fcuking idiotic idea. You can have regional pay but you can’t have a ‘snap your fingers approach’ to regional talent.

Offer one off golden relocation packages to whole departments and divisions. A once in a lifetime deal to move cities, add experience to those places, and put them on a front foot for long term success.

You need to pay according to value to the whole country. Not by costs of living in the area.

Apologies if I’ve got it wrong, but you need to pay areas outside London more, for at least a decade, before you can equalise wages. You can’t pay less where houses are cheap. That endorses landlord culture.

No national services should have offices in London. Too expensive and out of touch. But the solution is not to relocate jobs to areas that pay less in order to save money. Move qualified staff to the places these services should live. Reward loyalty and service. Give renters in London The opportunity to buy outside London. Be surgical. No sledgehammers needed. We have so many great Cities. A beautiful country.

I’m a working-wealthy Londoner. If someone offered me a years salary to relocate to Manchester or Sheffield, payable tax free over 3-5 years, and retain my job, I’d be gone in a heartbeat.

 

[UnrelatedPsuedo]

She’ll be worse than Boris.

100%. At least her old man hates her though. Boris’ dad loved how much of a cnut he was/is.

Its genuinely mad that the potential leader of 65 million people can write off 6 million of them (Sturgeon comments) and talk fantasy about tax, to appeal to the 160-200k people that will amount her.

I hate every inch of Sunak, but his saving grace was being an adult most of the time. The new promise of a 20% income tax cut inside 7 years shows his true colours. Dying with the ESG gangs cock up his bum rather than by his own (fcuked up) principles….. Why?

 

[Vidyoyo]

It’s still a Fcuking idiotic idea. You can have regional pay but you can’t have a ‘snap your fingers approach’ to regional talent.

Offer one off golden relocation packages to whole departments and divisions. A once in a lifetime deal to move cities, add experience to those places, and put them on a front foot for long term success.

You need to pay according to value to the whole country. Not by costs of living in the area.

Apologies if I’ve got it wrong, but you need to pay areas outside London more, for at least a decade, before you can equalise wages. You can’t pay less where houses are cheap. That endorses landlord culture.

No national services should have offices in London. Too expensive and out of touch. But the solution is not to relocate jobs to areas that pay less in order to save money. Move qualified staff to the places these services should live. Reward loyalty and service. Give renters in London The opportunity to buy outside London. Be surgical. No sledgehammers needed. We have so many great Cities. A beautiful country.

I’m a working-wealthy Londoner. If someone offered me a years salary to relocate to Manchester or Sheffield, payable tax free over 3-5 years, and retain my job, I’d be gone in a heartbeat.

In theory great but there's a big macroeconomic issue you're overlooking which is that if you increase influx of labour into regional cities then you drive up cost of housing/rentals. It'd be great for Londoners on those gilded packages but a nightmare for people already in those regional areas. We saw a minor version of it during Covid when more people moved to regional cities.

 

[11101]

It’s not Fcuking difficult to do some of this shit. A few random ideas….

1. Universities need to be regional hubs for education in certain industries.

2. Companies should be offered huge tax breaks for investing in these areas. Sunset tax breaks of course.

3. People in London public sector jobs that are transferable need to be offered bumper relocation packages. Move entire departments. NONE of these things should be in London by 2050. It’s too goddamn expensive. Let them move on salaries that see them buy expensive houses in the north. It’s ok.

4. Move Parliament regionally, every 10(?) years. There is absolutely no reason for MP’s to have second homes, huge expense accounts and to spend so much time in London. 80% of them don’t need to be there daily. Voting on anything should be remote. They all do whatever they’re whipped to do anyway. Those 2m spaced queues to vote on shit during Covid, should have been a national embarrassment. It doesn’t need a forever home until they can prove they can act for everyone. 100 years of touring would stop this soppy Eton Cnuts enjoying it quite so much.

5. Parliamentary recess should be regionalised. There is Fcuk all reason for the whole place to shut down. Ever. Everyone deserves a holiday. But as a maximum, 5 in 6 MP’s should be doing shit all the time.

6. Aim to Divide the country into federal regions inside 50(?) years.

7. For the every living Fcuk, start to accept the idea that we are one country. Kind of. Fair go for Scotland wanting to Fcuk off. But get people to Edinburgh, Cardiff, Belfast. Invest in transport to those places.

I’m probably posting in the wrong thread But I’m in the spirit of this one. Levelling up is so Fcuking easy. More fool me for assuming it’s actually a meaningful policy rather than a catchphrase.

1 and 2 already exist.
3 would just push the prices up in the regions for the people who are from there.
4 would mean instead of some MPs claiming travel expenses, all of them would have to.

Anyway we don't need to worry about any of it. She will be PM for all of 5 minutes, after she mistakes the wave of party support for actual votes and calls a general election resulting in a hung parliament with somebody else as the boss.

 

[UnrelatedPsuedo]

In theory great but there's a big macroeconomic issue you're overlooking which is that if you increase influx of labour into regional cities then you drive up cost of housing/rentals. It'd be great for Londoners on those gilded packages but a nightmare for people already in those regional areas. We saw a minor version of it during Covid when more people moved to regional cities.

That doesn’t exist. Not enough people would move to make an impact. Don’t let London homeowners move. Solved. If you rent in London, yes you’ll get a one off benefit through buying anywhere outside the M25 (some counties may be excluded)

Do also know that I would impose rent caps in the UK and tax private landlords out of existence. It should be illegal in 95% of instances by 2030.

Rents will go down everywhere as fewer Londoners will be paying rent. Demand down, supply will increase.

 

[UnrelatedPsuedo]

1 and 2 already exist.
3 would just push the prices up in the regions for the people who are from there.
4 would mean instead of some MPs claiming travel expenses, all of them would have to.

Anyway we don't need to worry about any of it. She will be PM for all of 5 minutes, after she mistakes the wave of party support for actual votes and calls a general election resulting in a hung parliament with somebody else as the boss.

Dream bigger man.

1&2 have token nods at genuine effort.

3. Don’t let any current homeowners buy. As wonderful as our country is, nobody is giving up a mortgage in the south without reward.

4. No it wouldn’t. I didn’t think I needed to explain a full idea, but Parliament is a maximum 650 homes. The next location has 10 years to build 650 homes. Built by the state. For a decade they are properties for MP’s. After the cycle they’re sold at 80% of market rate to people that have lived in the area in council houses that work in hospitals or schools.

I do appreciate that lots of this sounds like fantasy. But these problems are easily mitigated and embraced.

Our country is fcuked and we think change will come by voting for a party that has to shrink to fit the current system. It’s pathetic. 16 year old sociology students would come up with workable ideas. The people of this country are just so weak and conformist.

 

[Jippy]

That doesn’t exist. Not enough people would move to make an impact. Don’t let London homeowners move. Solved. If you rent in London, yes you’ll get a one off benefit through buying anywhere outside the M25 (some counties may be excluded)

Do also know that I would impose rent caps in the UK and tax private landlords out of existence. It should be illegal in 95% of instances by 2030.

Rents will go down everywhere as fewer Londoners will be paying rent. Demand down, supply will increase.

What about someone who moved abroad for a bit and rented out their UK property, like I've done? Would you force me to sell it?

 

[Sweet Square]

What about someone who moved abroad for a bit and rented out their UK property, like I've done? Would you force me to sell it?

 

[Sweet Square]

The guy telling everyone to vote for the current labour party but also wants private landlords to be illegal by 2030 is just perfect.

 

[Vidyoyo]

That doesn’t exist. Not enough people would move to make an impact. Don’t let London homeowners move. Solved. If you rent in London, yes you’ll get a one off benefit through buying anywhere outside the M25 (some counties may be excluded)

Do also know that I would impose rent caps in the UK and tax private landlords out of existence. It should be illegal in 95% of instances by 2030.

Rents will go down everywhere as fewer Londoners will be paying rent. Demand down, supply will increase.

You think? I'd say anywhere within an hour train journey to London has already seen an increase in people moving out of London on higher wages over the past decade and increased demand/cost of housing due to the unaffordability of buying/renting property in London. It's further accelerated since WFH become a normalised way of working - quite a few people I know left.

I'm not sure how you can increase the amount of people moving out of London and not create some kind of immediate housing crisis in regional locales (well, a bigger one).

 

[Dans]

I’m probably posting in the wrong thread But I’m in the spirit of this one. Levelling up is so Fcuking easy. More fool me for assuming it’s actually a meaningful policy rather than a catchphrase.

I really don't think the want to level anything up at all.......it's just talk to keep the few whose votes they need believing that they actually might mean it.

 

[Jippy]

 

[4bars]

There already is wage disparity in public services based on where you live in the UK. Do we need more of it? That just feeds into rich southerners earning more money buying cheap property up north to rent for profit. Solves nothing.

As for Union representatives, they aren't taking holidays for a jolly, they're working on behalf of the union and representing their members. It's not like they're taking £500,000 private jets to Australia in Lizs case or taking carribbean holidays paid for by the tax payer like Boris.

This is the party which has spent the last 18 months shouting about levelling up too.

If the goverment wants to save money then it's quite simple really. Why not target the tax havens, the tax avoidance and all the loopholes which are costing the country billions. Why not target the landlord? Why not target companies like amazon who have their staff working in applaing conditions while paying barely any tax. (and you want the union representstives fighting for these people to do it for free at their expense?)

Keep dreaming

 

[sun_tzu]

As for Union representatives, they aren't taking holidays for a jolly, they're working on behalf of the union

So the union rather their employer should pay right?

 

[UnrelatedPsuedo]

What about someone who moved abroad for a bit and rented out their UK property, like I've done? Would you force me to sell it?

If you had two, I’d give you 5 years to sell one of them. If it’s just one, no.

 

[RedSky]

What about someone who moved abroad for a bit and rented out their UK property, like I've done? Would you force me to sell it?

Personally, I think everyone with a British passport should be entitled to owning two properties in the UK. Naturally the loophole there would be a family of 4 could own 8 properties, so you'd need to add some carefully worded laws to ensure people don't take the piss. It should also be possible for someone without a British passport to own one property when applied for. But property portfolios is horrendous in a country of our size.

 

[Frosty]

If you had two, I’d give you 5 years to sell one of them. If it’s just one, no.

If we actually went ahead and built 3m homes and then actually sold them to first time buyers, property prices would fall and that may help solve the issue of multiple ownership. Of course that means telling people they cannot expect house prices to constantly grow, and therefore no one will vote for you.

 

[Frosty]

Personally, I think everyone with a British passport should be entitled to owning two properties in the UK. Naturally the loophole there would be a family of 4 could own 8 properties, so you'd need to add some carefully worded laws to ensure people don't take the piss. It should also be possible for someone without a British passport to own one property when applied for. But property portfolios is horrendous in a country of our size.

A British passport holder, or a British resident, or a British citizen?

 

[ThehatchetMan]

Personally, I think everyone with a British passport should be entitled to owning two properties in the UK. Naturally the loophole there would be a family of 4 could own 8 properties, so you'd need to add some carefully worded laws to ensure people don't take the piss. It should also be possible for someone without a British passport to own one property when applied for. But property portfolios is horrendous in a country of our size.

The carefully worded law could be one per person? And thus in your scenario a family of 4 can have 2 houses, one per parent.

 

[RedSky]

A British passport holder, or a British resident, or a British citizen?

British Citizen would be fairer. I have no problem people coming over to the country to work and live. It's the rich bastards with dozens of properties and barely sets foot in the country that fecks me off. No person needs to own more than two houses in the UK. It's just utterly unreasonable to me.

Anyway, I guess this is going offtopic.

On subject: Truss is a thunder shite with horrific opinions.

 

[ThehatchetMan]

If we actually went ahead and built 3m homes and then actually sold them to first time buyers, property prices would fall and that may help solve the issue of multiple ownership. Of course that means telling people they cannot expect house prices to constantly grow, and therefore no one will vote for you.

At this rate home owners will be a minority in a couple of decades. Its decreasing at an alarming rate.

So the majority of the population won't care about keeping house prices on the rise.

 

[Jippy]

If you had two, I’d give you 5 years to sell one of them. If it’s just one, no.

We were more accidental landlords not wanting to give up our London flat. We're not going to put the current tenants' rent up when it comes to renewal if they stay either- they've been no bother and don't want to fleece them.

 

[Frosty]

At this rate home owners will be a minority in a couple of decades. Its decreasing at an alarming rate.

So the majority of the population won't care about keeping house prices on the rise.

I appreciate that home owners vote in large numbers, but I do wish the Labour Party would actually take on this vested interest. And I say that as a home owner.

 

[ForeverRed1]

does anyone like either truss or sunak? Both horrible.

 

[sun_tzu]

If we actually went ahead and built 3m homes and then actually sold them to first time buyers, property prices would fall and that may help solve the issue of multiple ownership. Of course that means telling people they cannot expect house prices to constantly grow, and therefore no one will vote for you.

I mean 3m homes over how long... thats close to 10 years capacity in the UK...so if you want to accelerate that what support is available to contractors and material suppliers ... let alone the issues about planning and land bank release

 

[marktan]

I mean 3m homes over how long... thats close to 10 years capacity in the UK...so if you want to accelerate that what support is available to contractors and material suppliers ... let alone the issues about planning and land bank release

I mean that's where the bulk of council housing came from, Atlee and Bevarins huge post war home building program. At one point there was something like 300k new houses being built per year. So it is doable. Is there a will for it? Is there feck.

 

[11101]

What all of this misses is that people bought rental properties because Gordon Brown screwed everybody's pensions and left them needing to sort their own retirement out. Fix that problem and it becomes less desirable to own multiple properties.

 

[Frosty]

I mean 3m homes over how long... thats close to 10 years capacity in the UK...so if you want to accelerate that what support is available to contractors and material suppliers ... let alone the issues about planning and land bank release

I mean that's where the bulk of council housing came from, Atlee and Bevarins huge post war home building program. At one point there was something like 300k new houses being built per year. So it is doable. Is there a will for it? Is there feck.

Wilson's Government built 400,000 in a year

https://redbrickblog.co.uk/2016/03/harold-wilson-a-housing-hero/

And just look at this chart:

We built hundreds and thousands of homes a year before. Local authorities could be given money and powers to best alleviate shortages without central government control. Central government could borrow (not as cheap now, but still) to invest in new homes, as well as providing support and legal changes for the private sector too.

The current system is failing. Everything privately built near me is luxury flats with no or next to no affordable houses.

The thing is we have done this before, so we can do it again.

And build on the green belt:

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[sun_tzu]

Wilson's Government built 400,000 in a year

/MEDIA]

So just 7.5 years to build the 3m houses presuming we go back to 1970s health and safety and environmental standards and allow no lead time to ramp up to that