Lionel Messi | PSG Watch

[Zehner]

Isnt it bit like how much fuel he has left in his tank to play at the highest level? Also about "retiring on a high". Going into semi retirement after winning the WC and possibly a 8th Balon D'or is about as good a ending you can have at 36.

All that "he's finished" stuff feels a bit artificial to me considering he still is the second highest scorer in all top 5 leagues as a CAM. Anyway, I generally get the idea of retiring at your best but as it seems it is either Barca or Al Hilal right now and in that case the semi retirement option is one with a very bad aftertaste. Would be a different story if he was to join his boyhood club in Argentina or at least an MLS franchise. But with these options on the table, I don't get how anybody can root for the semi retirement option.

In general, I think the Ibrahimovic/Buffon way is the nicest. Play a part time role at a top team until you're finished. Or the David Silva/Rakitic/etc. way of playing for a smaller club that's happy to have you around and surrounds you with hard working players.

Well you seems wanting him to move back to Barca instead and taking 1/20th of salary he could make in Saudi. I think that’s fair on fans perspective.

But let’s be realistic, at some stage in the near future, he would decline sharply too, due to inevitable aging/when his legs are gone. Would it be really good scene to watch when it reached to a that point, when undroppable Messi hindering the progress/result for Barcelona, or when unhappy Messi sitting on the bench being pictured all over the headlines every other weeks?

Even if we pretend that won’t happen anytime soon, we all know Barca is currently struggling with their finance and compliance with FFP rules, and registration of their best young players. Besides, they are also currently facing corruption charges which could possibly end up in worst ever consequence in football.

Should Messi really need to risk his final years putting himself in such mess?

And let’s not forget Messi does care his money more than you thought of him - his controversial 550m contract with Barca, his infamous tax fraud, and his current big money contract with Saudi on ambassador role.

Risk his final years? Come on. What would he risk that he's not going to lose when he's going to Saudi Arabia, anyway?

And I think being an impact sub and occasional starter at a top club at 36+ is fine. As long as you don't make a fuss, obviously.

 

[troylocker]

The idiots are the people who look to footballers as being moral examples. Especially if there exists people who think that all those things you mentioned are suddenly super cool because they pay Ronaldo's and Messi's wages.

You don't recognize sportswashing as probematic or Ronaldo and Messi openly saying yes to being tools for dictatorship regimes for shitloads of money as problematic? What do you think the incentive for paying Ronaldo and Messi 100s of milllions a year is (playing for clubs with total revenues under 50M)? Nothing political, image polishing, divertion...etc.
If you don't think global superstars have responsibilities as rolemodels, that's on you, but don't go around calling people with different opinions than you idiots. Is there anything you wouldn't do for the right amount of money? Anyone's money you wouldn't take? Your opinion on this is scary to say the least. The cynisism is unreal.
Of course superstars in sports are rolemodels for the younger generations. If we accept that the people our kids look up to are horrible rolemodels and defend/justify their bad choices, then we are literally lowering the bar for our kids to make similar bad choices themselves.

 

[Zehner]

I think this may not be the best way to put it, but It’s funny his ending moment in Europe would be quite similar to Ronaldo - disrespect by his home fans, getting banned/fined by his own club, heading towards Saudi for big money move - all he need to do next is an interview with Piers Morgan bitching PSG perhaps.

That's a much better explanation why you root for him to go to Saudi Arabia than what you posted earlier who cares if this means he sportswashes an oppressive regime as long as it sheds a better light on CR7

 

[Gehrman]

You don't recognize sportswashing as probematic or Ronaldo and Messi openly saying yes to being tools for dictatorship regimes for shitloads of money as problematic? What do you think the incentive for paying Ronaldo and Messi 100s of milllions a year is (playing for clubs with total revenues under 50M)? Nothing political, image polishing, divertion...etc.
If you don't think global superstars have responsibilities as rolemodels, that's on you, but don't go around calling people with different opinions than you idiots. Is there anything you wouldn't do for the right amount of money? Anyone's money you wouldn't take? Your opinion on this is scary to say the least. The cynisism is unreal.
Of course superstars in sports are rolemodels for the younger generations. If we accept that the people our kids look up to are horrible rolemodels and defend/justify their bad choices, then we are literally lowering the bar for our kids to make similar bad choices themselves.

I think its only as problematical in these cases as you make them. I havnt seen Ronaldos stint so far change anyones view on Saudi Arabia apart from that more of his fanboys watch clips from Saudi League. Do you think Messi's fanboys will end up championing Shariah law because of the job he might do there? But the point is also, he's 36 in a bit over month. The whole meat of his career is over. Its just semi retirement. So many great players do this. Do i think its awesome? No. I just dont see at as a game changer in any way.

 

[shamans]

That's a much better explanation why you root for him to go to Saudi Arabia than what you posted earlier who cares if this means he sportswashes an oppressive regime as long as it sheds a better light on CR7

Hope you know Messi already makes a ton of Money from Saudi Arabia. Maybe because he's an adult and realizes he is a footballer not a politician?

 

[Zehner]

Hope you know Messi already makes a ton of Money from Saudi Arabia. Maybe because he's an adult and realizes he is a footballer not a politician?

No idea what your point is supposed to be.

 

[shamans]

No idea what your point is supposed to be.

That the politics is irrelevant to footballers and their legacy. Should Messi be worrying about France's well documented past and current oppressive policies?

 

[Zehner]

That the politics is irrelevant to footballers and their legacy. Should Messi be worrying about France's well documented past and current oppressive policies?

Yes, he absolutely should care whether or not his employer is beheading innocents.

 

[shamans]

Yes, he absolutely should care whether or not his employer is beheading innocents.

And if his current employer has $20 billion+ worth trade with beheaders of the innocent? It's okay?

I'm glad he is an adult and doesn't have to play politics like this.

 

[Zehner]

And if his current employer has $20 billion+ worth trade with beheaders of the innocent? It's okay?

I'm glad he is an adult and doesn't have to play politics like this.

Call me crazy, but for me working with somebody who beheads innocents is worse than working with somebody who works with somebody who beheads innocents. Basically, the closer you get to the beheading thing, the worse it gets.

Still curious what exactly your argument is? That we adults should just accept that we're hypocrites, cut the middlemen and do the beheadings ourselves?

 

[troylocker]

That the politics is irrelevant to footballers and their legacy. Should Messi be worrying about France's well documented past and current oppressive policies?

It's not irrelevant though. He is literally already receiving money from the regime as a tourist ambassador for Saudi Arabia. Becks the same for Qatar. They are literally using their footballing legacies to fill their pockets doing political work, and rightfully receiving critisism for it.
Are you putting France and Saudi Arabia in the same bracket here?
Saudi Arabia is in the bottom 10% while France is in the top 20%, when it comes to Human freedom index. A democracy vs. a totalitarian absolute monarchy. One of the worst dictatorships on the planet vs. a democracy. The guy paying Ronaldo's and Messi's wages has the blood of 100 000's thousands on his hands. France is far from perfect, but it has the basics in place: freedom of speach, freedom of religion, free elections every 4 years, freedom of sexuality, "equality" between the sexes etc.

 

[shamans]

Call me crazy, but for me working with somebody who beheads innocents is worse than working with somebody who works with somebody who beheads innocents. Basically, the closer you get to the beheading thing, the worse it gets.

Still curious what exactly your argument is? That we adults should just accept that we're hypocrites, cut the middlemen and do the beheadings ourselves?

It's not an argument, it's the reality that footballers do not care about politics above their control. Messi is a footballer and he will play wherever he wants that gives him a good deal be it competitiveness, money, the city or whatever.

Furthermore, Saudi Arabia is a key ally of the western world that have encouraged the kings for decades at this point. So even from a western lens, Messi is absolutely irrelevant to the larger political game. On the contrary, if you must be political the likes of Messi or famous artists that go to perform at Saudi can make the argument they are improving the situation.

Was Saudi Arabia better in the 90s when no one went there despite still being freakishly rich or now that the doors have opened up? They're more in the public eye and thins have been improving. Women couldn't drive not long ago. Now they can because they want to be accepted by the western world.

Saying "He's taking money from tyrants that behead innocents!" is simplifying the situation and its not what he's doing.

 

[RedRonaldo]

It's Mbappe who has wasted his own prime years, as has Neymar by playing for PSG and playing in France in their prime. You play in ligue one when you are just beginning or for PSG's money when you are ending your career. As Messi has done.

BTW Mbappe has been most shit this season and thus has nothing to do with Messi.

Didn’t he score 38 goals in 40 games this season so far? I wouldn’t described this as “most shit” this season.

 

[RedRonaldo]

That's a much better explanation why you root for him to go to Saudi Arabia than what you posted earlier who cares if this means he sportswashes an oppressive regime as long as it sheds a better light on CR7

Well that was obviously meant to be a joke, I think something must have hit you hard on the topic as you are taking this whole thing far too personal. Just take it easy, and chill!

By the way Messi is currently ambassador of Saudi regime, taking hundred millions from them to promote tourism of their country, if you haven’t yet realized. He is all up for their money.

 

[That_Bloke]

Call me crazy, but for me working with somebody who beheads innocents is worse than working with somebody who works with somebody who beheads innocents. Basically, the closer you get to the beheading thing, the worse it gets.

Still curious what exactly your argument is? That we adults should just accept that we're hypocrites, cut the middlemen and do the beheadings ourselves?

I don't quite follow your reasoning.

Not saying that SA aren't one of the worst regimes on the planet, because they really are, but why are you expecting from a single man, and a footballer at that, be it Messi or Ronaldo or whoever to lead the way, so to say? All while we, the western countries and our governments are besties with them, and work hand in hand? When so many western companies would basically do anything to get juicy contracts from them and have no problem with that? It doesn't only apply to Saudi Arabia by the way. Would you react the same way if they went to China for example?

Since when people paid to kick a bag of wind became a beacon of light for the masses?

 

[mshnsh]

Didn’t he score 38 goals in 40 games this season so far? I wouldn’t described this as “most shit” this season.

The "most " was a typo. I meant mostly.

Those stats dont tell the whole story (typical for stats). Until a couple of games ago, he wasnt olaying well at all.

Anyway, I've understood your thinking in football. He who scores is the bestest footballer in the world. The rest of the team including the players who create the chances, imbalance the opposition with their skill etc don't matter.

 

[RedRonaldo]

The "most " was a typo. I meant mostly.

Those stats dont tell the whole story (typical for stats). Until a couple of games ago, he wasnt olaying well at all.

Anyway, I've understood your thinking in football. He who scores is the bestest footballer in the world. The rest of the team including the players who create the chances, imbalance the opposition with their skill etc don't matter.

Not exactly. He has been asked to play more of a receiver/goalscorer role this season, as their manager thought it would be more beneficial to then team as the have some of the best creators in the game (Messi and Neymar), who hadn’t been as sharp in goalscoring. I remembered he wasn’t all that happy as he see himself more as a wing forward who could both do both roles, and remembered how he was linked to us at some point. But I’d say he has done quite well scoring close to a goal per game, being forced to play such role for his team.

 

[Gehrman]

I don't quite follow your reasoning.

Not saying that SA aren't one of the worst regimes on the planet, because they really are, but why are you expecting from a single man, and a footballer at that, be it Messi or Ronaldo or whoever to lead the way, so to say? All while we, the western countries and our governments are besties with them, and work hand in hand? When so many western companies would basically do anything to get juicy contracts from them and have no problem with that? It doesn't only apply to Saudi Arabia by the way. Would you react the same way if they went to China for example?

Since when people paid to kick a bag of wind became a beacon of light for the masses?

Let me say first that yes, Messi seems doesnt mind taking dough no matter who pays him for it. And these questions arent aimed at you but more the people in uproar. What are the best, medium and worst case scenarions from this? Like totally realistically? I grew up trying to base my game on Giggs and Michael Laudrup. Giggs turned out to be a sociopath in terms of having a conscience regarding adultery and Michael became a sell out in terms with Qatar post his retirement. Apart from a bit of disappointment i honestly couldnt care less. Messi is a Christian. I don't believe he will suddenly empower islamism because he spends a couple of years there in semi retirement. I cannot see what people are realistically worried about other than yes, Messi comes across as a nice guy but is definitely not ideological about who pays his salary and yeah got done for tax evasion like the other guy.

 

[Zehner]

It's not an argument, it's the reality that footballers do not care about politics above their control. Messi is a footballer and he will play wherever he wants that gives him a good deal be it competitiveness, money, the city or whatever.

Furthermore, Saudi Arabia is a key ally of the western world that have encouraged the kings for decades at this point. So even from a western lens, Messi is absolutely irrelevant to the larger political game. On the contrary, if you must be political the likes of Messi or famous artists that go to perform at Saudi can make the argument they are improving the situation.

Was Saudi Arabia better in the 90s when no one went there despite still being freakishly rich or now that the doors have opened up? They're more in the public eye and thins have been improving. Women couldn't drive not long ago. Now they can because they want to be accepted by the western world.

Saying "He's taking money from tyrants that behead innocents!" is simplifying the situation and its not what he's doing.

The cultural exchange through business argument worked pretty well with Russia. I'm from Germany, we know what we're talking about.

By the way Messi is currently ambassador of Saudi regime, taking hundred millions from them to promote tourism of their country, if you haven’t yet realized. He is all up for their money.

Yeah, and I would prefer that he doesn't double down on this endorsement

I don't quite follow your reasoning.

Not saying that SA aren't one of the worst regimes on the planet, because they really are, but why are you expecting from a single man, and a footballer at that, be it Messi or Ronaldo or whoever to lead the way, so to say? All while we, the western countries and our governments are besties with them, and work hand in hand? When so many western companies would basically do anything to get juicy contracts from them and have no problem with that? It doesn't only apply to Saudi Arabia by the way. Would you react the same way if they went to China for example?

Since when people paid to kick a bag of wind became a beacon of light for the masses?

The West's partnership with Saudi Arabia is a necessity. The Saudi regime knows that and plays their hand. However, Messi as an individual is not reliant on them, he can afford to tell them to go feck themselves. That doesn't automatically make him a terrible human being but it is a valid point of criticism. And the farther he intensifies his relationship with them, the more there is to criticize. So as an admirer of the footballer Messi, I think it is only normal to root for a different club in the race for his signature.

 

[shamans]

The cultural exchange through business argument worked pretty well with Russia. I'm from Germany, we know what we're talking about.

Of course it has worked. Do you think rights of Russian people would be better off had the world continued to just ostracize them in the 90s? If there was no cultural exchange the war might have had a lot more support from local Russians. Germans silly foreign policy towards Russia has little to do with that.

 

[Zehner]

Let me say first that yes, Messi seems doesnt mind taking dough no matter who pays him for it. And these questions arent aimed at you but more the people in uproar. What are the best, medium and worst case scenarions from this? Like totally realistically? I grew up trying to base my game on Giggs and Michael Laudrup. Giggs turned out to be a sociopath in terms of having a conscience regarding adultery and Michael became a sell out in terms with Qatar post his retirement. Apart from a bit of disappointment i honestly couldnt care less. Messi is a Christian. I don't believe he will suddenly empower islamism because he spends a couple of years there in semi retirement. I cannot see what people are realistically worried about other than yes, Messi comes across as a nice guy but is definitely not ideological about who pays his salary and yeah got done for tax evasion like the other guy.

I'd add that he doesn't seem to give a feck about climate change.

 

[Zehner]

Of course it has worked. Do you think rights of Russian people would be better off had the world continued to just ostracize them in the 90s? If there was no cultural exchange the war might have had a lot more support from local Russians. Germans silly foreign policy towards Russia has little to do with that.

Germany's reliance on Russian fossil energy was always justified with the same arguments you're using now: It will bring them closer to Europe, will make them less likely to attack, lead to a cultural exchange and a indirect democratization, etc. Those are nice thoughts but in most cases, it was opportunistic greed covered as idealism. An easily available excuse to just brush aside any moral objections. It's the same with this.

Working together with Saudi Arabia isn't forbidden, footballers have every right to do so. But let's call a spade a spade.

 

[shamans]

Germany's reliance on Russian fossil energy was always justified with the same arguments you're using now: It will bring them closer to Europe, will make them less likely to attack, lead to a cultural exchange and a indirect democratization, etc. Those are nice thoughts but in most cases, it was opportunistic greed covered as idealism. An easily available excuse to just brush aside any moral objections. It's the same with this.

Working together with Saudi Arabia isn't forbidden, footballers have every right to do so. But let's call a spade a spade.

So Germany shouldn't have fielded a team for the 2018 world cup?

The fossil fuel trade has nothing to do with this. You ignored my question -- would ostracizing russia post cold war have more of their locals supporting the war or less? If you're being honest with yourself you know the answer and these irrelevant examples of fossil fuel trades don't negate that.

 

[Gehrman]

I'd add that he doesn't seem to give a feck about climate change.

Oh another mega rich celebrity who flies private jets. Colour me surprised. If only he did it to fly around the world and lecture fairly poor people like me about what i ought to do, im personally grateful he doesnt do that. Anyway no surprises about him giving zero fecks there.

 

[Zehner]

So Germany shouldn't have fielded a team for the 2018 world cup?

The fossil fuel trade has nothing to do with this. You ignored my question -- would ostracizing russia post cold war have more of their locals supporting the war or less? If you're being honest with yourself you know the answer and these irrelevant examples of fossil fuel trades don't negate that.

No country should have fielded a team for the 2018 world cup.

The German reliance on Russian fossil fuels was one of the biggest problems in the beginning of the war. And it was a result of the exact same train of thought that you just presented so how is that irrelevant? It proves that at least in this case, your take evidently backfired. If you want to know my personal opinion, trading is generally something positive and leads to cultural exchange but when it comes to oppressive regimes, it shouldn't excel certain degrees. There's nothing positive about a footballer with billions of followers indirectly legitizimizing human right violations by signing a €400m per year contract. It gets a message across that the leaders of Saudi Arabia can just buy whatever support they want - and that Western people are opportunistic and greedy and don't take their own values serious.

 

[ericPSG]

I’d argue Messi has been better than mbappe this season, nobody has more goals and assists in Europe than Messi. If anything it is crazy how little criticism mbappe gets because he is French

I have watched almost every PSG games this year
Messi was really good from September to the WC as I said.
From January to the past few weeks, he was really poor. Some goals and assist but poor
And we all know spring football is when it matters…

Mbappe was not as good as well but was defended by 2 or 3 defenders because of Messi being subpar and Neymar injured

Just watch Psg Bayern. The whole bayern defense was focused on Mbappe and Messi did nothing of it.
Mbappe missed some chances as well to be fair

Mbappe still scored 38 goals for PSG this season. I have crazy expectation for Mbappe as well but 38 goals with that team is not bad. Not great but not bad

 

[troylocker]

I’d argue Messi has been better than mbappe this season, nobody has more goals and assists in Europe than Messi. If anything it is crazy how little criticism mbappe gets because he is French

Haaland and Mbappe have better goal+assist-ratios than Messi in European club football this season. Players like Rashford, Salah and Vini from the top 5 leagues also has more goalcontributions than him (lower ratio though). Mbappe and Messi are arguably playing in the easiest league though.

Haaland: 1,44 goals+assists/90 (52 goals/8 assists) (total: 60)
Mbappe: 1,29 goals+assists/90 (38 goals/9 assists) (total: 47)
Osimhen: 1,06 goals+assists/90 (28 goals/5 assists) (lower total: 33)
Messi: 1,04 goals+assists/90 (20 goals/19 assists) (total: 39)
Salah: 0,96 goals+assists/90 (30 goals/14 assists) (higher total: 44)
Rashford: 0,88 goals+assists/90 (29 goals/11 assists) (Higher total: 40)
Vini Jr.: 0,88 goals+assists/90 (23 goals/21 assists) (higher total: 44)

Being the 4th most productive player in the top 5 leagues is also pretty darn good though, and shouldn't mean he's done in the top leagues in Europe. If he want's to taint his legacy he goes to Al-Hilal, if he wants the opposite he'll go back to Barca and win a couple of trophies with them while fading into less minutes and retirement.

 

[The Boy]

No country should have fielded a team for the 2018 world cup.

The German reliance on Russian fossil fuels was one of the biggest problems in the beginning of the war. And it was a result of the exact same train of thought that you just presented so how is that irrelevant? It proves that at least in this case, your take evidently backfired. If you want to know my personal opinion, trading is generally something positive and leads to cultural exchange but when it comes to oppressive regimes, it shouldn't excel certain degrees. There's nothing positive about a footballer with billions of followers indirectly legitizimizing human right violations by signing a €400m per year contract. It gets a message across that the leaders of Saudi Arabia can just buy whatever support they want - and that Western people are opportunistic and greedy and don't take their own values serious.

Making the argument is sadly pointless, the whataboutism and the dodging of any social or moral responsibility in the replies is just endless. But good try!

 

[FrankFoot]

No country should have fielded a team for the 2018 world cup.

The German reliance on Russian fossil fuels was one of the biggest problems in the beginning of the war. And it was a result of the exact same train of thought that you just presented so how is that irrelevant? It proves that at least in this case, your take evidently backfired. If you want to know my personal opinion, trading is generally something positive and leads to cultural exchange but when it comes to oppressive regimes, it shouldn't excel certain degrees. There's nothing positive about a footballer with billions of followers indirectly legitizimizing human right violations by signing a €400m per year contract. It gets a message across that the leaders of Saudi Arabia can just buy whatever support they want - and that Western people are opportunistic and greedy and don't take their own values serious.

You are putting way too many expectations in a couple of footballers, who have no say in what Saudi Arabia do or don't with their citizens/women.

 

[giorno]

Being the 4th most productive player in the top 5 leagues is also pretty darn good though, and shouldn't mean he's done in the top leagues in Europe. If he want's to taint his legacy he goes to Al-Hilal, if he wants the opposite he'll go back to Barca and win a couple of trophies with them while fading into less minutes and retirement.

fun fact: of his 39 G+A, 26 came in 2022. Since the turn of the year his productivity has cratered, while playing for PSG in Ligue1 with Mbappé...

Messi does not have a full season in him anymore

 

[Zehner]

You are putting way too many expectations in a couple of footballers, who have no say in what Saudi Arabia do or don't with their citizens/women.

They can decide where they live and who they endorse. If Messi decided to publicly support Putin after being paid by him, would that also be okay?

 

[antk]

Reminder that you can, in fact, reject obscene offers from the Saudi government.

 

[Fobal]

fun fact: of his 39 G+A, 26 came in 2022. Since the turn of the year his productivity has cratered, while playing for PSG in Ligue1 with Mbappé...

Messi does not have a full season in him anymore

The thing is that usually the winner of the WC takes the crown (sometimes without very little football season behind like R9, or a good but not extraordinary season like Zizou in 98, the WC has an over the top romanticism and adding Messi being in his last years even more) if they are going to do ti in such fashion this year or nope, we don't know, but it won't be far fetched if he wins nor undeserving, more when he had a great season and even a very good calendar year overall beyond the WC.

PD: as a side we can make a whole 5 minutes vid with Killian missing Messi's passes this last year, he missed to many easy goals to be such a phenom, but he also tends to score some with difficult angles or out of the blue, he is kind of inmature in that regard.

 

[Fobal]

The whole political, economics debate is kind of silly, much can be said about our western hypocrisy too and our own lives and jobs.

But for certain nor Jordan, Pele, Messi, CR, are in the mold of fellas like Socrates, the Great Ali or even as crazy, over the top, contradictory a Cantona or Maradona could be, the fellas mentioned at the beginning does not have much of a social political stand or ideas to fight for, many times not even that great mates with their own teamates or rivals (in such regard Messi and his mostly public calm demeanor and more than often respectful manners is sthg good, but doesn't excuse him of letting other run his bizzness with all the taxes, the greedy and other affairs involved).

This world certainly needs an Ali, right or wrong in his ideas, with many flaws like anyone, but really going beyond his profession and putting himself in the line for it.

 

[giorno]

The thing is that usually the winner of the WC takes the crown

Oh he 100% deserves the 2022/23 Ballon D'Or, unless Vini or Haaland do something amazing in the last 2 CL games, in which case he'd still deserve it but maybe Haaland would deserve it more. Vini, not sure

 

[Fobal]

Oh he 100% deserves the 2022/23 Ballon D'Or, unless Vini or Haaland do something amazing in the last 2 CL games, in which case he'd still deserve it but maybe Haaland would deserve it more. Vini, not sure

Normally more than one player deserves the prize, season wise in results and stats mainly...not that much strict football wise, when comes to what a Pele, Maradona, R9, Cryuff, the little fella from this thread, these kind of fellas could do in every season even their "looser" ones tend to always be outstanding or out of the norm football wise in terms of overall plays.

BTW Hallaand, Mbappe, Vini, and even Cortouis (once again) had great seasons, many City players with very good to great seasons will be affected with Pep's heavy rotation.

Fooling a bit, imagine if somehow Julian plays a sub and pulls out some great shyte in semis and the final, Luis de la Fuente will laugh his arse off his next press conference....what a lucky charm the mf will become if he wins everything with City

 

[Andrade]

Reminder that you can, in fact, reject obscene offers from the Saudi government.

I mentioned this before and I was very impressed that Tiger did that because it is not easy to turn down that much money, no matter how rich you are. But then he cheated on his wife with hundreds of women and is a drug addict (mainly because of the breakdown of his body, but still) so it just depends on what you are most outraged by morally. No one is perfect, especially super famous sportspeople that live in a bubble of worshippers.

 

[Zehner]

I mentioned this before and I was very impressed that Tiger did that because it is not easy to turn down that much money, no matter how rich you are. But then he cheated on his wife with hundreds of women and is a drug addict (mainly because of the breakdown of his body, but still) so it just depends on what you are most outraged by morally. No one is perfect, especially super famous sportspeople that live in a bubble of worshippers.

I don't think that this is comparable at all. We are not talking about personal flaws like cheating or substance abuse that affect yourself and your family/friends but the conscience decision to play along in the propaganda of one of the most oppressive regimes on earth. He's basically supporting death sentences, gender inequality, religious discrimination, etc if he signs there respectively communicates that those things aren't important enough for him to give up on money.

 

[Andrade]

I don't think that this is comparable at all. We are not talking about personal flaws like cheating or substance abuse that affect yourself and your family/friends but the conscience decision to play along in the propaganda of one of the most oppressive regimes on earth. He's basically supporting death sentences, gender inequality, religious discrimination, etc if he signs there respectively communicates that those things aren't important enough for him to give up on money.

Sorry to say bud but he's already made his decision by agreeing to be an ambassador for Saudi tourism, for which I am sure he is being paid a hefty sum. It doesn't actually matter if he signs with a club or not, if we're talking about his moral compass. Sadly, it's already pretty clear that he will advertise or align himself with anything, no matter how damaging that thing may be. Plus, as other posters have pointed out, I do take some issue with Western nations demonising Asian nations, especially countries that have managed to get some agency through the mucky business of oil. If they're evil, are Europe and America good?!

On your point about the demerits, flaws are flaws. Some people take much more account of the personal than the political. It's up to the individual what they judge to be the most egregious. I personally don't care about people's private lives, but the media reaction to Woods's infidelities (totally unfair IMO) and drug issues shows that a lot of people do.

 

[Zehner]

Sorry to say bud but he's already made his decision by agreeing to be an ambassador for Saudi tourism, for which I am sure he is being paid a hefty sum. It doesn't actually matter if he signs with a club or not, if we're talking about his moral compass. Sadly, it's already pretty clear that he will advertise or align himself with anything, no matter how damaging that thing may be. Plus, as other posters have pointed out, I do take some issue with Western nations demonising Asian nations, especially countries that have managed to get some agency through the mucky business of oil. If they're evil, are Europe and America good?!

On your point about the demerits, flaws are flaws. Some people take much more account of the personal than the political. It's up to the individual what they judge to be the most egregious. I personally don't care about people's private lives, but the media reaction to Woods's infidelities (totally unfair IMO) and drug issues shows that a lot of people do.

There's a difference between being an ambassador for Saudi tourism (bad enough) and joining the Saudi league. And it's not demonising, it is a fact that Saudi Arabia breaks fundamental human rights. I hate this kind of whataboutism. Yeah, Europe and the US aren't flawless but the very fact that you can criticize them without fearing consequences shows that they are "better" countries than Saudi Arabia. Tolerance stops where people are harmed.