at the same time moaning we pay too much and sell for too little money.
Maguire | he stays!
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Don’t know why you think that. If you compare their histories, attendances, attainments, Roma are a much bigger club and, I think, currently a slightly better team.
Precisely. Folks don't realise how difficult a job it is.
Think Maguire still definitely get sorted. £32m+£3m or something like that.
McT I'm not as sure... £38+£5m might do it.
McT I'm not as sure... £38+£5m might do it.
£70m plus add ons? I just don’t see it happening.
Maguire will end up at about £35m is my guess, we need about £30m to make him neutral from a FFP perspective, and will probably have to give him a golden handshake of about £10m to make up the drop in wages for the next 2 years.
Split the difference on the £10m with them and that'll be that, hopefully
McT, I'd say £35+5m will be enough to get it done.
So £65-70m I think would be good value for both parties.
Split the difference on the £10m with them and that'll be that, hopefully
McT, I'd say £35+5m will be enough to get it done.
So £65-70m I think would be good value for both parties.
I think 60/65 million for both players is a good deal. Wouldn't want it to fall through for being too greedy. I can't see Maguire getting his confidence back this season at OT, so better for us and him that he goes for a fresh start. I would also say Fred was a better performer than McTominay last season and would rather see him go than Fred.
That's why I see it just being Maguire... Unless we cave on £35m for McT
Pretty sensible imo. Hope WH would think the same especially for Maguire.Maguire will end up at about £35m is my guess, we need about £30m to make him neutral from a FFP perspective, and will probably have to give him a golden handshake of about £10m to make up the drop in wages for the next 2 years.
Split the difference on the £10m with them and that'll be that, hopefully
McT, I'd say £35+5m will be enough to get it done.
So £65-70m I think would be good value for both parties.
If the wages issue could be solved I can't think of any reason he'd want to stay.
£70m for both is stunning business for us and great business for West Ham. Maguire suits Moyes. The worry is if West Ham fire Moyes, then they are fecked.
I regard McTominay as a valuable squad member - not as deadwood - and I don't think Hag would mind keeping him. You'd struggle to buy a 30m midfielder that would go directly in and strengthen the first 11 and Fred, DVB, Sabitzer and Iqbal, that's already 4 midfielders out. If we get a good price, then ok, but I see no reason to sell McTominay just for the sake of it. He's actually not that bad a fotballer even if he's not a starter.
Shush now.
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Well, they need to wake up really. Despite winning the European Conference (or whatever its called), the reality is they will be playing Europa League fixtures this year, they were 5 points away from being relegated from the PL last season, have lost their captain and best player, and brought no one in yet.
An extra £10-15m for 2 players could be peanuts, particularly, if, like me, they think Maguire & McT could be very good players for them.
You're underrating the size of west ham Imo.
Moyes would pretty much need to relegate them (fingers crossed) to get the boot at this point, the goodwill from the Conference League win will see him through anything else I reckon.
I have said this before but using who Gareth Southgate does or doesn't pick as a barometer for a players talents is a slippery slope.
He isn't.
Plenty of good players don't make Southgates squad, another one of them played in a UCL semi final last season and is a Seria A champion
I was a Mike Smalling fan but he was hopeless with the ball at his feet. I reckon Southgate was beyond short sighted not picking him however.
Have you watched Maguire? Smalling made far less mistakes whilst playing out under LVG, he's looks aqkward on the ball and he can't play long passes like Maguire.
However, he would make far less mistakes on the ball than someone like Maguire.
Yep and then next year we should have replaced AWB with Frimpong
Why would we pay maguire off? We can sell him any time we want, it's up to him and his agent to agree terms according to WHU's wage structure. Why is it even our concern what they offer him?Maguire will end up at about £35m is my guess, we need about £30m to make him neutral from a FFP perspective, and will probably have to give him a golden handshake of about £10m to make up the drop in wages for the next 2 years.
Split the difference on the £10m with them and that'll be that, hopefully
McT, I'd say £35+5m will be enough to get it done.
So £65-70m I think would be good value for both parties.
I watch every game mate. Mike and Blind were wonderful partners for each other, I thought Smalling was close to a worldie, but as his fitness issues began and he came out the team, any time he went back in he was so poor. I am beyond glad he turned it around when he went to Italy and he definitely earned England call ups.
For all Maguire faults he's generally good on the ball when facing away for his goal. Against teams who don't press hes incredibly assured and its probably why he looks good for England. He just cannot play out from the back against a high press, at least not when De Gea would panic more than him.
If we went to 3 at the back then Frimpong would suit, but he cannot play in a flat back 4.Yep and then next year we should have replaced AWB with Frimpong
Hes on an insane wage for us that the average Prem team cannot compete with. Effectively he is on double what West Hams best player is on (when you factor in his 25% raise due to Champions League qualification) Its standard when teams are trying to shift big earners that they give a financial sweetener. Otherwise he sits on the bench and affects your own pay structure until his contract expires.
If he was going to a better club than West Ham his wage is easily transferred. Thats not happening sadly.
I'm just hoping they wait till september!
Because he has a signed contract guaranteeing him £190k a week for the next 2 years.
If there's an option for him to move for half that weekly amount that benefits us more than him, he's perfectly within his rights to insist on us paying him the difference.
Depends. Nobody knows the difference between his basic wage and his CL wage. If the 190 is the upper limit, then perhaps the difference for the following season will be less than 90k.
Not necessarily. His pay increase due to CL has been well documented. If that takes it to 190k, then he is only guaranteed 190k for the coming season, not the next 2. And he wouldn’t have received that this (last) season for example.
If this all happens, I’m celebrating. Thought we were stuck forever with him
Can we ask him nicely to not do that? Just like Barca did with dembele?
Wrong. Can't sell a player that doesn't agree to a new contract with the new club.
What's wrong with that valuation? 30-35 mill for Maguire and 40-45 mil for McTominay isn't something ridiculous IMO. Maguire is a vastly experienced CB, who is England's starting CB and till very recently, United's captain.
McTominay is also a very useful player, with lots of experience at the highest levels, and has had a lot of good performances.
Both are English, home grown, with loads of PL and CL experience.
McT is just 26 and Maguire just turned 30.
Every other team puts ridiculous price tags on their players, but we can't? Especially when West Ham have about 100 mill lying around from the Rice deal?
Maguire’s management must of given West Ham the nod that Harry was up for the move.
No reason to submit a bid otherwise.
No reason to submit a bid otherwise.
Which is why I've said in earlier posts that £35m would be fair, cover our FFP commitment and about half the salary reduction.
Everton monitoring the situation it seems , thought only we did that.
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Not the most glamorous signings but on paper if they invest the rest of the Rice money, 70-75m on Maguire and McT will make them a stronger team for Moyes' football.
Two very experienced players that would likely become their best players and probably fairly productive too. Maguire defensively an aerial magnet in the box/deep own half and McT probably would thrive in their box to box style games.
I think different rules apply for the Maguire and McTominay bids. I 100% support rejecting the McTominay bid; with players like Rice and Enzo going for 100mil, Scott is worth at least 40 as an international in his mid-20's.
Maguire is a different story. We're talking about a player the wrong side of 30, out of form, just stripped of the captaincy, and suffering regular online ridicule. His stock has never been lower, and West Ham are the only buyer. I think it's very risky turning down a 30mil bid. Maybe we get the extra 5mil we want, in which case great, and overall I applaud the club for trying to change our selling practices to avoid buyers taking the piss. But if there was ever a player where it made sense just to cut our losses, it's Maguire.
Maguire is a different story. We're talking about a player the wrong side of 30, out of form, just stripped of the captaincy, and suffering regular online ridicule. His stock has never been lower, and West Ham are the only buyer. I think it's very risky turning down a 30mil bid. Maybe we get the extra 5mil we want, in which case great, and overall I applaud the club for trying to change our selling practices to avoid buyers taking the piss. But if there was ever a player where it made sense just to cut our losses, it's Maguire.
I feel the challenge is not the transfer fees for maguire. Its his wages. Would a club like West ham be able to afford paying such high wages for him?
No, the talk is he'd half to take just under a 50% pay-cut, from 190k down to around 100k. That's likely where the sticking point is and why there's talk of us having to pay him of with around 9.5m for the two years left on his contract.
That's probably why we're holding out for more money so we can at least break even on the amortisation of the 80m we paid for him. West Ham are likely to raise their bid so it may well still get done.