Quoting your own posts, you are better than that.
Man Utd set to appoint Director of Football (when hell freezes over)
- Thread starter RedMachine03
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While I agree for the most part, didn't Mourinho adjust to having no say in things at Chelsea and barely any say at Real Madrid? While I believe (no clue, guesswork) Inter has/had a DoF?
I'd like to see a DoF that doesn't get in the managers way (signings, gameplans etc) but has a plan on what kind of manager to sign when needed. A very limited role in other words.
I find it more bothersome that we went from getting to the byline and cross to holding the ball to save our life and finally to letting our opponents having the ball and try to force mistakes than our failed signings over those managers periods.
So as I said, if it goes wrong there will be one man to blame and it won't be our mis-titled DOF. Jose now has to get it right as he has all the power in his hands as he wanted.
At Real, I believe he was their most powerful manager ever. He even managed to oust Valdano there.
So nothing truely exciting then.
I'm keen on a DOF just for continuity mainly but we'll probably have to wait until the Jose era is over with.
I'm keen on a DOF just for continuity mainly but we'll probably have to wait until the Jose era is over with.
Might as well do it!Quoting your own posts, you are better than that.
I'll accept that.
However my point is that in Mourinho's case while he's earned his stripes, he's worked under such conditions and worse before, no?
As I mentioned, I hope the director of football doesn't meddle in stuff so our managers gets to do their job without shackles, but that the DoF has a vision for how the club is to play and gets managers that fills that long-term vision.
For me the change is welcome. You can't shake the feeling that under Fergie we understandably eschewed evolving our administrative and management hierarchies in similar ways to most other clubs, but now Fergie is out the equation we are left behind somewhat.
The man played a key role, I'd argue the key role, in United being different in modern football, and since he's departed we've struggled to accept we need to start playing the game like every other club.
I am not against the idea of a DOF. In my opinion, the gap between the CEO and the manager is far too big to be ignored. However things needs to be done in a certain way especially since we've got a world class manager on board. Its one thing bringing in a new manager into an estabilished system and its another imposing new restrictions to the manager especially someone like Mou who won't take new restrictions lightly
Assuming that Mou is on board on this then I would suggest the Juventus structure. At Juventus there's 3 people known as the triade. Currently the triade is made up of Andrea Agnelli, Giuseppe Marotta and Pavel Nedved. Agnelli is the money guy who takes care of the financial aspect of the team. Marotta is the experienced football person and whose job is to make sure that the right people are in the job and that the football aspect is well run. Finally there's Pavel Nedved who gives club tradition and fans a voice in a coherent, realistic and intelligent way. Previously they were the Giraudo, Moggi and Bettega. Please note that Marotta/Moggi had no history with the club whatsoever. That a small but significant detail as it avoid club bias, nepotism and nostalgia to rule the board. Juventus has some of the finest staff in Italy, most of whom with plenty of year experience in their role. The job is given out of pure meritocracy and aren't meant to give a job to some drunk relative of the boss or to a former player with zilc coaching experience who cant find it in himself to leave the nest.
Now Woody can do the Agnelli job and Gaz can slot into Nedved's role. However we do need our Marotta.
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He has, but I think there has been a bit of trouble with such an arrangment as well. People have argued that Mourinho could be a good long term fit at United because he'll get a kind of autonomy that he's never had at a top club before. If he goes to PSG or wherever he's not going to get the same level of freedom as he has at United.
Marotta might move to the FIGC. I doubt he would come to United though
Okay that's nice and all but when the hell are they going to update the club website?
Do they have a DOF at Real now and if so they have been more successful since?
I have no idea about the current set up. I assume that ZZ is not responsible for the transfers though.
Correct, look like this is a role in managing Academy and may be some of the non-sales staff. i.e. someone being paid in millions for pushing paper without making any decisions.
Theoretically this is a good idea.
Technically It's supposed to be Ramon Martinez but I'm almost that I have read about the fact that Perez kept the limited DOF role and he is basically doing the job himself.
Exactly - pretty clear message, that.
So, unless Woody has changed his mind rather dramatically, we aren't appointing a DOF of the sort people are now getting excited about.
We should, mind you. But it doesn't look like we are.
Nicky Butt is doing a great job of rebuilding the academy and seems to know the type of players that we want at United. I would choose Butt and see how it goes from there.
Give it to Giggsy.
With the way thing are moving fast forward, I say Monday?
Ideally, the coach and the DoF are not at odds over whom to sign. It's supposed to be a division of labour. Frankly I don't see how a coach is supposed to have time to deal with transfers, anyway. Mourinho sure as hell isn't executing the transfers right now, either.
There's lots of different ways to arrange responsibilities and decision power. 'Final say', 'veto power', etc. This notion that DoFs strive to load players onto the coach against the coach's will is nonsense. Obviously, there has to be a functional working relationship and common goals.
I think Butt won't be able to, let's say, "enforce" stuff on Jose when needed.
We need a bigger person than him, someone with a well documented CV in that position.
We were in for Monchi a couple of summers ago and it never panned out. I don't think we were able to give him as much control as he or most top-level DoFs would want
Will he/she have the power to fire Mourinho's ass?
Not a chance, that will be Ed's call.
Maybe the little wobble over the last few weeks has made the higher ups a little nervous?
It's something we should be doing, but I am not sure we can drop someone in now with Jose in place. Maybe if we had done this prior to him coming in so he would know what to expect.
No one employed at the club will be able to overrule Woodward.
Can we rename this thread please? It's so, so misleading.
I'm hoping its more of a cooperative role to support a manager. I see no point in having a director in charge of tactics/transfers/training, why not hire him as a manager. If the role is to help in day-to-day such as; academy structure, scouting strategy, transfer strategy and negotiation, then great.
The role should be strong enough to argue with Mourinho, for example, if he was against a transfer of a player, high salary/transfer fee/ better options. One of United's problems is our transfer strategy.
For a big club, we seem to lack some intelligence in the transfer market. We sign players who only seem to want to be here as we offer a higher salary or we end up paying over the odds. We are only interested in a player if they've had a good season or their marketing potential.
Absolute gems we've missed:
The role should be strong enough to argue with Mourinho, for example, if he was against a transfer of a player, high salary/transfer fee/ better options. One of United's problems is our transfer strategy.
For a big club, we seem to lack some intelligence in the transfer market. We sign players who only seem to want to be here as we offer a higher salary or we end up paying over the odds. We are only interested in a player if they've had a good season or their marketing potential.
Absolute gems we've missed:
- Griezmann at Real Sociedad. Where he was fantastic and it was obvious that he had potential to be more.
- Vidal at Leverkusen was also a standout player, but he went to Juventus for peanuts. Now we are linked with him for a £240k a week contract.
- The summer Robben/Snjider left Real Madrid, we should have splashed some of that Ronaldo cash.
Read my last sentence again. Or, presumably, for the first time.
You lost me on football manager tbh. Its a very childish way to discuss things.
Technically Avram Glazer is an employee as the executive co-chairman of the club isn't he?
Sure, but there's a huge difference in being able to speak about tactics at a pundit level and being able to implement a successful and sustainable style of play at a football club. He has a good football mind compared to an average football watcher, but who's to say how he compares to other coaches, managers and DoFs. His limited time at Valencia is sort of relevant for that comparison.
Awful decision if true, a manager should be allowed to target his own players and live/die on their success.
So in actual fact we're not employing a Dog... meh. False hope.
Will Jose care, he will go off with a lovely big payoff. It is Manchester United and our reputation that will suffer if he gets it wrong. He has one season to get it right. Because if he doesn't he will be gone. As was said in another thread, Jose does not have a particular style, it is all about the oppostion and negating them. Making sure you stop them. United should be able to go toe-to-toe against anybody. Teams should be worrying about us. That is not the case we scare noone. We need somebody in the club to get us back on track. I was happy we won trophies last season, but presumed, foolishly, that the football would get better.
I was hoping for Air Bud
Hope we do get a DOF, as we need it. Does not look like this is the same though.
Damn auto correct
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