Agreed but not sure a spell upfront would do much good either, his lack of movement is an issue and it would be quite painful to see that upfront. Not sure if there is anything more we can do, either he has it or it doesn't.
Martial's United career so far?
- Thread starter Amar__
- Start date
He has one goal more, and 3 assists less in about 90 minutes less than last season. Statistically, hardly an improvement.
He's averaging a goal every 30 minutes more than last season, that's not at all insignificant.
He is also averaging goal and assist every ten minutes less than last season in PL, and also has two assists more in last seasons CL in one game less, while he is even dropped this season in CL. Again, hardly an improvement.
Comparing like for like in the CL is impossible, the standard of opponent varies too strongly.
I also never mentioned assists, I was speaking specifically about his goal scoring.
Well put. I attribute all of this to his lack of footballing insight. He is not a smart player and makes poor decisions with the ball and without the ball.
Martial's United career so far is being wasted playing out wide.
His performances of late have been inexcusable, mind.
But this hug the touchline role he's playing is for the birds.
His performances of late have been inexcusable, mind.
But this hug the touchline role he's playing is for the birds.
I agree and this is indicative of a larger problem with patterns of play. Things like if there's only 1 forward pressing you should easily be able to play out from the back all the time. There are coaches that emphasize how your hands should be positioned when controlling a ball which foot to use etc...I understand each player has different levels of potential but I don't see these fundamentals being instilled. The passing tempo, simple passes not being properly placed (i.e. Smalling). And as you mentioned, the non-movement of the forwards is the primary cause of bad play through the lines (at least from the midfield).
He’s underwhelmed.
Needs smoking jacket, cravat and cigarette in holder to go with his level of effort.
He's not all that. Been saying it for a while.
We just need to accept that he's not very good. He doesn't have the stones for the task.
This. He's not mentally strong enough to play at the highest level.
All the talent in the world but doesn't seem to fancy taking people on and pursuing the difficult option. He'd rather play the simple pass back to the original passer and kill all our momentum.
Let's hope we can find someone to take him. Might end up in China.
Big new contract, get out the pipe and slippers.
When you realize Mane has been a better signing than Martial
I've been thinking this for a while, he seems to have the talent but isn't putting it together. In a way he reminds me of former ravens QB Joe Flacco. On his day he looks so impressive and dangerous, but those days are quite far apart. Flacco never became more than an average QB, but people insisted he had tools for greatness and made excuses for him constantly. It wasn't until last year I think most ravens fans realised he simply is what he is and won't be more. I'm getting that same feeling about Martial.
Might as well try him down the middle at this point, because out wide is starting to look like a waste of time, he’s so patchy in that position. When he’s bad there’s zero point him even being on the pitch.
Martial always reminds me of Lucas Moura who started like a house on fire and everyone thought he would rule football. But alas, Moura didn't turn out to be the great everyone thought but has still settled to be a decent, often substituted, not-so-regular-for-his-national-team, player for a top six team.
Bobbins.
Jose stalled Martial's development?
Square pegs, round holes.
Story of our team in any number of positions. He's done OK to good on the left wing, but you have to wonder would CF not be better suited for him? We've a problem in that we've 3 players vying for that one position basically.
Lukaku at €75 simply hasn't been consistent enough and Ole has made a big call dropping him in favor of Rashford.
Rashford looks a big talent, still very young but is so far from being a complete forward.
Martial, can be lazy and withdrawn but I feel has better ability control / holding up the ball that either of the other 2 and better finishing ability.
So something has to give and often its Martial and he's put to the left side and drifts in.
Story of our team in any number of positions. He's done OK to good on the left wing, but you have to wonder would CF not be better suited for him? We've a problem in that we've 3 players vying for that one position basically.
Lukaku at €75 simply hasn't been consistent enough and Ole has made a big call dropping him in favor of Rashford.
Rashford looks a big talent, still very young but is so far from being a complete forward.
Martial, can be lazy and withdrawn but I feel has better ability control / holding up the ball that either of the other 2 and better finishing ability.
So something has to give and often its Martial and he's put to the left side and drifts in.
At least Moura gets involved in his team's plays. The main issue with him is that he's utterly hopeless when it comes to the final pass or shot. But tactically, he's not a bad player to have around and bring on from the bench.
The most frustrating thing about Martial is that, when the ball isn't coming his way, he looks completely out of synch with everything that happens on the pitch. He just sits out-wide on the left and waits to see if the ball will arrive at his feet. No runs toward the far-post to get at the end of crosses, no movement between the lines, no desire to occupy the half-spaces when the LB overlaps.
He's got skills on the ball alright but, although these skills tell us that he's a good footballer, this doesn't mean that he will eventually become a good player.
I think its time to sell martial, he's so predictable,yesterday against west ham he couldn't even pass the ball a few yards, gave it away 3 or 4 times in the first 15 minutes
In a word Yes.Jose stalled Martial's development?
Jose stalled Martial's development?
Well yes he did.
Some interesting numbers to put to you.
In Martial's debut season he had his best run of starts for us, 29 games started on the bounce. As a young 18 year old kid he was superb in his debut season. In those 29 games he provided us with 8 goals and 5 assists.
The next 2 seasons under Jose he was absolutely shat on! In Jose's first season here the best he could give Martial was 5 starts on the bounce! FIVE! This after the kid won the World Young player of the year award, scoring I think 18 goals in a debut season? Jose was a clown dropping him. Still in that run of 5 games Martial scored once and set up two more.
Only got worse for Martial from there the next season where the best Jose could afford him was a whopping... THREE starts to make up his best run in the side. How in the hell is any player supposed to find consistent form and product when starting so sparingly?
His best run this season is 9 games on the bounce which is his best run of games to date since Nov 2015 - April 16 under LVG.
So yes, Jose ruined the kid and arguably cost him a world cup winners medal by signing Sanchez for a performing Martial and ostracized him from the club.
He has been struggling with injury this season its clear to see that. Even with his injury he has scored some great goals this season. He should be the least of our worries when we have average players like Lingard playing for the club. Mata was signed for big money but he is now past it. Yet Lingard has been past it since his debut. Never good enough. We also have people who think Rashford is good enough to start upfront for a title winning team. Martial has more ability then both and he will prove it. He isn't English so its easier to criticize him for some fans. Once he gets rid of the injury issues he will be back to being our best attacker.
Give it a rest. I've noticed your anti-English agenda in other threads. You bring it up all the time, often in completely irrelevant discussions (like here).
By a country mile, my friend.When you realize Mane has been a better signing than Martial
You can give every excuse in the book for Martial: 'Mourinho stopped his development', 'injuries', 'playing out of position', the fact is that this lad is no kid anymore, he is a pro footballer on a sheet load of cash playing for one of the biggest teams on the planet. If that does not give you the motivation to do what you can do (or can he, consistently?) then we need to look elsewhere.
For the first 20 minutes of the game yesterday I didn't even realise he was on the pitch, and when I did realise, it is the same old, one dribble too many, not releasing the ball in time for his contribution to be effective.
When he is playing well, he can be brilliant, but it just does not happen enough.
We gave him the contract he wanted due to FOMO, nothing more than that, because the glimpses of quality he has shown over the years are starting to get pegged back by the average performances.
He's really, really not.
Totally agree. Very frustrating to watch him.
I disagree. Numbers have never told the whole story and those numbers don't mean it was down to his manager. Martial's attitude is his problem. That much is getting clearer now under Ole as much as it was from Didier Deschamps headaches with him in France. And how do you explain his great performances under Jose and then another incredible slump under Ole? Jose did that? Many, many players have had fantastic debut seasons and then slumped. Just as much as many players have had poor debut seasons but later became legends under the same manager. Debut seasons hardly ever tell the whole story.
Totally agree with you. On balance he has been quite disappointing. Very little improvement and he is consistent at being inconsistent.
To me it is his head down mentality. His cup must seem only one quarter full.
Motivating him must be a nightmare. Best of luck to the coaching staff.
He's frustrating in an entirely different way to Pogba, but the end result is the same. An incredibly talented player who isn't showing his worth consistently enough
Completely disagree.Jose stalled Martial's development?
Martial stalled Martials career.
Jose has never liked players who are inconsistent. As I have mentioned many times, he wants players who deliver 8/10 every time. Hardly what you get from Martial.
Honestly, if someone came in with a bid of anything around £60m I wouldn't hesitate.
I think he'd thrive in a team like Spurs, but with us it's just not a perfect fit. I don't see him reaching the heights that we hoped he would reach here when he first burst onto the scene.
I think he'd thrive in a team like Spurs, but with us it's just not a perfect fit. I don't see him reaching the heights that we hoped he would reach here when he first burst onto the scene.
4-2-3-1 is not the best formation for him, since it places too too much onus on the guy to pick up the ball from deep. That's not his game. His passing and movement have always been below par if we're being honest.
It's his ability to drop a shoulder and finish that make him a good prospect. He needs to be played higher up the pitch or not at all. More left wing forward than left midfielder.
It's his ability to drop a shoulder and finish that make him a good prospect. He needs to be played higher up the pitch or not at all. More left wing forward than left midfielder.
Martial(time to sell, replace with someone like Neres at Ajax ) lingard(bench role) Smalling (bench role, no confidence and usually only kicks it out if an opponent anywhere near him) Rashford (Bench role, can’t even head the ball after 3 seasons) Young(sell)Lukaku (sell).
This united team is useless without a top form Pogba and his withdrawn position in the absence of Herrera has caused all creativity to dry up.
This united team is useless without a top form Pogba and his withdrawn position in the absence of Herrera has caused all creativity to dry up.
Some of his really bad moments yesterday came in the final third though. Beating a couple guys and passing back or cutting back and finding no one.
I've no problem with him making mistakes in the final third, because sometimes he pulls it off. Same with Rashford.
Just keep him there rather than asking him to be a creative outlet in the middle third, because that only brings out the worst in him.
His strengths are enough to warrant a place in the team. But his weaknesses need mitigating if he's in.
For me he epitomises the major issue in our squad and that is that it's jam packed full of players that are exceptional on their day but far too inconsistent. He needs to improve his decision making and make himself more difficult to tackle - sometimes his dribbling is just plain awful considering what he's capable of.
He was especially poor against West Ham but still had a big hand in both goals and I think he's our best finisher, not sure we're in a position to be getting rid.
He was especially poor against West Ham but still had a big hand in both goals and I think he's our best finisher, not sure we're in a position to be getting rid.